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[Column] Star Wars: The Old Republic: Is SWTOR Moving Toward the Dark Side or the Light?

24

Comments

  • McGamerMcGamer Fairfield Bay, ARPosts: 1,012Member
    Like I have always said since I gave up on SWTOR; "I will never play that game again even if it was free." Which I stand by still today. BW would have to make drastic changes to the game for it to be even remotely worthy of being called a Star Wars game any longer.
  • RemyVorenderRemyVorender Riverside, RIPosts: 3,265Member Uncommon

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

    Played: AA, AC1, AC2, Aion, AO, AoC, CO, CoX, DAoC, DCUO, DN, EVE, EQ1, EQ2,
    ESO, FE, FFXI, FFXIV, FF, GW1, GW2, Istaria, L2, LoTRO, MO, MxO, NW, Rift, RoE,
    Ryzom, SB, SWG, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, WAR, WoW, WURM...

  • koboldfodderkoboldfodder Danbury, DEPosts: 390Member Uncommon

    It's a 100% linear game.  You do quests, you gain levels and you do the next set of quests in the next area.  LOTRO is divided up into zones, and some of the levels overlap so you have a choice where to go and what to do.  You don't have that with SWTOR.  You do your newbie planet, then go to your next two planets with everyone else.  Because there is only one way to actually play the game, a quest grind for levels, they cannot restrict that otherwise the whole thing would be pointless.

    So they have to restrcit the other areas of the game, like sprint or UI bars or things that directly stop you from actually playing the game.  Their philosophy is that if they let you play the game, then you are led by the hand into a brick wall, you will pay money to get around that brick wall.

    So they hope you play the game and like it and as soon as you like it, they say "Aha!  now take THIS!"  And you suddenly find the need for an extra UI bar, or sprint, or the ability to use purple loot.

    It's pretty much the direct opposite of every F2P game.

  • eyeqdkeyeqdk Posts: 29Member Uncommon

    Sorry, but when you have to pay to get use the bedst gear in game, thats called PAY  2 WIN

    Free to play, is when you cant pay real cash for better gear, in SWTOR, you have to pay to be able to use epix (or artifact) gear. 

    so who ever is paying real money, is always going to be in better gear, no mater how much you farm as free player. (have fun in PVP) 

     

    And yes, making game where you have around 20 skills to use, but only can use 10 at at time, is also the dumest thing i ever heard. 

     

    Overall, fail of "F2P" model, that is more of P2W model

  • cosliecoslie Vancouver, BCPosts: 4Member
    Originally posted by Gaborik
    I think the ones who cry and whine about all these mmos not being "free enough" are the problem. Todays society is leaning more and more to feeling entitled to things for free, now the mmo community is trying to go the sane route. Its no good for a society to be this way and not good for a gaming community. ....

    Get off my lawn!

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

    $15 is not the problem. If the game is good enough then you will easily put the money into it. WOW has not dropped from the top spot fopr 8 years with its $15 monthly fee. SWTOR is like a single player game with multiplayer functionality, and you do not pay $15 per month to play them.

    Besides SWTORs F2P system costs more than $15 in the month when you add it all up, and you can get the most out of the game in a month. Then it is just creating alts and doing 90% of the same content again on another profession - not exactly worth paying for.

    http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2012/11/future-of-mmo-games

    As the game development website Gamasutra put it, the most expensive game in history is now free: With a reported $200 million budget, the massively multiplayer RPG Star Wars: The Old Republic wasn’t attracting nearly the number of subscribers that publisher Electronic Arts needed if it was going to see returns. So EA added a business model that has been lucrative for other online games: Allow gamers to play for free, then charge them small amounts for upgrades once they’re hooked.

    But that may not be enough. Experts in the space say the reason Star Wars struggles while other online games are killing it isn’t because of the money, it’s because of how the games themselves are designed. It’s not the business model that’s obsolete, but the product.

  • DeeweDeewe Long Beach, CAPosts: 1,965Member

    TOR business model would not have been wrong, provided the game would have been a good MMO.

     

    As stated above the Freemium is too restrictive, the worst being selling UI elements.

    Also the model feels a bit too much like wanting to milk players without giving them much in return.

