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Opinions So far on the beta

daveospicedaveospice Olympia, WAPosts: 349Member Uncommon

I just have to say, it at times can be a very fun game when you finally get the right ideas to be able to craft some interesting things, and start settling down in your own little city.

 

Getting to that point?  Boy.  Oh boy.  It's a grind.  A extremely tedious and boring grind.  Your first 5-10 hours will be spent wandering around, looking for the things you need to improve your skills.

Then you'll get to the point where walnuts and smooth stones just don't do you any good (or the first tier crafted items, either).

Pretty soon you need prospector tools and such to raise mine and mountain, etc.... 

this is where the game takes a turn for the worst.  The game has the habit of giving you all but one of the ingredients you need to finish something, so you end up having a full inventory of "almost completed" goods.  This means you can't pick anything new up, and you spend most your time just hoping you get lucky and it spawns (i.e. course salt, lime, or indian feathers).  This to me is a very annoying mechanic, especially considering you can't expand your inventory.

 

The next annoying mechanic is that you have 15-20 skills you need to "level up".  So you use this awesome item you got, and it gives you 2000 of five of those skills.  You have to pick one, and then you lose all the other gains you got.  So you are constantly feeling this underwhelming "ughh" every time you need to level a skill, especially when like the above situation it is an item very difficult to get, and if you don't use it and need to keep it it just sits in your inventory, taking up space.

 

Settling down is the third, and last annoying thing.  Lets be honest.  This game so far, doesn't have very good defenses for stopping people from looting your town/city.  I don't even bother anymore storing anything in my little hut because it gets looted while I'm at work.  So might as well just remain mobile.

Permadeath?  More like permaneverplayagain.  The game is "fun" the first time through.  I couldn't imagine going through this grind a 2nd time, just because some player who's most likely rediculously higher level and grinded to higher skills than you decided to enforce his will.    Not to mention the combat is so horrendous, I couldn't imagine even having PVP in this game!! WTF! Have you tried the combat?! lol

 

Anyway that's my rant/experience so far.  I like these types of games, big Harvest Moon fan, I liked Wurm until I realized nothing new was being added & had experienced everything.

 

Where this game really suffers is that it doesn't give the player the ability to be creative.  You are given replicas of what you CAN make, and that's it.  This isn't minecraft.  You're not going to make something cool, you're going to have all the same things as everyone else.  You can't even expand your house.

Where Wurmonline lets you do everything at the beginning of the game, but poorly...  this game lets you do nothing.  You are basically playing the game to unlock the ability to play the game.  It makes no sense at all. 

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Comments

  • BiskopBiskop AvalonPosts: 709Member Uncommon
    Couldn't agree more. Salem could have been so cool, but it turned out to be just a long an boring grind in an ugly world.

    I especially agree with your last paragraphs. What's the point of a "crafting mmo" in which you can't make anything yourself but just grind to unlock premade recipes?
  • daveospicedaveospice Olympia, WAPosts: 349Member Uncommon
    Not to mention that yes you can place a city anywhere, but if you do just place it "anywhere" you're going to be hurting later on.  If you're not near a clay deposit, a salt deposit, water, etc...  you're going to find life to be extremely harsh, and the grind even more horrible.  So you will find the wilderness void of life, until you come across good home spots, and then that's where everyone is.  Why bother making the rest of the world when you're so dependant on the spots already created?
  • IchmenIchmen Winnipeg, MBPosts: 1,228Member Uncommon

    clearly you have not played their first game (haven and hearth) salam is using a vast majority of that game's systems. so much so one of my error tickets was tagged as haven... lol.

     

    while i never did get my salam beta to download/install even on my other pc. both HnH and salam will always suffer from the same issue, you have to grind items just to gain points for skills you have to grind to beable to grind skills.. 

    its like pumping gas, just to learn/unlock the ability to pump gas so you can pump the needed gas you need to level up and pump more gas... for that epic gas pumping pump of gases...

     

    while i cant really speak on salam (my view on it is mixed after reading alot of the stuff players have posted on the offical forums, as well as watching a few of the LPs for it people have done.  it seems enjoyable on paper but given how much of a pain death is in havan i cant see the death being kinder in salam, seeing as its 10x harder to level skills it seems, as haven you can shove items in for Lp and bank it for use to unlock many skills where salam you dump the whole works on 1 stat buff or 1 skill. 

     

    both games though will have their following.  its not exactly a game you just randomly pick up and love you have to really like these styles of games to enjoy it.  its not really a crafting mmo or a pvp mmo.. its kinda a inbetween, crafting can be fun i would assume if they improved crafting from the crap havan has. doesnt sound like you have to "learn" every item to learn a skill  like havan has..

    salam really isnt a game for everyone, mostly a game for diehards of the style.

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  • CaldrinCaldrin CwmbranPosts: 4,505Member Uncommon

    Well i did start it up I had some kind of naked baby as a character.. then i quit.. not had the time to get into it really..

    Thats also an issue because i will find it very hard to get into with the character model style they have gone with.. i really dont get why they did that.. i can handle the bad graphics but the character models make me puke..

