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End Game Grind Now Showing?

13

Comments

  • BladestromBladestrom edinburghPosts: 4,941Member Uncommon
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by halflife25

    If legendary items exist in game and are advertised as end game weapons which make you look unique and different ofcourse a lot of players would think they 'need' it. it is just how they are advertised.

    Also it is in interest of Anet that players keep playing and trying to get those weapons because lets be fair for PVE players there is not much to look for ward to once you hit 80. So legendary weapons gives them a reason to log in and play.

    However, i completely disagree that mystic forged items look better. Not even clsoe in terms of design and effects. my personal opinion ofcourse.

    As far as word 'grind' is concerned. It has always been about repeition but at some point it got associated only with 'gear progression dungeons'.  It is the asian titles which amde this word famous and i doubt at that time anyone though that the word grind was specificaly made for tier based dungeon MMOS.

    Well, as you say, Anet wants people playing the game for a while. And yes, of course there's incentive. However it's not forced. And that's the key difference. You don't need them.

    It's like a high end car. You don't need it, but damn does it look cool. You want it, and unless you do something clever, it's going to take you a long time to get enough money to afford it. It's only a grind for people who get it into their heads that they 'need' to have it.

    As for the mystic forged items, of course it's all a matter of opinion. However, I think you'd be surprised. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess you haven't seen a full list of what's available. (Tbh I'm not sure there is a 100% complete list atm, as there's still a lot of items that are unknown). However, for example, all of the elementalists' conjured items are actual skins in the game, and you can craft items that look the same. I.E. you can have a warrior running around permanently wielding a fiery greatsword.

    There's also items that are spectral that you can craft in the mystic forge, that each have their own effects.  There's weapons that have runes etched in them that glow and look pretty awesome. There's ones that glow different colors during different times. Etc. There's a couple foci that also look awesome. One looks like you're manipulating magics in your hand, the other basically looks like a crystal that permanently drips blood. There's some really cool items hidden in there that people haven't discovered yet. Not to mention, there's also legendary armor, which exists, but noone has even begun to figure out how to make them.

  • TdogSkalTdogSkal Livonia, MIPosts: 1,244Member
    Originally posted by vigg2004

    I'm approaching level 80 in GW2, and I'm looking to the future.  I've seen several posts here indicating that there is a huge grind at endgame, be it DE's, dungeons or WvW, if you want to get good/rare gear.  Is this true?  Was GW2 not supposed to do away with grinding the same content over and over?

     

    Thanks for the info!

    You can grind if you choose too.

    I choice to grind Dungeons as the armor looks great.

    Once you have a lvl 80 exotic gear you have max stats.   No reason to grind gear for stats, only looks and runes/sigils.

    I am just about done with my stat gear and been grinding for look now. 

    WvW - Grind badges for PvP gear (look not stats)

    Dungeons - Each dungeon has its own set of armor and weapons with different looks.  Each dungeon has certain stats on the armor as well but no better than dropped exotic stats

    DEs -  Grind for Karma gear.

    Even the top of the line weapons and armor have the same max stats.  Once you have those max stats its all about grind for type of look you want and its not really that much grinding.    3 to 4 runs of a dungeon on explorer will get you a piece of armor

    Sooner or Later

  • BladestromBladestrom edinburghPosts: 4,941Member Uncommon
    I can give a really abstract example that demonstrates what I'm talking about. Imagine 2 basic arcade machines sat side by side- space invaders and asteroids. Both games are both repetitive in the extreme. Historically you can put your 10 pence in either and play the repetitive levels to try and reach a high score. This was never known as a grind - you can play either game whenever you like. Now imagine you were only allowed to play asteroids if you cleared 50 levels of space invaders first - even when you did not want to play space invaders. .. This is a grind.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon
    I don't think the grind is the problem.  The problem is the lack of a proportional reward for the grind.  Even sPVP needs to reward those players with ladder rankings.
  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by observer

    The "grind" is optional.  If you want a super amazing looking set, then set that as your goal.  If you don't want it, then don't do it.  I really hate when players complain that there isn't anything to do.  There's a lot of things to do, they just don't want to do them.  They might not like the content, but it's there.

    End-game gear isn't the only thing to strive for in GW2.  Same goes for almost all MMOs, such as, Lotro, WoW, AoC, Swtor, etc.

    • 400 Max. for all crafting disciplines.
    • Explorable Dungeon runs for gear.
    • WvW.
    • SPvP (ranks).
    • 100% map completion.
    • Achievements. (there's a lot of these)
    • Personal Story.
    • Alts.
    • Mystic Forge discoveries.
    • Jumping Puzzles.
    • Dynamic Events (hundreds?).
    • Roleplay (if you're into it).
    • Create your own guild/public events (be creative).
    • etc..

