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I dont understand why some people feel cheated

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  • PurutzilPurutzil East Stroudsburg, PAPosts: 2,924Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by itgrowls
    Originally posted by The_Korrigan

    Because many people are spoiled consumers who think they should get everything for free?

    Also: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5385610#5385610

    The thing that amazes me is there are hours of gameplay in this game, not just 300, so why stop there? Other mmo's like WoW with it's 4 expansions I have just as much to do as GW2 does before it's releasing any 1 piece of extra content.

    Um... what? What crazy make believe land are you in? Theres a lot less to do in Guildwars 2 unless you look at that "Dev list for dumbies" they released entailing all the stuff you can do which in that case, apply it to WoW as well. 

     

    It doesn't need to have more content then a game thats had more time, but its just a blatant lie to make a claim that it does. I have no problem if you found yourself having more fun for as long but as soon as you try to push it has just as much to offer as a game with that much time out your really deluding yourself. Theres a difference between having 'more desire to play that long' then 'more to actually do'. If your comparing what you can do in GW2, it falls rather short compared to a good majority of games, even brand new games much like GW2 had more to offer content wise.

  • RohnRohn Saint Peters, MOPosts: 3,740Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Siphaed
    Originally posted by Rohn
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

     

    That's because it's not a singleplayer game - it's an MMO, and is therefore judged by MMO standards, one of which is longevity.

    Most MMOs in recent history have been bashed because players lost interested in playing them, just like many have with GW2.  The payment model doesn't really make a difference.  When playing an MMO, many players expect to become absorbed in the world, and their measure of success is how long they are interested in playing.

    Players have had similar criticisms of F2P games.  Even though they cost absolutely nothing to play, players still believe that if it doesn't hold their attention, it's a "bad" game.

    GW2 just doesn't have legs.  It's badly designed regarding long term interest.

    Exactly how so is it "badly designed" for long term interests? Do you know the time and effort it takes to put into getting a Legendary Weapon.  And, after seeing people walking around with them (and their steps being growing plants, rainbows, streams of the sky, and so on), only then did I start working towards one myself.  

     

    Legendarys take 500 dungeon tokens, 500 WvW Badges, 1,000's of other materials, 600,000 Karma. That's a goal!

     

    No, that's a grind - the same type of pointless, soul-killing grind found in every other game out there.  Lame.  The game's two and a half months old, and quite a few people have had legendaries for a while.  Not much of a long term goal, is it?

    Meanwhile, WvW is a waste of time, real social elements are non-existent, and the gameworld is meaningless.

    There's a reason why the game is bleeding players, spurring threads like this and others.  The payment model is no excuse - an MMO that fails to keep players long term has always been considered a failure.  In this, GW2 is no exception.

    Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,216Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Yamota

    Because a lot of us are waiting for the MMO to re-capture the feeling of the classic one's. However, it may be time to realise that this will not happen. Atleast not with ThemePark MMOs.

    As for 300 hours, I only got 160 hours out of it before I got bored. Still ok but not what I expected.

    Here's the thing, and I'm not picking on you in particular:  If the "first" generation MMOs (UO, AC, Lineage, and EQ) weren't really themeparks, why would anyone expect new themepark centric mmos to deliver a non-themepark experience?

    I've got more than 300 hours out of the game and I still have lots of stuff to explore and things to do.  GW2 offers me a fairly off-rails experience.  I don't have to do anything I don't want, I can level through doing pretty much whatever I feel like, and I enjoy the combat.  When I get burnt out on it I'll set it down for a while like I did GW1 and pick it up later when I want to.

    Stop trying to recapture something from the past.  Live in the now.  Enjoy things for what they are and stop railing about things that don't parallel what you had.  Gaming might be more fun that way and if you're lucky who knows.  Manage your expectations should probably be in there somewhere too.

  • ZylaxxZylaxx Erlanger, KYPosts: 2,574Member
    Originally posted by Yamota

    Because a lot of us are waiting for the MMO to re-capture the feeling of the classic one's. However, it may be time to realise that this will not happen. Atleast not with ThemePark MMOs.

