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[Review] Guild Wars 2: Raising the Bar

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  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member

    I totally agree with that score - which is well deserved just for having the "balls" to get away from the WoW clone model in an AAA theme park MMORPG. And it's a success.

    [mod edit]

    There are very few MMORPGs I'd rate above 9.0 in the 17+ years I'm playing the graphic version of that genre - and GW2 is one of them.

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

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  • adam_noxadam_nox hays, KSPosts: 2,073Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Good review Bill, I agree with it.

    But the best part of this review is reading all of the vitriol from the jilted anti-fans of GW2 ;).

    jilted?  Do you even know what the word means?

     

    This review is a joke though. 

  • ZylaxxZylaxx Erlanger, KYPosts: 2,574Member
    Originally posted by grimal

    Longevity 9?   How in the world did you come up with this number?

    Edit:  I guess since "hundreds and hundreds of hours" equals a 9, the expectation is for an MMO to satiate our appetites for a month?  If so, what's the big deal if it's B2P or P2P since all the content is done within that first month and there is never a need to pay past the inital box price?

    Easy becasue anyone who isnt a voracious 16+ hour a day (which is 90% of an MMO demographic) consumer of content relizes that GW2 has 2 times the content of a normal MMO.  Look at this, yesterday the first legendarys were crafted, more then a month after release.  The average gamer will take months, if not years to aquire something like this.  Everything from WvW to Orr to Armor/Weapon skin farming and everything inbetween.  The great thing is none of those things will EVER be made irelevant due to gear threadmill or leveling out of the area. Downscaling and flat stat progression in and of itself creates content.

    Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online

    Playing: GW2
    Waiting on: TESO
    Next Flop: Planetside 2
    Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.

    image

  • grimalgrimal Stamford, CTPosts: 2,873Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lethality

    It's the gameplay... hack/slash/grind and no RPG elements involved. As a matter of fact, Diablo 3 does RPG better than GW2.

    It's simply not an MMORPG as people would expect.

    I agree.  It's more akin to Diablo or Gauntlet than it is of other MMORPGS.

    Now, there is nothing wrong with that. 

    But, this site is an MMORPG site and if this is considered and compared to other MMORPGS, why not include games like Borderlands?

  • stevebmbsqdstevebmbsqd Orlando, FLPosts: 448Member
    Originally posted by The_Korrigan

    I totally agree with that score - which is well deserved just for having the "balls" to get away from the WoW clone model in an AAA theme park MMORPG. And it's a success.

    Those who don't like it are for most either bitter sandbox fan who are just hating on every new MMORPG anyway (so their opinion isn't worth much), or prisoners of the EQ/WoW clone model where everything should be a grind for a shiny purple reward instead of just playing for fun.

    There are very few MMORPGs I'd rate above 9.0 in the 17+ years I'm playing the graphic version of that genre - and GW2 is one of them.

    I would say that most of the people hating on it are bored. The idea of the game seemed better than the actual implementation. There are tons of posts of people who didn't realize what combat would be like minus the trinity or a game without gear / vertical progression. There are a lot of people who don't want to redo content being down leveled. They are not all "bitter" sandbox fans or "prisoners" of the WoW/EQ model. Even if they are, why must you demean them for something they like. To them, grinding for that purple may be fun.

  • ZylaxxZylaxx Erlanger, KYPosts: 2,574Member
    Originally posted by Dakirn

    I'm floored by this score.. really, a 9.3? Have our expectations really gone that low for games?

     

    Why didn't you talk about the non-existant economy and how items are selling for less than cost to make.. or how the customer service is non-existant?  The non-existant PvE game at 80 that only exists of endless Legendary grinding?

     

    I'm sorry Bill but this review is just your initial love for the game.  Everyone I know has already quit because at 80 there's nothing to do but grind, grind, grind.

    As opposed to the endless stat grinding in other MMO's? 

     

    You may not like it but GW2 is a game and a world, it isnt a checklist of failed "been there - done that" experiences.

    Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online

    Playing: GW2
    Waiting on: TESO
    Next Flop: Planetside 2
    Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.

    image

  • FlawSGIFlawSGI Woodstock, GAPosts: 1,378Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Zylaxx
    Originally posted by Dakirn

    I'm floored by this score.. really, a 9.3? Have our expectations really gone that low for games?

