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Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?
I knew it would be a good game with some fresh ideas,but I never expected it to change the MMO world or direct it into a completely new direction
Biased poll. i wonder what the results would be if the question had been "do you think Gw2 has significantly altered the genre ", without all the hyperbole. Of all the points the op mentions im only going to focus on combat
Combat: moving around and being able to detect aoe effects, dynamic dodging, movement based attack skills that take you into and out of range while pushing a button....thats all "oh really" to you?. I tried Mop after and i felt as if i was fighting on a wheelchair.
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus Its never been called revolutionary
Now that is a paradigm shift in history rewrite levels.
Originally posted by Blackstar347 I think you are nitpicking a bit. Some might find it revolutionary others will not. Why should we care if some people out there don't find it a revolutionary game?
It doesn't work that way, you don't get to *find* it revolutionary. It either is or isn't, measured by the effect it has on it's field (genre, in this case).
If it is, we can't tell yet, but in any event, you don't just get to decide on a personal level.
In my opinion, it may spawn a B2P mini revolution, but as far as gameplay conventions go - nothing. Just nothing.
Currently playing Real Life..
For all your stalking needs..http://www.plurk.com/Random_
Originally posted by freston Biased poll. i wonder what the results would be if the question had been "do you think Gw2 has significantly altered the genre ", without all the hyperbole.
That's almost what "revolution" means. Not exaclty, but most people aren't naive enough to expect a sudden, extreme change just because a game succeeded. And yes, I do think GW2 changed the genre significatly, simply because it's the first "big" MMO since WoW that didn't fall flat on its face in one way or another and isn't a WoW clone. Like SWTOR proved that a big budget can't compensate for a lack of polish and innovation, GW2 proved that non-WoW MMOs can succeed.
AoC is the only other game since WoW's release that could've done this, but it got funcommed.
Exploration: Exploration is nice in GW2. Is it genre changing? In some aspects yes, in others no. I agree that the rewards are underwhelming though. They should scale better and give more incentive to do them. Structured PvP: is too bland for me. Only 1 gameplay style and it's Capture & Hold. The lobby browser is a backwards step in the genre, and it should have been an automatic grouping for random players, and organized teams could have used the lobby style system instead. WvW is fun for random pvp action, but it's sorely lacking for coordinated guild and group play. The features such as Commander needs a lot of work. This the main reason for the lack of teamplay. Rewards. I agree with this. They are very lackluster, especially the Daily rewards. Crafting is pretty good. I was able to craft gear and weapons every tier as i leveled up. Gathering materials was a hassle though, and i bought everything i needed from Trading Post when i had to. Dungeons disappointed me the most with this game. It was too much of a learning curve for new players. Story disappointed me too, especially after playing swtor. I just couldn't get into the awful voice-acting, but it was still good considering A-Net didn't have a big budget like Bioware. The actual characters and story in GW2 didn't interest me either, especially Traeherne. Combat is a welcome change for me. It's more action-focused, instead of standing still. I love the dodging mechanic too. Money Costs are ok. It's kind of pain for new players though, but once you hit 80, you shouldn't have problems with alts.
Exploration: Exploration is nice in GW2. Is it genre changing? In some aspects yes, in others no. I agree that the rewards are underwhelming though. They should scale better and give more incentive to do them.
You didn't have to call us fanbois/fangirls. I'm a fan, but also a critic. It's good to be balanced and see the pros and cons.
I dont think anyone, except maybe complete fools, thought it was going to just suddenly turn the entire genre on its head overnight like some people tend to imply about anyone who enjoys the game. But it is clear that it has had at least some effect on the genre, and several other currently in development games are using some similar features & mechanics (like active dodging, smaller sets of skills, combo fields , dynamic events, not relying on trinity & taunt mechanics). It got the wheels turning, it didnt revolutionize it. It was a step in the right direction for some players, but it isnt perfect. Other games will improve on and perfect the ideas of things that GW2 brought.
No, it wasn't. Honestly I feel like I was *almost* lied to.
Dynamic Events: Hearing everything I did about dynamic events made them seem like world changing and impactful. In reality they change the world for minutes, then it repeats over and over.
Trinity: Losing the trinity was a miss for me. I like the responsibility of keeping yourself alive, but it makes for horrid gameplay in groups. Nothing but zerging and since there is no real tank and healer the bosses are really lackluster and boring. This is where the trinity shines imo. You can have truly dynamic boss fights and make them unique in their own way. GW2? Stand there and spam abiltiies if you want. Sure you'll die, but just run back and repeat it.