    So they are making some money for now but eventually people will get bored with the cartel packs scam and well won't drop that much more money in game.

     

    In the end both the players and EA looses.

    This game is in dire need of a direction that knows about MMO and delivering.

     

     

     

  • SuperDonkSuperDonk Vancouver, WAPosts: 781Member Common
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

     Horrible logic, if something is worth $5 to me but they are asking for $15 means I will not buy it whether  I have the money or not.

     

    SWTOR is just not worth the sub or the F2P restrictions, which is the problem. If EA really wanted to turn things around they would of designed a F2P that is both profitable and inviting - now they will have neither. It won't be as profitable as it could of been because not many who bought the game will come back and the new players will soon find they have to sub or get nickled and dimed to be able to continue - many won't - they are F2P players for a reason.

     

    I am not a GW2 fan - but I think SWTOR would be better suited to be B2P with a cosmetic cash shop.

  • eddieg50eddieg50 Tolland, CTPosts: 1,613Member Uncommon
    the only problem i have with TOR F2P is the reduced experience, that could throw off the balance of the game or force you to do boring grinding
  • eddieg50eddieg50 Tolland, CTPosts: 1,613Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SuperDonk
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

     Horrible logic, if something is worth $5 to me but they are asking for $15 means I will not buy it whether  I have the money or not.

     

    SWTOR is just not worth the sub or the F2P restrictions, which is the problem. If EA really wanted to turn things around they would of designed a F2P that is both profitable and inviting - now they will have neither. It won't be as profitable as it could of been because not many who bought the game will come back and the new players will soon find they have to sub or get nickled and dimes to be able to continue - many won't - they are F2P players for a reason.

     

    I am not a GW2 fan - but I also think SWTOR would be better suited to be B2P with a cosmetic cash shop.

     

     He is not saying YOU should give 15 a month because it is obviouse you do not like the game, he is saying that if you like it than 15 a mo for a hobby you like is worth it

  • eddieg50eddieg50 Tolland, CTPosts: 1,613Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SuperDonk
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

     Horrible logic, if something is worth $5 to me but they are asking for $15 means I will not buy it whether  I have the money or not.

     

    SWTOR is just not worth the sub or the F2P restrictions, which is the problem. If EA really wanted to turn things around they would of designed a F2P that is both profitable and inviting - now they will have neither. It won't be as profitable as it could of been because not many who bought the game will come back and the new players will soon find they have to sub or get nickled and dimes to be able to continue - many won't - they are F2P players for a reason.

     

    I am not a GW2 fan - but I also think SWTOR would be better suited to be B2P with a cosmetic cash shop.

     

     He is not saying YOU should give 15 a month because it is obviouse you do not like the game, he is saying that if you like it than 15 a mo for a hobby you like is worth it

  • SuperDonkSuperDonk Vancouver, WAPosts: 781Member Common
    Originally posted by eddieg50
    Originally posted by SuperDonk
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

     Horrible logic, if something is worth $5 to me but they are asking for $15 means I will not buy it whether  I have the money or not.

     

    SWTOR is just not worth the sub or the F2P restrictions, which is the problem. If EA really wanted to turn things around they would of designed a F2P that is both profitable and inviting - now they will have neither. It won't be as profitable as it could of been because not many who bought the game will come back and the new players will soon find they have to sub or get nickled and dimes to be able to continue - many won't - they are F2P players for a reason.

     

    I am not a GW2 fan - but I also think SWTOR would be better suited to be B2P with a cosmetic cash shop.

     

     He is not saying YOU should give 15 a month because it is obviouse you do not like the game, he is saying that if you like it than 15 a mo for a hobby you like is worth it

     That might be the case, but many who bought SWTOR felt that it was not worth the sub fee. F2P should be designed to invite those players back, not push them away again. But I see the point, if you like the game it is worth the $15. But it is hard to like the game, EA missed up by launching SWTOR to soon, then they messed up by not fixing llum ASAP. Then they brought out the nerf hammer seriously hampering several classes. And now they roll out the worst F2P implementation I have ever seen.

  • eddieg50eddieg50 Tolland, CTPosts: 1,613Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SuperDonk
    Originally posted by eddieg50
    Originally posted by SuperDonk
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

     Horrible logic, if something is worth $5 to me but they are asking for $15 means I will not buy it whether  I have the money or not.