     

    Why didn't you talk about the non-existant economy and how items are selling for less than cost to make.. or how the customer service is non-existant?  The non-existant PvE game at 80 that only exists of endless Legendary grinding?

     

    I'm sorry Bill but this review is just your initial love for the game.  Everyone I know has already quit because at 80 there's nothing to do but grind, grind, grind.

    As opposed to the endless stat grinding in other MMO's? 

     

    You may not like it but GW2 is a game and a world, it isnt a checklist of failed "been there - done that" experiences.

    +1   Nice response to the quoted portion. I fail to see the difference and never understood how anyone can argue one way regarding GW2 and it's end game (or lack there of) and then champion another games endgame when it is essentially the same thing with different delivery. The things I enjoy most in GW2 are all about the presentation and that seems to include endgame but I have to admit I haven't made it there due to my altohaulic nature.

    For everyone arguing that something was rated and not in other games I can say the same thing regarding replayability. WTH didn't GW2 get a replayability rating since I have enjoyed revisiting zones in this game more than any other game I have played. Wonderwhat the reviewer would have thought of that aspect?

    RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.

  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member
    Originally posted by stevebmbsqd
    Originally posted by The_Korrigan

    I totally agree with that score - which is well deserved just for having the "balls" to get away from the WoW clone model in an AAA theme park MMORPG. And it's a success.

    Those who don't like it are for most either bitter sandbox fan who are just hating on every new MMORPG anyway (so their opinion isn't worth much), or prisoners of the EQ/WoW clone model where everything should be a grind for a shiny purple reward instead of just playing for fun.

    There are very few MMORPGs I'd rate above 9.0 in the 17+ years I'm playing the graphic version of that genre - and GW2 is one of them.

    I would say that most of the people hating on it are bored. The idea of the game seemed better than the actual implementation. There are tons of posts of people who didn't realize what combat would be like minus the trinity or a game without gear / vertical progression. There are a lot of people who don't want to redo content being down leveled. They are not all "bitter" sandbox fans or "prisoners" of the WoW/EQ model. Even if they are, why must you demean them for something they like. To them, grinding for that purple may be fun.

    They are bored precisely because they need that gear carrot from EQ/WoW clones. Without it, they can't play a game... they can't play a game just for fun, like many did in games like UO and AC1.

    And yes, I "demean" them... I demean people who need a game to be a second job at max level to play it. And I do that because they are the main cause why all AAA MMORPGs in the last 8 years are WoW clones. I'm glad to have a game where the gameplay doesn't drastically change and force you into a group based raid grind at max level. Seriously, all those grind greedy people can play WoW or any of its numerous clones, and just stay the hell away from the only AAA theme park game in 8 years which had the balls to move away from that rigid model.

    PS: this comes from a guy who played WoW for 8 years (including beta) and will certainly try Pandaria at some point. But for hell's sake, it's time to break that mold... for those who want more WoW, there is WOW. I'm glad to have a game that is NOT WoW. Not to mention all those who have tried to imitate the master sucked at it.

    The endless chain of mediocre to bad WoW clones is broken. Any true MMORPG fan should rejoice, even if he doesn't like GW2, because despite him not liking it, the game is a success showing that things can be done differently. Or do you guys want to spend the next 10 years getting more poor WoW clone after poor WoW clone?

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

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  • DakirnDakirn Kansas City, MOPosts: 374Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by raven222
    Originally posted by Dakirn

    I'm floored by this score.. really, a 9.3? Have our expectations really gone that low for games?

     

    Why didn't you talk about the non-existant economy and how items are selling for less than cost to make.. or how the customer service is non-existant?  The non-existant PvE game at 80 that only exists of endless Legendary grinding?

     

    I'm sorry Bill but this review is just your initial love for the game.  Everyone I know has already quit because at 80 there's nothing to do but grind, grind, grind.

    Grinding dungeons and BG's or whatever all day to get that new set of armor is any different to that .

    U people are after gear over and over aggain to keep on subbing and u call that 'end game'.