Hearts: I still don't get these. The game would've done a lot better without them. It almost hurts more than it helps.
Economy: This is where the game makes me most angry. They set it up so you cannot buy low and sell high, and everything has a minimum price. Having every server connected was a mistake also. It would've done better if it was per server or split with like 3-4 servers making up each trading post. The price on everything is so low making money is a painful experience, but this is why ArenaNet wanted. They want to make their cash shop valuable, but doing it this way just annoys me.
Controls: Anyone who says they're good is lying to themself. They are truly horrid. I still don't understand even to this day why there is not a zoom in for the camera. Going into any tight spaced area is nothing but pure frustration. This is one thing WoW will always win on it seems. Their controls are 100% fluid and perfect.
Dungeons: I find dungeons to be pretty decent. They are at the right difficulty. My only issue is what I stated above. A lot of dungeons are tiny, so the camera comes into play and makes it annoying to fight them.
Orr: This is a hit or miss for a lot of people. I do like the zone, I do think it is deserving of a level 80 zone, but the respawns are out of control. You have around 40 seconds to move on after you fight something or you will begin to start getting swarmed.
Cash Shop: This is by far the best feature of GW2. I hope future F2P/B2P games follow suit. This is how you do a cash shop well. Any game that comes out if it isn't anywhere near like this one I won't touch it.
Overall the game is still a great. It easily beats out 99% of other MMOs that are on the market. The game still needs to evolve and grow, but I fear ArenaNet won't change certain things and that will end up hurting the game. The only thing GW2 changed imo is the cash shop. They have evolved it and other companies will need to step up if they want their games to be able to survive. I think the "revolutionary game" will have to be as much sandbox as it is themepark. You need to give the userbase the tools to do anything they want.
I think they did most what they aimed to do. And as it goes with any new thing - not all turns out to be actually better than old.
Only hyped fanboys thought the game will change the MMO genre in any other way it allready did : killing P2P MMO games
for one reason only the buy 2 play
nothing else can justify the subscription cost after gw2 it is extramly difficult to see any reason for a subscription
yeh some games out there will do things a little bit better but taken as a complete game vs a complete game
other than a scam for cash why do they have a sub
i personaly wont buy another mmo with a sub unless i seriously see somthing worth my subscription money and as gw2 in my opinion is in the top 1-3 mmos ever , it is going to be somthing really really special for me to purchase and pay a sub
so has gw2 been a revolution to me yes
Originally posted by freston Biased poll. i wonder what the results would be if the question had been "do you think Gw2 has significantly altered the genre ", without all the hyperbole. Of all the points the op mentions im only going to focus on combat Combat: moving around and being able to detect aoe effects, dynamic dodging, movement based attack skills that take you into and out of range while pushing a button....thats all "oh really" to you?. I tried Mop after and i felt as if i was fighting on a wheelchair.
Sorry but i think Tera's combat is way more engaging than GW2 imo.
Originally posted by zimboy69 yes for one reason only the buy 2 play nothing else can justify the subscription cost after gw2 it is extramly difficult to see any reason for a subscription yeh some games out there will do things a little bit better but taken as a complete game vs a complete game other than a scam for cash why do they have a sub i personaly wont buy another mmo with a sub unless i seriously see somthing worth my subscription money and as gw2 in my opinion is in the top 1-3 mmos ever , it is going to be somthing really really special for me to purchase and pay a sub so has gw2 been a revolution to me yes
Going by a recent poll on this site most prefer a subcription, B2P has hardly killed P2P like some are claiming.
Originally posted by Rimmersman Originally posted by zimboy69 yes for one reason only the buy 2 play nothing else can justify the subscription cost after gw2 it is extramly difficult to see any reason for a subscription yeh some games out there will do things a little bit better but taken as a complete game vs a complete game other than a scam for cash why do they have a sub i personaly wont buy another mmo with a sub unless i seriously see somthing worth my subscription money and as gw2 in my opinion is in the top 1-3 mmos ever , it is going to be somthing really really special for me to purchase and pay a sub so has gw2 been a revolution to me yes
Lol. I'd be surprised if the people on this site didn't want to pay a subscription. The people on this site represent a very small minority of the people who play MMOs. Taking the collective opinions of the people on this site and passing them off as some sort of measurement for MMO players as a whole is probably one of the most unintelligent things that can be done.