     

    SWTOR is just not worth the sub or the F2P restrictions, which is the problem. If EA really wanted to turn things around they would of designed a F2P that is both profitable and inviting - now they will have neither. It won't be as profitable as it could of been because not many who bought the game will come back and the new players will soon find they have to sub or get nickled and dimes to be able to continue - many won't - they are F2P players for a reason.

     

    I am not a GW2 fan - but I also think SWTOR would be better suited to be B2P with a cosmetic cash shop.

     

     He is not saying YOU should give 15 a month because it is obviouse you do not like the game, he is saying that if you like it than 15 a mo for a hobby you like is worth it

     That might be the case, but many who bought SWTOR felt that it was not the sub fee. F2P should be designed to invite those players back, not puch them away again. But I see the point, if you like the game it is worth the $15. But it is hard to like the game, EA missed up by launching SWTOR to soon, then they messed up by not fixing llum ASAP. Then they brought out the nerf hammer seriously hampering several classes. And now they roll out the worst F2P implementation I have ever seen.

       I enjoy the game, in fact I guess sony did a good job with the F2P because I will be subbing again, for one month anyway

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,187Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by eddieg50
    Originally posted by SuperDonk
    Originally posted by remyburke

    If 15 bucks is too much to spend on your hobby every month, then maybe you should spend more time on your career, and less on grinding purples.

     Horrible logic, if something is worth $5 to me but they are asking for $15 means I will not buy it whether  I have the money or not.

    SWTOR is just not worth the sub or the F2P restrictions, which is the problem. If EA really wanted to turn things around they would of designed a F2P that is both profitable and inviting - now they will have neither. It won't be as profitable as it could of been because not many who bought the game will come back and the new players will soon find they have to sub or get nickled and dimes to be able to continue - many won't - they are F2P players for a reason.

    I am not a GW2 fan - but I also think SWTOR would be better suited to be B2P with a cosmetic cash shop.

     He is not saying YOU should give 15 a month because it is obviouse you do not like the game, he is saying that if you like it than 15 a mo for a hobby you like is worth it

    Did he say that he didn't like the game in that post?  Nope.  Let's spell it out clearly for those of you who have a comprehension problem: The game isn't worth what they're asking for it.  He's obviously not alone in that thought.  You can disagree and pay the $15 and feel the game is worth it, but don't go all derp and say that people who won't pay that can't afford it.

    The game can be good or even interesting, but still not worth $15 per month or any dedicated recurring fee.  I agree with him, B2P would be a much better model for these sorts of content churn MMOs.  I also don't think B2P is the exclusive purvue of GW2.  B2P just fits these sorts of themepark MMOs.

    ----------------------

    Richard, I think their chintzy model, is based on the premise that subscribers are better, should be treated better, and have a more fun game experience.  Their whole "f2p" is built on the idea that everyone will try and love the game and therefore subscribe.  It's the same mistake Funcom made with the AoC free play transition and that really bit them in the butt.

    A very strong benefit of free play is the low barrier to entry.  When a publisher artificially raises that barrier in their f2p model, they are sabotaging themselves.

    TOR isn't not worth playing to me, but I'm not likely to waste my time on it.  For one there are better games and business models out there.  For another, I actually support and pay for the F2P/B2P games I play and I'm nost supporting this sort of junk implementation of F2P.  It is rubbish.

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,187Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by eddieg50

       I enjoy the game, in fact I guess sony did a good job with the F2P because I will be subbing again, for one month anyway

    Interesting since SoE has nothing to do with TOR.

  • PresbytierPresbytier Phoenix, AZPosts: 424Member
    Originally posted by meddyck
    They should have just followed what Arenanet did with GW 2 and made the game buy to play. They could then have charged for xp boosts, cosmetic gear, new species, extra character slots, and other stuff that players would have been fine with paying for. Having to pay to unlock the standard number of quickbars, the ability to hide headgear, the ability to wear purple gear, and the ability to display titles is just insulting.

    I agree with this; although i do not feel that they could have after charging a sub for so many months. I don't believe F2P is the way to go at all, but the B2P model looks the most convincing. In fact I feel SWTOR would have been as succesful as GW2 if it went that route. SWTOR is a good game, but sub based games or just not where the market is heading.

