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Pathfinder Online: A Fantasy Sandbox MMO (kickstarter)

MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member

Pathfinder Online: A Fantasy Sandbox MMO

PathfinderOnlineKickstarter

SANDBOX FEATURES @ A GLANCE:

 

  • Player-Player Contracts - replace quests
  • Player formed factions - all/any eg as per EVE
  • Skill-Training Progression -> 2.5yrs to max level earliest in x1 role only
  • Player created settlements -> Each Hex (256) can be conquered and controlled
  • Player formed Armies -> Real formations
  • Virtual Economy -> full-blown autonomous economy (not simulated)
  • Player Crafting item production and PvE Resource Cycle (maj. item creation by players)
  • Career Skills as well as Combat Skills (bounty-hunter, bandit, diplomat, tavern owner...)
  • Alignment, Reputation, Politics & Open-World PvP (EVE style again)
  • NPC Alliances (changes which mobs are friend/foe
  • Single-server World map - all game story is shared by all players

...

& more at the blogs: https://goblinworks.com/blog/

 

Updates:

Update #29: UNITY

Update #30: MAC SUPPORT

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Comments

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member

    PaizoCon PathfinderOnline Presentation Video (13 minutes)

    • Goblin Works & Paizo
     
    • A brief History Of MMOs
     
    • Sandboxes vs Themeparks
     
    • "Crowdforging" (ie google mail beta)
     
    • Pathfinder Online: Adventure, Exploration, Development, Dominion
  • TamanousTamanous Edmonton, ABPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon

    God damn it is nice listening to developers who actually "get" what has happened in the mmo market.

     

    I never thought I would see the day where I would have solid choices between sandbox games. Still waiting to see then come out but times could be good my friends ... times coudl be good  :)

    You stay sassy!

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member

    USEFUL LINKS:

    Goblin Works Website & Development Blogs: https://goblinworks.com/blog/

    Paizo Pathfinder Online Forums: http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/licensees/pathfinderOnline

    Summary Of Developer Blogs:

     

    • Blog #27 Live Through This - NPC Alliances
    • Blog #26 Gentlemen, You Can't Fight in Here! This is the War Room! - Combat
    • Blog #25 A Game of Thorns 
    • Blog #24 A Three-Headed Hydra - Combat
    • Blog #23 Begin the Beguine
    • Blog #22 Time Keeps On Slipping, Slipping, Slipping into the Future!
    • Blog #21 I Heard It through the Grapevine - Community
    • Blog #20 30 Days in the Hole
    • Blog #19 Three Goblins and a Fighter Walk into a Bar... 
    • Blog #18 You're in the Army Now! - Armies
    • Blog #17 RESPECT: Find Out What It Means to Me! - Alignment & Reputation
    • Blog #16 Put It in Writing - Politics
    • Blog #15 Kickstarter Aftermath
    • Blog #14 Designing Thornkeep
    • Blog #13 Signed... in Blood - Contracts
    • Blog #12 The Blog About Kickstarter
    • Blog #11 Where the Wild Things Are - Dungeons and Mobs
    • Blog #10 Butchers, Bakers and Candlestick Makers - Crafting: Production, Consumption, Construction
    • Blog #9 Money Changes Everything - Virtual economy
    • Blog #8 Time is the Fire in which We Burn - Game time, distance, speed
    • Blog #7 Player-Created Buildings and Structures - player run infrastructure
    • Blog #6 LFG! (Looking for Group!) - social organisation
    • Blog #5 Adventure in the River Kingdoms - pve
    • Blog #4 To Live and Die in the River Kingdoms - pvp
    • Blog #3 Your Pathfinder Online Character - avatar
    • Blog #2 Introducing the Crusader Road - world map
    • Blog #1 A Journey of a Thousand Miles Begins with a Single Step - design

     

  • ThorbrandThorbrand West Palm Beach, FLPosts: 1,198Member

    First off Pathfinder Online isn't a sandbox. It is their PnP world made into a MMO. Think of it more like Vanilla EQ more advanced. Don't know if I should donate given how much I give Paizo every month for Pathfinder as it is.

    This is one of the games to bring the MMO back to MMOs...LOL! Stop supporting all the other crap!

