If you get all of your information from theser forums I suppose you would assume that.
Fact of the matter is, there are a lot of fans of DAOC on these boards and as TRIONs pretty much made up of the old Mythic devs those fans push the idea that Rift is doing amazingly well, regardless of what may or may not be happening.
I do find it hillarious sometime that the same people who hate WoW for having hand holding questhubs and raid/geargrinding, seem to love Rift, which is essentially the same setup PVE wise. I would summaise it's a touch of, 'COHitis', i.e love the company but don't actually play the game.
There's a theory going around that the guys at TRION hate Blizzard for making RvR, (i.e. stealing the initals for there different concept), and that all the success Blizzard had should of been theres, for other reasons. The evidence for that I guess is their adverts, which continue to try and poke fun at WoW,and on some levels come across as just plain jealousy.
Some have suggested that Storm Legion is a last throw of the dice for Rift. Populations are dwidling, how badly I don't know, but the server my son played on is pretty much dead. A lot of games have come out recently that offer better overall experiences then Rift, (GW2, MOP,), so when the expansion does hit could it be the thing that gives the game a new lease of life or that which just delays the inevitable?
One thing for sure, you won't find a balanced debate on here...
5. Last I heard isnt bleeding subs and has a stable population of around 500k?
Rift is likely somewhere around 200k subs, give or take 50k ether way. With the exception of a two month span in jan/feb its been bleeding subs since it launched...
Bleeding subs since it launched huh?
So, lets see, official NA launch, not head start, was March 4th, 2011...
Now, is it currently anywhere near 1 mil? no. Not likely. But 200k? Not even close. EQ2 has more than 200k subs and Rift is far far more healthy than it.
The other reality is Rift is the game everyone constantly comes back to after the new shiny MMO thats supposed to conquer the world fails miserable. We've seen huge pop influxes after Tera, SWTOR and now GW2 people are shuffling back in at a high rate. MoP is shaping up to be a huge failure too so i wont be surprised to see a pretty massive surge especially once expac drops.
a
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
5. Last I heard isnt bleeding subs and has a stable population of around 500k?
Rift is likely somewhere around 200k subs, give or take 50k ether way. With the exception of a two month span in jan/feb its been bleeding subs since it launched...
Bleeding subs since it launched huh?
So, lets see, official NA launch, not head start, was March 4th, 2011...
Now, is it currently anywhere near 1 mil? no. Not likely. But 200k? Not even close. EQ2 has more than 200k subs and Rift is far far more healthy than it.
The other reality is Rift is the game everyone constantly comes back to after the new shiny MMO thats supposed to conquer the world fails miserable. We've seen huge pop influxes after Tera, SWTOR and now GW2 people are shuffling back in at a high rate. MoP is shaping up to be a huge failure too so i wont be surprised to see a pretty massive surge especially once expac drops.
a
Your wrong about a few things.
The article you quoted does not say Rift had a milliin subs on 6/24/11. Rather it said they sold their 1 millionth box on 6/24/11.
At release Rift had 99 NA and EU servers. Now it has 8 non dead servers left just as Tor now has 11 non dead servers left (out of 216). That in itself should give you an idea of the population of both games.
Your also wrong about the population of EQ2. EQ2 after a rough start recovered to peak in population with a little over 200k. Which they held for a few years. They held this 200k population with 16 servers. No chance EQ2 has even 100k subs anymore. Interestingly EQ2's revival was under Hartsman and used the same strategy that Rift uses. That is adding quality content after content and supporting their game.
But I do believe you are right about Rift being the game that many people do come back to. ToR's failure was a boon for Rift. GW2 did little to Rift and should help Rift in the long run. Tera and TSW did nothing, As the horizon clears of new over hyped games i do think people will begin to realize how good Rift is. Hopefully the Xpac will add a lot of momentum.
To be correct:
TOR right now has 8 NA servers (not dead), 9 EA servers (not dead) and 3 Oceanic servers (pretty much dead). 20 servers total (ehem... megaservers /grin).
Ok... server status is not telling much... low, standard, heavy, very heavy, full. They moved few weeks ago to megaservers and we have no idea right now what the new light standard etc means.
There is an attempt to figure out concurrent user number right now to figure out the numbers, but as server changed it will take some time to get enough data to have numbers for statuses.
