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Originally posted by Skichalet [B][URL=http://www.chilliandice.com/]Ski chalet [/URL][/B]
*squints* ...Chili and Dice?
Originally posted by Antipathy Originally posted by Rydeson It would look like the cave troll fight in Lord of the Rings.. Trust me when I say that Frodo wasn't tanking. The whole fight looked like a FFA ..
So you support the idea that the fight would be a zergfest?
He's saying he supports a more chaotic encounter. I'm curious what your personal definition is of "zergfest" that you reached that conclusion.
I also would prefer more chaotic encounters. Asheron's Call and UO offered the closest I've currently found to "Batman"-style combat.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Vindictus has no real tank, Fiona can't hold aggro, every class is a DPS class in Vindictus.
While the gameplay is fun, the actual strategy in that game is non-existent, and the community suffers greatly because all classes are DPS classes.
I think it's not just the tnak that stops the zergfest, it's the tank - healer - dps - support - puller - CC system, the traditional Everquest system and even the smaller holy trinity systems are really good systems that make people depend on each other.
I remember when I was playing Champions Online, before the free to play change. Since there were no predefined classes, quite often you would jump into a group without any actual tank and any actual healer. Actually, most of the times. People would just zerg and die, and zerg and die.
Meanwhile, I built an actual tank (ranged tank, and it was awesome), and an actual healer. I looked for players willing to learn how to run lairs and drop cosmics in a different way, and soon we were obliterating everything on elite difficulty without even dying once. We were asking for more difficult encounters on the forums while everybody else was crying for nerfs.
Games keep beeing simplified, and with it, roles disappearing. The fine art of crowd control is lost. Virtually no new game offers an actual crowd control role. Now they want tanking and healing to disappear. Well, the old tank & spank is the easiest way to get people into group mechanics, a very easy way to make each player play a different and complementary role in a group. It is easy to understand for new players, and it just works.
Many of you want tanking and healing to disappear becouse you are playing an MMO to solo, solo, solo, solo, and nothing more than solo until level cap, and you want to get there as fast as possible. So you rolled a DPS char, and now, surprise, you have to queue up for ten times longer than tanks and healers who needed way more time to level up, who need way more time to farm their stuff and who, on top of that, can't slack for a split second on groups becouse it means wipe. Well, I am not sorry that you can't have it all.
Many of you are basically hypocrites who say that want tanking and healing to disappear in order to get new mechanics, but the only thing that you want is a shorter qeueing time until your next random group dungeon.
Originally posted by Enigmatus I'm more inclined to think that there just hasn't been any solutions yet that can allow for co-operation, and at the same time not force everyone into an absolute trinity. That, or people don't want it to happen because they attached some kind of personal value to one of the "necessary roles" (AKA everything that isn't straight out DPS), and would lose that personal value the moment those roles are eliminated.
Totally agree. Having clearly set roles creates responsibility, when you wipe you kinda "know" if it was your fault so you know where and how to improve etc. And yes, there are lots of people who just want to be special, be and do something "different" from the big mass of players - CC oriented chars, hybrid heal-when-you-dps chars and stuff like that.
Mabinogi doesn't have a tanking system and it's far from a "zerg fest".
Edit: Dang, holy 2 year necro batman.
Originally posted by spades07 that box you live in is mighty small. ;p
Regarding your new poll, MMOEx, was there a post where you said GW2 is a zergfest? The OP was simply "I say PvE without a tanking system is nothing more than a Zerg Fest. Prove me wrong" and everyone did. It's really unlike you to pull a necro like this, especially on a 2 year old troll post that more than accomplished its task. What gives?
Originally posted by MMOExposed I say PvE without a tanking system is nothing more than a Zerg Fest.
A crafty way of bringing up the "trinity" argument I guess but I'm not sure to what end. There really is no difference in the quote above aside from one less person "zerging", though they are still attacking it right? It's a preferance call. Some people like constant movement, others don't. It's a little vague.
guild wars 2: hey you i dont care who you are i dont care what class you are, just do damage so we can finish this and get badges and leave, no dont you dare talk either and dont try to add me on a friends list because who cares everyones the same anyway.
played a million mmo's
Originally posted by Quirhid Guild Wars. 'nuff said.
quod erat demonstrandum
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
Originally posted by engellen guild wars 2: hey you i dont care who you are i dont care what class you are, just do damage so we can finish this and get badges and leave, no dont you dare talk either and dont try to add me on a friends list because who cares everyones the same anyway. fun.
Yeah man, Karma grind in Orr!
I agree that PvE without the established mechanic is often a zerg fest but that does not prove we have to have a tanking system. It just means we need to have some sort of system.
Even in a FPS like Battlefield you have roles. You could argue that your role in that kind of game is more defined than in a MMO like GW2. I think a strong role for your charecter adds a lot to combat. But role take time to learn, they expect players to learn how to play a certain way. That is not easymode and its all about how easy they can make a MMO now.
You received 25 Agrees. You're posting some good content. Great!
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Now Doesn't That Make You Feel All Warm And Fuzzy? :P
I love being the tank, so I agree.