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How long before Blizzard anounce sales for release day of MoP

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  • Ramonski7Ramonski7 Aurora, ILPosts: 2,656Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ghern
    Originally posted by Ramonski7

    Yes, yes they're bleeding subs. Everyone knows it including Blizzard as you so pointed out. Is it that hard to understand with such an old ass game? It's like someone constantly telling me that Vanessa Williams is damn near 50 years old and me saying: Yeah, but she still looks good! Or better yet your grandpa is taking all newcomers in a boxing match and constantly whooping their asses and someone pointing out: Hey look! He's getting tired!

    Well no sh*t after knocking out 10 people half his age our younger. We all know he won't last forever...

    Well, I suppose because people find it interesting to watch.

    It's in your right to get frustrated by all the talk about it but that isn't going to make it stop.

    All the stuff you pointed out should be obvious to everyone. It does not mean people will just stop discussing it though.

    Yeah I know it won't stop. Look, I've been at this (mmorpg gaming) for a long time. Been playing mmorpgs before WoW hit the scene and will be playing them well after it makes the final curtain call. It's just odd to see that some people can never get this game out of their system and I think the current and future crops of mmorpgs are the only things suffering from it. I've managed to move on while at the same time I don't hold any ill will toward my time in Azeroth. It was a good experience for me and I don't regret it (I learned some valuable lessons about myself as a mmorpg player). But some of the chuckleheads here are treating their time in Azeroth as a relationship gone bad rather a lesson learned (whether it's the evils of raids, gear threadmills or questing).

     

    And people tend to hold on and fester in the memories of bad relationships much longer than bad experiences. They, unlike experiences, tend to carry over to the next relationship. While bad experiences, on the other hand, can be reflected on or reversed. I mean really, where do you think all that vemon will be directed at once WoW shuts down for good?

    image
    "Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Virginia, VAPosts: 2,131Member
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by Ramonski7

    Those numbers INCLUDE campaigns sold as well since you cannot have a expansion without the original. I thought I explained that. They never released the sales figures of each campaigns sold seperately. I'm sure if Blizzard released a 2 year spread of how many WoW accounts were added since it's original release date til Dec 2006 you'd see number dwarfing those of GW.

    GW1 and WOW expansions are impossible to compare

    unlike other mmos -- you could buy a different GW1 campaign like Factions or Nightfall and need nothing else

     

    for other mmos, expansion is worthless unless the base game is included

    GW1 had a variety of bundlepacks but only 1 expansion (Eye of the North) that required an existing game

     

    otherwise,

    you are correct, if comparing sold accts to sold accts, WOW may be as high a 100 million

    (even everquest claims they had 20 million accts over the course of history)

    Both are still content  based on the original game made from the same company.  They can very well be compared: both are methods of distributing content.

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

    Both are still content  based on the original game made from the same company.  They can very well be compared: both are methods of distributing content.

    how so?  if i bought Factions - i dont need Prophecies (the original game)

    Factions has nothing from original game beyond the same core classes and same game engine

     

    Prophecies, Factions, Nightfall -- are each "stand alone" games, independent of each other

     

     if you bought one campaign, you would never see the other campaigns

    --  i met GW1 players that never had interest in buying other campaigns

     

    in a game like WOW,  most players are at the upper levels

    if you dont buy the latest expansion, you cannot play with the majority of the playerbase

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member
    Originally posted by nyxium
    There are massive queues to get in realms at the moment. That does not mean large sales of MoP however, players could just want to login and roll a free panda without the expansion, or just log in to chew the fat.. after going to the offiical forums I get a preliminary hunch that the panda's are not going down too well, and have put people off the game. So far.

    Pandas have definitely been a polarizing part of the game.  Either the player is insanely happy with them being added, and thinks it's the greatest thing in the world, or they think they were better left as an April fools joke and only make an already silly expansion even sillier.

    The real complaint is the Cross Realm Zones (CRZ).  Finding nodes and rare mobs are annoyingly difficult now.  Granted, you could argue that rare mobs should be rare, but they've moved beyond simply rare, and into impossible territory.  Resource nodes, however, have no such justification.  Trying to level up a profession now is aggrivating, to say the least.

    You make me like charity

  • 13lake13lake Posts: 295Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ramonski7

    A damn near decade old mmorpg sells 2.7 million copies in ONE week before they release in China and this crowd is harking on it selling less that the last expansion? After so long do you really expect the game to continue to out perform itself? While at the same time it's STILL out performing the competition. Let's not debate that little nugget, but do yourself a favor and try to think of ANY mmorpg expansion released  that has outperformed it's previous expansion or matched it. You won't find those numbers and you know why? Because no other mmo developer EVER releases those numbers! And no one in the industry cares about them either.

