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[Poll] Which payment model fits you best?

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  • DemogorgonDemogorgon New York, NYPosts: 206Member Common
    Originally posted by Sicae
    Originally posted by Demogorgon

     

    - The almighty GW2 "B2P + benefit shop" models doesn't even get 2%... nough said. rofl

     

    Its quite obvious that most people view gw2 as b2p+fluff, even if there are some small benefits from the cash shop. 

    You mean most of its "still in honeymoon" fan right? Because its pretty clear that their shop do have more than fluff.

    A fluff shop is one like TSW periode.

  • GravargGravarg Harker Heights, TXPosts: 3,332Member Uncommon
    I'm a pretty impulsive guy, and just from my experience with all of them, I like just buying the game and having access to everything for a subscription.  I've played games that made you pay for time online (Neverwinter Nights) all the way to completely free with freemium, and just paying a subscription always ends up with me paying less (well the freemium without a cash shop option also, but it's the same as a sub hehe).  If there's a cash shop, like lotro, maplestory, atlantica online, where most of the items are fluff, then I end up spending 3-4 times what I would on a subscription game.
  • kaiser3282kaiser3282 Phoenix, AZPosts: 2,690Member Uncommon

    I just chose see results since there is no option for no preference / it doesnt matter.

    I dont judge a game based on payment model. I research the game, try it out if it looks interesting, and then judge the game itself.Payment model is irrelevant to me as I can afford and have no problem with all of the above.

    Of course a F2P game that is P2W with just completely riduclous prices is a big turnoff. This is the reason I stopped playing retail version of RF Online. Approx $45 for 1 box that has about a 5% chance to giv you an upgrader that is actually even remotely useful at all. About a .5-1% that it will be good. For situations like this, I prefer a private server instead of paying nonsensical retail prices.

  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INPosts: 3,734Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Searias
    Buy to play with subscriptions and no cash shops is what I want :).

            To me b2p with sub is a waste of money....Most of us move on from games pretty quickly so there is no reason to pay alot for it......Prior to 2005 (when we really had no options) this was fine, but in 2012 there are simply too many cheaper options out there to have to go this route.

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,314Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mmoguy43
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by GwapoJosh
    Originally posted by Searias
    Buy to play with subscriptions and no cash shops is what I want :).

    This..  It's the cheapest option.  People who think the other options are cheaper are delusional.

    Research supports that most F2P MMO players do not pay.

    Personally, i hop arount lots of F2P MMOs and have yet to spend a dime. So it works great for me. People who think everyone will pay is delusional.

    Does that research also find that players have to play longer and find less enjoyment when not paying?

    How do you enjoy playing F2P games when you keep jumping from one to another?

     Hmm.  Are you implyng that people's enjoyment of a game is based on how much they spend, or that it is necessary to spend significant amounts of time in a game to enjoy a game?

    That seems odd.  IMO I think most people can enjoy a game the same regardless if they spend thousands or nothing, or if it's 10 minutes or 10 years.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • tman5tman5 mesa, ALPosts: 604Member

    Just about any F2P model works for me.  Show me your game and, if it works and it's fun, I'll buy stuff from you as it enhances my play.

     

    That day is gone when I would pay for a game- whether it be the software, sub or both- only to be disappointed with subpar and repetative gameplay.  The onus is now on the gamemaker to show me they deserve my money.  Anyone willing to purchase a game untried and unproven is a fool and contributes to the sorry state the MMO industry finds itself today.

  • TerranahTerranah Stockton, CAPosts: 3,605Member

    I chose b2p with sub and cash shop for fluff.  I am really on a continuum though and it depends on the game.  I really hate being nickle and dimed though. 

     

    Free to play is kind of a turn off to me.  Sure it's nice to demo a game, but beyond that if I want to play I don't want to be hit up for real world cash at ever turn.  I'd rather pay $15 and have everything unlocked.  The problem is, a lot of things which make the game more fun for me like additional hair styles, faces, armor skins, tend to not get added very often.  So if having a cash shop to make these fluff items available is what we need, so be it.  The one major problem I have then is that these unlocks are usually poorly implemented, not account wide or come with restrictions that ruin the appeal for me.

     

    Oh well, times are a changing...having to change with them I guess...

  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 , CAPosts: 2,439Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
    Originally posted by mmoguy43
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by GwapoJosh
    Originally posted by Searias
    Buy to play with subscriptions and no cash shops is what I want :).

    This..  It's the cheapest option.  People who think the other options are cheaper are delusional.

    Research supports that most F2P MMO players do not pay.

