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Auction House: Death of Community
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I totally agree with you. I don't think every game should be made the same, with the same mechanics. How boring. But the OP was basically saying they needed to be forced to socialize and I ask, why? There are plenty of games out there that allow for both solo and group play. There are also many that cater to group play. And there are those that cater more to solo play. I have no problem with any of them.
That's been my point all along, give people a choice. If there are games that cater to "forcing grouping", games that "force solo play", and games allowing for both, I don't see a problem.
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!
You seem to be under impression that OP is on some sort of fanatical crusade in order to change all or most mmorpg's.
Hell no, at least I did not get that impression. Me myself - I don't want to change anyone's game. Seriously - if someone like GW2 in a way it is designed atm? Nice, grats you found some mmorpg you like. I am very far from wanting to change it.
If someone like WoW - nice go and knock yourself out having fun.
I just would like also to have game or two well done mmorpg's that have difftent design one that is about cooperation and interdependability. Nothing more, nothing less. Seriously I am not telling you that your mmorpg's are bad or I am not ranting about how mmorpg's have to change.
Just would be fun to actually have some small but well made niche with an actually qualiity game for gamers similar to me.
That may be true for the combat side of the game.
The game of crafting and trading is indeed a game specifically for more than one. Some of us want to find a virtual world in which we can play it. People ask why we want to be "forced to interact", well it's for the same reason that poker players want to be "forced to interact".
If you're building an mmorpg, or if you'd like to share ideas or talk about this industry, visit Multiplayer Worlds.
see the part that says "At Least i am" ......I am speaking for myself .....
nethervoid - Est. '97
[UO|EQ|SB|SWG|PS|HZ|EVE|NWN|WoW|VG|DF|SWTOR|SotA|BDO]
24k subs YouTube Gaming channel
You seem to neglect the point that you present your argument as correct and everyone elses as wrong. Also, you bringing up co-op/standard multiplayer games in no way contributes to an argument about an MMO. You bring up Diablo 3 so often....
And thankfully, people are voting with their wallets. You and your "I want the same thing over and over" clique is starting to become a minority. Devs are starting to notice that catering to you and others like you is only profitable for the short term.
Also, nothing makes my interests more important, what I tried to point out that you neglect over and over again, is that my opinion leaves room for everyones play style. I don't feel that every MMO needs to be the same so that you can hop in and try it for a month before leaving. If there are games I don't like, thats fine. They don't need to change for ME. And there are MMO's I like. Just nothing that great at the moment.
I'm sure you will just brush off all logic and continue on your crusade to make everything the same. Fuck innovation right? Trying something different is scary!!!!
And D3 sold 10M copies. Borderlands 2 is a big success. WOW sold 2.7M copies of MOP first week (looks like a decline but a huge success most companies would dream of) and add 1M subs.
So i highly doubt i will have a lack of game to play. And who says anything about them being the same? And what does that have anything to do with game hopping? The point of game hopping is to play something DIFFERENT.
Bad idea? I am sure that is why it has become a STANDARD feature, and even implemented in non-MMOs.
Probably because it suits non mmos more.
One central AH is a bad idea if you want to include a complex, economical meta game in your mmo for the players to get involved in. More meta game = increase social interaction. It is a good idea if you just want to make the game as accessible as possible regardless as to loss of depth/gameplay/social features.
So it is bad for a complex, community driven mmo. It is good for a pick up and play, just want to LFG RAID game. Horses for courses really.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
MMOs are not "complex, community driven" anyway. Most modern MMOs are action RPG with more content & progression.
Sure, you may want to play a blacksmith running your own shop. Personally i want to sell & buy items in the most efficient manner.
And there are people who play the market too. Have you read about the dude that made $10000 on D3?
Socializing adds very little to efficient transaction of items. When you want to buy a computer off the internet, it is quite easy just to look at all the attributes (CPU, memory, price ...) and made a decision. I won't want to talk a person when i do that. Buying a virtual sword where the price and stats are known .. is the same thing.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
bump because this was taken from the following link
http://massively.joystiq.com/2015/01/26/pax-south-2015-why-arent-mmos-more-social/
Auction house bad
Jenesee mentioned how Camelot Unchained won't have an auction house because that promotes interaction within the game. Alex agreed that the auction house itself tied into the whole idea of the panel. "I don't care who made the armor I'm wearing," he said, "I don't care who made the potion I drank, as long as it's the cheapest." However, a game like Elder Scrolls Online barely has anything that you can even call a vendor for player wares, let alone an auction house. Where is the line there?