     

    I even tried to look up GW numbers for how the original sold as oppose to the expansions and no one is bothering to seperate the numbers. They are all lumped together as one big number at 6.5 million. And if you divide that number by the number of expansions then you get roughly 1.6 million per release. Now compare that to WoW's numbers at 4.7 million per release with the exception to the last expansion at 2.7 million. And if you lump together Blizzard's game + expansions like GW's, you get a whopping 21.5 million copies of WoW roughly sold.

     

    I repeat, that is not bad for such an old game. To steadily out perform EVERY competitor since it's last exansion release 2 years ago says a lot about the impact it still has on the industry. That list includes: TSW, GW2, SWTOR and a slew of F2P and expansions for all of those games.

     

    And this is coming from a guy that currently enjoying the sh*t out of GW2 and looking foward to enjoying DF: UW, AoW and AA.

    You're wrong, its not 6.5 per expansion, its not per box either, its 6.5 million accounts which can me from 1 box sale to all 4 box sales, ...

  • itgrowlsitgrowls newport news, VAPosts: 2,951Member

    completely agree. so far i've seen the press online do everything they can to add together the special deals and such to improve the numbers far beyond what they actually are like adding annual passes n such.

    The only accurate data out there is the estimated 700k sold on launch day. Not really impressive considering Cata sold 3.3 mil within the first 24hrs.

  • 13lake13lake Posts: 295Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ramonski7
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by Ramonski7

    I even tried to look up GW numbers for how the original sold as oppose to the expansions and no one is bothering to seperate the numbers. They are all lumped together as one big number at 6.5 million. And if you divide that number by the number of expansions then you get roughly 1.6 million per release. Now compare that to WoW's numbers at 4.7 million per release with the exception to the last expansion at 2.7 million. And if you lump together Blizzard's game + expansions like GW's, you get a whopping 21.5 million copies of WoW roughly sold.

    ive only mentioned Blizzard compared to Blizzard in this thread

     

    but since ANET has been mentioned - they too have a site for press releases

    http://www.guildwars.com/events/press/releases/

     

    ncsoft used to give a 2 year quarterly history of new GW1 accounts being sold

    (not to be confused w campaigns -- these are new accounts)

    http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/ncsoft-releases-quarterly-report-guild-t10355520.html?s=03c4de217efb063cd387c2af2fa6ac77&t=10355520

    QTR / Accounts
    Sep 2006 / 2,447,000
    Dec 2006 / 3,122,000
    Mar 2007 / 3,555,000
    Jun 2007 / 3,917,000
    Sep 2007 / 4,500,000
    Dec 2007 / 4,878,000
    Mar 2008 / 5,159,000
    Jun 2008 / 5,377,000
    Sep 2008 / 5,589,000
    Dec 2008 / 5,803,000

    Those numbers INCLUDE campaigns sold as well since you cannot have a expansion without the original. I thought I explained that. They never released the sales figures of each campaigns sold seperately. I'm sure if Blizzard released a 2 year spread of how many WoW accounts were added since it's original release date til Dec 2006 you'd see number dwarfing those of GW.

    You can hold any of the 2 campagins without the original, and you can hold the expansion with any of the 3 campaigns, you're wrong again.

  • L0C0ManL0C0Man Puerto OrdazPosts: 1,065Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ramonski7
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by Ramonski7

    I even tried to look up GW numbers for how the original sold as oppose to the expansions and no one is bothering to seperate the numbers. They are all lumped together as one big number at 6.5 million. And if you divide that number by the number of expansions then you get roughly 1.6 million per release. Now compare that to WoW's numbers at 4.7 million per release with the exception to the last expansion at 2.7 million. And if you lump together Blizzard's game + expansions like GW's, you get a whopping 21.5 million copies of WoW roughly sold.

    ive only mentioned Blizzard compared to Blizzard in this thread

     

    but since ANET has been mentioned - they too have a site for press releases

    http://www.guildwars.com/events/press/releases/

     

    ncsoft used to give a 2 year quarterly history of new GW1 accounts being sold

    (not to be confused w campaigns -- these are new accounts)

    http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/ncsoft-releases-quarterly-report-guild-t10355520.html?s=03c4de217efb063cd387c2af2fa6ac77&t=10355520

    QTR / Accounts
    Sep 2006 / 2,447,000
    Dec 2006 / 3,122,000
    Mar 2007 / 3,555,000
    Jun 2007 / 3,917,000
    Sep 2007 / 4,500,000
    Dec 2007 / 4,878,000
    Mar 2008 / 5,159,000
    Jun 2008 / 5,377,000
    Sep 2008 / 5,589,000
    Dec 2008 / 5,803,000

    Those numbers INCLUDE campaigns sold as well since you cannot have a expansion without the original. I thought I explained that. They never released the sales figures of each campaigns sold seperately. I'm sure if Blizzard released a 2 year spread of how many WoW accounts were added since it's original release date til Dec 2006 you'd see number dwarfing those of GW.