    There's really no character progression if you have all exotics.  Sure legendaries are nice but not THAT nice.

     

    There is stuff to do, but for me personally I just don't want to run dungeons for cosmetics.  the only reason I would go back to crafting is for the legendary but meh.

     

    I don't feel misled or bitter.  I just lost interest.

  • BladestromBladestrom edinburghPosts: 4,941Member Uncommon
    I think pve has got it perfect, the rewards are loot drops, and beyond dungeon tokens most rewards can be turned into gold which you can assign to any goal you fancy. spvp does have issues as the motivation for pvp is very different.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member

    It does all feel somewhat "meh" to me now tbh. It's got some great little features, does a lot of things well and is amazing value for money. But currently it offers jumping puzzles and sPvP and that is about it, for me anyway.

     

    BUT it allows instant access to those things and the potential to keep going back for updates, or whenever the fancy takes me. It will run nicely alongside Unholy Wars in the future. So no real complaints.

     

    Others are ofc, having a blast and enjoying their time and will continue to do so, fair play to them and I hope they do indeed continue to have great fun.

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • TeknoBugTeknoBug Calgary, ABPosts: 2,156Member


    Originally posted by aesperus

    As for the word 'grind', I think if people actually took a step back and looked at what they are calling a grind now, vs. what they considered a grind 2-4 years ago, they'd be shocked. Grind is quickly becoming synonymous with 'anything repetative', which is basically any videogame ever made, ever. What grind used to be, is a mundaine repeated task that was required in order to progress. GW2 doesn't have that. The 'grind' in this game is one that is completely optional. Sure there's incentives to do it, but as some have said, it's definitely a more longterm goal. You are still just as powerful w/ out a legendary, you just won't be cleaving the night sky, or shooting rainbows out of your butt.

    Ah no, grind means going for the next tier of gear, rank or whatever, SWTOR and WoW has the most OBVIOUS grind; tier based dungeon and pvp gear, and I grew to freaking hate that because once you've accomplished enough pieces the devs add another set for you to go after, it got really bad in pvp with SWTOR.


    There is a cosmetic grind in this game, but I've found enough mid-level gear that looks cool on my toons with a decent combination of dye colors. I'll keep playing the game until I gain enough gold or karma or skillpoint to get something new past 80, I don't even think about grinding anything- just play the game.

    image
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  • GolbezTheLionGolbezTheLion Los Angeles, CAPosts: 331Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Magnetia

    I am certainly not decked out in exotic gear. Max stat gear does require some grind, but the benefit gained is not super large. 

    41k Karma per karma vendor armour, 10-12 gold per cultural piece, 200-300 tokens per piece for dungeon armour.

    There is grind with max level gear, but rares and even blue gear is good enough for every bit of content in the game.

    Why would you buy cultural pieces lol? The entire intent of them is as a cosmetic addition.

    Dungeon armor is intended to be cosmetic as well.

    Exotic armor crafted specifically for your build costs 2-3g per piece and is always available at the TP. Exotic weapons of the same variety also cost 2-3g.

    It takes about an hour and a half in Orr to make 2-3g, you could have your entire set in a single day if you wanted, minus jewelry.

    You're doing it wrong.

     

  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,272Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member

    It's pretty much the same as every other themeparks "endgame" and suffers from exactly the same issues, you just get there faster and don't fork over money every month to do so.

     

    Get your exotics (quickly), then run dungeons (raids) or WvWvW (door banging lake pvp).

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • teotiusteotius RovaniemiPosts: 100Member
    Still people complain, probably most of these complainers play wow.
  • halflife25halflife25 Toronto, ONPosts: 737Member
    Originally posted by GolbezTheLion
    Originally posted by Magnetia

    I am certainly not decked out in exotic gear. Max stat gear does require some grind, but the benefit gained is not super large. 

    41k Karma per karma vendor armour, 10-12 gold per cultural piece, 200-300 tokens per piece for dungeon armour.

    There is grind with max level gear, but rares and even blue gear is good enough for every bit of content in the game.

    Why would you buy cultural pieces lol? The entire intent of them is as a cosmetic addition.

    Dungeon armor is intended to be cosmetic as well.

    Exotic armor crafted specifically for your build costs 2-3g per piece and is always available at the TP. Exotic weapons of the same variety also cost 2-3g.

    It takes about an hour and a half in Orr to make 2-3g, you could have your entire set in a single day if you wanted, minus jewelry.

    You're doing it wrong.