     

  • HodoHodo Raeford, NCPosts: 542Member
    Great review of the game.   If only things like this showed up on the main page more often.   The game isnt bad, but its far from great.   I gave it a solid 5 out of 10.  

    So much crap, so little quality.

  • LarsaLarsa NurembergPosts: 990Member

    Yeah, it's a very rough thing, just like Haven & Hearth is.

    Basically Salem is a 3d version of their older game, and I cannot even say it looks better than the older isometric one. Personally I think it doesn't.

    Apart from looks very little has changed, there's still the same progression method: crafting or gathering stuff to consume for skill-gain, cooking or gathering food to eat it for stat-gain. Only thing that has changed is that now you can eat without being hungry.

    Thus the game will suffer from the same problem Haven & Hearth has: armies of alts. But that's not only a problem but also a solution. Players have many characters in those two games so that it's no big deal when one of them dies. Alts are the cop-out in these two permadeath games.

    When your character is an expendable asset that is easily replaced it's no big deal to lose it.

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  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member Common

    The game seems incredibly primitive to me. As in the game systems themselves are primitive. It looks like a game from 1995 trying to look new and fresh, not like a game from 2012 trying to look retro. If that makes sense.

    I think they should go with the whole retro thing, but go at it from the perspective of a modern game. Instead of that wonky button thing in the lower, right hand corner, do the usual action bar(s) across the bottom and for the love of Cthulhu, fix the stupid camera.

    Basically, I think different is good, but they've gone full different, and I can't relate to it.

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  • daveospicedaveospice Olympia, WAPosts: 349Member Uncommon

    this game suffers from ?WHY? syndrome.  I could learn prospecting/mining, but why?  So I can make weapons.  Why?  So I can kill deer.  Why?  So I can gain skills.  Why?  The same action redressed isn't something new.  When will game developers understand that changing the icon of an item, even though it has the same functionality of everything else in the game does not actually add content.

     

    Anyway, I have an extra beta key if someone wants one.  You'll have to talk with me on vent and play with me in the evenings, though :)

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 14,247Member Rare

    Salem was fun for me until I joined a town. The town was built, and had everything. More importantly, the people in the town seemed like really awesome people. However, they were all far beyond me in skills and resources. There was nothing i could contribute to the group that they didn't already have in spades. Progression shifted from discovering new things and building up a small homestead to trying to catch up in order to be able to contribute anything meaningful to the game I was now playing. It simply killed the game for me.

     

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
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  • daveospicedaveospice Olympia, WAPosts: 349Member Uncommon
    I had the same problem with other games of this type like wurm Online.  You basically can't be social, or it ruins the game lol
  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour SwedenPosts: 2,155Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Loktofeit
    Salem was fun for me until I joined a town. The town was build, and had everything. More importantly, the people in the town seemed like really awesome people. However, they were all far beyond me in skills and resources. There was nothing i could contribute to the group that they didn't already have in spades. Progression shifted from discovering new things and building up a small homestead to trying to catch up in order to ve avle to contribute anything meaningful to the game i was now playing. It simply killed the game for me.  

     

    Once you join a town, the "discovery phase" is over and it becomes a game about politics, attacking, defending, hunting down criminals, doing criminal activity  etc. while doing some mandatory daily work to keep the town characters growing.

     

    As for contributing to the group: there is probably nothing you and only you but noone else can contribute with, but there is tons of work to be done such as:

     

    • Feeding the turkey coops.
    • Preparing, harvesting and sorting farm-related products. 
    • Ore smelting.
    • Wall-building.
    • Preparing, harvesting and sorting gardening products.
    There will always be work to be done and if there isn't, it means your town is not being as efficient as it can be and is underproducing.
     
    I can imagine a lot of people will not enjoy having to do this mandatory work everyday just to do their part. I would estimate it to be 1-2 hours daily just working before you a free to do other stuff like attacking/defending/hunting criminals/doing criminal activity etc.
     
    I know I didn't have the time anymore so I quit as well.

     

     

  • SirBalinSirBalin Joppa, MDPosts: 1,230Member Uncommon
    I love the idea of this game, having to guard your holding, etc.  Would be fun to have a small group you play with making up 5 in the day and 5 in the night with the goal of holding down a small hideout, then raiding other peoples hideouts and keeps to live.  Sounds amazing.

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  • VolnusVolnus Chandler, AZPosts: 39Member
    They found a way to make monecraft into an mmorpg
  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 14,247Member Rare
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Loktofeit
    Salem was fun for me until I joined a town. The town was build, and had everything. More importantly, the people in the town seemed like really awesome people. However, they were all far beyond me in skills and resources. There was nothing i could contribute to the group that they didn't already have in spades. Progression shifted from discovering new things and building up a small homestead to trying to catch up in order to ve avle to contribute anything meaningful to the game i was now playing. It simply killed the game for me.

    Once you join a town, the "discovery phase" is over and it becomes a game about politics, attacking, defending, hunting down criminals, doing criminal activity  etc. while doing some mandatory daily work to keep the town characters growing.