    One can only laugh at that i am sorry but that is how it is.

    The same is true about raids and heroics and so on , they are just an endless gear grind ,and u all know that but still this is what end game is for u people , one can only be sad by what Blizz and all those companies have turned MMO's into.

    But if this is what turns u on go on and pay them ur hard earned cash for that garbage.

    Have a nice day

    You people? Don't assume you know anything about my play styles or what I want.

     

    I hate grinds of any kind.  I don't WANT grinds at all.  The amount of GRINDING needed to get ONE legendary item in GW2 is more than the total grinding I've done in almost any MMO for the ENTIRE GAME.

     

    And it's just not that it's for a single item.. it's a cosmetic item with no major advantage over a non-legendary.  Since stats aren't that big of a difference I don't feel an inscentive of to spend months of my life grinding the same "dynamic" events over and over again to gain skill points so that I can purchase mats and "gamble" at the mystic forge getting the mats I need to craft one.

     

    I'm not advocating the standard MMO grind either, but in GW2 it's all grind.  I don't call that an innovation of 10.

  • umie214umie214 TOronto, ONPosts: 123Member
    Will, thanks for a good review, and for recognizing that gw2 will have a bright future. it was a huge project and it's not perfect (even though ANet is doing a great job addressing the bugs in a timely manner). but this is indeed the next big thing. 
  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member
    Originally posted by Dakirn

    I'm not advocating the standard MMO grind either, but in GW2 it's all grind.  I don't call that an innovation of 10.

    It's because of stuff like this that some GW2 players get angry on this forums sometimes. People have been complaining about having to grind for gear for ages before they can compete at max level, GW2 completely removed that grind. You won't have to grind the normal version of a dungeon for weeks before you can do the harder one, and then the raid version of it. You won't have to grind for weeks if not months before you are no longer canon fodder in PvP.

    As I said in another thread, if GW2 has a grind, then WoW clones are the virtual version of slavery.

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

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  • RizelStarRizelStar Raleigh, NCPosts: 2,773Member

    Guild Wars 2 while unfortunate for [some] is a [Great] game.

    By the way it still has me with longevity in PVE in fact, post 80 which I might be an "minority."(Meaning I stil am having the same amount of fun in PVE before I was level 80)

    A-NET stated they wanted to make a great game, well they did.

    By the way, s expected is there anny reviews where it scores below 9.0? I'm curious cause I been looking, it was like back when WoW released, had a lot of 9.0+ reviews.

     

    It's that a game that isn't a WoW(EQ tbh) clone actually get good reviews and is a great game any way. Longevity is there, but whether you like it or not is a different question, oh and I can't wait for ArcheAge to release hopefully by the end of 2013 or early 2014 how ever I hope it doesn't have a sub, or it'll be the "great game I'll nver play."

     

    Anyways I'm out spot on review tbh, however I treat all reviews like opinions. People who are up in arms lol, don't worry hopefully Arch Age and Darkfall will get you guys, both are sandboxes, well one is a sandpark, just like GW2 being a "themebox" sorry but Badspock was spot on when he said that months ago.

     

    I'll continue to eat my popcorn though, A-NET does deserve these scores an etc, they or at the very least [attempting] but are actually not [half-assing] their [attempt] to be different.

    Please do enjoy life fellas and peace.

    I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

    I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

    P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)

    Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  • BladestromBladestrom edinburghPosts: 4,941Member Uncommon
    Every single mmorg and rpg created since the dawn of gaming has grind, the majority of single players have grind and all single player games that dont have grind have an end. 'I hate grind' not really, you just label stuff you don't like as grind to suit your own arguements.

    To put it another way:

    All games with no end point have grind, and many with an end point have grind anyway. Doesn't leave you with much.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member
    Originally posted by grimal
    Originally posted by Lethality

    It's the gameplay... hack/slash/grind and no RPG elements involved. As a matter of fact, Diablo 3 does RPG better than GW2.

    It's simply not an MMORPG as people would expect.

    I agree.  It's more akin to Diablo or Gauntlet than it is of other MMORPGS.

    Now, there is nothing wrong with that. 