     

    God forbid he doesn't spend every waking hour in GW2 farming gold.

  • XzenXzen Los Alamos, NMPosts: 2,607Member Common

    I said from the start that this game has a grind. Though it's only for cosmetics. Getting full exotics is pretty easy and not much grind required. If you want dungeon sets or a legendary weapon then yeah the grind is huge.

     

    P.S. You can beat story mode with junk blues and greens you pick up on the way so you can "beat the game" without any grind other than getting to max level which is also very easy.

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

    have you never done a tier based raiding game before? try to play one of those and do the highest tier raid without any raiding gear and see how well you do.. the BIG difference which I still can't see how you don't see it is in GW2 you are not required to continuously repeat content to get gear that allows you to play all of the games content.. this simply is not true in other raid based games.. Again both have their advantages and disadvantages but how you can't differentiate between the two is beyond me.

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • pmcubedpmcubed Portland, ORPosts: 289Member
    Originally posted by observer
    • 400 Max. for all crafting disciplines. (maxed 3 professions - friends got the other 5)
    • Explorable Dungeon runs for gear. (I did each at least once and I have no drive to run them 30-50 times more to get a cosmetic upgrade - which aren't even that great looking)
    • WvW.  (this one is ok for the first week or two weeks, then it really gets monotonous.  Zerg here, zerg there)
    • SPvP (ranks).  (sPvP is ok - I had the most fun here.  Then i consider how much time I spent doing BG's in Rift and SWTOR and WoW for that matter... its kind of the same with no substantial reward except cosmetic stuff.  I would say the cosmetics in this department are WAY better, but nobody will ever see them except for in the Mist)
    • TPvP. (Can be much better than SPvP - less glory gain, but you can get some titles)
    • 100% map completion.  (done)
    • Achievements. (there's a lot of these)  (completed most but the very grindy ones i.e. kill 5000 enemies with sheild etc.)
    • Personal Story.  (5 characters.  Once they hit 50, the story converges into the same story - so for the most part except for some story-arches I've not seen, done.)
    • Alts.  (80 main, 4 level 50ish's)
    • Jumping Puzzles.  (all done)
    • Dynamic Events (hundreds?). (The only one's worth doing are in Orr so you can also mine worthwhile materials around the area.  So I would say more like 10's to do.  And once you've done an invasion DE or Escort DE, you've literally done them all.)
    • Roleplay (if you're into it).  (No thanks)
    • Create your own guild/public events (be creative). (Social aspects of this game are way too lacking for anyone to want to do this.   Anet would have to sponsor these events for anyone to show any interest.)
    • etc..  (game uninstalled)

    I got my 60$ out of the game.  It's b2p so when more stuff gets added I might mess around.  The stuff I've done would take a casual player much longer to complete, but honestly, once you hit 80 and do most of the content.  You're left with an indescribably insane grind for the last carrot - the legendary.  Which adds a very minor stat increase over the Exotic.  It does change your spell effects.  Also, if you got one, you would be among the 1% of people who are crazy enough to get it.  (Search reddit about the estimated material/karma cost of a legendary and be suprised)

    To those still enjoying, have fun :-)  I'm not trying to make anyone stop playing - This is how it happened to me.  That's it.

  • NaralNaral Solway, MNPosts: 751Member
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

    have you never done a tier based raiding game before? try to play one of those and do the highest tier raid without any raiding gear and see how well you do.. the BIG difference which I still can't see how you don't see it is in GW2 you are not required to continuously repeat content to get gear that allows you to play all of the games content.. this simply is not true in other raid based games.. Again both have their advantages and disadvantages but how you can't differentiate between the two is beyond me.

    I think you are missing his point. He is simply saying, at least I think he is, that you are never required to raid. Just because it is there, does not mean you have to do it.

    Hell I played WoW for three years, and never did more than a ten man raid, and only a few times really. There was always something to work for that did not require raiding (incidentally the same is true I feel for GW2, I just don't see it taking me three years to do all those things). Was I competitive in pvp? No, not really, but I didn't care, I just did it for fun, the way we are supposed to play GW2 ;-)

    While there are plenty of games with raids in them for those so inclined, there are very few raid free games. The thing is, people seem to think that because raids exist, you *have* to do them, which is just not true. I feel the flaw in Anet's design is that they (again, imho) gain nothing by refuting raids, and not having them, except to limit their content to a certain design, which is fine, but they are disavowing their self stated goal of knocking WoW off of it's golden throne.  I suppose that was all marketing bluster at any rate, though.