    At least as far as I understand, the key word is "accounts activated" (from the actual report linked in the gwguru thread). For example, I have prophecies, if I buy factions, then I wouldn't be counted as a new account since the new campaign is applied to my already existing account (unless I actually create a new account which I'm sure some people did). You have to take into account that GW1 had only one expansion (Eye of the North) with Factions and Nightfall being campaigns, not expansions. The difference is that they were basically standalone games, you could buy any of the three campaigns and play it completely without ever needing to have the other two, and even play the expansion with only one campaign.

    I do agree that WoW sold a LOT more than GW1, nothing to contend there, just clearing up some things on the GW1 front.

    What can men do against such reckless hate?

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by L0C0Man

    I do agree that WoW sold a LOT more than GW1, nothing to contend there, just clearing up some things on the GW1 front.

    i agree - no contest  :)

  • Ramonski7Ramonski7 Aurora, ILPosts: 2,656Member Uncommon
    Lol ok so you basically have 3 versions of GW1 + an expansion. Still doesn't take away from the fact that 3 boxes were released and sold seperately plus a expansion. Also all 4 are counted as GW1 sale data as none of them are tracked as individual releases.

    But I don't understand how this turned into types of boxes sold rather that how you cannot compare sale data from other companies release to release sales (whether they are 3 versions of the same game or a not) so you can critique diminishing returning sales of that IP.

    image
    "Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."

  • JackdogJackdog Charleston, SCPosts: 6,344Member

    Here is what I find interesting, supposidly according to Gamasutra  Mop sold 2.3 million copues and WoW is back to 10 million. Does that meant that over 7 1/2 million decided not to go Panda ? Says a lot of 2 out of every 3 players did not buy the expansion.

    I have a lifetime sub but have not played LoTRO for 5 hours in the last year or so but I  still am considering purchasing the Rohan expansion just in case GW2 gets old to me

    I miss DAoC

  • L0C0ManL0C0Man Puerto OrdazPosts: 1,065Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Jackdog

    Here is what I find interesting, supposidly according to Gamasutra  Mop sold 2.3 million copues and WoW is back to 10 million. Does that meant that over 7 1/2 million decided not to go Panda ? Says a lot of 2 out of every 3 players did not buy the expansion.

    I have a lifetime sub but have not played LoTRO for 5 hours in the last year or so but I  still am considering purchasing the Rohan expansion just in case GW2 gets old to me

    From what I remember reading, about half (maybe a bit more) of the WoW players are in China, so if there are 10 million active players now, that makes it about 2.3 million of copies sold out of a total of 5 million (since MoP isn't yet available in China). All we can get from that so far is that about 1 out of every 2 WoW players hasn't bought MoP yet.. but that doesn't mean they won't buy it, or that they will either.

    Also you have to take into account that there are several players that bought 1 year of WoW time after October 2011 (so they still count as active players) to take advantage of the offer to get Diablo 3 for free and might not be interested in MoP, but we can't say how many are there or how big of an impact will be once it ends (it could be big, it could be nothing).

    What can men do against such reckless hate?

  • RebelScum99RebelScum99 Mesa, AZPosts: 1,090Member
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by fenistil

    http://eu.blizzard.com/en-gb/company/press/pressreleases.html?id=6147208

    2,7 mln copies in first week.   Subs rise to 10 mln. 

    Now important will be figures 1  and 3 months from now on.

     MOP undersold LK - WOTLK had 2.8m in the first 24 hours

    http://massively.joystiq.com/2008/11/20/wows-lich-king-sells-record-2-8-million-copies-in-24-hours/

     

    That really shouldn't be surprising.  WoW was at its peak when WOTLK came out, and had just come off arguably one of the best expansions any MMO has ever had in The Burning Crusade.  So there's no doubt that WOTLK was going to be huge.  Once WOTLK hit, the raiding game opened up to more players than ever before, and although it had mixed reviews from veterans of the game due to the simplification of content, it was generally thought of as a solid expansion, and made the endgame raids and dungeons even more accessible than previously.  

    Cata carried a lot of promise with it due to the restructuring of the old world content, which explained its great sales figures, but was a disappointment to many people.  It just wasn't a very good expansion.  Then Blizzard announced...pandas.  

