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Smedley: "EverQuest Next will be the world's largest sandbox-style MMO ever made"

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  • pvpirlpvpirl Orlando, FLPosts: 167Member

    Whether or not EQ1 was a sandbox, which is a matter of opinion, EQNext WILL be a "sandbox-style" game, what that exactly means, however, is pure speculation..

    Having said that, going off of what we "know" so far, I'll stick my neck out and suggest EQN may be more "sandy" than ArcheAge, despite knowing orders of magnitude less of what EQN will offer.

    But now that I think about it, what level of importance will player-crafted weapons and armor have in a game that I presume will still place a high level of value on "named" or dropped items, I come to this conclusion based off of item implementation of SOE Player Studio.. thoughts?

    image

  • CalmOceansCalmOceans BergenPosts: 2,273Member

    Looked up whol was leading EQNext, it's Dave Georgeson and Terry michaels, I know both, Dave is the guy working for EQ2 now, and Terry michaels worked for EQ1.

     

    Now for some drama.....

    there was a hack once where some people managed to take down the zones in Everquest, they were able to crash any zone in the world, it often brought the whole server down. Might not seem like a big deal but because each time after the zone comes back online "mob placeholders" have a chance to respawn as a named, as anyone who played EQ knows. So people used this non-stop.

    Now, one day, someone noticed a ranger in the game that had raid gear, but there was no way he could have gotten it legitimately, there were no guilds on that server that progressed to those raids yet. When people asked he wouldn't respond how he got it, but eventually he said "a developer gave me all the stuff because I gave them hack code".

    So that became a huge ridiculous thread on the EQ forums, and people asked at Fan Faire from SoE to developers what was going on, apparently some developers thought giving this hacker free gear in return for his hacking code so they could fix it was a good idea, and according to people at fan faire, that guy was Terry Michaels who made that call.

    That hacker was afterwards banned I believe, but that was a serious mistake on the developer's part, you never negociate with hackers.

     

  • YizleYizle Atlanta, GAPosts: 517Member
    So when is mmorpg.com setting up an EQN page and forum?
  • CalmOceansCalmOceans BergenPosts: 2,273Member
    Originally posted by Yizle
    So when is mmorpg.com setting up an EQN page and forum?

    When this hits 100 pages lol, I don't know.

  • YizleYizle Atlanta, GAPosts: 517Member
    Yeah just odd we have to search other forums for EQN info still
  • NeherunNeherun St. MichelPosts: 278Member
    Originally posted by CalmOceans

    Looked up whol was leading EQNext, it's Dave Georgeson and Terry michaels, I know both, Dave is the guy working for EQ2 now, and Terry michaels worked for EQ1.

     

    Now for some drama.....

    there was a hack once where some people managed to take down the zones in Everquest, they were able to crash any zone in the world, it often brought the whole server down. Might not seem like a big deal but because each time after the zone comes back online "mob placeholders" have a chance to respawn as a named, as anyone who played EQ knows. So people used this non-stop.

    Now, one day, someone noticed a ranger in the game that had raid gear, but there was no way he could have gotten it legitimately, there were no guilds on that server that progressed to those raids yet. When people asked he wouldn't respond how he got it, but eventually he said "a developer gave me all the stuff because I gave them hack code".

    So that became a huge ridiculous thread on the EQ forums, and people asked at Fan Faire from SoE to developers what was going on, apparently some developers thought giving this hacker free gear in return for his hacking code so they could fix it was a good idea, and according to people at fan faire, that guy was Terry Michaels who made that call.

    That hacker was afterwards banned I believe, but that was a serious mistake on the developer's part, you never negociate with hackers.

     

     

    EQ is far away from being the only game where this has happened. Handing in an dub bug post-release usually leads to somekind of ingame reward, and a signing of someform of NDA.

     

    image

  • pvpirlpvpirl Orlando, FLPosts: 167Member


    Originally posted by CalmOceans

    Originally posted by Yizle So when is mmorpg.com setting up an EQN page and forum?
    When this hits 100 pages lol, I don't know.