    I am happy with the game how it is, and if there were raids, I would not do them anyway. But to say the game is somehow better because it does *not* have raids, just kind of does not make sense to me. Raids are just one of many things to do in a game like this, why deny *any* aspect is my thinking, but then I am not a game developer.

  • observerobserver Houston, TXPosts: 3,004Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by pmcubed
    Originally posted by observer
    • 400 Max. for all crafting disciplines. (maxed 3 professions - friends got the other 5)
    • Explorable Dungeon runs for gear. (I did each at least once and I have no drive to run them 30-50 times more to get a cosmetic upgrade - which aren't even that great looking)
    • WvW.  (this one is ok for the first week or two weeks, then it really gets monotonous.  Zerg here, zerg there)
    • SPvP (ranks).  (sPvP is ok - I had the most fun here.  Then i consider how much time I spent doing BG's in Rift and SWTOR and WoW for that matter... its kind of the same with no substantial reward except cosmetic stuff.  I would say the cosmetics in this department are WAY better, but nobody will ever see them except for in the Mist)
    • TPvP. (Can be much better than SPvP - less glory gain, but you can get some titles)
    • 100% map completion.  (done)
    • Achievements. (there's a lot of these)  (completed most but the very grindy ones i.e. kill 5000 enemies with sheild etc.)
    • Personal Story.  (5 characters.  Once they hit 50, the story converges into the same story - so for the most part except for some story-arches I've not seen, done.)
    • Alts.  (80 main, 4 level 50ish's)
    • Jumping Puzzles.  (all done)
    • Dynamic Events (hundreds?). (The only one's worth doing are in Orr so you can also mine worthwhile materials around the area.  So I would say more like 10's to do.  And once you've done an invasion DE or Escort DE, you've literally done them all.)
    • Roleplay (if you're into it).  (No thanks)
    • Create your own guild/public events (be creative). (Social aspects of this game are way too lacking for anyone to want to do this.   Anet would have to sponsor these events for anyone to show any interest.)
    • etc..  (game uninstalled)

    I got my 60$ out of the game.  It's b2p so when more stuff gets added I might mess around.  The stuff I've done would take a casual player much longer to complete, but honestly, once you hit 80 and do most of the content.  You're left with an indescribably insane grind for the last carrot - the legendary.  Which adds a very minor stat increase over the Exotic.  It does change your spell effects.  Also, if you got one, you would be among the 1% of people who are crazy enough to get it.  (Search reddit about the estimated material/karma cost of a legendary and be suprised)

    To those still enjoying, have fun :-)  I'm not trying to make anyone stop playing - This is how it happened to me.  That's it.

    You're obviously a hardcore gamer with a lot of time (or content locust, as some people call them).  Luckily for you, you can always come back when more content is added.

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by Naral
     

    I think you are missing his point. He is simply saying, at least I think he is, that you are never required to raid. Just because it is there, does not mean you have to do it.

    *snip*

    But that's my point.. there is gated content in those games.. content you cannot do or complete without doing some sort of dungeon grind. Doesn't matter whether you "need" to do it or not.  GW2 offers you the entire game without the need to do any of that. Anytime they add anything it will be available to people without having to grind out another set of this or that. The advantage of this is not spending countless hours and resources in a department to create raid content.  This frees up time and people to work on other aspects the bigger majority of players with be participating in. This to me is a huge difference and why I enjoy ANETs design as opposed to other themeparks and don't see why certain people can't see the difference here.

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • austriacusaustriacus limaPosts: 624Member
    Originally posted by Naral
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

    have you never done a tier based raiding game before? try to play one of those and do the highest tier raid without any raiding gear and see how well you do.. the BIG difference which I still can't see how you don't see it is in GW2 you are not required to continuously repeat content to get gear that allows you to play all of the games content.. this simply is not true in other raid based games.. Again both have their advantages and disadvantages but how you can't differentiate between the two is beyond me.

    I think you are missing his point. He is simply saying, at least I think he is, that you are never required to raid. Just because it is there, does not mean you have to do it.

    Hell I played WoW for three years, and never did more than a ten man raid, and only a few times really. There was always something to work for that did not require raiding (incidentally the same is true I feel for GW2, I just don't see it taking me three years to do all those things). Was I competitive in pvp? No, not really, but I didn't care, I just did it for fun, the way we are supposed to play GW2 ;-)

    While there are plenty of games with raids in them for those so inclined, there are very few raid free games. The thing is, people seem to think that because raids exist, you *have* to do them, which is just not true. I feel the flaw in Anet's design is that they (again, imho) gain nothing by refuting raids, and not having them, except to limit their content to a certain design, which is fine, but they are disavowing their self stated goal of knocking WoW off of it's golden throne.  I suppose that was all marketing bluster at any rate, though.

