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Reddit's AMA with Chris Whiteside

135

Comments

  • kamenriderkamenrider kapolei, HIPosts: 41Member

    So good, better, best and something unique/awesome looking for hardcore players not enough?  Is it because you can convert gems and buy a set of exotics cheap that made acquiring "best" too easy?  Can you buy ascended items or the mats on the TP?  Is it to increase cash flow for the game?

     

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,395Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish

    "we have never said there would be no vertical progression. We do intent to focus on horizontal but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve."

    In other words, we are going to lie to you  now and say we always intended to be a WOW clone and that our Manifesto was total BS the entire time, god its only going to get worse now, if you don't like grinding gear I advise you get a refund while you still can.

    FYI, originally GW2 was supposed to have unlimited leveling with diminishing returns. It was really never meant to be a horizontal game like GW1, just a game that's mostly about skill. The problem with Ascended gear is currently that it's doing vertical progression wrong.

    Looks like the AMA ended. Too bad he didn't answer all of the official forums questions, but well, there was a lot of them. The answers were a bit better than I expected.

  • mazutmazut SofiaPosts: 885Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

    Really should have kept his mouth shut, these comments are not going to help the situation at all.


    Biggest mistake was saying "we have never said there would be no vertical progression".


    Then he says they intend to focus on horizontal progression but will have vertical progression. Slowly rolling out a tier over the course a year then introducing another higher tier doesnt count.


    But he also insists that they design the game with everything having little to no grind. How can anyone lie that badly with a straight face? Its so laughably bad you cant get angry at it.

    Even if this is not exactly what most if not all was expecting, this gear is not hard to get and dont need months in grind. Which is the biggest difference to other MMOs. You can play FotM without it and its needed only if you want challenge. Also The actual stats are really not that big again compared to other MMOs where the next set of items has much higher difference in stats increase.

    I'm also a bit disapointed, but on other hand this give the "grind" for some people to keep playing for a while. And even I dont like grind, sometimes its ok in small doses. So far it looks like to get Ascended really dont lead to countless repeats and month of doing the same.

    If they keep it that way its tolerable and wont make me quit. I grind for achievements and specific skins, there is actually no difference. Just another thing to do.

     

  • AnthurAnthur StolbergPosts: 686Member Uncommon

    I just saw a post on gw2 reddit of someone who is now level 31 in this FoTM dungeon. People are really doing this same dungeon 30 and more times ? Isn't this..hmm... totally boring ? I would feel like a hamster. And yes, I know the dungeon is composed out of different mini dungeons every time. But even those repeat over time.

    As long as we players are willing to accept such kind of content we don't really deserve anything better.

    Anyway, concerning this AMA and GW2 it is obvious I misunderstood Anet. My fault probably. But I still feel like I listened to a politician before an election and got the truth afterwards.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,800Member Uncommon

    It is good to see they aren't burying their heads and making weak excuses like some others.

    1) Maxing stats in a game where the output of your actions depends in part of those numbers isn't optional. Not caring about being gimped is an option everyone has, but you are still gimped.

    Good Anet don't come with that excuse and the similar weak excuse that "it is only required for a dungeon after a certain point".

    2) Tying this gear with only 1 type of content is also bad.

    Good Anet recognizes this, but the speed in which they correct this is important.

    3) The grind required for something that isn't optional (vide 1) is too high.

    This unfortunately has been a traditional problem of Anet since GW1, where playing general content isn't rewarding enough compared to specific farms/trading and they end up having to boost rewards several times to equate activities and stop some getting things too fast while for others is too grindy.

     

    And yes, people reading interviews before the game release were expecting level cap increases with EXPANSIONS. Not wiht content patches 3 months after release.

     

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • CalerxesCalerxes LondonPosts: 1,630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Zeus.CM
    Originally posted by Calerxes
    Originally posted by Zeus.CM

    People are mostly concerned about ascended gear. As I am. To get full exotic gear I was required to get around 30-40g (gear + accessories). It was obtainable within a week of farming gold/materials. And now they introduced ascended back slot and rings. My experience: I had to grind 40g just to get back slot. ALso, it's been 6 days since I've been doing level 10 fractals and still not a single ring dropped.