    As for contributing to the group: there is probably nothing you and only you but noone else can contribute with, but there is tons of work to be done such as:

    • Feeding the turkey coops.
    • Preparing, harvesting and sorting farm-related products. 
    • Ore smelting.
    • Wall-building.
    • Preparing, harvesting and sorting gardening products.
    There will always be work to be done and if there isn't, it means your town is not being as efficient as it can be and is underproducing.
     
    I can imagine a lot of people will not enjoy having to do this mandatory work everyday just to do their part. I would estimate it to be 1-2 hours daily just working before you a free to do other stuff like attacking/defending/hunting criminals/doing criminal activity etc.
     
    I know I didn't have the time anymore so I quit as well.

    Thanks for the info. Yeah, there is definitely madatory work that needs to be done on a daily basis to keep the town running, but that's not realy what I'm looking for from a game, even from a sim like Salem. Xsyon is much like Salem in this regard, which is a shame because when joining a village/town in both games I found really great people to play with - there just wasn't anything to play, only checklists of daily chores as I grind to level up in hopes of being able to contribute something meaningful or join in something enjoyable in the game.

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • daveospicedaveospice Olympia, WAPosts: 349Member Uncommon
    join me in wurm online.  I've gone back to it and it's quite fun!  I'm playing on one of the epic servers.  Message me for details
  • StarIStarI Mount EverestPosts: 974Member Uncommon

    I got a key yesterday and decided to  give it a spin.

    And hell was I pleasantly surprised. Nothing groundbreaking but so much fun being a newb in a dangerous world yet not too dangerous since there have been 2 new servers opened a couple of days ago.

    I know it's too early for me too have any "real" impressions but the first one is great. Quickly forgot about weird graphics after I met some people and immersed myself in exploring and getting lost looking for stuff.

  • BizkitNLBizkitNL NetherlandsPosts: 2,302Member Uncommon

    I just can't grasp why one would choose "crappy 3d" over 2d graphics. They should have just improved the 2d look of H&H.

    10
  • IchmenIchmen Winnipeg, MBPosts: 1,228Member Uncommon

    im not liking the graphics either. and the random hills are pissing me off, i go to harvest some grass for a cerio and i get stuck in a climbing animation. preventing me from harvesting anything.  but salem for me suffers the same problem hnh did, its boring as fk. as i tend to hermit as i dont trust people either game.  its rather dull. like playing CS 1.6 on an empty server. 

    graphics really need an overhaul though. i accepted hnh as it was old and graphics suited it. salem is new and the graphics are worse then minecraft's defaults. i shouldnt have to rely on community made texture packs for salem to improve the defaults ( minecraft i use HD  packs only because mc was not built with hd inmind at the start) :/ 

     

    also the default client is HORRIBLE... like WOW.. rip my eyes out >>"  i see why people are always promoting bd or ender client over seatribe's ... ><" (its nice that none of the community clients work either.. all out of date fun times)

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  • Greymantle4Greymantle4 Posts: 809Member Uncommon

    The game needs a lot of work. I started today and was walking around trying to find mats climbing up and down hills and all of a sudden I ran out of one of those energy bars. Without that energy  I couldn't get out of the area I was in.  To make a long story short I was stuck and had to start over.

    I will pass for now and see if they can smooth out the starting experience which is poor at best. I'm only trying it out because I'm so bored with the standard MMO's we have today. I don't even like hardcare pvp but I'm so desperate for a crafting focused game here I am. 

  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member

    -Never could even get in the game =(

    I thought H and H was awesome so I am sure I would like it but the damn installer just doesnt like my PC (and my sys req are far above what this game needs)- Apparently others have had my problem as well and tech support is good but has no fix.

  • IchmenIchmen Winnipeg, MBPosts: 1,228Member Uncommon
    check your anti virus or firewall, both of mine hate salem's installer/patch thing. comodo hates when i try to run it, constant splash fails :/ took me awhile to get salam to even download its patches :/

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  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by Ichmen
    check your anti virus or firewall, both of mine hate salem's installer/patch thing. comodo hates when i try to run it, constant splash fails :/ took me awhile to get salam to even download its patches :/

    Yeah- Mu issue is the "verifying application" freeze. They said there isnt anything you can do =(

    Thanks though. I really want to play too but after downloading it will not verify. I hit their tech support (no fix- Its on Oracles end) and Oracles (blames them). Quite sad actually.

  • FromHellFromHell NY, NYPosts: 1,311Member
    Strangely this sounds fun to me, just got a key and will try it out

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  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by FromHell
    Strangely this sounds fun to me, just got a key and will try it out

    If its anything like H and H (which its based on) it will be a BLAST...For certain people.

  • zevni78zevni78 grimsbyPosts: 1,120Member Uncommon

    I agree with the OP 100%

     

    This is some of the worst basic design I've ever seen, they need to redo all the crafting UI, and ingredient and gathering balance. World navigation is a pain too, and the tutorial needs tons of work, got killed by a snake at the start, no indication of what to do, as you couldn't out run it.

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