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Sandbox/sand park/ themebox?

MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,419Member Uncommon
This game a sandbox of sorts?

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  • JatarJatar San Dimas, CAPosts: 348Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    This game a sandbox of sorts?

    CoS certainly has aspects of a sand box game, but it is also very difficult to pin down to one thing.  There are multiple styles of game play possibilities.  At its core, players go on epic quests,  however these novel deep stories are non-linear, and customized to every player for a unique experience.  Like a sand box game, you may also build up housing, businesses, guild halls, and the towns around them.  Yet there is also an overall progressing world history since time continues to move forward in an ever changing world.  There is nothing out there like it.  

  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLPosts: 22,608Member Epic

    Originally posted by Jatar


    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    This game a sandbox of sorts?

    CoS certainly has aspects of a sand box game, but it is also very difficult to pin down to one thing.  There are multiple styles of game play possibilities.  At its core, players go on epic quests,  however these novel deep stories are non-linear, and customized to every player for a unique experience.  Like a sand box game, you may also build up housing, businesses, guild halls, and the towns around them.  Yet there is also an overall progressing world history since time continues to move forward in an ever changing world.  There is nothing out there like it.  

    More and more it looks like there's nothing really out there.

     

    "Winning" at EVE Online since May, 2007! 

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • IsaneIsane EnglandPosts: 2,630Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Kyleran


    Originally posted by Jatar



    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    This game a sandbox of sorts?

    CoS certainly has aspects of a sand box game, but it is also very difficult to pin down to one thing.  There are multiple styles of game play possibilities.  At its core, players go on epic quests,  however these novel deep stories are non-linear, and customized to every player for a unique experience.  Like a sand box game, you may also build up housing, businesses, guild halls, and the towns around them.  Yet there is also an overall progressing world history since time continues to move forward in an ever changing world.  There is nothing out there like it.  

    More and more it looks like there's nothing really out there.

     

    And you would know........ But then again you don't.... what a shame...

    ________________________________________________________
    Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel 

  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLPosts: 22,608Member Epic

    Originally posted by Isane


    Originally posted by Kyleran


    Originally posted by Jatar


    Originally posted by MMOExposed

    This game a sandbox of sorts?

    CoS certainly has aspects of a sand box game, but it is also very difficult to pin down to one thing.  There are multiple styles of game play possibilities.  At its core, players go on epic quests,  however these novel deep stories are non-linear, and customized to every player for a unique experience.  Like a sand box game, you may also build up housing, businesses, guild halls, and the towns around them.  Yet there is also an overall progressing world history since time continues to move forward in an ever changing world.  There is nothing out there like it.  

    More and more it looks like there's nothing really out there.

     

    And you would know........ But then again you don't.... what a shame...

    No one actually does, which is sort of shameful I suppose.

     

    "Winning" at EVE Online since May, 2007! 

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • Crunchy221Crunchy221 Trollsberg, ILPosts: 489Member

    Well im interested, because they say they are going to do something diffrent, what that is exactly...well im not sure. (aside from whati can assume is the quest system that may or may not include the same structured quests in every game just served to you diffrently) 

    Just looking at the sceenshots...well it looks like high rez textures placed on innatural perfect shapes, and those shaps placed together to make "stuff"  all the stuff is seated in an unnatural way on the ground, lots of right angles and sharp contrasts between vivid textures on the buildings ect.  That was good in 2008...but weve come a lon way since then, and it looks dated.  I do realize those screenshots are old however, and lack any form of vegatation which could mask the rough polygon into terrain sharp angles and distinct bright colors highliting it all...

    Look this was something that would have really revved me up in the past.  Ive grown weary of indy games using a  "made for the game" engine...game engines are incredibly complex and have a massive effect on the games quality of play, its a huge risk, and while the guys making the game engine for this mmorpg as their "unreal tournament for the unreal engine" gives me a bit of hope that they are some serious code-monkies and it will be quality and specific to the game genere i like (where unreal does fit mmorpgs it wasnt specifically built for it, and usually lacks custimization ect)

    Im rooting for this all to work out soon enough to where it wount be completely dated.

     

    However...people are getting sick to death with games focused on questing.  Specifically that the quests consist of the same ingredients since the first mmorpgs, they are just served to you in diffrent manners.  I cant be the only one whos noticed that 90% of the game community breezes by quests as an obstical for their belived instanced hampsterwheels that are raids/battlegrounds.  Hopefully this is out the box questing in a way that will seem completly new to vets.