    Ascended brought what we feared the most in GW2 - the grind. I really hope they reduce the amount of materials or make better ring drop because as it is now, it's a bad grind.

     

    Why are you grinding Ascended gear? what do you need it for? can you play other parts of the game effectively without Ascended gear? 

    Without it I cannot play fractals beyond level 12 or so. Arenanet stated they will be adding more content to fractals, more dungeons. So, If I want to do it on higher levels I am required to make ascended gear... I'm a type of a person that want to be 100% efficient and when it comes to mmos that means to have max gear. I play GW2 because achieving that was not as time consuming as in other mmos. By playing 2 hours a day I could have max gear within 2 weeks or so. This will not be the case anymore, unless they improve the way to get it. The most concerning thing is that ascended gear introduced gear requirement to enter a group doing a certain level of a dungeon.

     

    So its voluntary on your part? you can still do FotM without Ascended gear but need it to do higher level fractals which you voluntarily want to do., I don't see a problem.

    This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up™ the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,800Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Calerxes
    Originally posted by Zeus.CM
    Originally posted by Calerxes
    Originally posted by Zeus.CM

    People are mostly concerned about ascended gear. As I am. To get full exotic gear I was required to get around 30-40g (gear + accessories). It was obtainable within a week of farming gold/materials. And now they introduced ascended back slot and rings. My experience: I had to grind 40g just to get back slot. ALso, it's been 6 days since I've been doing level 10 fractals and still not a single ring dropped.

    Ascended brought what we feared the most in GW2 - the grind. I really hope they reduce the amount of materials or make better ring drop because as it is now, it's a bad grind.

     

    Why are you grinding Ascended gear? what do you need it for? can you play other parts of the game effectively without Ascended gear? 

    Without it I cannot play fractals beyond level 12 or so. Arenanet stated they will be adding more content to fractals, more dungeons. So, If I want to do it on higher levels I am required to make ascended gear... I'm a type of a person that want to be 100% efficient and when it comes to mmos that means to have max gear. I play GW2 because achieving that was not as time consuming as in other mmos. By playing 2 hours a day I could have max gear within 2 weeks or so. This will not be the case anymore, unless they improve the way to get it. The most concerning thing is that ascended gear introduced gear requirement to enter a group doing a certain level of a dungeon.

     

    So its voluntary on your part? you can still do FotM without Ascended gear but need it to do higher level fractals which you voluntarily want to do., I don't see a problem.

    Why do people keep insisting in that excuse?

    Not even Anet does.

    That excuse can be used to justify anything in a game, because a game is all optional.

     

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • NailzzzNailzzz fullerton, CAPosts: 510Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Silentstorm

    What you got here is people who are horizontal basically not wanting to share the game. Kinda selfish and childish especially considering the vertical and hardcore/pvp outnumber you greatly. I said in a different post I like a game that isn't one dimensional where you have the {option} to do whatever you like. Alot of people say vanilla wow was like that to a extent it's also been labeled as the best mmorpg during that time. So I won't knock a company trying to do something like that.

     

    Problem is you have people who are lazy and selfish who would exactly do just that knock the company. Want it all for themselves and screw the rest of the population of the game. That's fail and if you really want to act that way just quit the game you will be replaced with someone less selfish in mentality. If they want to make a game that suits everybody let them maybe they can pull it off. But don't play god all seeing and down the people for trying to make everyone happy.

     

    Reason I'm singling out the Horizontal gamers is because vertical fan base didn't cry this hard. They did cry and bitch but not to the extent the horizontal gamers are. Also you don't see any major publication complaining now that GW2 put vertical content in. They actually have gotten praise for doing it. But before this every pc magazine from NYC to China bashed them. This very site was hard on them for lack of end game. They responded and save the army of carebears crying the media has not attacked them. You tubers haven't I would know I'm cool with and subbed to majority of them. 