Actually it shows that the preference for P2P vs B2P / F2P is fairly evenly split, with just a few more % on the side of P2P (currently 53.9%). It also shows that more people are OK with a cash shop in either P2P, B2P, or F2P than completely against it.
You guys act like it was a landslide victory in an election, when really your favorite candidate barely scraped by with the win.
Originally posted by crosslee Do you still think GuildWars 2 was that "Revolutionary Game That Would Change The Genre"?.
What else can change the genre??
It been so long since something have change the MMO's . We have seen alot of cocie cutter mmo's. And i mean alot.
To me it looks like OP come up with his personal opinion of why the game doesn't catch him, but doesn't actual reflect on what the game does to the genre. Isn't his post actual offtopic to the question he raise?
I asume there is 2 kind of gamers. Casuals and Addicts. its a fact that GW2 is made for casuals.
If it can succesfull be the game for casuals and make money doing that, it is a genre changing game. Because so far most if not all mmo's have either tryed to go for the addicts, or just not been succesfull.
But that doesn't change the fact that addicts will often not like a casual game at all, and do alot to express their dislike and their utter disbelief of why someone is actual liking it. Alot of the regulars on MMORPG will not like GW2 simply because they are gaming addicts, in different states, yes, some even in recovery, but they are defently not casuals.
I play in a small guild with a circle of friends where i am the addict , and the rest is for sure casuals. They have tried more MMO's than i have though, they just don't hang in there with them 3 month after launch, becuase they are NOT addicts, but casuals, that moves on when a game require them to be addicts. What will show if GW2 is a revolutionary game is if this is the game they still play as casuals in a year.
i don't know if they will, but for sure the game looks like it is not forcing them to move on.
btw hardcore is a describtion that addicts gives them self, because no one likes to be called an addict.
read how to create a succesfull mmo before posting about GW2. And read tao of ArenaNet before talking about innovation in GW2
It does change some things.
First,it actually brings the "MMO" to the open world instead of the "MMO" in an instance.
Additionally it made every player an ally in PVE, removing factions and removing competition for resources.
It also changed "questing", from the method of delivering them to the way it rewards them.
It is also possible to craft the best items in the game instead of them being hidden in some instance.
There are also a number of things that aren't exactly exclusive to it but that aren't (or were at GW2 release date) very common in MMORPGs, like 3-side PvP, non gear based PvP, etc.
Currently playing: GW2Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
The poll could have been there without the nitpicking wall-of-text rant towards GW2.
Now this is just a nice strawman trick. You put up a huge 200 line whine with your hurt feelings in it, and then add a poll to show "hey 50% of the people agree with what i said" while the poll question isn't nessesarily connected to your list of (in my opinion) invalid arguments.
One could vote no on the poll, and still agree with 0% of the OP.
Originally posted by crosslee Long time reader on this website, but a starter poster To me many of Guildwars 2 "Revolutionary Gameplay" ideas are kinda sad and nothing new... just reused old ideas under a new shiny name. Read as: I'm another MMORPG.com whiner who just whine about everything. Please make attention to my whining thread. I missheard and missunderstand everything and now I'm saying something 100% stupid. Is it worth the 60$ simple answer for me yes because i do enjoy it as a quick pick up n play kinda game and it will always be there years later unless they pull the plug on servers of course lol. If it had a subscription attached to it, i Wouldn't even bother with it tbh. It's good for casual players to come on and get something done for an hour or two almost like a WoW Jr in that aspect. Exploration is kinda dull and un-rewarding half the time, minus the beautiful views of course and random 1 or 2 chests you find along the way. All the waypoints, hearts, points of interest all marked on your map ruins it. Plus some areas you stumble into while exploring might require a party to kill monster/monsters which is annoying if your solo or no one is around to help. Exploration is not about walking arround and finding dragon, big golden chests and super-hiper-all-powerfull swords in most obvious places (old remote cave because everyone left most expensive stuff there). There is more than 1-2 random chests. In just one area you can find chests if you notice and solve "jumping puzzle". Sometimes it's quite long. You should see my suprise that I found cave above cave with one small entry point that I noticed just because of lag (i jumped in wrong place and noticed it then). I find exploration really rewarding and interesting. Structured PvP is nice for an hour or two but then it gets boring. Can't make premade groups which is odd but understandable i guess. Again the accesiblilty