    Also, people have been burned to a crisp by indy developers promising the world but delivering a unstable client with a combat system that was a chore and anything but entertaining...the community is going to be very distrustful of any developer speaking in the same manner that those other guys did...which is what this developer or spokesman on this site from the studio is speaking...just saying, doesnt bother me but it does come off as "oh great another indy studio promising the world again..."

     

     

     

     

    So when can we expect some modern screen shots and videos of gameplay....when is expected launch...ballpark figure...we talking another 7 years, 5 years, 2 years....

    An last is what DX are you guys planning to use?  Seems to be a good gauge at how modern the game will look.

  • IsaneIsane EnglandPosts: 2,630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Crunchy221
    Well im interested, because they say they are going to do something diffrent, what that is exactly...well im not sure. (aside from whati can assume is the quest system that may or may not include the same structured quests in every game just served to you diffrently) 

    Maybe you should post on the official forumns and surprisingly you will more than likely get a response from the Developers(If you are really interested)

    But as an aside, the game World is the size of an real planet.

    The quests described in a simplistic way are generated around thousands of parameters, and consist generally of and are played in a Reflected world with between 1-8 invited players invited by the owner (you). These are generated where storyline components are embeded into quests which are dynamically generated based on what you as a Fallen Hero has done within the game. Different variations exist of the Reflected Worlds you can play in as such Global events can be played out where the 1-8 player limit becomes more cooperative due to the nature of the challenges presented to the World.

    The main Hub of the Worlds for players is "The Citadel" which hold 7 Tiers , 5 Leagues has an aim that you progress and get promoted through the leagues and tiers to be trusted to face the perils of Morphael with the Shattered Worlds Reflecteions of the original.

    Each Tier has 54 available skills per tier which can be learned through gaining tomes on your trabvels but only lerning from these can be acheived at the Universtity ( 7 Tiers / 5 Leagues and 54 skills per tier) giveing a variety of  abilities to choose from 1890 base skills/abilities in game. Other abilities exist beyond these  but they are unknown. I believe that you start with 10 base skills two from each league but after that your progression is your own choice or via guidance from the University Lecturers.

    The game is predominantley PvE and the NPC ai is based on their inteligence not player Int or skills the players use so the game will play a lot more tactical and require a lot more thought. (This game is all about Gameplay most of which has become non existent in most MMOs thesedays). The Citadel hosts a Arena where challenges can be made to test skills against other players.

    This is a World which is consistent structurally but will vary depending on yourself you nemesis and what can be loosely termed as faction(but are not).  So theoretically your gameplay is one big quest which happens around yourself based on your World Storyline, this is a big change from the norm because if you want to you head to you current work as allocated by the leagues at the citadel which will portal you to the vicinity of what they wish you tyo acheive, from that point on you could just head north and brave the wilds.

    An example may be you have to retrieve "The Tome of Ultimate Evil" ,

    • This Tome for your story could be in a Chest 10 miles north of The Citadel.
    • In the back pocket of an NPC who wants you to work for him
    • Left in the Study of a Noble living in a Country Estate  50 Miles South East of The Citadel, On a Bookshelf.
    • In any  Ruin taken over by Morphaels Minions (any of hundreds)
    • In a dungeon under a ruins (any of hundreds) 
    • (Add thousands of options to this)
    This is where the bespoke engine comes in and as you stated very difficult to acheive , my understanding is this is what they have developed along with the World Simulator that they were also commisioned to generate. Which uses Biomes and true Geography and erosion and weather patterns and all that goes with this(Compolicated).
     
    So their priorities:
     
    • Game Design/Engine Design
    • AI Development
    • World Generation/ Biomes for everything Natural
    • Graphics Updates as the final as gameplay is the important factor the skin is the skin

    This is just for info and I guess that you probably aren't that interest but I would go to the forumns and ask if you are.

    I have dropped a quote in from the Developer about Guilds just out of interest as it gives a feel about gameplay options (Please note this is in development so nothing is set in stone):

    Guilds


    "What are you asking? Do you want to know if you must join a guild, or are you asking about the benefits? Or, are you asking if you can just solo the game? I believe there is another thread somewhere about solo vs. group play, so I'll assume that you want to know the benefits of joining a guild.