     

    Most you tubers were mad more about plinx than ascended gear lol...........

         So what mmo's out there have vertical progression players having to compromise and share thier game with horizontal progression players after being told thier game wasnt going to be based on horizontal progression? Yes, i wanted to play an mmo based on horizontal progression. How dare i be so selfish? Especially when i should have just went to one of the hundreds of vertical progression mmo's and insisted they cater to horizontal progression instead. What right do i have to expect that us horizontal progression players should get more than 2-3 mmo's catering to our tastes. That is just a childish selfish mentality i have, to expect that maybe i should get the game that was advertised and i paid for.

         Some tastes are mutually exclusive. I shouldnt be accused of being selfish and lazy just because i dont share yours. You vertical progression fans have just about every mmo on the market as an option for you if a game you like goes south. Those of us who prefer horizontal have maybe 1-2% of the options available to us that you have. Seeing this one taken off the table is likely going to impact us far more than it would your crowd.

         Sometimes compromise just means that no one gets thier way and no one gets to be happy as a result. We all would have been better off if we just had more options.

  • skydiver12skydiver12 burgundPosts: 432Member

    Seems to be the new way to pointless talk about "ideas" with zero indication and will to actually implement them.

    Yeah right it's not like EAWARE made everyone sick of this kind of talk aready.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,800Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by skydiver12

    Seems to be the new way to pointless talk about "ideas" with zero indication and will to actually implement them.

    Yeah right it's not like EAWARE made everyone sick of this kind of talk aready.

    No idea.

    Not a SWTOR customer.

    But if I remember correctly according to them the main problem of the game was having a subscription.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • IPolygonIPolygon ViennaPosts: 707Member Uncommon
    There are a couple of things I don't like.

    "How is introducing VP respecting the player? Because it's fun to be challenged and rewarded. Because it's fun to have the character you play grow and evolve over time. Because ArenaNet (sort of) held a hard line against all VP with GW1 -- no VP ever, year after year -- and it wasn't that fun. It was stagnant."

    This is a punch in the face for your loyal playerbase.

    "I need to keep playing or else eventually I'll fall significantly behind ... Why on earth do you want people to play for so long? Well, obviously there are many reasons why it's good for any online world for people to actually play it. But the design motivation here is simple. We're intending to build content that's most fun for people who are playing the game, not that's most fun for people who are not playing the game. If you want to take a break for a year, that's fine, but we're not going to freeze the game for you while you're gone. I'm sure we'll make it reasonable for you to catch back up when you return. After all, it's clearly in our best interest to do so."

    Which means a treadmill is incoming.

    "
    E9:There are no ways to repair inside of fractals aside from cash shop items, providing an inherent advantage to people who pay for advantages. Can this be fixed?

    Well it certainly wasn't designed to be a monetization resource, however i do see your point. We wanted to get rid of rez rushing and focus more on parties working together to not die and die less (-: We will continue to monitor the need for repair in the fractals and go from there.

    Sorry if i am not giving more details here but this is something i would like to get metrics on.

    Chris"

    Dodging questions is always fun.

    "
    I think it's important for GW2 to be able to have this kind of gradual progression. Of course we made some mistakes with the way we introduced ascended gear. (See ChrisW's answers for details.) But those are addressable issues. I don't think they invalidate the fundamental concept that GW2 can have gradual stat progression without being a gear treadmill game.

    ~ MO"

    Hi there treadmill.

    Bottom line, you cannot please both crowds. Trying to do so will alienate both sides. There is a great comment about cars and different target audiences. The good thing, we finally know two things: ANet got no clue of where they are going and where they want to go. ANet got no clue of what grind is. There are numerous examples of that fact in the AMA.
  • HomituHomitu Hometown, HIPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish
    Originally posted by Thupli
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish

    "we have never said there would be no vertical progression. We do intent to focus on horizontal but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve."

    In other words, we are going to lie to you  now and say we always intended to be a WOW clone and that our Manifesto was total BS the entire time, god its only going to get worse now, if you don't like grinding gear I advise you get a refund while you still can.