    "Never pay more than 20 bucks for a computer game."-Guybrush Threepwood
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."-Hunter S. Thompson

  • kb056kb056 redford, MIPosts: 423Member Common

    Game was abandoned within less then a month after release. The most hyped game for 7 years.

     

    It failed, there is no reviving it. There is no saving it. It's over.

     

    Star Wars Online died the moment SWG died.

  • bpraswidbpraswid JakartaPosts: 7Member
    Former subcriber should be given free cartel points without need to re subcribe
  • IsilendisIsilendis BelgradePosts: 1Member Uncommon
    I don't like the SWTOR "F2P" option, if you could even call it like that. Basically what they did is strip the game to the bare minimum and just leave the story so it looks like you get something, but you actually got nothing. If i wanted to play "story" i would just replay KOTOR and KOTOR 2 again. The game has an insane amount of restrictions. It's like someone created a first person shooter but removed all the weapons for "free users". It's like humanity has forgotten the meaning of the word free. All in all this is "Pay or GTFO" option.
  • GaborikGaborik Roseville, MNPosts: 251Member
    The ones who say OMG 2 action bars hate the game already and will never fill one. Theses same people who say OMG only 2 character slots will never get one to 50. The game is full and lots of fun right now for some. Some spend $14.99/month some are doing it free. There are some who before this game was released called it crap, shit, a heap, dead, horrible its clear these same people are back. Why spend so much time and energy trying to bash something others enjoy? The mmo market is flooded with games go find one and play it. Whining and crying this one is "not free enough" is pathetic.
  • GaborikGaborik Roseville, MNPosts: 251Member
    Originally posted by bpraswid

    Former subcriber should be given free cartel points without need to re subcribe

     

    Your not entitled to crap in a video game or real life deal with it.
  • lotapartylotaparty taxila canttPosts: 514Member
    Originally posted by Naral

    They need to look at the PS2 F2P model. As much as SOE can screw over the customer, their free to play model for PS2 is actually pretty good. 

    Just make progress slower if you are unwilling to pay for the game. Say, cut xp in half unless you pay or something.

    Charging for hotbars and sprint? That is going to do nothing but drive people away. Hell, if they changed up the game a bit I might go back, even as a subbed member, but this plan is horrid. It reeks of what it is: fleecing the last dollars out of a failed game.

    ps2 model sucks eyeballs

    image

  • jonathon82jonathon82 front royal, VAPosts: 21Member
    Im not even trying to be negative just trying to be honest. I now feel like I was basically robbed for my 60 dollars. I enojed it for a few weeks but stopped playing and hoped it would get better. Instead of trying to make the game better for the players that bought the game and subbed they made it free to play. Not only that but its no better its actually worse. I didnt even complete one quest before I quit. I hoped on my mount thingy and when I tried to jump off I was stuck in that animation then whe I triend t attack it was so delayed and just shit lol  It sucked and Im so disaponited not even for the 60 bucks who cares but for the IP that they ruined. What a fail
  • jonathon82jonathon82 front royal, VAPosts: 21Member
    Originally posted by Gaborik
    Originally posted by bpraswid
    Former subcriber should be given free cartel points without need to re subcribe

     

    Your not entitled to crap in a video game or real life deal with it.
     

    why not? If you pay for something you should get your moneys worth. If you buy a car and it is recalled because it fucked up what happens? It gets fixed or you get a new one. Oh and cheer up lifes not that bad :)

  • lotapartylotaparty taxila canttPosts: 514Member
    Originally posted by eyeqdk

    Sorry, but when you have to pay to get use the bedst gear in game, thats called PAY  2 WIN

    Free to play, is when you cant pay real cash for better gear, in SWTOR, you have to pay to be able to use epix (or artifact) gear. 

    so who ever is paying real money, is always going to be in better gear, no mater how much you farm as free player. (have fun in PVP) 

     

    And yes, making game where you have around 20 skills to use, but only can use 10 at at time, is also the dumest thing i ever heard. 

     

    Overall, fail of "F2P" model, that is more of P2W model

     

    enlighten me with any f2p title that has not got it :)

    image

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