    Personally, i hop arount lots of F2P MMOs and have yet to spend a dime. So it works great for me. People who think everyone will pay is delusional.

    Does that research also find that players have to play longer and find less enjoyment when not paying?

    How do you enjoy playing F2P games when you keep jumping from one to another?

     Hmm.  Are you implyng that people's enjoyment of a game is based on how much they spend, or that it is necessary to spend significant amounts of time in a game to enjoy a game?

    That seems odd.  IMO I think most people can enjoy a game the same regardless if they spend thousands or nothing, or if it's 10 minutes or 10 years.

    Bob, he is a casual gamer that plays a B2P game. He can only play up to 10 hours a week. It has been 3 weeks of playing and he is starting to not enjoy the game because of how much time it is taking to get the next big item. He will need to pay for that item or a faster means of obtaining it in order to continue enjoying the game. Otherwise, the grind will get to him and he will likely quit after a few weeks.

    A F2P game can be fun to whatever degree up to a point and then it will need to be fed money to be enjoyable. That's how I see it anyway.

  • SuperDonkSuperDonk Vancouver, WAPosts: 781Member Common

    I like B2P with a sub and no cash shop. I prefer to have full access to everything in game without being nickled and dimed for them, even if they are cosmetic only.

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,314Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mmoguy43
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
    Originally posted by mmoguy43
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by GwapoJosh
    Originally posted by Searias
    Buy to play with subscriptions and no cash shops is what I want :).

    This..  It's the cheapest option.  People who think the other options are cheaper are delusional.

    Research supports that most F2P MMO players do not pay.

    Personally, i hop arount lots of F2P MMOs and have yet to spend a dime. So it works great for me. People who think everyone will pay is delusional.

    Does that research also find that players have to play longer and find less enjoyment when not paying?

    How do you enjoy playing F2P games when you keep jumping from one to another?

     Hmm.  Are you implyng that people's enjoyment of a game is based on how much they spend, or that it is necessary to spend significant amounts of time in a game to enjoy a game?

    That seems odd.  IMO I think most people can enjoy a game the same regardless if they spend thousands or nothing, or if it's 10 minutes or 10 years.

    Bob, he is a casual gamer that plays a B2P game. He can only play up to 10 hours a week. It has been 3 weeks of playing and he is starting to not enjoy the game because of how much time it is taking to get the next big item. He will need to pay for that item or a faster means of obtaining it in order to continue enjoying the game. Otherwise, the grind will get to him and he will likely quit after a few weeks.

    A F2P game can be fun to whatever degree up to a point and then it will need to be fed money to be enjoyable. That's how I see it anyway.

     ok so you made a valid point that in SOME games it may be necessary to spend money in order to keep playing a game you enjoy.  I accept that, however that does mean he did not enjoy the game while spending nothng.  This just shows that a apayment may be necessary for continued enjoyment. 

    You still haven't validated your comment about needing to spend time in a game to enjoy it.

    Your comment was , "How do you enjoy playing F2P games when you keep jumping from one to another?"  Why do you think you need to spend a lot of time in a game before you enjoy it?  Many/most people IMO can have fun in a game even if it's only a few minutes.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 , CAPosts: 2,439Member Uncommon

    F2P games USUALLY take even longer than normal if not paying to make progress. Hence why I find it hard to imagine that you can genuinely have quality entertainment in the short term with them. Long term or paying, it makes more sense that you are actually enjoying the game.

    I don't know why you have this idea that my question is somehow making the statement: people can only enjoy a game if they spend a long amount of time playing it. It is a question because I personally don't truely enjoy the game until I have partially mastered it, which takes time, or I have made some character development progress. Sure, someone can hop in and have fun in 3 seconds of a game because they clicked a button and something went POW. But you are calling fun as it is anything and I view fun for what is fun for me, which is more than simple instant gratifications of joy.

    "Many/most people IMO can have fun in a game even if it's only a few minutes." Most people can have fun in a few minutes is completely false. It can take up to an hour playing just to know how to play and even after that there are fewer fun minutes than filler minutes. Most people can have fun in a few minutes is true... if not playing EvE.

    So call it a subjective opinion and move on?

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,314Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mmoguy43

    F2P games USUALLY take even longer than normal if not paying to make progress. Hence why I find it hard to imagine that you can genuinely have quality entertainment in the short term with them. Long term or paying, it makes more sense that you are actually enjoying the game.