I've brought it up before, and I believe the panel agreed, that there is a middle ground. That's where Star Wars Galaxies became relevant to our discussion again. Players could place items on the auction house, which was called the bazaar, but there was a credit cap. That meant items like doctor's buff packs and other items that were worth more than the cap had to be sold on vendors. Thanks to a patch well into the game's life, eventually players could search all the vendors in the galaxy through the bazaar terminal in towns, but players had to go to the player-run vendor to actually purchase the item.
That system was layered on top of a crafting system that made crafted items unique by allowing players to name them and experimentat on their stat layouts, all of which combined to inspire player interaction and even loyalty. Alex told a quick story about how he had run into a guy in Star Wars Galaxies who stopped him to say, "Hey, I made that armor!" To which he replied, "Hey, I bought your armor! It saved me from a Krayt Dragon."
It was a simple exchange, really, but sometimes the simple things make an MMO seem bigger than a place where you just sit in your garrison with your minions and pets.
If you'd like to hear the whole audio version of the panel, Jenesee Grey uploaded the recording to her site.
I think, as much as I want to disagree, you might be right. On a surface level, a lack of AH, or even just a commodities market, does force more player interaction. For what you might consider "mmo purists", this seems a good thing, because it rewards the socializing aspect they espouse as genre-integral.
However, here's the thing. Someone is going to fulfill that role now. Someone is going to fill their days, in shifts with others even, bartering, brokering, buying, and while they're doing this, there will be no controls. Some will become very prominent as "handlers" or "fixers", wherein, because of knowledge of html, they advertise via their own websites what items they buy or sell outright, at what price, and where to go to find the contact guy. No single person without this capacity will have an opportunity to compete, as would have been the case had the ah been conventional and universal across the board. They're swapping out a lesser evil for a regiment of technical domination and while some proponents will get very "in-game currency" wealthy, many more will be frustrated and it will lead to a loss of population base... but why stop there. If customers access your market through the html-friendly ui, accept payments to paypal. Now what have you created...
you are assuming everyone plays MMO to interact with other people in an economic fashion. That is simply not true, given the progression combat/loot nature of many MMOs.
Some only play MMOs for the content.
Don't you mean it made the MMO feel smaller?
I mean I could have 8 alts worth of characters churning out Blacksmith armor. It would sell, because it's great-quality gear for starting into raiding.
But I would never see it on any player, because WOW is actually a big place with so many players that it's rare that I'd ever group with someone who had the armor.
Most ways of fostering a community will naturally make the game feel more like a small town than a big city. Whether that's a bad thing depends on which you romanticize more.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Yeah I'm not really buying this. I absolutely hated trading via chat to the point that I just turn that chat off completely and I still found the older games had way more social interaction. If you want to try to pin it down to only one thing it is easily instancing. Nothing killed the social aspect of these games more than sticking everyone in their own little box. Cross server dungeon finders just made it even worse since now you play the game with throw away friends that you know you will never see again.
There are plenty of other things to point at but nothing else is anywhere near as close.
I believe that the mechanics should fit the game setting. I would be realistic to have a auction house, GPS, and maps of sorts in a modern or futuristic game.
In a high fantasy game that is supposed to mimic a more primitive life style where you are just trying to survive in the wilderness and there is a lot of unknown I don't believe the auction house makes much sense. You can have auction houses in towns, but they would likely be limited to the surrounding area. Transporting goods to other areas might be very dangerous or take a long time. People would likely sell their goods themselves in a shop they setup or if they are hunters they would just sell the goods and go back out hunting. It all depends on what you are harvesting/making.
Says who? You can easily tweak the lore to say instead of technology, the setting has magic in its place, and that allows for magic portals, magic communications, magic auction houses, and so on ... you get the idea.
You can justify anything by creative writing.
Of course you can justify anything, but that doesn't always make it a wise decision. Even with the most creative writing, an idea can still fall flat on it's face because it was a stupid idea to begin with; justified or not.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
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