    I am happy with the game how it is, and if there were raids, I would not do them anyway. But to say the game is somehow better because it does *not* have raids, just kind of does not make sense to me. Raids are just one of many things to do in a game like this, why deny *any* aspect is my thinking, but then I am not a game developer.

    You dont have to do them but its not nice to not be able to enjoy content you have paid for because you have a life.

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member
    Originally posted by austriacus
    Originally posted by Naral
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
     

     

     

    You dont have to do them but its not nice to not be able to enjoy content you have paid for because you have a life.

    I'm not sure why this should really bother an mmo player. The games are (generally) meant to cater to a wide range of players with a wide range of how much time they have to actually play.

     

    I don't have the time for long ass stuff, but I'm glad it is added for those that do and for when I get the chance to clear a weekend etc.

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,272Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

    have you never done a tier based raiding game before? try to play one of those and do the highest tier raid without any raiding gear and see how well you do.. the BIG difference which I still can't see how you don't see it is in GW2 you are not required to continuously repeat content to get gear that allows you to play all of the games content.. this simply is not true in other raid based games.. Again both have their advantages and disadvantages but how you can't differentiate between the two is beyond me.

    I have for quite awhile... 

     

    You get the raiding gear AFTER you do the raid... You start the raids with dungeon gear. This is where GW2 stops, at dungeon gear. You don't grind for raid gear, then go do the raid. 

     

    The difference between the two is that raid gear does not exist in GW2 because there is no raid content... There is only the Heroic dungeon tier. Nothing was changed, raiding was just left out. 

     

    They sure did market the hell out this game.

     

    edit - matter of fact instead of having another tier of content and gear, the simple made legendaries. I'm sure they saved a lot of money doing it that way.

  • WarbandWarband ChesterPosts: 723Member
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

    have you never done a tier based raiding game before? try to play one of those and do the highest tier raid without any raiding gear and see how well you do.. the BIG difference which I still can't see how you don't see it is in GW2 you are not required to continuously repeat content to get gear that allows you to play all of the games content.. this simply is not true in other raid based games.. Again both have their advantages and disadvantages but how you can't differentiate between the two is beyond me.

    I have for quite awhile... 

     

    You get the raiding gear AFTER you do the raid... You start the raids with dungeon gear. This is where GW2 stops, at dungeon gear. You don't grind for raid gear, then go do the raid. 

     

    The difference between the two is that raid gear does not exist in GW2 because there is no raid content... There is only the Heroic dungeon tier. Nothing was changed, raiding was just left out. 

     

    They sure did market the hell out this game.

     

    edit - matter of fact instead of having another tier of content and gear, the simple made legendaries. I'm sure they saved a lot of money doing it that way.

     You sorta completely missed his point. His point is doing tier 7 raid with dungeon gear. Not doing tier 1. Of course you can easily do Tier 1 raid's with dungeon gear that's the point.

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by Warband
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    That is true, im more ir less agreeing with you. the problem comes not from gw2 but from games like wow that focuses its gameplay with dungeon repetition. The majority of mmorg players are forced to grind dungeons. Gw2 has lots of repetition all over the place and as I say it is not a grind purely because it would only be a grind if you were daft enough to take part in repetitive activity that you don't find fun.

    Repetitive activity = grind if you don't want to do it.

    This is another one of those half truths floating around, being "forced" to grind dungeons in other games. You are no more forced "to take part in repetitive activity" in those games than you are in GW2.  It's pretty much the same in this respect. 

    have you never done a tier based raiding game before? try to play one of those and do the highest tier raid without any raiding gear and see how well you do.. the BIG difference which I still can't see how you don't see it is in GW2 you are not required to continuously repeat content to get gear that allows you to play all of the games content.. this simply is not true in other raid based games.. Again both have their advantages and disadvantages but how you can't differentiate between the two is beyond me.

    I have for quite awhile... 

     

    You get the raiding gear AFTER you do the raid... You start the raids with dungeon gear. This is where GW2 stops, at dungeon gear. You don't grind for raid gear, then go do the raid. 

     

    The difference between the two is that raid gear does not exist in GW2 because there is no raid content... There is only the Heroic dungeon tier. Nothing was changed, raiding was just left out. 

     

    They sure did market the hell out this game.

     

    edit - matter of fact instead of having another tier of content and gear, the simple made legendaries. I'm sure they saved a lot of money doing it that way.

     You sorta completely missed his point. His point is doing tier 7 raid with dungeon gear. Not doing tier 1. Of course you can easily do Tier 1 raid's with dungeon gear that's the point.

    at least someone got it...

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

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