  • NevulusNevulus Miami Beach, FLPosts: 1,288Member Uncommon

    If there's one company that gets it, it's Paizo.

     

    What they did with the D&D 3.5 ruleset is pretty amazing. How they treat their customers is pretty stellar. How this will all translate into a MMO? Who knows. What I do know is had they released a virtual table with a mobile version, I wouldve been just as happy. 

  • stealthbrstealthbr BrasiliaPosts: 1,053Member
    Wasn't the point of the Technology Demo Kickstarter to get investors interesting in the game?
  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member

    Originally posted by Tamanous

    God damn it is nice listening to developers who actually "get" what has happened in the mmo market.

     

    I never thought I would see the day where I would have solid choices between sandbox games. Still waiting to see then come out but times could be good my friends ... times coudl be good  :)

    Bingo. The information is the first thing to provide your customers. Then it is up to them to estimate the potential success of the design idea and any potential drawbacks. But the first thing mmorpg developers should do is reveal their design document overview to the players.

     

    Originally posted by stealthbr
    Wasn't the point of the Technology Demo Kickstarter to get investors interesting in the game?

    Quote: Ryan Dancey, Goblin Works CEO:

     

    "The Tech Demo was a success in all respects and as a result of the Tech Demo we have secured the financing we need to put the game into production.

    The Kickstarter allows us to make the game bigger, better and FASTER than we can with the financing we've already lined up. And that reduces the risks we face in making the game, and it will let us make a better product."

    I still think supporting the kickstarter is risky from the point of view of crowdsourcing best practices:

    1. Fund smaller projects

    2. Fund faster to finish projects

    3. Fund only what you really dig and don't dig too deep into your pockets for any one project

    ==

    But it's heartening to see a sandox fantasy mmorpg heavily influenced by EvE's successful model is blueprinted.

  • TamanousTamanous Edmonton, ABPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Nevulus

    If there's one company that gets it, it's Paizo.

     

    What they did with the D&D 3.5 ruleset is pretty amazing. How they treat their customers is pretty stellar. How this will all translate into a MMO? Who knows. What I do know is had they released a virtual table with a mobile version, I wouldve been just as happy. 

    Yes the first step in their success was knowing that D&D was headed in the entirely wrong direction with Wotc's 4th edition and stole nearly their entire 3.5 playerbase with the licensed d20 system. Hell there was more players still playing versions 1 through 3.5 than 4th ever got and they are reselling older editions again and making 5e nearly begging players to come back lol. I honestly hope (for the sake of mmo's) that they can do the exact same thing with a mmorpg (in terms of securing a solid direction for their design that influences other developers).

    You stay sassy!

  • ThorkuneThorkune Eastern, KYPosts: 1,830Member Uncommon
    I just finished watching their video and I have to say that I am genuinely interested.
  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
    Looks pretty cool. I'll keep my eye on it
  • TamanousTamanous Edmonton, ABPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    [mod edit]

     

    It is entirely the responsibility of the donors to vet who they invest in ... not the company asking for investors. They assume investors are smart ... not stupid.

    You stay sassy!

  • DihoruDihoru ConstantaPosts: 2,731Member
    I am keeping an eye on this, if the F2P system is DDO or heaven's forbid SWTOR levels of bad I am out (content should never ever be gated, progression and aesthetics are the way to go, if the sandbox is good enough both will be in high demand) but otherwise... I'll likely be the burly dwarf crashing into enemies Gimli style <3

    image
  • snapfusionsnapfusion San, CAPosts: 954Member
    Wait, didnt they just do one of these a few months ago for half a mill?  Now their back for a mill?
  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,437Member Uncommon
    Over reaching a bit with asking for a million aren't they? Doesn't seem like they are coming anywhere close to that goal.

    image
  • TamanousTamanous Edmonton, ABPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Over reaching a bit with asking for a million aren't they? Doesn't seem like they are coming anywhere close to that goal.

    I've seen many other kickstarters earn much much more. It sounds like a solid concept and a near AAA game already with their current investors. Why not do it? If they don't reach their goal the don't get the money.  If they reach their goal it only proves a significant level of interest exists. 

     

    They have pointed out already why they do it. Reaching kickstarter goals sets a benchmark on how much interest players have in the project and therefore can garner more corporate investment. NOBODY here is being forced to give them money. NOBODY here needs to be concerned over it if that is the case.