    Before this patch there was vertical progression of gear in the game.  Once you hit 80 you had to gear up blue to green to exotic.  Why weren't you screaming about it and calling them liars then?

    No you didn't those stat increases were marginal, Ascended not only ups the bar on the stats, it also creates a mandatory window to do the dungeons because of Agony. Hell even if the stats were the same adding agony alone creates its own treadmill. Not to mention the boost it will give in WvWvW. Before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable greens and blues anyway just by playing the game. Ascended gear forces the issue and makes what used to be optional dungeons into a mandatory grind. I wont waste too much time arguing about it since frankly I am looking/waiting for other games now. If you are happy with it fine by me.

    Concerning stat improvement, let's look at 5 rings of the same stat type but of varying quality.  I chose Chyrsocola (condi/power/vit).  

      Fine Masterwork Rare Exotic Ascended
    Condition damage 41(14) 55(18) 59(21) 67(25) 71(32)
    Power 29(10) 39(12) 42(13) 48(15) 50(18)
    Vitality 29(10) 39(12) 42(13) 48(15) 50(18)
    Total Stats 133 175 190 218 239
               

    Stats in parenthesis are from gems of a similar quality.  For ascended items, these stats are incorporated into the item itself and they come with a specific infusion slot. 

    The stat increase from Fine to Masterwork quality is 31.6%

    The stat increase from Masterwork to Rare quality is 8.6%

    The stat increase from Rare to Exotic quality is 14.7%

    The stat increase from Exotic to Ascended quality is 9.6%.

     

    So no, the stat increases between the other qualities were NOT any more marginal than the increase from exotic to ascended.  And the statement "before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable blues and greens anyway by just playing the game" is rendered ludicrous any which way you meant it it.  For one, you still passively pick up blues and greens.  As far as them being "applicable," they were never applicable to anything at least as far as min/maxers are concerned, who are the ONLY people who have a reasonable issue with the new ascended gear.  If you used "applicable blues and greens" before, you can still use them now; but they will be just as bad.  And if you used green/blue gear before, you obviously weren't a min/maxer, you were already playing while extremely underpowered relative to many of your peers (and presumably either didn't notice or didn't care), and you have no more reason to care now.  If you were actually doing WvW in "applicable blues/greens," then you were fighting enemies in exotics who had between 24.6 and 63.9% more stats from gear.  If you didn't care about that, you sure as hell shouldn't care about the extra 10% gap.  

    Concerning min/maxers, many of them were the exact players looking for something else to progress toward because previous statistical min/maxing could be achieved so quickly after reaching 80 in GW2.  I honestly don't think these people are the one's doing much of the complaining.  

    Lastly, concerning Agony and infusions, we really have no clue where Anet is going with these yet.  Any speculation about gating content is just that: speculation.  Currently, the only thing it "gates" is level XX of FotM.  Once again, to min/maxers and hardcore progressionists, this probably won't be gated at all, as they will get the gear.  To everyone else, especially those who are complaining about grinding FotM, the only thing this gates you from is doing MORE FOTM.  Do you really care about this or are you just looking to take an emotional moral stance on something and get riled up over something that's largely inconsequential to you?  

     

  • greenreengreenreen Punchoo, AKPosts: 2,101Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Homitu
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish
    Originally posted by Thupli
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish

    "we have never said there would be no vertical progression. We do intent to focus on horizontal but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve."

    In other words, we are going to lie to you  now and say we always intended to be a WOW clone and that our Manifesto was total BS the entire time, god its only going to get worse now, if you don't like grinding gear I advise you get a refund while you still can.

    Before this patch there was vertical progression of gear in the game.  Once you hit 80 you had to gear up blue to green to exotic.  Why weren't you screaming about it and calling them liars then?