    But, this site is an MMORPG site and if this is considered and compared to other MMORPGS, why not include games like Borderlands?

    some people said the same thing about original guild wars being like Diablo

    and GW1 had far more story than diablo

     

    GW2 is fully persistent world and is no Diablo lobby game

    mmos like WOW seem more like a lobby game

     - stand in city, que for dungeon finder instance w random people that you'll probably never see again

  • PsychowPsychow SF Giants Territory, CAPosts: 1,784Member

    Boy do I feel silly.

     

    Had I known this was a bar raising 9.3 game of perfection, I wouldn't have allowed myself to get bored and stopped playing after 4 weeks.

    [mod edit]

  • IsawaIsawa Middle 0 Nowhere, ORPosts: 1,051Member

    Originally posted by grimal

    Originally posted by GrayGhost79

    Originally posted by grimal

    Longevity 9?   How in the world did you come up with this number?

    Edit:  I guess since "hundreds and hundreds of hours" equals a 9, the expectation is for an MMO to satiate our appetites for a month?  If so, what's the big deal if it's B2P or P2P since all the content is done within that first month and there is never a need to pay past the inital box price?

    I've put in almost 300 hours in the last month and ... theres still a ton of stuff for me to do. Contents there and will last you a good while.

    That's one month.  Compared to every other MMO (including Vanguard, EQ and everything else), a 9 is basically saying the longevity of this game is the length of playtime all MMOs should strive for.   Have we gotten to the point where 1-2 months of play is a 9????

    300 hours into one month is 10 hours a day, I hope you're old and retired - because that is pretty absurd otherwise. 300 into 2 months is 5 hours a day, that is still above my gaming rate into the game, and I consider mine to be pretty high at 180 hrs over 40 days (4.5), and I'm sitting around recovering from a foot injury. So for folks working and having other hobbies, I can easily see these be expanded to twice its length. That is 3-4 months.

  • animeoutlawanimeoutlaw Columbus, OHPosts: 20Member

    Meh, I really wanted to like this game. Seeing as how the original Guild Wars just didn't do it for me. However, I couldn't get past the first 11 levels because I felt like I was just aimlessly wondering around, by myself, with no real human interaction except for the randoms you bump into during the dynamic events (whom never even responded whenever I tried to talk to them). I don't know, I guess I'm still a fan of the FFXI social experience. Where grouping was, and is still absolutely necessary. And because of that you met a lot of amazing people and made a lot of amazing friends; while shooting the shit and kicking monster ass until the sun came up.

    I will say this though, graphically, they did a very nice job with the game. And I do like the classes and the unique way they made the weapons you use dependant on the skills you can use (at least as an Elementalist. Haven't tried the other classes). Though I still find the camera movement much to clunky and awkward for my taste. However, I do like that there is plenty of exploration to do in the game as well. But, the social experience as a whole killed it for me. I never even really saw people talking in the "General" chat. Not unless someone just wanted help with something and was looking for a hand.

    As a whole, I felt like I was playing a Single Player console title with the acronym "MMO" slapped on there just for the fun of it. A trend that's been on the rise for a while that's really bumming me out. Seems like if I want a great social experience I'll have to go back to the older titles that first got me hooked. But I'd much rather something a bit new, and innovative, and that DOESN'T lean towards the "You don't have to play with anyone...EVER...if you don't want to. Pffft, save that shit for end game.". Makes me sad...:(



     

  • CyraelCyrael VA, USAPosts: 88Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Eluldor

    Originally posted by grimal

    Originally posted by GrayGhost79

    Originally posted by grimal

    Longevity 9?   How in the world did you come up with this number?

    Edit:  I guess since "hundreds and hundreds of hours" equals a 9, the expectation is for an MMO to satiate our appetites for a month?  If so, what's the big deal if it's B2P or P2P since all the content is done within that first month and there is never a need to pay past the inital box price?

    I've put in almost 300 hours in the last month and ... theres still a ton of stuff for me to do. Contents there and will last you a good while.

    That's one month.  Compared to every other MMO (including Vanguard, EQ and everything else), a 9 is basically saying the longevity of this game is the length of playtime all MMOs should strive for.   Have we gotten to the point where 1-2 months of play is a 9????