    As for 300 hours, I only got 160 hours out of it before I got bored. Still ok but not what I expected.

    Although I agree with the OP I also agree with this.  I am quitting because theres nothing of my interests to do any more.

    Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online

    Playing: GW2
    Waiting on: TESO
    Next Flop: Planetside 2
    Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.

    image

  • grimalgrimal Stamford, CTPosts: 2,873Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Roxtarr

    If anyone didn't know what they were getting into when they bought the game, they didn't do their research.  There were more blogs, videos and websites about this game than just about anything that has come out in recent history.

     

    How do you explain all the "fans" whom did all that research and now posting that they are disappointed?

    These kind of posts just try to place the blame on the players.

  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Nevada, MOPosts: 2,732Member Common
    Unrealistic expectations, perhaps? Most of them will likely be peeved when they wake up on December 22 and still have bills to pay.

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,216Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by grimal
    Originally posted by Roxtarr

    If anyone didn't know what they were getting into when they bought the game, they didn't do their research.  There were more blogs, videos and websites about this game than just about anything that has come out in recent history.

    How do you explain all the "fans" whom did all that research and now posting that they are disappointed?

    These kind of posts just try to place the blame on the players.

    Because it is the players fault.  How about people taking some personal responsibility for themselves?

    If one is the pre-purchase type then how much more needed to be available?  If someone is going get all bent because they don't like something then maybe they should wait until they can try it before buying?  How hard is it to use a little common sense?

    On top of all that ANet honored refunds.

    So I can see disappointed or ambivalent, but cheated?  That's ridiculous.

  • FoomerangFoomerang Portland, ORPosts: 5,565Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Torvaldr

    Originally posted by grimal

    Originally posted by Roxtarr If anyone didn't know what they were getting into when they bought the game, they didn't do their research.  There were more blogs, videos and websites about this game than just about anything that has come out in recent history.
    How do you explain all the "fans" whom did all that research and now posting that they are disappointed? These kind of posts just try to place the blame on the players.
    Because it is the players fault.  How about people taking some personal responsibility for themselves?

    If one is the pre-purchase type then how much more needed to be available?  If someone is going get all bent because they don't like something then maybe they should wait until they can try it before buying?  How hard is it to use a little common sense?

    On top of all that ANet honored refunds.

    So I can see disappointed or ambivalent, but cheated?  That's ridiculous.


    +1

    You know we debate and dissect every minute feature of every mmo on this site. From the moment it is announced, to 10+ years after release. To say you are duped or caught unaware is laughable. I know more about mmos Ive never played than a normal person
    should.

    Besides, accepting responsibility for how you spend your money and time is... well thats just what adults do.

  • ConnmacartConnmacart OsloPosts: 681Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Foomerang

     


    Originally posted by Torvaldr

    Originally posted by grimal

    Originally posted by Roxtarr If anyone didn't know what they were getting into when they bought the game, they didn't do their research.  There were more blogs, videos and websites about this game than just about anything that has come out in recent history.
    How do you explain all the "fans" whom did all that research and now posting that they are disappointed? These kind of posts just try to place the blame on the players.
    Because it is the players fault.  How about people taking some personal responsibility for themselves?

     

    If one is the pre-purchase type then how much more needed to be available?  If someone is going get all bent because they don't like something then maybe they should wait until they can try it before buying?  How hard is it to use a little common sense?

    On top of all that ANet honored refunds.

    So I can see disappointed or ambivalent, but cheated?  That's ridiculous.


     

    +1

    You know we debate and dissect every minute feature of every mmo on this site. From the moment it is announced, to 10+ years after release. To say you are duped or caught unaware is laughable. I know more about mmos Ive never played than a normal person
    should.

    Besides, accepting responsibility for how you spend your money and time is... well thats just what adults do.