    I don't know why you have this idea that my question is somehow making the statement: people can only enjoy a game if they spend a long amount of time playing it. It is a question because I personally don't truely enjoy the game until I have partially mastered it, which takes time, or I have made some character development progress. Sure, someone can hop in and have fun in 3 seconds of a game because they clicked a button and something went POW. But you are calling fun as it is anything and I view fun for what is fun for me, which is more than simple instant gratifications of joy.

    "Many/most people IMO can have fun in a game even if it's only a few minutes." Most people can have fun in a few minutes is completely false. It can take up to an hour playing just to know how to play and even after that there are fewer fun minutes than filler minutes. Most people can have fun in a few minutes is true... if not playing EvE.

    So call it a subjective opinion and move on?

     Fair enough.  I don't think most people play games to master them, nor do I think most people even care about mastering them.  They just do it for some short-term entertainment.  Which is why I found the question odd.  I don't think it's completely false at all.  I think most people know in the first few minutes whether they like a game or not.  There is very little that changes in a game from start to finish, controls are similar across games. 

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • negativf4kknegativf4kk WorthingPosts: 377Member Uncommon

    My best experience comes from R2 Online Russia(before all that cash shop madness).

    The model was simple F2P with CS were u can buy non-stat boosts. But then God of Greed came  into MMO industry and changed it forever(at least for me) ......

    <a href="http://www.danasoft.com"><img src="http://www.danasoft.com/sig/499105419258.jpg"; border="0"></a><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:11px;"><p>Sign by Danasoft - <a href="http://www.danasoft.com">For Backgrounds and Layouts</a></p></div>

  • goozmaniagoozmania chino, CAPosts: 145Member Uncommon

    I hate everything about cash shops, even "fluff." Awesome looking and identifiable mounts and equipment should be thing you find in-game, through extensive questlines or difficult enemies.

    I also detest the reallocation of development resources for DLC and cash shops.

    That is why, this November, I am voting on B2P w/sub and NO cash shop.

  • SilokSilok Mascouche, QCPosts: 732Member
    Originally posted by Zylaxx

    B2P with cash shop containing fluff items, or reskinned armor/weapon models and mounts.

     

    Sub based MMO's are a dieing breed and an archaic hold over from years past when the sub fees were used for hosting servers.  If B2P without a cash shop is good enough for all other games from PC's to consoles then its damn well good enough for MMO's.  Its time MMO developers stop living in the past or trying to bleed subscriber numbers.  Its been proven time and time again, for last few years B2 subless games are a money making endeavor but I wouldnt suppose a company that cant innovate or try originality to think any different.

    And yet  "B2P with sub and no cash shop" is winning this poll so far...

    The sub was not only for hosting server, it was for patch and the constant work of the dev teams to polish the game and its still is. I will not even comment the other part of your post, all i can do is that  image

  • defector1968defector1968 Nar ShaddaaPosts: 393Member Common

    B2P with sub and no cash shop ONLY

    i play games with other types and was crap

  • OrtwigOrtwig Cambridge, MAPosts: 1,159Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Banquetto

    Model that fits me best wasn't on the list. :-(

    * No upfront B2P payment, limited (either time-limited or content-limited) trial then sub

    Humm, well it may not perfectly match but I think one of the below could be close.  I believe either of those could be locked by time or content:

    • F2P with "freemium" sub that gives access to locked features (no cash shop)
    • F2P with "freemium" one-time payment that gives access to locked features (no cash shop)
  • OrtwigOrtwig Cambridge, MAPosts: 1,159Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by fenistil
    Originally posted by Rimmersman
    P2P with no cash shop.

    this

    Yeah, wish I could have fit this one, but I think these might be close -- let me know of any fine differences, but I am thinking of these as free initially, but upgradable with sub or fee. 

    • F2P with "freemium" sub that gives access to locked features (no cash shop)
    • F2P with "freemium" one-time payment that gives access to locked features (no cash shop) -
  • NikopolNikopol The ZonePosts: 626Member Uncommon

    Anything without a cash shop, really. Not even fluff.

    So I guess it'd probably be P2P.

    Anyway, I had no problems with the old way, paying for box and paying monthly on top. Even makes me pick my games a bit more carefully... and ask the right questions, like:

    "If it's not worth spending my money on, why am I spending time on it?" :)

     

  • OrtwigOrtwig Cambridge, MAPosts: 1,159Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Gruug
    Originally posted by Ortwig
    So which payment model best suits you?  Assume that all the B2P models could charge for large expansions and all subbed games might also include an option for a lifetime sub.  If you have another model, add it below!  Also, for F2P cash shops selling gear and benefits, assume that gear items could also be purchased through game play, and that cash shop items would not match gear obtained through game play (no "pay to win").