I am right now on The Ebon Hawk thr RP server, which is standard right now and sure it does not feel dead at all.
My apologies you are right according to Tor Staus Tor has 17 western servers that are non dead. I counted the EU looking at the list when as 3 when it should have been 9.
No problem. I will try to get here numbers when they will be available for each status. Thanks
5. Last I heard isnt bleeding subs and has a stable population of around 500k?
Rift is likely somewhere around 200k subs, give or take 50k ether way. With the exception of a two month span in jan/feb its been bleeding subs since it launched...
Bleeding subs since it launched huh?
So, lets see, official NA launch, not head start, was March 4th, 2011...
Now, is it currently anywhere near 1 mil? no. Not likely. But 200k? Not even close. EQ2 has more than 200k subs and Rift is far far more healthy than it.
The other reality is Rift is the game everyone constantly comes back to after the new shiny MMO thats supposed to conquer the world fails miserable. We've seen huge pop influxes after Tera, SWTOR and now GW2 people are shuffling back in at a high rate. MoP is shaping up to be a huge failure too so i wont be surprised to see a pretty massive surge especially once expac drops.
a
Your wrong about a few things.
The article you quoted does not say Rift had a milliin subs on 6/24/11. Rather it said they sold their 1 millionth box on 6/24/11.
At release Rift had 99 NA and EU servers. Now it has 8 non dead servers left just as Tor now has 11 non dead servers left (out of 216). That in itself should give you an idea of the population of both games.
Your also wrong about the population of EQ2. EQ2 after a rough start recovered to peak in population with a little over 200k. Which they held for a few years. They held this 200k population with 16 servers. No chance EQ2 has even 100k subs anymore. Interestingly EQ2's revival was under Hartsman and used the same strategy that Rift uses. That is adding quality content after content and supporting their game.
But I do believe you are right about Rift being the game that many people do come back to. ToR's failure was a boon for Rift. GW2 did little to Rift and should help Rift in the long run. Tera and TSW did nothing, As the horizon clears of new over hyped games i do think people will begin to realize how good Rift is. Hopefully the Xpac will add a lot of momentum.
Fair enoguh on the article, i guess its all in how you read it. I see what you're saying though as it says "the millionth subcriber" not "The millionth concurrent subscriber".
Really my point was not to argue overall numbers, it was to argue that its been bleeding subs since it launched, Which absolutely was not the case. Really it was gaining slowly up until right about when tortanic came out. Ever since then Rift hasnt been able to recover from the barrage of other MMOs coming out, Diablo III took a good dig at it too.
But, things apparently are going reasonably well b/c they secured even more investor money ($85 million), and made $100million in revenue solely from Rift. Its well document the game cost $50million to develop, so by all standards the game is a success.
But, yeah, i agree with you 100% on your last point. I think now that the wave of crap has subsided people are going to realize that as far as MMOs worth their salt, its pretty much only Rift and WOW, and even the latter is debatable.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
Originally posted by FrodoFragins I seriously doubt it's anywhere near 500k subscribers. I have nothing against the game, it's jsut too close to WOW for my current tastes.
Of the 4 games listed, Rift is by far the closest to WoW (in fact not many games closer to copying it period).....I also doubt it has anywhere near 500k subs (closer to 100-200k I'd bet)
Here is what I dont like about games like WoW and Rift.
End game PvP.
Its dull and boring and if you arent top geared, you are gimped. So if you arent first to get there and first to gear grind, you are gimp for longer than it took you to actually level.
As soon as I hit max level, the arena style PvP is lame to me.
I know, there are others that love it and love being gimp for a year before they are finally in top. Not fun for me to grind gear. Id rather be a crafter in a sandbox MMO running a shop selling goods than to grind gear. Gear was one of the worst things MMOs did to me. Its obviously great for others though as they seem to continue to make games with geart grinds.
I just prefer the old SWG and UO days where the economy was player driven and crafting meant more than drops. It was the time I enjoyed these games. Shortly after SWG it crashed though and the WoW genre came and every MMO after seems to have followed their foot steps and those that dont, are like a prison yard full of jerks. Not my style either.
Anyways, luckily we have some sandbox games on the horizon to fill my void.