    This. Until they cave to our demands under the sheer volume of this thread lol.

    image

  • HedeonHedeon GraestedPosts: 954Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by pvpirl

     


    Originally posted by CalmOceans

    Originally posted by Yizle So when is mmorpg.com setting up an EQN page and forum?
    When this hits 100 pages lol, I don't know.

     

    This. Until they cave to our demands under the sheer volume of this thread lol.

    tbh while there is nothing concrete about the game, they shouldnt, doesnt have as much as a screenshot or any sort of cover picture

  • mjr727mjr727 Lockport, ILPosts: 22Member

    The meaning of Sandbox doesn't really matter here.  The reason EQ1 worked like it did is because of the social draw.  You kept coming back because of the community you built.  You are not going to build rich communities in new games that can be soloed to max level.  How many hours did you spend sitting with a group and chatting while you waited to get an FBSS drop.  Was it because the content was just utterly amazing?  No.

    Start with a very addicting community aspect,  great guild systems and big perks for grouping.  Actually, make soloing very difficult.  The rest of your beautiful grand design should be built off of that.

  • xpowderxxpowderx Radcliff, KYPosts: 2,131Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by rungard

    I knew it. This announcement deserves the creation of a dedicated forum. All SWG/sandbox players rejoice.

    Hopefully a AAA home is on the way.

    I loved SWG, if EQ Next is anything like SWG-PreCU then im IN!!

  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,947Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by xpowderx
    Originally posted by rungard

    I knew it. This announcement deserves the creation of a dedicated forum. All SWG/sandbox players rejoice.

    Hopefully a AAA home is on the way.

    I loved SWG, if EQ Next is anything like SWG-PreCU then im IN!!

    It won't be.

    "Sandbox style game" is being used strictly as a marketing term, and it can mean different things to different people (and thus why it is a good marketing term). Which is exactly why Smed used it: to drum up hype.

    What EQN will most likely be is another level based, quest driven, themepark, albeit more non-linear than the offerings of late.

    It may be large, it may be non-linear, but it will have a long way to go before it is approaching anything sandbox. And SOE has none of the people that made the previous generation of sandbox games, except a few hold overers that wrecked SWG and are not talented enough to work anywhere else.

    And as to anything approaching the level of sandboxishness of SWG, good effin luck. No Koster, no way.

    No one should have high expectations for EQN at all.

     

  • rungardrungard st. john''s, NFPosts: 1,035Member
    Originally posted by Burntvet
    Originally posted by xpowderx
    Originally posted by rungard

    I knew it. This announcement deserves the creation of a dedicated forum. All SWG/sandbox players rejoice.

    Hopefully a AAA home is on the way.

    I loved SWG, if EQ Next is anything like SWG-PreCU then im IN!!

    It won't be.

    "Sandbox style game" is being used strictly as a marketing term, and it can mean different things to different people (and thus why it is a good marketing term). Which is exactly why Smed used it: to drum up hype.

    What EQN will most likely be is another level based, quest driven, themepark, albeit more non-linear than the offerings of late.

    It may be large, it may be non-linear, but it will have a long way to go before it is approaching anything sandbox. And SOE has none of the people that made the previous generation of sandbox games, except a few hold overers that wrecked SWG and are not talented enough to work anywhere else.

    And as to anything approaching the level of sandboxishness of SWG, good effin luck. No Koster, no way.

    No one should have high expectations for EQN at all.

     

     Your name says it all. Im not nearly as fargone as you probabally are, so i still have hope. :)

  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,947Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by rungard
    Originally posted by Burntvet
    Originally posted by xpowderx
    Originally posted by rungard

    I knew it. This announcement deserves the creation of a dedicated forum. All SWG/sandbox players rejoice.

    Hopefully a AAA home is on the way.

    I loved SWG, if EQ Next is anything like SWG-PreCU then im IN!!

    It won't be.

    "Sandbox style game" is being used strictly as a marketing term, and it can mean different things to different people (and thus why it is a good marketing term). Which is exactly why Smed used it: to drum up hype.

    What EQN will most likely be is another level based, quest driven, themepark, albeit more non-linear than the offerings of late.

    It may be large, it may be non-linear, but it will have a long way to go before it is approaching anything sandbox. And SOE has none of the people that made the previous generation of sandbox games, except a few hold overers that wrecked SWG and are not talented enough to work anywhere else.