is there for casuals to jump in and start playing but thats about it. I don't get an addiction for it like other mmo's PvP systems. *since i waited over an hour to eventually give up waiting for 9 more teams of five to join for it to start i forgot about tournaments being a vaible premade method for sPvP. If u can wait for others to play with you....that is. Maybe my server is dead idk. But what is your complain ? sPVP is like any other and I enjoy it just the same. I would welcome more modes but that's it. WvW is zerg here zerg there everywhere a zerg, plus what server has the most people online at the time you decide to go in. Trying to get in solo or with friends is a test of patience and time with the fact that you can't join que as a group so each person gets there own que timer to get in. There is no Estimated Time to show how long till your eligible to zone in. Yeah because when 3 realms clash with each other everyone stand in queue and kill each other in turns. Then they move to another castle or stay if they won and everything repeat itself. And there is always single individual that will single-handed take down a castle using sword, his mage friend, thief and ofcourse - cute little girl that will pose as healer. What manga are you reading ? Seriously What you see in World vs World is "mob fights". Bunch of brainless people just wanting to hit something. When our guild joined and create some hierarchy (someone barking orders by TS3, groups of mele, range etc, guys provided with money for siege equipment) and attack like you should (mele up front, range in the back etc) we had not problems dealing with anyone in WvsW. This is how it should be. From bunch of idiots some orginized teams rise. If your server have one you will notice because they will take down one fort after another. Because idiots on the other side rush to kill and forget to defend like they should. Rewards. Area rewards are horribly stupid, waste all that time trying to complete an area for mediocre items makes it pointless imo. Dungeons drops are nice in the sense no one ever fights about drops, it's all randomly distributed behind the curtains which is very nice. Probably the best part about the game is the distribution of loot. lol Again, can't say I agree. Just transmutation stones are reward like any other. I can look like I want while having stats that I need. Also you not only have stones and items but also potions or mats for crafting. And it's cost you nothing since it's just for exploring the map and that I enjoy regardles of rewards. Why ? Because ANet know how to make maps. I visit human city just to see bunch of drums :-) Crafting is nice but lots of stupid clutter to make it look like a vast crafting system but in turn just makes it annoying half the time. Want to craft a pair of boots, wait u 1.need to smelt your copper 2. get some cloth (of course our virtual boots need to be comfy for our long travels, espicially with walking soo slowly everywhere lol) 3. make three parts : sole, padding, exterior of your boots 3. add insignia's for extra stats then viola your 1 pair of boots is finished..... again more stupidity then an actual complex crafting system. System is fine. I would only ask ANet for one thing. I would love to choose between boots models I already saw. Like they do it in DC Universe Online. Once you aquire some item you can use it shape anytime. One of suggestions I posted. Dungeons feel unorganized and messy, i hate them with a passion. Tera, Secret World, WoW dungeons feel nice and layed out perfectly from start to finish. On here tho i want to kill myself while im doing a dungeon start to finish, hypothetically of course. (no offense toward suicidal people) Again loot is beautifully handled, most of the time completly useless aswell but thats another story lol. So... dungeons are bad because they are too hard for you while WoW, TOR, SW and TERA have dungeons that are childs play. Easy mode is not present at this time. Also corridor fighting and holding hands mode are off. Want easy mode ? Learn to play and find some guys to play with. Only real problem with dungeons I currently have is amount of high HP mobs. They should have complex attack pattern, high damage and less HP. Story is interesting but the cutscenes ruin it. Boring cutscenes with wallpaper backgrounds ruins the immersion they try so hard to instill within the game. Maybe it's from seeing The Secret World and Swtor cutscenes but is it soo much to ask to see the actual in-game background instead of wallpaper???? It was easy this way. Story is nice (it's nothing special and kind of straight forward but not bad). What I like is branching. Actual changes based on your decisions. Love that. Don't know about SW because this game is just a big pile of crap in my opinion but TOR had very poor and linear story (everything in that game was linear), no branching, stupid and on top of that - stupid and poor ending. Cinematic dialogues (that were useless except class story) - only advantage of TOR. But at the same time because of them TOR have no real expansions and you can't expect any in near future. One planet for 3-4 lvl after a YEAR does not cut it. So I will trade walper for more expansions and better game. Sorry. Combat is sad aswell, nice