    Did not vote in this poll as it leaves out some obvious options. One is "B2P WITHOUT sub and WITHOUT cash shop".

    This was intentional in that there is an assumption that developers will need some kind of revenue stream if they are to continue supporting servers, patch bugs, create new features and add new content in-between expansions.  Perhaps the assumption is a bad one, but I think most would agree that an MMORPG by its nature needs some sort kind of ongoing revenue stream.  Be interested in hearing people's thoughts on this one.

  • neumneum OsakaPosts: 137Member Uncommon
    I like  B2P with sub and no cash shop.  B2P and a sub keeps the riff-raff out.  I really do not like  a cash shop in any form.  Fluff should be crafted IMO.

  • RydesonRydeson Canton, OHPosts: 3,858Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Silok
    Originally posted by Zylaxx

    B2P with cash shop containing fluff items, or reskinned armor/weapon models and mounts.

     

    Sub based MMO's are a dieing breed and an archaic hold over from years past when the sub fees were used for hosting servers.  If B2P without a cash shop is good enough for all other games from PC's to consoles then its damn well good enough for MMO's.  Its time MMO developers stop living in the past or trying to bleed subscriber numbers.  Its been proven time and time again, for last few years B2 subless games are a money making endeavor but I wouldnt suppose a company that cant innovate or try originality to think any different.

    And yet  "B2P with sub and no cash shop" is winning this poll so far...

    The sub was not only for hosting server, it was for patch and the constant work of the dev teams to polish the game and its still is. I will not even comment the other part of your post, all i can do is that  image

    So you think that paying $15 a month for patches and content is good?  Really?  That comes out  to $60 in four months, the COST of a B2P game like GW2 for example..  I have YET to see any sub based game generate content to justify the monthly sub.. Not in today's era..  If  I'm paying $180 a year, I better seen added content equal to that of the ORIGANAL game purchase 3 times.....  Right?  Or could it be that most of the monthly sub fee is just cash cow greed?  

  • fenistilfenistil GliwicePosts: 3,005Member
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Silok
    Originally posted by Zylaxx

    B2P with cash shop containing fluff items, or reskinned armor/weapon models and mounts.

     

    Sub based MMO's are a dieing breed and an archaic hold over from years past when the sub fees were used for hosting servers.  If B2P without a cash shop is good enough for all other games from PC's to consoles then its damn well good enough for MMO's.  Its time MMO developers stop living in the past or trying to bleed subscriber numbers.  Its been proven time and time again, for last few years B2 subless games are a money making endeavor but I wouldnt suppose a company that cant innovate or try originality to think any different.

    And yet  "B2P with sub and no cash shop" is winning this poll so far...

    The sub was not only for hosting server, it was for patch and the constant work of the dev teams to polish the game and its still is. I will not even comment the other part of your post, all i can do is that  image

    So you think that paying $15 a month for patches and content is good?  Really?  That comes out  to $60 in four months, the COST of a B2P game like GW2 for example..  I have YET to see any sub based game generate content to justify the monthly sub.. Not in today's era..  If  I'm paying $180 a year, I better seen added content equal to that of the ORIGANAL game purchase 3 times.....  Right?  Or could it be that most of the monthly sub fee is just cash cow greed?  

    No cash shop,rmah and gold selling is worth 15$ for kind of mmorpg I would like to play.    Problem is most p2p games put cash shops.

  • 3-4thElf3-4thElf Elftown, MEPosts: 489Member

    I didn't really see my option.

     

    I like how Wizards101 and LotRO does it. Even in contrast to their own companies other games. 

    F2P ala carte

    Let me buy access at a reasonable price as I play along. It's like B2P but broken up into bits. In both games I researched what would paths to cap would be worth my investment and I planned ahead.

    If it's not B2P, then that's my preferred method.

    Subs are for suckers.

    a yo ho ho

  • TamanousTamanous Edmonton, ABPosts: 2,125Member Uncommon

    Monthly sub only with no cash shop of ANY kind is the only true and balanced option. It is the only method that is even for everyone and does not impact the game's developmental direction in any way.

     

    Some players may be too cheap to pay it (the free loaders relying on the <5% of players who pay the money and the <2% who pay the bulk of the money and then procede to biatch and whine that the game takes a direction in development they don't like ... no money = no voice) but they simply must admit a flat sub is the only way to take money out of voting for new content. This is exactly what F2P is ... those who pay and for what is what drives development in the game. If you don't pay and want your class balanced yet 80+% of the income comes from others buying pve/pvp potions, guess what, NO class balance for you!

    You stay sassy!

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