     

    I have no idea why this process doesn't fascinate people. We are starting to see options indie developers can take that pulls the power away from the mega-corps ruining the gaming industry. Solid developers will succeed and crap ones will be eaten up ... but at least they have the opportunity to try when even recently they had no chance. We will see more different types of PC games we would not normally see. This is a very good thing. A bigger pile may mean more crap but it also means the change for a real gem is increased.

    You stay sassy!

  • David_LopanDavid_Lopan Madison, WIPosts: 811Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tamanous
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Over reaching a bit with asking for a million aren't they? Doesn't seem like they are coming anywhere close to that goal.

    I've seen many other kickstarters earn much much more. It sounds like a solid concept and a near AAA game already with their current investors. Why not do it? If they don't reach their goal the don't get the money.  If they reach their goal it only proves a significant level of interest exists. 

     

    They have pointed out already why they do it. Reaching kickstarter goals sets a benchmark on how much interest players have in the project and therefore can garner more corporate investment. NOBODY here is being forced to give them money. NOBODY here needs to be concerned over it if that is the case.

     

    I have no idea why this process doesn't fascinate people. We are starting to see options indie developers can take that pulls the power away from the mega-corps ruining the gaming industry. Solid developers will succeed and crap ones will be eaten up ... but at least they have the opportunity to try when even recently they had no chance. We will see more different types of PC games we would not normally see. This is a very good thing. A bigger pile may mean more crap but it also means the change for a real gem is increased.

      I completely agree, however a cool mil is a bit much to shoot for. It's a little discouraging really.

  • xmentyxmenty SingaporePosts: 679Member

    Shouldn't they like finishes the game at 90% then asked for the 1 million to boost the game up.

    They haven't do anything yet and still asked for more money?

    Feels like they are abusing the Kickstarter by making a lot of promises?

    Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language :)

  • MyrdynnMyrdynn Beaumont, CAPosts: 1,518Member Uncommon
    seems cool, but wake me in 2015
  • ThumbtackJThumbtackJ columbus, OHPosts: 539Member Uncommon

    Now, this million is just to add more to the game and get it out sooner? So it will still be made even if the KS goal is not met? It's almost at 100k now, with 47 days to go, which is a fair bit of time, but I still have my doubts.

     

    Perhaps it's just a case of me living in a rural area in BFE, but I have to wonder, how many people know about Pathfinder, Kickstarter, play MMO's and like the concept of this one? At $35 for the lowest tier (that includes the game) that's ~28k backers needed (maybe closer to 15-20k with those who back more than $35). 

  • BanquettoBanquetto CityPosts: 1,037Member Uncommon

    I put some money into the tech demo Kickstarter, because I liked their ideas, and figured raising 50k to put together a tech demo to attract investors was a sensible and realistic goal.


    But now.. they say "we have secured the financing we need to put the game into production". But they want another million from crowdsourcers? Because they don't want to answer "to some investor who is only interested in how quickly they can get a return on their investment"? But "most of the budget is being provided by our initial investors"?


    I dunno. It doesn't quite add up. Not to mention that a million bucks really won't go very far at all towards making a top quality MMO.


    I still love the ideas and the design that Goblinworks are pushing, but I think I'll pass on this second Kickstarter, and take a look at the game when and if it is released.

  • tom_goretom_gore TamperePosts: 1,796Member Uncommon

    I'm sorry but if they spent 300k to build that tech demo (which looks dated and awkward), I don't think any amount of money will be enough for them to create a good game.

    Not backing this one.

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by Tamanous
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    [mod edit]

    -snip-

    I see Gdemami's post was given the [mod edit] treatment - I was going to say, HE was making MY point of questioning if it was a good idea posting this info on mmorog.com in the first place. image

    But one driving motivation to consider it worthwhile, is the sheer number of posts & threads on these forums at MMORPG.COM requesting a sandbox fantasy mmorpg to emulate/rival some of what EvE provides for sci-fi. So I think at least Pathfinder Online is of interest, even if it feels steep, risky and somewhat optional to back the kickstarter.