    The Players that did all that research and still felt cheated most likely should have done some research on themselves as well. 

  • timtracktimtrack StockholmPosts: 416Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Yamota

    Because a lot of us are waiting for the MMO to re-capture the feeling of the classic one's. However, it may be time to realise that this will not happen. Atleast not with ThemePark MMOs.

    As for 300 hours, I only got 160 hours out of it before I got bored. Still ok but not what I expected.

    The time for realization is now indeed.

    I feel a bit sorry for MMO-developers who are met with unreal expectations entierly based on every individual's one unique past feelings of "discovering my first real mmo".

    Will christmas ever again feel like it did was when you were 7?

    Will going to work every day ever feel like it did the first day of your first real job?

    Are you waiting for Metallica to sound like they used to?

     

    Guess why more recent MMO players are more exited about new games, and "fall for the hype"? They are you, back at that golden time.

  • Loke666Loke666 MalmöPosts: 18,019Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Rohn

    That's because it's not a singleplayer game - it's an MMO, and is therefore judged by MMO standards, one of which is longevity.

    Most MMOs in recent history have been bashed because players lost interested in playing them, just like many have with GW2.  The payment model doesn't really make a difference.  When playing an MMO, many players expect to become absorbed in the world, and their measure of success is how long they are interested in playing.

    Players have had similar criticisms of F2P games.  Even though they cost absolutely nothing to play, players still believe that if it doesn't hold their attention, it's a "bad" game.

    GW2 just doesn't have legs.  It's badly designed regarding long term interest.

    Is it really the games fault that most players seems to play them for a month?

    I still play GW2 after more than 300 hours, Rift on the other hand became boring after 12. That is not Rifts fault but mine, it felt like I played it and what it offered for endgame just wasnt my cup of tea.

    GW2 is not badly designed long term, it just aint your typoe of long term game.

    Then some games are just really badly done, or the devs thought they could use the same mechanics as Wow and EQ in sci-fi games which if it works is still far from optimal. Rift, GW2 and Tera all have worlds specifically made for the right mechanics and are well made, so if we dont like them it is our fault, the games just aint made for us. That goes really for TSW as well, but it could have been a bit better coded.

    Saying that GW2 suck because it isnt Asherons call 3 is rather stupid (not that I would mind if Turbine actually made AC3), they arew different games and the fact that noone makes more classic kinds of MMOs is not GW2s fault.

    GW2 is not perfect, far from it but it is well made and I think at least most of the players got out their $60, some of us got a lot more out of it.

  • RimmersmanRimmersman MonacoPosts: 885Member
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

    I don't feel cheated, i've never felt cheated over any game i've bought, it's always been my choice to buy the game. As for GW2 i don't think many who don't share your love feel cheated they just feel it's not a very good game.

    Time to except that not everyone like your game.You put 300 hours in, bully for you.

    I lasted untl level 80 and had no desire to go through that senceless, lifeless unimaginative journey again. Strange isn't it, Ive palyed Vanguard for 5 plus years and have 5 atls,  three are level 55.

    Everytime i start another atl it feels like a new start but then Vanguards world is vast and i could stay in one area witout actually leveing until top level.

    image
  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,216Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by timtrack
    Are you waiting for Metallica to sound like they used to?

    I chuckled seriously.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon

    The great thing of GW2 is that you never know what you gonna get from your play session.

    What started as a quick session after dinner to just get the last few things for the daily achievment ended in being a 3 hour long session.

    It all started with "Lets go finish that Harathi Hinterlands (a mid level zone) while finishing the daily" and ended in event after event in the top right corner of that map where around 10 players just went raiding the centaur camps.

    It progressed with bumping with some other players while I fetched the last 3 or 4 PoIs in the middle of centaur outposts scattered around the region, including one where I jumped in a water body to escape a Centaur Champion and being surrounded by 10 barracudas but fortunately 2 players materialized beside me.