    And as to anything approaching the level of sandboxishness of SWG, good effin luck. No Koster, no way.

    No one should have high expectations for EQN at all.

     

     Your name says it all. Im not nearly as fargone as you probabally are, so i still have hope. :)

    Nothing wrong with hope, and I'll be the first one to I admit I am wrong, if I am (but I doubt it).

    That said, blind optimism is probably not warranted in regards to a company/Smed with such a terrible history of over-promising and under-delivering.

     

  • rungardrungard st. john''s, NFPosts: 1,035Member
    Originally posted by Burntvet
    Originally posted by rungard
    Originally posted by Burntvet
    Originally posted by xpowderx
    Originally posted by rungard

    I knew it. This announcement deserves the creation of a dedicated forum. All SWG/sandbox players rejoice.

    Hopefully a AAA home is on the way.

    I loved SWG, if EQ Next is anything like SWG-PreCU then im IN!!

    It won't be.

    "Sandbox style game" is being used strictly as a marketing term, and it can mean different things to different people (and thus why it is a good marketing term). Which is exactly why Smed used it: to drum up hype.

    What EQN will most likely be is another level based, quest driven, themepark, albeit more non-linear than the offerings of late.

    It may be large, it may be non-linear, but it will have a long way to go before it is approaching anything sandbox. And SOE has none of the people that made the previous generation of sandbox games, except a few hold overers that wrecked SWG and are not talented enough to work anywhere else.

    And as to anything approaching the level of sandboxishness of SWG, good effin luck. No Koster, no way.

    No one should have high expectations for EQN at all.

     

     Your name says it all. Im not nearly as fargone as you probabally are, so i still have hope. :)

    Nothing wrong with hope, and I'll be the first one to I admit I am wrong, if I am (but I doubt it).

    That said, blind optimism is probably not warranted in regards to a company/Smed with such a terrible history of over-promising and under-delivering.

     

     they did create eq...which was a great game until raiding took over...you have to give them a little credit.

  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,947Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by rungard
    Originally posted by Burntvet
    Originally posted by rungard
    Originally posted by Burntvet
    Originally posted by xpowderx
    Originally posted by rungard

    I knew it. This announcement deserves the creation of a dedicated forum. All SWG/sandbox players rejoice.

    Hopefully a AAA home is on the way.

    I loved SWG, if EQ Next is anything like SWG-PreCU then im IN!!

    It won't be.

    "Sandbox style game" is being used strictly as a marketing term, and it can mean different things to different people (and thus why it is a good marketing term). Which is exactly why Smed used it: to drum up hype.

    What EQN will most likely be is another level based, quest driven, themepark, albeit more non-linear than the offerings of late.

    It may be large, it may be non-linear, but it will have a long way to go before it is approaching anything sandbox. And SOE has none of the people that made the previous generation of sandbox games, except a few hold overers that wrecked SWG and are not talented enough to work anywhere else.

    And as to anything approaching the level of sandboxishness of SWG, good effin luck. No Koster, no way.

    No one should have high expectations for EQN at all.

     

     Your name says it all. Im not nearly as fargone as you probabally are, so i still have hope. :)

    Nothing wrong with hope, and I'll be the first one to I admit I am wrong, if I am (but I doubt it).

    That said, blind optimism is probably not warranted in regards to a company/Smed with such a terrible history of over-promising and under-delivering.

     

     they did create eq...which was a great game until raiding took over...you have to give them a little credit.

    Which was almost 15 years ago. (And you did bring up the fact that SOE ruins all of their games eventually, which is a fact.)

    And most all of the people that made it are long gone, and everything SOE has touched for the last 5-7 years has been lousy.

    As has their F2P conversions.

    I have heard from people playing PS2 that that game is "decent" but it is not released yet and no one knows what the cash shop and F2P restrictions will look like. And more importantly in regards to EQN, PS2 is not even an MMO so much as a larger FPS game.

    None of which means anything in regards to making a "sandbox style" MMO.