    But the dissemination of information on the design of the game is 1st class. They have not revealed information on the middleware tech they are using yet - and bear in mind the demo footage is tech proof of concept eg choreographed animations converting 2d drawings into a 3d virtual environment for investors.

    /One to keep your eye on. ;)

  • watchawatchawatchawatcha LIC, NYPosts: 960Member

    Originally posted by Thorbrand

    First off Pathfinder Online isn't a sandbox. It is their PnP world made into a MMO. Think of it more like Vanilla EQ more advanced. Don't know if I should donate given how much I give Paizo every month for Pathfinder as it is.

    This is one of the games to bring the MMO back to MMOs...LOL! Stop supporting all the other crap!

    Pathfinder Online is a sandbox or technically will be a sandbox.  That's the whole point.  It will also be FFA PvP

    Originally posted by Nevulus

    If there's one company that gets it, it's Paizo.

     

    What they did with the D&D 3.5 ruleset is pretty amazing. How they treat their customers is pretty stellar. How this will all translate into a MMO? Who knows. What I do know is had they released a virtual table with a mobile version, I wouldve been just as happy. 

    They have a Vitrual Table Top in beta now.  It's called Game Space.  Should be out in a few months.  It will be free to use and they'll sell their game assets for people to use.  It's browser based, so technically I think you could use it on an iPad or something that has an internet connection and a full resourced browser.

     

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by watchawatcha

    Originally posted by Thorbrand

    First off Pathfinder Online isn't a sandbox. It is their PnP world made into a MMO. Think of it more like Vanilla EQ more advanced. Don't know if I should donate given how much I give Paizo every month for Pathfinder as it is.

    This is one of the games to bring the MMO back to MMOs...LOL! Stop supporting all the other crap!

    Pathfinder Online is a sandbox or technically will be a sandbox.  That's the whole point.  It will also be FFA PvP

    Originally posted by Nevulus

    If there's one company that gets it, it's Paizo.

     

    What they did with the D&D 3.5 ruleset is pretty amazing. How they treat their customers is pretty stellar. How this will all translate into a MMO? Who knows. What I do know is had they released a virtual table with a mobile version, I wouldve been just as happy. 

    They have a Vitrual Table Top in beta now.  It's called Game Space.  Should be out in a few months.  It will be free to use and they'll sell their game assets for people to use.  It's browser based, so technically I think you could use it on an iPad or something that has an internet connection and a full resourced browser.

     

    Forgive me for being a pedant: It's accurate to say it will be "limited open pvp" preferentially to "FFA pvp". More a nuance of emphasis to be sure, but none the less it's a hot button for some because of the problems of "Griefing" even in non-FFA pvp mmos. The 2 may be equivalent in the eyes of someone who does not like any pvp 100% of the time.

    This blog is very informative for reference: Goblin Works Blog #4: To Live and Die in the River Kingdoms

    For eg, the starter towns (some of them!) will be 100% safe, and various other "towns" will have zone gradations of safety. Then there will be player run territories and that's where it's more like EvE's sec. zones but specific to the behavior of the player communities of an area (as well as interlopers) - Secondly implications of pk'ing differ under different circumstances and conditions so again it's gradated and therefore distinct from some full free-for-all pvp designs. That's the plan in the blog in short.

  • TraugarTraugar Robbinsville, NCPosts: 183Member Uncommon
    If this were any company other than Paizo I would be calling this a cash grab, but I have been a loyal supporter of their products for years so I know better.  I gave a hundred to the initial kickstarter, and I will probably give them more on this one.  The quality of their PnP line is top notch, and they focus on making a quality product for their customers.  When Wizards went to 4e they could have easily have shifted to making 4e compatible products, and that would have been the safe route to have taken for safe investment.  Instead they saw that good percentage of the players weren't thrilled by 4e, and were actually quite happy with 3.5.  They focused on the 3.5 crowd.  They listened to us while developing the system, and as a result Pathfinder is an outstanding PnP ruleset.  I see them doing the same thing with Pathfinder Online.  The safe route to guaranteed cash is another over-hyped themepark that makes the money off of initial sales, but not off of sustaining players.  Instead they see that their is a sandbox crowd so they focus toward them.  I don't see the game ever getting WoW numbers, but I do believe that if Paizo treats this as they would their PnP line then it will be a success that focuses towards the players first.  
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