Rift was an okay game though. I enjoyed my short time playing it. It was worth the money for sure.
5. Last I heard isnt bleeding subs and has a stable population of around 500k?
But this is wrong.. they've already merged the servers more than once. The game is in its declining years already.
I don't think we are talking about declining years at this point. I think we are at a make or break point. If Trion pulled some of their magic on a major scale here, Sl can put Rift on the map in a big way and make it one of the premier games on the market. But if their expansion turns out like WoW's recent releases, then It's prettymuch over. At least as far as Rift being a major player in the market. The game really needs it's "Burning Crusade".
I have been repeatedly told by industry folks to not buy the Trion hype. They're reportedly not doing anywhere near as well as they would like you to think. The heads of their company are great venture capitalists and can scrape together money well (remember that $80 million they borrowed from a Canadian TEACHERS PENSION FUND?), but Rift definitely didn't perform to expectations.
I think anyone thats been observing the industry for years knows this. And the teachers pension fund is the most overblown thing ever, Trion doesnt even make their top 100 investments, not even close. The money they gave to Trion is an insignificant fraction of their total investments. The most likely case is someone is a fan of Rift and was able to use key talking points to build a case for the investment.
Really my point was not to argue overall numbers, it was to argue that its been bleeding subs since it launched, Which absolutely was not the case. Really it was gaining slowly up until right about when tortanic came out. Ever since then Rift hasnt been able to recover from the barrage of other MMOs coming out, Diablo III took a good dig at it too.
But, things apparently are going reasonably well b/c they secured even more investor money ($85 million), and made $100million in revenue solely from Rift. Its well document the game cost $50million to develop, so by all standards the game is a success.
That shows the NA server status early december, before SWTOR and after SWTOR. Rift launched with 56 (or more?) NA servers. As you can see, by that point it was already down to less than half that. Games that arent bleeding subs dont shut down half their servers in 8 months. 8 years later EQ2 still has half its servers (and all of them actually hit medium during primetime, though they should be merged regardless)
Also note that at the start of December 2011 over 20 of those servers were active in Rift. Now there are only 4 out of 16 that are active enough for Trion to call medium status (although Im betting 6-8 of them would hit medium during a weekend primetime if they updated the server status dynamically like they used to)
Comments
If you get all of your information from theser forums I suppose you would assume that.
Fact of the matter is, there are a lot of fans of DAOC on these boards and as TRIONs pretty much made up of the old Mythic devs those fans push the idea that Rift is doing amazingly well, regardless of what may or may not be happening.
I do find it hillarious sometime that the same people who hate WoW for having hand holding questhubs and raid/geargrinding, seem to love Rift, which is essentially the same setup PVE wise. I would summaise it's a touch of, 'COHitis', i.e love the company but don't actually play the game.
There's a theory going around that the guys at TRION hate Blizzard for making RvR, (i.e. stealing the initals for there different concept), and that all the success Blizzard had should of been theres, for other reasons. The evidence for that I guess is their adverts, which continue to try and poke fun at WoW,and on some levels come across as just plain jealousy.
Some have suggested that Storm Legion is a last throw of the dice for Rift. Populations are dwidling, how badly I don't know, but the server my son played on is pretty much dead. A lot of games have come out recently that offer better overall experiences then Rift, (GW2, MOP,), so when the expansion does hit could it be the thing that gives the game a new lease of life or that which just delays the inevitable?
One thing for sure, you won't find a balanced debate on here...
This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!
Bleeding subs since it launched huh?
So, lets see, official NA launch, not head start, was March 4th, 2011...
As of Jun 24th, 2011, it breached a million subs:
http://www.vg247.com/2011/06/07/rift-has-almost-one-million-folks-playing-it-according-to-trion-wolrds/
Now, is it currently anywhere near 1 mil? no. Not likely. But 200k? Not even close. EQ2 has more than 200k subs and Rift is far far more healthy than it.
The other reality is Rift is the game everyone constantly comes back to after the new shiny MMO thats supposed to conquer the world fails miserable. We've seen huge pop influxes after Tera, SWTOR and now GW2 people are shuffling back in at a high rate. MoP is shaping up to be a huge failure too so i wont be surprised to see a pretty massive surge especially once expac drops.
a
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
To be correct:
TOR right now has 8 NA servers (not dead), 9 EA servers (not dead) and 3 Oceanic servers (pretty much dead). 20 servers total (ehem... megaservers /grin).