     

  • koboldfodderkoboldfodder Danbury, DEPosts: 390Member Uncommon

    This thread has something like 80 pages and is still very much alive.  Are there any other threads on this forum that have this much activity.  That alone shows you what people thought of SOEs games.  Whether you liked them or hate them, you cannot ignore them.  They are front and center, and they know how to make games and business models.

     

    There are plenty of people who will gladly give SOE their gaming money.  Whether they played EQ or EQ2 or both.  Even SWG ex players will gladly give SOE gaming money to play a sandbox type game.

     

    When I first found out about EQ Next, I thought "why bother".  EQ2 was made and remade shortly after relases and is a pretty successful game.  There is no way EQ Next could be anything but an updated version of EQ2.  Now Smedley goes and pulls the plug on the project because he knew there was no way it could be anything but an updated version or EQ2.

     

    That has me very much intrigued.  The guy actually knows why players did not flock to EQ2 as they did EQ1, and he knows why everyone left SWG.

     

    They could have a big time game on their hands if they make a stable, SWG like gaming experience in the EQ world and focus on sandbox elements.  Big time game.

  • rungardrungard st. john''s, NFPosts: 1,035Member

    my ideas for eqnext advancement (until we have a forum, this is the forum)

    My idea of advancement is a 4 line model. In traditional mmos you have a single level. My idea expands this to 4, and we move away from the hard levels and instead call them lines where players can invest xp.

    Each line has a specific focus that is ingrained into the lore of the game. The lines are Race, Class, Deity, Survival. All lines would have a minor time based component (30%) and an earned based component (70%).

    Race:

    The race line has is primarily interested in your physical and mental base stats, a number of passive racial abilities and some activatable abilities.

    Improving this line would enable you to improve on basic stats such as strength, intelligence, wisdom, dexterity etc, and would also have selected resistances that could be improved (based on the race). Passive abilities which could be invested in would include things like infravision, health and mana regeneration, and other abilities unique or common to the races of eqnext. Activatable abilities would include things like the racial bash or sneak, dodge or jump which could be invested in.

    Class/job:

    The class line would be very familiar to original eq (by design to promote familiarity for old eq vets) and would have all the things you knew and loved about eq for any given class. This would include your spells, special class abilities and anything else class related. I would keep this similar to old eq1 on purpose as i think it would give a certain feel to it. The only difference would be that instead of levels you have to invest your exp into the different lines that the classes had.

    Deity:

    The deity line would be the main controller for death penalty and pvp. Unline the other lines the death penalty can increase and decrease (increase by staying alive and decrease by dying). You would still be able to invest the xp to unlock abilities in this line and they would stay unlocked  once you earn them, but you could only use them when you had enough " god love" in your deity meter. Thus if you unlocked a rank 7 skill, you could use the skill as long as your deity meter was at rank 7 or above. You can only lose xp from dying from the deity line. No other line is affected. PVP works the same way but the penalty is greatly reduced. The deity abilities are all centered around the specific norrath god you choose, and each rank has a number of skills to choose from that range from things like exp loss reduction to planar backpacks (unlootable) to soubbind items, to offensive, protection and defensive god abilities. This gives players a small ability to tailor the game to their liking in terms of pvp and death penalty rules. Note that if you choose all the protections you have to give up some other abilities so if your fully protected you wont have much or any offensive god based powers.

    Survival

    The survival line is the same for all players and includes things like direction sesning/compass, mapping, remote viewing magic, foraging, first aid, homehates, binding and other simple magics. As a player you stil have to invest to unlock the skills.

    Changing class

    Your choice for race and deity is final when you start the game. You can however change classes or jobs. What classes or jobs you can choose is dependant on your race and deity. For instance if your a dwarf and choose brell, you cannot ever be a shadowknight or necromancer. Each race/deity would have a number of choices but no race/deity could choose all the classes. This would be to give your character alot of longevity.

    When you change classes your original class doesnt dissapear. You can still use all the abilities of the old class at 50% strength (you wouldnt forget them), but you would also be limited in this regard by your choices of weapons and armor. So you wouldnt be doing much meteor storming in platemail and a huge axe.