    No you didn't those stat increases were marginal, Ascended not only ups the bar on the stats, it also creates a mandatory window to do the dungeons because of Agony. Hell even if the stats were the same adding agony alone creates its own treadmill. Not to mention the boost it will give in WvWvW. Before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable greens and blues anyway just by playing the game. Ascended gear forces the issue and makes what used to be optional dungeons into a mandatory grind. I wont waste too much time arguing about it since frankly I am looking/waiting for other games now. If you are happy with it fine by me.

    Concerning stat improvement, let's look at 5 rings of the same stat type but of varying quality.  I chose Chyrsocola (condi/power/vit).  

      Fine Masterwork Rare Exotic Ascended
    Condition damage 41(14) 55(18) 59(21) 67(25) 71(32)
    Power 29(10) 39(12) 42(13) 48(15) 50(18)
    Vitality 29(10) 39(12) 42(13) 48(15) 50(18)
    Total Stats 133 175 190 218 239
               

    Stats in parenthesis are from gems of a similar quality.  For ascended items, these stats are incorporated into the item itself and they come with a specific infusion slot. 

    The stat increase from Fine to Masterwork quality is 31.6%

    The stat increase from Masterwork to Rare quality is 8.6%

    The stat increase from Rare to Exotic quality is 14.7%

    The stat increase from Exotic to Ascended quality is 9.6%.

     

    So no, the stat increases between the other qualities were NOT any more marginal than the increase from exotic to ascended.  And the statement "before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable blues and greens anyway by just playing the game" is rendered ludicrous any which way you meant it it.  For one, you still passively pick up blues and greens.  As far as them being "applicable," they were never applicable to anything at least as far as min/maxers are concerned, who are the ONLY people who have a reasonable issue with the new ascended gear.  If you used "applicable blues and greens" before, you can still use them now; but they will be just as bad.  And if you used green/blue gear before, you obviously weren't a min/maxer, you were already playing while extremely underpowered relative to many of your peers (and presumably either didn't notice or didn't care), and you have no more reason to care now.  If you were actually doing WvW in "applicable blues/greens," then you were fighting enemies in exotics who had between 24.6 and 63.9% more stats from gear.  If you didn't care about that, you sure as hell shouldn't care about the extra 10% gap.  

    Concerning min/maxers, many of them were the exact players looking for something else to progress toward because previous statistical min/maxing could be achieved so quickly after reaching 80 in GW2.  I honestly don't think these people are the one's doing much of the complaining.  

    Lastly, concerning Agony and infusions, we really have no clue where Anet is going with these yet.  Any speculation about gating content is just that: speculation.  Currently, the only thing it "gates" is level XX of FotM.  Once again, to min/maxers and hardcore progressionists, this probably won't be gated at all, as they will get the gear.  To everyone else, especially those who are complaining about grinding FotM, the only thing this gates you from is doing MORE FOTM.  Do you really care about this or are you just looking to take an emotional moral stance on something and get riled up over something that's largely inconsequential to you?  

     

    You need to research more items.

    There are Ascended items with much greater gaps than you cherry picked.

    http://www.gw2db.com/items/71385-lost-seal-of-usoku-infused
    72+32= 104 power
    51+18= 69 toughness
    51+18= 69 vitality
    == 242

    (this does not even add in the infusion slot that is at least known to be +5 stats so far

    Link that shows infusion slot: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lost_Seal_of_Usoku

    Link that shows infusion option: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Precise_Infusion)

    http://www.gw2db.com/items/47737-invaders-ring
    67 power
    48 toughness
    48 vitality
    == 163
    The stat increase from Exotic to Ascended quality is 48%.
     

    Please don't mislead people and next time link to the items you are talking about if you would.

    Here are some MORE ascended items if people want to make their own minds up by doing their own calculations on things they use as stats.

    http://www.gw2db.com/items?filter-item-rarity=8

     

    Let's not even talk about the fact that no one is limited to only wearing ONE ascended item in the game. There is going to be an entire set of gear in the future and weapons.

     

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,800Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by greenreen
    Originally posted by Homitu
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish
    Originally posted by Thupli
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish

    "we have never said there would be no vertical progression. We do intent to focus on horizontal but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve."