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
Ok... server status is not telling much... low, standard, heavy, very heavy, full. They moved few weeks ago to megaservers and we have no idea right now what the new light standard etc means.
There is an attempt to figure out concurrent user number right now to figure out the numbers, but as server changed it will take some time to get enough data to have numbers for statuses.
I am right now on The Ebon Hawk thr RP server, which is standard right now and sure it does not feel dead at all.
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
No problem. I will try to get here numbers when they will be available for each status. Thanks
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
Fair enoguh on the article, i guess its all in how you read it. I see what you're saying though as it says "the millionth subcriber" not "The millionth concurrent subscriber".
Really my point was not to argue overall numbers, it was to argue that its been bleeding subs since it launched, Which absolutely was not the case. Really it was gaining slowly up until right about when tortanic came out. Ever since then Rift hasnt been able to recover from the barrage of other MMOs coming out, Diablo III took a good dig at it too.
But, things apparently are going reasonably well b/c they secured even more investor money ($85 million), and made $100million in revenue solely from Rift. Its well document the game cost $50million to develop, so by all standards the game is a success.
http://www.gamespot.com/news/rift-revenues-reach-100-million-in-2011-6348954?keepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=600&width=850&caption=GameSpots+PlayStation+3+News
But, yeah, i agree with you 100% on your last point. I think now that the wave of crap has subsided people are going to realize that as far as MMOs worth their salt, its pretty much only Rift and WOW, and even the latter is debatable.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
But this is wrong.. they've already merged the servers more than once. The game is in its declining years already.
Of the 4 games listed, Rift is by far the closest to WoW (in fact not many games closer to copying it period).....I also doubt it has anywhere near 500k subs (closer to 100-200k I'd bet)
Here is what I dont like about games like WoW and Rift.
End game PvP.
Its dull and boring and if you arent top geared, you are gimped. So if you arent first to get there and first to gear grind, you are gimp for longer than it took you to actually level.
As soon as I hit max level, the arena style PvP is lame to me.
I know, there are others that love it and love being gimp for a year before they are finally in top. Not fun for me to grind gear. Id rather be a crafter in a sandbox MMO running a shop selling goods than to grind gear. Gear was one of the worst things MMOs did to me. Its obviously great for others though as they seem to continue to make games with geart grinds.
I just prefer the old SWG and UO days where the economy was player driven and crafting meant more than drops. It was the time I enjoyed these games. Shortly after SWG it crashed though and the WoW genre came and every MMO after seems to have followed their foot steps and those that dont, are like a prison yard full of jerks. Not my style either.
Anyways, luckily we have some sandbox games on the horizon to fill my void.
Rift was an okay game though. I enjoyed my short time playing it. It was worth the money for sure.
Here is info about shard population in Rift for those interested
http://riftideas.com/shardwatch/
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
I don't think we are talking about declining years at this point. I think we are at a make or break point. If Trion pulled some of their magic on a major scale here, Sl can put Rift on the map in a big way and make it one of the premier games on the market. But if their expansion turns out like WoW's recent releases, then It's prettymuch over. At least as far as Rift being a major player in the market. The game really needs it's "Burning Crusade".
I think anyone thats been observing the industry for years knows this. And the teachers pension fund is the most overblown thing ever, Trion doesnt even make their top 100 investments, not even close. The money they gave to Trion is an insignificant fraction of their total investments. The most likely case is someone is a fan of Rift and was able to use key talking points to build a case for the investment.
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/431/view/forums/thread/335031/Population-trends.html
That shows the NA server status early december, before SWTOR and after SWTOR. Rift launched with 56 (or more?) NA servers. As you can see, by that point it was already down to less than half that. Games that arent bleeding subs dont shut down half their servers in 8 months. 8 years later EQ2 still has half its servers (and all of them actually hit medium during primetime, though they should be merged regardless)
Also note that at the start of December 2011 over 20 of those servers were active in Rift. Now there are only 4 out of 16 that are active enough for Trion to call medium status (although Im betting 6-8 of them would hit medium during a weekend primetime if they updated the server status dynamically like they used to)