    All the jobs or classes you accumulate become available at the same reduction, but on your character you are limited in your skill bar to 14 abilities on your combat bar so you could not have access to unlimited skills. Your non combat bar would also have 14 abilities.

    with so much to work on i would be it would take years to learn it all and provide near endless progression.  

    Anyhow , thats what id like to see. :)

     

    image

     

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Burntvet
    Planetside is a mmo
    It just isn't a rpg
  • pvpirlpvpirl Orlando, FLPosts: 167Member


    Originally posted by koboldfodder
    This thread has something like 80 pages and is still very much alive.  Are there any other threads on this forum that have this much activity.  That alone shows you what people thought of SOEs games.  Whether you liked them or hate them, you cannot ignore them.  They are front and center, and they know how to make games and business models. There are plenty of people who will gladly give SOE their gaming money.  Whether they played EQ or EQ2 or both.  Even SWG ex players will gladly give SOE gaming money to play a sandbox type game. When I first found out about EQ Next, I thought "why bother".  EQ2 was made and remade shortly after relases and is a pretty successful game.  There is no way EQ Next could be anything but an updated version of EQ2.  Now Smedley goes and pulls the plug on the project because he knew there was no way it could be anything but an updated version or EQ2. That has me very much intrigued.  The guy actually knows why players did not flock to EQ2 as they did EQ1, and he knows why everyone left SWG. They could have a big time game on their hands if they make a stable, SWG like gaming experience in the EQ world and focus on sandbox elements.  Big time game.

    AWESOME post!

    image

  • ice-vortexice-vortex Xenia, OHPosts: 951Member
    Originally posted by mjr727

    The meaning of Sandbox doesn't really matter here.  The reason EQ1 worked like it did is because of the social draw.  You kept coming back because of the community you built.  You are not going to build rich communities in new games that can be soloed to max level.  How many hours did you spend sitting with a group and chatting while you waited to get an FBSS drop.  Was it because the content was just utterly amazing?  No.

    Start with a very addicting community aspect,  great guild systems and big perks for grouping.  Actually, make soloing very difficult.  The rest of your beautiful grand design should be built off of that.

    I solo'ed to max level in Everquest. It was actually quite easy.

  • rungardrungard st. john''s, NFPosts: 1,035Member
    Originally posted by ice-vortex
    Originally posted by mjr727

    The meaning of Sandbox doesn't really matter here.  The reason EQ1 worked like it did is because of the social draw.  You kept coming back because of the community you built.  You are not going to build rich communities in new games that can be soloed to max level.  How many hours did you spend sitting with a group and chatting while you waited to get an FBSS drop.  Was it because the content was just utterly amazing?  No.

    Start with a very addicting community aspect,  great guild systems and big perks for grouping.  Actually, make soloing very difficult.  The rest of your beautiful grand design should be built off of that.

    I solo'ed to max level in Everquest. It was actually quite easy.

     the truth is that in original eq you could solo well with any caster class. Most melee classes couldnt solo as well (bards and shadowknights could). Eq gave you options though. Warriors were the worst if i remember correctly.

    For instance i played a cleric, which wasnt a  really strong soloer..unless you were soloing undead. If you were soloing a ghoul you were more powerful than a wizard. I know i could solo if i wanted well into Kunark. Not that i needed to, but it was there.

    most games these days are so shallow they dont even bother with different kinds of mobs, resistances, factions, or anything that made it interesting. Streamlined into suck.

    thats the essence i want to get back to. Not raids and not levels. The good stuff that made eq great.

     

    image

  • pvpirlpvpirl Orlando, FLPosts: 167Member

    I soloed a rogue using a combination of poisons, clickies, and the intimidation skill.

    I was deeply involved in the poison making skill in EQ, loved it, most people never even knew it existed.

    But I agree, (early) EQ had options, tactics, different approaches in which you could engage norrath, hell, the developers of EQ didn't even expect people to create camps and pull mobs...

    image

  • ice-vortexice-vortex Xenia, OHPosts: 951Member
    Originally posted by rungard
    Originally posted by ice-vortex
    Originally posted by mjr727

    The meaning of Sandbox doesn't really matter here.  The reason EQ1 worked like it did is because of the social draw.  You kept coming back because of the community you built.  You are not going to build rich communities in new games that can be soloed to max level.  How many hours did you spend sitting with a group and chatting while you waited to get an FBSS drop.  Was it because the content was just utterly amazing?  No.