    In other words, we are going to lie to you  now and say we always intended to be a WOW clone and that our Manifesto was total BS the entire time, god its only going to get worse now, if you don't like grinding gear I advise you get a refund while you still can.

    Before this patch there was vertical progression of gear in the game.  Once you hit 80 you had to gear up blue to green to exotic.  Why weren't you screaming about it and calling them liars then?

    No you didn't those stat increases were marginal, Ascended not only ups the bar on the stats, it also creates a mandatory window to do the dungeons because of Agony. Hell even if the stats were the same adding agony alone creates its own treadmill. Not to mention the boost it will give in WvWvW. Before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable greens and blues anyway just by playing the game. Ascended gear forces the issue and makes what used to be optional dungeons into a mandatory grind. I wont waste too much time arguing about it since frankly I am looking/waiting for other games now. If you are happy with it fine by me.

    Concerning stat improvement, let's look at 5 rings of the same stat type but of varying quality.  I chose Chyrsocola (condi/power/vit).  

      Fine Masterwork Rare Exotic Ascended
    Condition damage 41(14) 55(18) 59(21) 67(25) 71(32)
    Power 29(10) 39(12) 42(13) 48(15) 50(18)
    Vitality 29(10) 39(12) 42(13) 48(15) 50(18)
    Total Stats 133 175 190 218 239
               

    Stats in parenthesis are from gems of a similar quality.  For ascended items, these stats are incorporated into the item itself and they come with a specific infusion slot. 

    The stat increase from Fine to Masterwork quality is 31.6%

    The stat increase from Masterwork to Rare quality is 8.6%

    The stat increase from Rare to Exotic quality is 14.7%

    The stat increase from Exotic to Ascended quality is 9.6%.

     

    So no, the stat increases between the other qualities were NOT any more marginal than the increase from exotic to ascended.  And the statement "before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable blues and greens anyway by just playing the game" is rendered ludicrous any which way you meant it it.  For one, you still passively pick up blues and greens.  As far as them being "applicable," they were never applicable to anything at least as far as min/maxers are concerned, who are the ONLY people who have a reasonable issue with the new ascended gear.  If you used "applicable blues and greens" before, you can still use them now; but they will be just as bad.  And if you used green/blue gear before, you obviously weren't a min/maxer, you were already playing while extremely underpowered relative to many of your peers (and presumably either didn't notice or didn't care), and you have no more reason to care now.  If you were actually doing WvW in "applicable blues/greens," then you were fighting enemies in exotics who had between 24.6 and 63.9% more stats from gear.  If you didn't care about that, you sure as hell shouldn't care about the extra 10% gap.  

    Concerning min/maxers, many of them were the exact players looking for something else to progress toward because previous statistical min/maxing could be achieved so quickly after reaching 80 in GW2.  I honestly don't think these people are the one's doing much of the complaining.  

    Lastly, concerning Agony and infusions, we really have no clue where Anet is going with these yet.  Any speculation about gating content is just that: speculation.  Currently, the only thing it "gates" is level XX of FotM.  Once again, to min/maxers and hardcore progressionists, this probably won't be gated at all, as they will get the gear.  To everyone else, especially those who are complaining about grinding FotM, the only thing this gates you from is doing MORE FOTM.  Do you really care about this or are you just looking to take an emotional moral stance on something and get riled up over something that's largely inconsequential to you?  

     

    You need to research more items.

    There are Ascended items with much greater gaps than you cherry picked.

    http://www.gw2db.com/items/71385-lost-seal-of-usoku-infused
    72+32= 104 power
    51+18= 69 toughness
    51+18= 69 vitality
    == 242

    http://www.gw2db.com/items/47737-invaders-ring
    67 power
    48 toughness
    48 vitality
    == 163
    The stat increase from Exotic to Ascended quality is 48%.
     

    Please don't mislead people and next time link to the items you are talking about if you would.