    Finaly the session ended with me saving some soldiers from spider coccoons while running to the last PoI and be pursued by a ton of spiders that kept popping as I trashed each coccoon. That triggered the Gargantum spider event, but I saw no players so I just kept going to the PoI. Then I shouted in map that the event was up. Another warrior shown up and was bashing the champion spider while I "tanked" it with my Mace/Shield healing shouts spec. The other warrior went down a few times so I had to rezz him. An elementalist soon appeared and the Spider went down after losing interest in me and keep focusing on the other warrior.

    I didn't plan any of that - just wanted some gatherings and a couple of different mob kills for the daily.

    That is why I like in GW2 - wandering around with no long term goals (eventually legenday weapons will happen, but it isn't a focused effort).

    300+ hours and counting, and of that 250 is only in the warrior.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • MeridionMeridion HeidelbergPosts: 1,490Member
    Originally posted by bcbully

    60 bucks gives yeh 300 hours. How can you beat that.

     

    There is no way someone could make the argument that 300 hours of entertainment isn't worth $60. From that stand point you can't be wrong. I guess people let the hype leading into cause them to lose sight of the golden rule. "If it sounds to good to be true, it probably is."

    With LotRO Lifetime Account... =P

    Got me 292 days (=3504 hours) of gameplay for 150 bucks, all expansions for free via cash shop points and still running...

    M

  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

    The great thing of GW2 is that you never know what you gonna get from your play session.

    Reminds me in beta, when I wanted to run from Black Citadel to Divinity's Reach just to see how much time it would take (without using the Asura gates, obviously)... I ended stopping for dozens of events, and it took me like 6 hours for that trip :)

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

    image

  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,986Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

    I feel cheated because of this....

    https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/gw2/Perpetual-bar-brawl-what-happened-to-it

    I hate it when devs make false promises. Only difference is that FC not only made false promises but went one step ahead and printed it on back of the box. Devs need to stop fooling their player base.

     

  • dariuszpdariuszp PrzeworskPosts: 182Member
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

    They bought game because of some internet evangelist and their imagination was running wild. They they colide with hard reality. Something like that.

    People who knew what to expect got what we paid for and I'm glad I did. Everyone else - screw them. 

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by dariuszp
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

    They bought game because of some internet evangelist and their imagination was running wild. They they colide with hard reality. Something like that.

    People who knew what to expect got what we paid for and I'm glad I did. Everyone else - screw them

    Actually thank them for paying and not using bandwidth (although bandwidth is pennies).

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by dariuszp
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

    They bought game because of some internet evangelist and their imagination was running wild. They they colide with hard reality. Something like that.

    People who knew what to expect got what we paid for and I'm glad I did. Everyone else - screw them

    Actually thank them for paying and not using bandwidth (although bandwidth is pennies).

    Hehe yeah... actually, the more... how to put that without getting infracted? "funny"? - actually, the more "funny" ones are those who were already bashing the game big time during the whole beta, and STILL bought the game... I guess to be able to complain more about a game they already knew was not for them. I thank those people for giving their money to ANet and for supporting the game I enjoy - they know who they are ;-)

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

    image

  • ForumPvPForumPvP KingstownPosts: 871Member
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
    Originally posted by kishe
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

    I feel cheated because of this....

    https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/gw2/Perpetual-bar-brawl-what-happened-to-it

    I hate it when devs make false promises. Only difference is that FC not only made false promises but went one step ahead and printed it on back of the box. Devs need to stop fooling their player base.

     

    Thats pure gold right there.

    First theres a guy asking simple thing "where is this feature"

    then comes forum troll coling hijacking his thread "halloween is coming"

    then comes his alter egos and viral marketers "im so excited,way to go colin"

    then people are like "amazing Anet"

    and soon people are like "but where is those bar fights?? "

     

    Let's internet

  • Vunak23Vunak23 In your house eatin'' your cookies, FLPosts: 635Member

    While it is a great thing you got a decent amount of time from the money you spent. MMO's and Single player games can't be looked at in the same light. Here is another reason the B2P model shouldn't be done. 