    So honestly, nobody should have expected this expansion to outsell Cata or any of the previous ones.  But I will say this:  I've been pleasantly surprised at how good the expansion is.  Blizzard did a solid job with this one, and the general feeling in the community is that this expansion was a step up from Cataclysm.  And for all the hype that GW2 got, it took MoP only a week to surpass GW2's total sales.  

     

     

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by RebelScum99

    I've been pleasantly surprised at how good the expansion is.  Blizzard did a solid job with this one, and the general feeling in the community is that this expansion was a step up from Cataclysm.  

    agree - ive heard people are very happy w MOP content

  • AusareAusare adamstown, MDPosts: 850Member
    Well mmo champion.com has a release that first week sales are about 2.7 mill
  • JackdogJackdog Charleston, SCPosts: 6,344Member
    Originally posted by L0C0Man
    Originally posted by Jackdog

    Here is what I find interesting, supposidly according to Gamasutra  Mop sold 2.3 million copues and WoW is back to 10 million. Does that meant that over 7 1/2 million decided not to go Panda ? Says a lot of 2 out of every 3 players did not buy the expansion.

    I have a lifetime sub but have not played LoTRO for 5 hours in the last year or so but I  still am considering purchasing the Rohan expansion just in case GW2 gets old to me

    From what I remember reading, about half (maybe a bit more) of the WoW players are in China, so if there are 10 million active players now, that makes it about 2.3 million of copies sold out of a total of 5 million (since MoP isn't yet available in China). All we can get from that so far is that about 1 out of every 2 WoW players hasn't bought MoP yet.. but that doesn't mean they won't buy it, or that they will either.

    Also you have to take into account that there are several players that bought 1 year of WoW time after October 2011 (so they still count as active players) to take advantage of the offer to get Diablo 3 for free and might not be interested in MoP, but we can't say how many are there or how big of an impact will be once it ends (it could be big, it could be nothing).

    according to Gamespot it wa a global release

    http://www.gamespot.com/news/mists-of-pandaria-approved-for-china-6394709

     

    World of Warcraft: Mists of Pandaria will be released globally on September 25.

    In addition to the English version, Mists of Pandaria will be localised into Latin American Spanish, Brazilian Portuguese, French, German, European Spanish, Russian, Korean, traditional Chinese, and Italian.

    but the according to yahoo news the release was 2 days ago

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/world-warcraft-r-mists-pandaria-010000417.html

    whatever I was expecting the initial sales to be a lot higher. Less than a year ago WoW was consistently breaking 100K XFire hours even on weekdays. I was in Vent this  morning with my old LoTRO/SWToR buddies and this one girl who still has one of those one year subs said she had not bought MoM so as you say it will be interesting to watch it's numbers for a couple of months. Their stock had a nice bump this morning but it still has a way to go to get back to it's average

    WoW certainly is not dead but it is showing it''s age and does not look like this expansion will get the numbers back where they were a couple of years ago

    I miss DAoC

  • Drekker17Drekker17 Highlands Ranch, COPosts: 296Member

    It's down a lot compared ot Cata, but it isn't shocking. Cata recieved far more hate during the expansion than the previous and saw the first major declines for wow. Now if the number is about 3.7-4million in a month I will view MoP as an overall success, not a great success, but for a declining game following a hated expansion, it will be ok. If it goes higher then that I will honesty be surprised.

     

    It should be noted, you don't need the expansion to play pandas or pet battles, I'm wondering if that would reduce the number of purchasers a lot? I personally haven't bought it yet, waiting to get my panda to 85 then if I still enjoy it I'll get mop and try out a monk.

    "Great minds talk about ideas, average minds talk about events, and small minds talk about people." - Eleanor Roosevelt
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  • nsignificnsignific ljPosts: 212Member

    That's 2.7 million people who decided to play MoP instead of a competing game.

     

    That's the bottom line here.

  • nsignificnsignific ljPosts: 212Member
    Originally posted by Jackdog
     

    according to Gamespot it wa a global release

    http://www.gamespot.com/news/mists-of-pandaria-approved-for-china-6394709

    It was not a global release. China got MOP on Oct. 2nd and the press release specifically states those numbers are for the first week (AKA before Oct. 2nd).

     

    That's 2.7 million NONCHINESE people, since so many of you don't like to count the Chinese as people. Jesus.

  • JoeyMMOJoeyMMO SomewherePosts: 1,326Member

    I'm guessing you'll have to wait for the monthly figures as MoP isn't breaking any records so  far. If they were better than Cataclysm we'd have heard it by now. If the monthly numbers aren't there then you can expect any number that doesn't make it sound like a disaster. Remember the TOR-numbers? They might go for active subscriptions and other vague wording like that.