    First off, no, you don't have to join a guild. We don't like anything in the game that starts with 'you must'. However, that being said, there are benefits to joining a guild... many. Here are a few:
    1) Social interaction with a group of like minded people... and who knows, you might make some new friends.
    2) Easy grouping, with a built in set of people who you know, that will group with you for your stories (and no, going through a story does not require a group, but there are aspects that will make it enjoyable to group, so you will want to do that a lot of the time.)
    3) Help. Guilds tend to help their members (at least ones I would join). This can come in many forms, information, learning the quite considerable new features of Citadel of Sorcery, equipment, money, maps, or just a hint in the right direction when needed.
    4) Being part of building something beyond your own character and story. A Guild is more than a club in CoS, it is a real place. Land is owned by the Guild, and a Guild Hall is constructed, by the membership, and may be continually improved over time. Larger Guilds lead to bigger guild towns, also built by the members. Businesses and homes may be built and the business run by players. These are naturally created towns, and there is a sense of being part of something larger in their construction.
    5) Guild Competitions and Rankings. There are Guild level competitions in CoS, where you can challenge other guilds to compete. I won't go into all of these right now, but they are part of the game design, and another source of fun for those that wish to take part.
    6) Identity. Guilds offer a membership, one you can be proud of with the right guild and display proudly on your character.
    7) Guild Campaigns: A form of large group military actions that an entire guild may take on together in the war against Morphael.

    There is more, but these are some of the reasons for joining a Guild, though they are not requirements. We prefer to make social interaction have benefits, rather than requirements. If players get something for taking part, then they will, and in this case what you get are some very enjoyable game play elements, though certainly not the only ones in CoS. We believer that given these added enjoyments, players will want to take part and become part of the positive social aspects of a Guild (and group play), rather than turn the entire game into a big single player RPG environment. But if solo is your thing... you can still do that too."

    “Questions around Groups and Guilds:


    1) A group in CoS is up to eight players for a story, many more for a campaign (this has little to do with a Guild).
    2) The game content will allow you to play consistently through with the same group, various groups, no group, groups made up from your guild, etc.
    3) Yes, Guilds are an important part of the MMO world, and MMO Magic knows this. To that end we are offering as much as we possibly can to assist Guilds and make them fun and interesting. This includes many things: Building your own Guild hall, owning a part of the RWs, leasing land to Guild members (for housing and business building), taxing (if you want), Guild competitions, Guild Campaigns, and much, much more.
    4) There is no effect in logging in when other guild members are off line, since you can play with any mix of players in a group, changing at any time.
    5) For those who do not wish to join a Guild, there are also Citadel Garrisons, which offer many things a Guild offers, but have no Guild leadership/politics (some players really love that stuff, some don't, so we offer it both ways).

    There, hope that gives you a start on the Guild system for CoS.”
     

    Guuild Approach and Options


    “Have no worries... Guilds are there for people who like them, and will have our full support to give them every convenience and feature we can pack in, but that being said, there is no reason you must join a guild, in fact, you can join a Garrison to get the same features (but not the community). Guilds can gain status, and measure themselves against other guilds. However, this has no impact on an individual player, who can also impact the world as they wish. Citadel is designed to give the best possible game play for solo players, and for guild players, it's that simple.

    To clarify, a Garrison is like a Guild, but it is run by the game, not by players, and offers people who don't want to form, run or join a Guild the game play elements that you get in a Guild. You can open a business, own a house, go on Campaigns, fight in the arena, etc.”

     

     

     

    ________________________________________________________
    Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel 

  • amusedmonkeyamusedmonkey zarqaPosts: 42Member

    I see why you would be confused. Anyone would. The screenshots you've seen are just pre-alpha placeholders to be able to test systems, like they mentioned mmorpg.com required them to post screenshots to list the game. 

    They chose to communicate with players way earlier than other upcoming mmo's. Usually at this stage mmos don't involve players and they're just a project that no one but the developers know about, but mmo magic chose to involve the player from the very beginning when the game was just an idea in the developers mind to watch it grow bit by bit. Only recently have they started their hunt for a good publisher.

    As for the quest system I suggest you head to the official forums and read up a bit. It's not your usual "same thing done differently". It would be impossible to write a walkthrough for a quest because it would be so different for every person because it depends highly on your choices and past actions, For example (and this is a very general example that doesn't do the game justice) :

    You're buying something from the shop when you see a woman running around asking if anyone saw her son, you ask her a few questions gather info, you choose to head to look for him or ask around in the town. You would collect info and some of it might be wrong, you need to deploy your best judgement to see which pieces of info best serve your purposes. You are told he was playing with the blacksmith's boy when a person came and snagged him. You try to track that person and successfully do. Now you have to make a choice: You chose to knock that person down and interregate him, a better choice would have been to  kill him and retrieve the boy who is tied up behind the bush because he gives you false info that leads you into a trap where the boy gets killed... and t hings turn out to be bigger than just a case of kidnapping! and the fun begins...