and simplistic yes. Auto attack and cooldowns is all its about, with the new innovation of moving around!!?!?! to avoid AOE and attacks..... don't think i need to say more lol Dodge, attack, control - three principles of fighting in GW2. If you know what you are doing then you will see the difference. Only TERA have more interesting combat system since is more dynamic. But as modders shown us, GW2 have also quite dynamic system but placed under retarded controls. Hope they change that in near future. Money Costs are again a major downfall. Traveling, Repairing, Gathering Tools, Salvage kits. Money sink i understand but in a game where the trading post nets you 1 copper profit for the majority of items is ridiculous and selling to merchants is better then selling on trading post =/ maybe i fail at GW2 economy lessons. Every coin i make is precious for saving up for armor, *cough cough cultural armor and other items i may need only to spend a nice chunk teleporting everywhere. Traveling to meet friends is gonna cost you, even to help someone out in your guild. To check an area with a dungeon to see if anyone is forming pickup groups. Coins Coins and more Coins gone, reminds of Aion and the rezzing fee to get your exp back. Want to cut back on costs don't worry you can spend a nice chunk of time running to said location aka walking.... unless you have a speed boost skill.. then you get actual running lol. Or for those that have a nice chunk of real life money why not spend it on gems to convert into in-game gold!!! All your money issues in-game gone with actual spending of your hard earned cash. Legalized gold selling brought to you by the game that is against gold selling.lol (Protect our accounts from China men, fine but if your buying gold from said china farmers you should have that risk of being hacked etc. instead of not offering it at all they realize that, hey people do actually spend real money for in-game gold, lets benifit from it and make our pockets some extra cash) Hypocrits at the end of the day. Sorry but level after level I have more money than I had previously. So it's no money sing. Sorry. You just need to manage your expenses. Sorry but in this game you have to make a decissions about what to buy. It's not like TOR where you fast gain huge amount of money and you can farm even more every day so you can buy ANYTHING for MILLIONS. Long story short. (lol if you watch South Park) I have been playing since beta and there was something in the back of my head bothering me about this game. I just can't get into it like other mmo's, there is no addiction for me wanting to log in on a daily basis. Revolutionary game?? not by a loong shot just another niche game for those WoW stragglers looking for something new or those GW1 cultists waiting for thier long over due next coming of the ages aka GW2. It went with what all the new mmo's do, take a bit of this from here and there and put it all together and bam! "Revolutionary game that will change the genre" Amazing what ads do to mindless sheep, propaganda FTW. Literally sad truth of the world. **Heads up to all those GuildWars2 "fanboys/girls" No disrespect to you all and your love for the game i didn't mean to attack your precious baby (aka GW2) just my opinions about the game. Your opinion is yours. But if you post something online then also consider other people thoughts. Just because you are depressed and can't play something or you don't like it - it's not like it's bad or something. Also I'm sorry but NO ONE NEVER said that GW2 will change genre. Even ANet said that it will be just another MMO and it's not even made to be your primary MMO (their words). GW2 change some aspects of MMO that were retarded, old, useless and stupid. Like party system, loot distribution from mobs, group oriented gameplay and stuff like that. They improved many spects of typical MMO while borowing other good ideas making really really GOOD GAME. Just wait and see that next MMO in line (created after GW2) will borrow a lot from this game.
Have a nice day. Comments in orange.
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter It does change some things. First,it actually brings the "MMO" to the open world instead of the "MMO" in an instance. Additionally it made every player an ally in PVE, removing factions and removing competition for resources. It also changed "questing", from the method of delivering them to the way it rewards them. It is also possible to craft the best items in the game instead of them being hidden in some instance. There are also a number of things that aren't exactly exclusive to it but that aren't (or were at GW2 release date) very common in MMORPGs, like 3-side PvP, non gear based PvP, etc.
But none of those things is actually new.
No instances: All the old games were like that. Instances came later.
"Every player an ally on PVE": I've seen that in text mode muds when graphic web browsers did not exist yet.
It's also not the first game that changes the "questiong approach". It has got its personal approach but still uses quests anyway.
Best items are crafted is as old as SWG.
So, yes, GW2 will change some things, the same way other games have done. Now, will it be the revolution that some players were talking about? Not really.