    A single player game has a set amount of entertainment it has to offer. Once you hit that cap, the game is over and finished. You feel satisfied with your purchase because that is all you expected out of the game in the first place. An aside to occupy time with an interactive story.

    MMO's are different in nature as they are a lasting enjoyment. When people drop money on an MMO, they expect it to occupy there time for a long period of time. Thats what the additional service costs are for. Now in GW2's defence they don't charge the premium so they have no obligation to extend your time in the game (B2P/F2P models have that luxury). Which is where I believe the "I feel cheated" sentiment is coming from. 

    If you look at the trend of MMO's, most in the last few years should have gone B2P or F2P to start. Thats why we are seeing them change business models now. The MMO's of today haven't been able to justify the subscription cost because they don't have the capability to sustain a players interest for long periods of time, at a time. Content can't keep up. 

    Whether we will see MMO's of old coming back that justify the subscription cost is yet to be seen. But I think with games like ArcheAge, WoD, Elder Scrolls Online (renewed faith after the video seen yesterday),  and possibly EQ:Next from what Smedley has said of it (not that I believe a word he says)....we may see a return of premium AAA titles that do infact justify that sub price. 

    "In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  • StarIStarI Mount EverestPosts: 926Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by grimal

    This is pretty accurate.  I guess the biggest obstacle for many to overcome is that this is a very casual MMO.  So casual and lightweight that it blurs the line between coop multiplay and MMO.  

    Price has never been an issue with this game.  I think people would have gladly payed more than $60 for something with a bit more meat at its core.  

    It's a good fun video game but it is like night and day difference from classic MMOs (such as EQ, UO, SWG).

    This is like an MMO appetizer....a poo-poo platter.  Has a little of this, little of that, some of this.  Tastes really good but it's not that filling.  More of a sampling of some aspects of the genre.

     

    A poo-poo platter,

    lol.

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by chryses

    I have got my monies worth and just taking a break to play XCOM and that is why I love GW2. I will definitely go back to it but not pressured to use up sub.

    As for feeling cheated I personally think its a generation thing. When I started playing games we used 51/4 inch floppies and you were winning if the game even worked.  Then you had to work with a monochrome 256x screen with beeps as sound effects.  I know where games have come from and I really really appreciate the modern games out there.

    If you haven't started from the beginning then you can feel cheated as you always wan't to be dazzled.  I think older gamers are more appreciative because we know how crap games were!

    However, I do feel games have lost that old school feeling that came with Elite, Master of Orion 2, Bards Tale (1980's), Wizadry fallout, Baldurs Gate, Privateer etc.  They seemed to be closely aligned to D&D or role playing games and had that intense feeling.  Today games are more like smack a mole.

    Best post I've read in a while.

    I think with mmorpgs - if you sink 300 hours into a game, you may have got your money, but if you end it there, you feel that those 300 hours did not meet the expectation of a mmorpg, that is 3 hrs, 30 hrs, 300 hrs, 3000 hrs - the virtual world is always interesting in some way.

  • jondifooljondifool cphPosts: 1,114Member
    Originally posted by kishe
    I dont understand why some people feel cheated ?
    Considering I paid the price of an normal singleplayer game and got to 300 hours played before said "Done!" I feel I've gotten my 60 dollars worth of entertainment.

     

    What ever players reason for being disappointe is could differ alot amd some well feel cheated because they reasonable was lead to belive that the game could deliver what they expected. 

    I did also get my 60 dollars worth of entertainment. And i don't feel cheated, but i feel disapointed so far. Mostly because the type of gamer i am, did actual get a much better game from GW1 and nothing prepared me for that.

    I still have hope that in the end GW2 could get there where i get my expectation satisfied. But it require alot work and a change of focus, back to some of the qualities that was aboundant in GW1.

     

     

    read how to create a succesfull mmo before posting about GW2. And read tao of ArenaNet before talking about innovation in GW2

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