    Now if another person gets the same quest it would be so different to the point of unrecognizable, like for example turns out the boy was hiding watching a band of bandits plotting something. Different but equally engaging.

    Like you've noticed no "kill 10 rats" or "collect 10 bananas" or "escort said person" or "give this item to this other npc". It's an actual story where things happen not just the same old quest types worded differently. one of these quests could take you a week to complete with enough story details to keep you glued to the screen like a good book that you happen to live inside, a book that writes itself as you go, affected by your choices.

    This is a far cry from other quest based mmo's and it's one of the reasons why they chose to build their own engine. I suggest you go to the official forums and give it a look.

  • BigRock411BigRock411 Barrington, ILPosts: 299Member

    Hmm website states states that they will give updates every month or two.  Only that news update is dated in Jan 2012 and its the only new update ever.

     

    Vaporware?  Or is this one of those things where they make a game engine with the intentions of selling the game engine and never really make a mmorpg out of it...seen that happen on this site plenty of times.  "Whoops we ment to say that it was just a game engine but no one bought it and there was never a game just some screenshots and videos of the engine"

  • JatarJatar San Dimas, CAPosts: 348Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Deleted User
    Hmm website states states that they will give updates every month or two.  Only that news update is dated in Jan 2012 and its the only new update ever.   Vaporware?  Or is this one of those things where they make a game engine with the intentions of selling the game engine and never really make a mmorpg out of it...seen that happen on this site plenty of times.  "Whoops we ment to say that it was just a game engine but no one bought it and there was never a game just some screenshots and videos of the engine"

    We're sorry you had trouble finding the updates, but they do come out every few months, and there are many of them online, not just one.  You can find them at www.mmomagic.com, look for the Dev Log.

    And no, this is not vaporware, or a game engine only.  Yes, this game uses a new engine, and tools, but it is very much a game under development, though we never promised it would be a short development.  You can find out as much as you want about the game and progress at the www.citadelofsorcery.com site, go to Forums.

    We are happy to answer any questions you might have about the game, if we can, either here, or at our forums.  

    Hope to see you in Citadel of Sorcery some day!

  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLPosts: 22,608Member Epic

    Had trouble remembering the name of the game as I was thinking about it while reading a thread discussing alternatives to standard MMO questing.  (I know you guys fly under the radar, but you're practically invisible these days) image

    Glad to see you're still around and kicking Jatar

     

    "Winning" at EVE Online since May, 2007! 

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • IsaneIsane EnglandPosts: 2,630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kyleran
    Had trouble remembering the name of the game as I was thinking about it while reading a thread discussing alternatives to standard MMO questing.  (I know you guys fly under the radar, but you're practically invisible these days) image Glad to see you're still around and kicking Jatar  

    Maybe it's just this site ; Visit the official forumns ...

    ________________________________________________________
    Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel 

  • redman875redman875 illinois, ILPosts: 230Member

    This games still alive?

     

  • IsaneIsane EnglandPosts: 2,630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by redman875
    This games still alive?  

    Just goto the Official site if you are interested. No interest in dealing with anyone here, sick of the hate fest.

    ________________________________________________________
    Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel 

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,675Member Uncommon
    The worlds are only for 1-8 invited players? What?! So they make a world as big as a planet then instance it off? Am I reading this right?

    image
  • DakirnDakirn Kansas City, MOPosts: 374Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    The worlds are only for 1-8 invited players? What?! So they make a world as big as a planet then instance it off? Am I reading this right?

    The personal/group story worlds are 1-8 players.  The community reflected worlds are for all players.  The community worlds are where the incursions and warfare stuff takes place with multiple groups working towards a goal.

     

    It ties into their lore of their world, but it also stops random people from breaking their complicated questing system.

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,675Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dakirn
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    The worlds are only for 1-8 invited players? What?! So they make a world as big as a planet then instance it off? Am I reading this right?

    The personal/group story worlds are 1-8 players.  The community reflected worlds are for all players.  The community worlds are where the incursions and warfare stuff takes place with multiple groups working towards a goal.

     

    It ties into their lore of their world, but it also stops random people from breaking their complicated questing system.

    Kinda ruined it for me :( that's like the ultimate instancing. 

    image
  • parrotpholkparrotpholk Leland, NCPosts: 3,275Member
    I admit my interest is high but I do not think they have a shot at the 700k goal on kickstarter.  I would love to see a game go back to building worlds and will be window shopping on this one depending on how it goes through alpha.
  • JatarJatar San Dimas, CAPosts: 348Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Originally posted by Dakirn
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    The worlds are only for 1-8 invited players? What?! So they make a world as big as a planet then instance it off? Am I reading this right?