    Here are some MORE ascended items if people want to make their own minds up by doing their own calculations on things they use as stats.

    http://www.gw2db.com/items?filter-item-rarity=8

     

    Let's not even talk about the fact that no one is limited to only wearing ONE ascended item in the game. There is going to be an entire set of gear in the future and weapons.

     

    The previous poster is including gem+item.

    The main gap difference though is in grind required.

    Just the ascended backslot require as much as a full exotic crafted set.

    So we have a progression from item that cost under 5s (for blues and greens that could be sold back to the merchant for 1 copper less than the cost) to 10-30s for rares (which could be salved for ectos) to a few gold per exotic piece to 60g for 1 ascended item..

    Any player just playing the game would be able to craft/buy from the TP rare items. A bit of farmand they could craft their set, plus a few gold for runes, sigils and gems.

    Now the jump is from 5ectos per piece to 50 ectos per piece.

    So we moved from a small grind going from rare to exotic to large grind from exotic to ascended.

     

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • NaeviusNaevius Houston, TXPosts: 334Member Uncommon
    A more reasonable measure of the impact of the Ascended gear would be to look at how much effect it has on the characters TOTAL stat. By that standard, the improvement over Exotic is very small. And infusion is irrelevant outside of FOM (so far.)
  • botrytisbotrytis In Flux, MIPosts: 2,567Member

    Chris said they are looking into the grind and thinks it is too high. Let them adjust and then let's talk then.

     

    I guess this is the reality, youo can't please everyone. You can make some people happy with the changes, some people won't be happy, and others are just trying to figure out if they are happy or not.

     

    It happens.....

    image

    "In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
    by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

  • greenreengreenreen Punchoo, AKPosts: 2,101Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Naevius
    A more reasonable measure of the impact of the Ascended gear would be to look at how much effect it has on the characters TOTAL stat. By that standard, the improvement over Exotic is very small. And infusion is irrelevant outside of FOM (so far.)

    Nix that thought, they allowed stats to be on infusions.

    That was part of the complaint, if all they wanted was a gating mechanic, they didn't need to add the stats.

    http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Precise_Infusion

    As the gating gets larger, the stats will naturally rise too, making infusion based dungeon grinder gear the best. There were lots of forum posts about it. That was part of us "whiners" trying to reason with people but they don't like reading.

  • NaeviusNaevius Houston, TXPosts: 334Member Uncommon
    With a precision over 2000 on my character (IIRC), a plus 5 is still what I would consider irrelevant.
  • killion81killion81 A City, MIPosts: 985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Naevius
    With a precision over 2000 on my character (IIRC), a plus 5 is still what I would consider irrelevant.

     

    Max stats are max stats.  You have the option of choosing to use stats that are not maxed, but that does not make it irrelevant.  In a theoretical situation with two equally skilled players facing each other with no difference besides gear (say a +5 precision infusion), the one with higher stats will win.  In this case, it would be that extra crit due to the very small increase in crit chance. The extra crit may not even happen every fight, but it will if you carry it out over enough hits.  There is no such thing as irrelevance in stat differences, unless the stats literally do nothing.

  • greenreengreenreen Punchoo, AKPosts: 2,101Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Naevius
    With a precision over 2000 on my character (IIRC), a plus 5 is still what I would consider irrelevant.

    Do you consider it irrelevant when it is 14 pieces of gear and a weapon slot? I don't login to the game now but I believe there were 7 slots of gear and 7 slots for jewelry and back.

    15*5= +75 instead of +5

    Is +75 stats an irrelevant number?

    Pin me down on what a relevant number is to you, I consider 75 relevant.

  • NaeviusNaevius Houston, TXPosts: 334Member Uncommon

    Don't get me wrong, I wish the Ascended gear didn't exist. But even a 5% increase in total stats is only a small factor in the game (especially since sPvP is not an issue here.)

    The point is that I can't get too worked up about such a minor advantage.

    The most worrisome thing in the Reddit thread was actually the hint of a level cap increase. That would instantly make ALL gear obsolete.