    300 hours into one month is 10 hours a day, I hope you're old and retired - because that is pretty absurd otherwise. 300 into 2 months is 5 hours a day, that is still above my gaming rate into the game, and I consider mine to be pretty high at 180 hrs over 40 days (4.5), and I'm sitting around recovering from a foot injury. So for folks working and having other hobbies, I can easily see these be expanded to twice its length. That is 3-4 months.

     

    As someone who plays about 8-10 hours a week, I'm personally looking forward to my next three years of GW2. :)

  • JonokuJonoku Cool, PAPosts: 645Member
    one of my favorite mmorpgs but not the best.

    Looking at: The Repopulation
    Preordering: None
    Playing: Random Games

  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member
    [mod edit]

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

    image

  • if i wrote a review for GW2, this would be it.

    nice job on the write up.

  • Pretender00Pretender00 Spokane, WAPosts: 84Member

    I think it deserves the score it got.

    Just last night the Tarnished Coast crew was in Sea of Sorrow's zone capturing Hero's Lodge. I had run by solo and had seen the dots on the screen showing our group battling there, when low and behold I run into the Gates of Madness zerg steaming on headed directly at me. I turned around and ran into the Hero's Lodge encampment with them on my heels. I ran directly into our group and the battle began. GoM had us outnumbered 3-1 but our guys spread out and aoe'd the heck out of their massive zerg. After a good amount of coordination and tactics we crushed them completely! Outnumbered 3-1, joined together we perservered and overcame the odds. Afterwards we all congratulated each other and the commander we had present. Several people shouted out how much they LOVE our server. If that's not good social atmosphere I don't know what is.

    I don't know how other servers are but the atmosphere on Tarnished Coast has made this game for me. I've spent alot more time in WvW recently and we always have good coordination and leadership. I've yet to see a bunch of asshats running around.

    FOR THE COAST !!

     

     

  • AmanaAmana New York, NYPosts: 2,527Moderator Uncommon
    Just a reminder to remain on topic. That is, the GW2 review and GW2, not other reviews or comparisons. Comments on our review policy and related suggestions should be put in the Site Suggestions forum.

    To give feedback on moderation, contact community@mmorpg.com

  • YakamomotoYakamomoto Osaka, ARPosts: 363Member

    this score is a joke. Boring story, boring fetch quests, not worth a sub. 6/10 at best












    Arenanet must have paid a fortune in advertising money.  For me this site has lost any credibility today.




    Thanks for such reviews, now we can be prepared for another 10 years of brain dead quest goals and collect quests from other developers. Thanks, really, well done.





























     






















     










     




     

  • grimalgrimal Stamford, CTPosts: 2,873Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Cyrael
    Originally posted by Eluldor

    Originally posted by grimal

    Originally posted by GrayGhost79

    Originally posted by grimal

    Longevity 9?   How in the world did you come up with this number?

    Edit:  I guess since "hundreds and hundreds of hours" equals a 9, the expectation is for an MMO to satiate our appetites for a month?  If so, what's the big deal if it's B2P or P2P since all the content is done within that first month and there is never a need to pay past the inital box price?

    I've put in almost 300 hours in the last month and ... theres still a ton of stuff for me to do. Contents there and will last you a good while.

    That's one month.  Compared to every other MMO (including Vanguard, EQ and everything else), a 9 is basically saying the longevity of this game is the length of playtime all MMOs should strive for.   Have we gotten to the point where 1-2 months of play is a 9????

    300 hours into one month is 10 hours a day, I hope you're old and retired - because that is pretty absurd otherwise. 300 into 2 months is 5 hours a day, that is still above my gaming rate into the game, and I consider mine to be pretty high at 180 hrs over 40 days (4.5), and I'm sitting around recovering from a foot injury. So for folks working and having other hobbies, I can easily see these be expanded to twice its length. That is 3-4 months.

     

    As someone who plays about 8-10 hours a week, I'm personally looking forward to my next three years of GW2. :)

    Just don't play during the holidays or you might lose a year of playability there. :P

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