    They already talk about "subscriber base" being back to 10M, you could read that as active subscriptions but with the way they work in China, there is no way that's even remotely accurate. And there could be a big difference between a base number of people that could pay the sub and the number that actually pay the sub (or part of it since then can pay as they play).

    Spin doctors will be spin doctors. They'll come up with something.

    imageimage
  • kitaradkitarad RomePosts: 1,745Member Uncommon

    Aside from the discussion about profits and paid subscriptions. The current MMORPGs have F2P,B2P, freemium like LotRO where you can sub or use points the bottom line is whether people are playing your game. If WoW manages as an eight year old game to attract that many to buy it it is still doing pretty darn well. I am not a shareholder just a gamer and as long as the game I am playing currently which is GW 2 and WoW is doing well enough I am content.

     

    Seriously as long as someone somewhere is paying either hourly or buying and subbing they are still minting which is to them a revenue. It is us the pundits on  the tin can that are discussing whether the Chinese should be counted. Looks like that date does not include them so I guess more numbers will come.

    image

  • nsignificnsignific ljPosts: 212Member
    Originally posted by JoeyMMO

    I'm guessing you'll have to wait for the monthly figures as MoP isn't breaking any records so  far. If they were better than Cataclysm we'd have heard it by now. If the monthly numbers aren't there then you can expect any number that doesn't make it sound like a disaster. Remember the TOR-numbers? They might go for active subscriptions and other vague wording like that.

    They already talk about "subscriber base" being back to 10M, you could read that as active subscriptions but with the way they work in China, there is no way that's even remotely accurate. And there could be a big difference between a base number of people that could pay the sub and the number that actually pay the sub (or part of it since then can pay as they play).

    Spin doctors will be spin doctors. They'll come up with something.

    Why do you care if they're playing off of a sub, or a game room account in China? A person playing is still a person playing. And besides, Blizzard goes into great detail describing what constitutes a "subscriber" included in those 10 million - I suggest you read their press release. They disclose everything, there's no deception or "spinning".

    I don't get this obsession with China. Even Blizzard seems to have gone out of their way to exclude China for the first week (they got MoP on October 2nd), just so you wouldn't be crying over inflated sales numbers in the first week. Still, every post seems to mention China...

  • smh_alotsmh_alot Area 51Posts: 976Member
    Well, 2.7 million isn't bad for an MMORPG at all, but it's certainly the lowest for WoW. I think it's the first time that they didn't announce the 1st day sales, and the 1st week sales barely equal the 1st day sales of tBC and WotLK. You also have to wonder, 'so only 2.7 mln people of a 10 mln subscriber base purchased the new expansion?'

    Usually you have a lot of people returning with an expansion and a boost. But let's say that half of WoW players is Chines, that's still only half of all other WoW players that bought the expansion. If you take into account that a number of returnees, ex-WoW players, came back for it, what the jump from 9.1 to 10 mln seems to suggest, then it's even less than half of the current non-Chinese WoW playerbase that bought MoP.




    So, objectively speaking, MoP did worse in sales than all former expansions. Is WoW doing badly though? Of course not, it's still the most played MMORPG, even if it does seem to be in decline. That's a nice achievement too, I'd say, after 8 years.
  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member
    Originally posted by nsignific
    Originally posted by Jackdog
     

    according to Gamespot it wa a global release

    http://www.gamespot.com/news/mists-of-pandaria-approved-for-china-6394709

    It was not a global release. China got MOP on Oct. 2nd and the press release specifically states those numbers are for the first week (AKA before Oct. 2nd).

     

    That's 2.7 million NONCHINESE people, since so many of you don't like to count the Chinese as people. Jesus.

    No, we don't count the Chinese because:

    A.) Chinese players get expansions free because of Blizz agreements with China's government ( the only way they were allowed to even operate the game there ), so there's noone in China buying MoP to count.

    and

    B.) Chinese players do not have subscriptions, they pay by the hour. So there are no subscriptions in China to count.

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  • ThupliThupli Spokane, WAPosts: 587Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Nadia

    i was giving contextual information

    Blizzard is the best selling mmo but MOP seems to be the weakest selling expansion for Blizzard in the last 4 years

    What it means is that Cataclysm really sucked and some people aren't coming back to see if MOP is better.

     

    I wonder if it's better now than Cataclysm, but I won't go back when I only get one choice on how to "build" my character every 15 levels.   Can you imagine being a new player with no heirlooms?  How boring.

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