    The personal/group story worlds are 1-8 players.  The community reflected worlds are for all players.  The community worlds are where the incursions and warfare stuff takes place with multiple groups working towards a goal.

     

    It ties into their lore of their world, but it also stops random people from breaking their complicated questing system.

    Kinda ruined it for me :( that's like the ultimate instancing. 

    Accept... each Reflected World is not an instance, but a different world, like an alternate universe.  An instance is a copy of something, this is not a copy since, many, many things are different in each world.  I'm not sure how this ruins anything for anyone.  You can go to Community Worlds and adventure with lots of players in the same world, or go to endless Reflected Worlds with varying storylines for smaller group play.  Since which  you choose to do is your choice, what are you losing?

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,675Member Uncommon
    Have to see how it plays out. But I worry the game will end up mostly solo on your own planet even and it will just be group content on main world. Can people choose to only play on group world as a viable option? Is there lore for this?

    Seems like a waste of having a planet as big as earth as they have said.

    image
  • DakirnDakirn Kansas City, MOPosts: 374Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Have to see how it plays out. But I worry the game will end up mostly solo on your own planet even and it will just be group content on main world. Can people choose to only play on group world as a viable option? Is there lore for this?

    Seems like a waste of having a planet as big as earth as they have said.

    There's plenty of lore for this and it's perfectly viable.

     

    When you're in a group the entire world scales for the group in difficulty.  They let you take people with you on your group quest (where they can come and go as they please) or you can do specific group quests that can be postponed and resumed later by the entire group (from what they've said).

     

    All worlds scale to who's in them and the group ones are probably going to be much more difficult and require grouping.. sounds like fun if you're into that.

     

    Personally I'd rather come and go as I please and play with my friends for a while or on my own without being forced to do anything.  Too many years of MMO forced grouping jaded me.  I love to group but I don't want to be sitting on my arse while waiting for one.

  • amusedmonkeyamusedmonkey zarqaPosts: 42Member
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Have to see how it plays out. But I worry the game will end up mostly solo on your own planet even and it will just be group content on main world. Can people choose to only play on group world as a viable option? Is there lore for this?

    Seems like a waste of having a planet as big as earth as they have said.

    Don't quote me on this but I believe there will be plenty of lore in the community worlds. You are forgetting one point, is that apart from your personal quests which you do in other reflected worlds on your own or with a small group, there is a grand story for the game as a whole, since history moves forward and events happen regardless where you play or even if you're online.. the lore will always be there and advance towards a grand climax for the whole world.

  • JatarJatar San Dimas, CAPosts: 348Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Have to see how it plays out. But I worry the game will end up mostly solo on your own planet even and it will just be group content on main world. Can people choose to only play on group world as a viable option? Is there lore for this?

    Seems like a waste of having a planet as big as earth as they have said.

    I think players may be getting a little hung up on the full planet thing.  It's really much more like real life than you think.  How much of the real earth did you see today?  Or this week, or this  month?  I bet most of you were in a fairly small area of that big planet earth.

    The game is like that, there is a big world out there, sure, but you will likely spend quite some time in a much smaller area, only moving onto new parts of the world now and then.

    But, back to your concern about group play.  First off, even on Story RWs, you can party up with up to eight players, which is equal to or greater than many MMO games, so not 'solo'.  And when you want to work together with lots of other groups on a big objective, we offer that too.  Go to a Community world, get involved with some of the speicalized game play we offer just for multi-group cooperation.  Not good enough, then join a campaign which is kind of like a large raid.  There many types of mutigroup and multiplayer game play options for when you want that, and also smaller group epic and deep stories for when you want that, what we believe is the best of BOTH worlds.

  • mamildormamildor domzalePosts: 18Member
    I guess we'll have to wait for alpha stage of the game to see if it's a sanbox/themepark or whatever. So far i like what i hear about the game and i pladged a few bucks on kickstarter page and i hope they can get 700k for them to start alpha testing.
  • MyrdynnMyrdynn Beaumont, CAPosts: 1,776Member Uncommon

    kickstarter needs some help!!!!

     

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,675Member Uncommon
    I just prefer living in a single world I guess. I don't like the idea of instance hopping. I get that you can invite people to play with you, but I like I play solo sometimes while still having an active community of players around me doing there thing as well. I don't wanna be soloing in my own planet until I feel like doing group content.

    Will community planets have any room for solo players/small groups? Or is that limited to large scale content only?

    image
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