    Start with a very addicting community aspect,  great guild systems and big perks for grouping.  Actually, make soloing very difficult.  The rest of your beautiful grand design should be built off of that.

    I solo'ed to max level in Everquest. It was actually quite easy.

     the truth is that in original eq you could solo well with any caster class. Most melee classes couldnt solo as well (bards and shadowknights could). Eq gave you options though. Warriors were the worst if i remember correctly.

    For instance i played a cleric, which wasnt a  really strong soloer..unless you were soloing undead. If you were soloing a ghoul you were more powerful than a wizard. I know i could solo if i wanted well into Kunark. Not that i needed to, but it was there.

    most games these days are so shallow they dont even bother with different kinds of mobs, resistances, factions, or anything that made it interesting. Streamlined into suck.

    thats the essence i want to get back to. Not raids and not levels. The good stuff that made eq great.

     

    image

     

    One of the key things that separate EQ and modern MMORPGs is the toughness of a single mob which directly effects the flow of the game. Instead of killing a lot of mobs in a short amount of time, you focused on one mob at a time. Anymore than one, even for a group in a dungeon, could spell disaster which is why crowd control was so important.

    As for levels, I like levels. Levels have been apart of the RPG genre since the first D&D pen and paper RPG.

  • ice-vortexice-vortex Xenia, OHPosts: 951Member
    Originally posted by pvpirl

    I soloed a rogue using a combination of poisons, clickies, and the intimidation skill.

    I was deeply involved in the poison making skill in EQ, loved it, most people never even knew it existed.

    But I agree, (early) EQ had options, tactics, different approaches in which you could engage norrath, hell, the developers of EQ didn't even expect people to create camps and pull mobs...

     

    Yep, a lot of what happened with Everquest's metagame was completely unexpected. Verant created a world and let the players figure out what to do in it. Camping a spawn and pulling mobs was the path to least resistance for leveling so it became standard. The boss mob at the end of the dungeon was just a really powerful mob and it was up to the players to figure out a way to bring it down. The developers never designed them with a pre-planned way to beat it.

  • mjr727mjr727 Lockport, ILPosts: 22Member
    Originally posted by ice-vortex
    Originally posted by rungard
    Originally posted by ice-vortex
    Originally posted by mjr727

    The meaning of Sandbox doesn't really matter here.  The reason EQ1 worked like it did is because of the social draw.  You kept coming back because of the community you built.  You are not going to build rich communities in new games that can be soloed to max level.  How many hours did you spend sitting with a group and chatting while you waited to get an FBSS drop.  Was it because the content was just utterly amazing?  No.

    Start with a very addicting community aspect,  great guild systems and big perks for grouping.  Actually, make soloing very difficult.  The rest of your beautiful grand design should be built off of that.

    I solo'ed to max level in Everquest. It was actually quite easy.

     the truth is that in original eq you could solo well with any caster class. Most melee classes couldnt solo as well (bards and shadowknights could). Eq gave you options though. Warriors were the worst if i remember correctly.

    For instance i played a cleric, which wasnt a  really strong soloer..unless you were soloing undead. If you were soloing a ghoul you were more powerful than a wizard. I know i could solo if i wanted well into Kunark. Not that i needed to, but it was there.

    most games these days are so shallow they dont even bother with different kinds of mobs, resistances, factions, or anything that made it interesting. Streamlined into suck.

    thats the essence i want to get back to. Not raids and not levels. The good stuff that made eq great.

     

    image

     

    One of the key things that separate EQ and modern MMORPGs is the toughness of a single mob which directly effects the flow of the game. Instead of killing a lot of mobs in a short amount of time, you focused on one mob at a time. Anymore than one, even for a group in a dungeon, could spell disaster which is why crowd control was so important.

    As for levels, I like levels. Levels have been apart of the RPG genre since the first D&D pen and paper RPG.

     

    Funny - I enjoy even reminiscing about EQ.  I really hope whatever they end up releasing can suck us back in :)

This discussion has been closed.