  • ThupliThupli Spokane, WAPosts: 582Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish
    Originally posted by Thupli
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish

    "we have never said there would be no vertical progression. We do intent to focus on horizontal but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve."

    In other words, we are going to lie to you  now and say we always intended to be a WOW clone and that our Manifesto was total BS the entire time, god its only going to get worse now, if you don't like grinding gear I advise you get a refund while you still can.

    Before this patch there was vertical progression of gear in the game.  Once you hit 80 you had to gear up blue to green to exotic.  Why weren't you screaming about it and calling them liars then?

    No you didn't those stat increases were marginal, Ascended not only ups the bar on the stats, it also creates a mandatory window to do the dungeons because of Agony. Hell even if the stats were the same adding agony alone creates its own treadmill. Not to mention the boost it will give in WvWvW. Before this patch you would have passively picked up applicable greens and blues anyway just by playing the game. Ascended gear forces the issue and makes what used to be optional dungeons into a mandatory grind. I wont waste too much time arguing about it since frankly I am looking/waiting for other games now. If you are happy with it fine by me.

    So you immediately say that "those were marginal increases".  By marginal you mean that they did in fact increase vertically?  Wow, what sort of twisted definitions game are you playing here?

    The big complaint that I'm actually hearing you make, as opposed to this totally false "vertical progression" is that you dont like how long it takes to get to max level gear now, since it is "grindier".  That is a different argument.  There has always been vertical progression in this game; beta's onward.  You have no excuse to use this argument.

  • botrytisbotrytis In Flux, MIPosts: 2,567Member
    Originally posted by killion81
    Originally posted by Naevius
    With a precision over 2000 on my character (IIRC), a plus 5 is still what I would consider irrelevant.

     

    Max stats are max stats.  You have the option of choosing to use stats that are not maxed, but that does not make it irrelevant.  In a theoretical situation with two equally skilled players facing each other with no difference besides gear (say a +5 precision infusion), the one with higher stats will win.  In this case, it would be that extra crit due to the very small increase in crit chance. The extra crit may not even happen every fight, but it will if you carry it out over enough hits.  There is no such thing as irrelevance in stat differences, unless the stats literally do nothing.

    Actually, it depends on how damage, armor, etc are calculated. In GW1, for example a sword, with 15% above 50 and a sundering mod was good for a total 1-2 point increase in damage compared to a 14% above 50 w/o the mod. Do we know how they calculate it and has anyone tested yet? All I see are complaints about things that may or may not matter. We don't know yet, to be honest. I understand preception is ruling, why don't we actually show some test data.

     

    Let the testing begin!!

    image

    "In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
    by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

  • ibn_Cartwellibn_Cartwell Northwest, MTPosts: 47Member

    I've never played GW 2, but this is my opinion after reading some of the Q/A and peoples posts. In MMORPG's there is nothing wrong with rare or hard/time consuming items to obtain, this is the basis for many in MMO's.

     

    be it they like PK, PVE, or just Trading in general, but there Player Skill/Experience factor should always come out on Top, ;considering both players are moderately around the same level, aka level 60-100, not level 5 - 275 for PK. Player skill should determine general out come ~ items might scale how intense and quick paced it goes, but there should always be some percentage chance of winning. ( Unlike most games LVL 1 vs LVL 2, is such an unscaled battle you'd think one LVL 5 vs 275 type deal, where of course your gonna get splattered.)                                                                                                
                                                                                                    
    ;for PVE the more experienced player uses more mechanics to there advantage, aka Kiting, or AOEing with tact                                                                                                 
                                                                                                    
    ;and the more experienced Trader should be able to build better quality items, faster, therefor lowering there prices and creating a bigger customer base. Most games nowadays void all of these checks and balances completely. Old school SWG & AC1 good games to look at for fine mechanic balances.

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,395Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Naevius

    The most worrisome thing in the Reddit thread was actually the hint of a level cap increase. That would instantly make ALL gear obsolete.

    A level increase is very likely to come in an expansion, based on what they said in pre-release interviews.

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