Originally posted by odinsrath is the combat still gonna be like what i see on youtube from the old DF? people runing around randomly swinging in circles like an old "benny hill show" ..if so count me out..way out
they are swinging like that because they are not good melee players and don't know how to time their swings.
Your statement is untrue. Tasos himself even said that they hoped to have addressed this issue with melee mechanics with UW. He said in the video that they had resolved the sprinting in circles and swinging wildly as the way melee combat is resolved.
There is absolutely no reason to continue defending this when the developers own actions and statements clearly indicate that it was poorly done and so addressed in the new game.
Uhh, melee combat is arguably the most skill-based aspect of Darkfall's combat system. Tasos mentioned melee in that contex because he's attempting to bring back the people who ran around like chickens with their heads cut off, ie. the people who didn't know what they were doing.
AV creditability is below zero, and I do not take their word seriously.
2 months time is the last mile period before the release. so every system should be in place and working. and we should get soon TONS of gameplay footage.
in the meantime , I have not seen a SINGLE gameplay footage from AV the mighty.
kind of strange do not you think…
now, what a about the closed Beta ? they did not even said that there is a Beta going on. how can you expect to release a new title without Beta testing it ??? and I am not saying a word about an open Beta..LOL
OK, lets put aside the footage and Beta, cause I know that they are probably beyond busy with the Asian market and other projects…all I want is gameplay info. I want to know about races ,classes ,abilities ,fighting system, magic system,crafting, sandbox elements, flagging , naval war and more.
surely if the game is about the get released, they have all these info on the palm of their hands. and not releasing it has no sense at all. (or they do not want new players to play their game).
the last joke for the meantime: AV do not even give a horse shit about their current smallish player base. all these dedicated troopers want to know is a very easy answer for a crucial issue. and they are asking this question for more than a year (maybe even more than two years): “WHAT ABOUT OUR CURRENT CHARS: NAMES, ABILITIES,LOOT,HOUSING)”. it’s such a trivial issue for AV , as their new game is about to get released , and all systems are in place. they surely know about it. and they surely have made a decision.
BUT NO…AV are mute about it.
last question from me: HOW DO YOU EXPECT ME AND MY PALS TO BUY YOUR GAME /PRODUCT AS A ZERO CREDITABLITY COMPANY (DUE TO THE ABOVE)???
maybe AV will give some answers, but more likely they do not.
I tried Darkfall but I really didn't have the time to dedicate to it. Also the graphics and interface really bugged me. The inventory and endless dragging did my head in.
They have stated they have updated the graphics and now the interface so I will watch it closely.
Even if I don't play it I really hope this game gets a solid player base as its an indy firm trying something different and its really the only MMO that caters for the hard core MMO gamer (to my knowledge). If we lose these indy firms and their unique games, then we will all be forced to eat big corp cookie cutters.
Only downfall is the size of the firm, the testing and QA must be so hard before launch.
AV creditability is below zero, and I do not take their word seriously.
2 months time is the last mile period before the release. so every system should be in place and working. and we should get soon TONS of gameplay footage.
in the meantime , I have not seen a SINGLE gameplay footage from AV the mighty.
kind of strange do not you think…
now, what a about the closed Beta ? they did not even said that there is a Beta going on. how can you expect to release a new title without Beta testing it ??? and I am not saying a word about an open Beta..LOL
OK, lets put aside the footage and Beta, cause I know that they are probably beyond busy with the Asian market and other projects…all I want is gameplay info. I want to know about races ,classes ,abilities ,fighting system, magic system,crafting, sandbox elements, flagging , naval war and more.
surely if the game is about the get released, they have all these info on the palm of their hands. and not releasing it has no sense at all. (or they do not want new players to play their game).
the last joke for the meantime: AV do not even give a horse shit about their current smallish player base. all these dedicated troopers want to know is a very easy answer for a crucial issue. and they are asking this question for more than a year (maybe even more than two years): “WHAT ABOUT OUR CURRENT CHARS: NAMES, ABILITIES,LOOT,HOUSING)”. it’s such a trivial issue for AV , as their new game is about to get released , and all systems are in place. they surely know about it. and they surely have made a decision.
BUT NO…AV are mute about it.
last question from me: HOW DO YOU EXPECT ME AND MY PALS TO BUY YOUR GAME /PRODUCT AS A ZERO CREDITABLITY COMPANY (DUE TO THE ABOVE)???
maybe AV will give some answers, but more likely they do not.
Good luck with your new game…LOL
If you have ever worked on a project the size of this with a very small team you will know all of the answers to your questions. I have been in a situation like this and I can guarantee you, we published, highlighted, alerted no one in the entire firm because every second was pumped into finishing the project. AV are not going to make some fancy video or promo like EA or Blizzzard because they don't have the people or money to do so. I always felt SWTOR developers should have spent no time on making the awesom video promo footage and concentrated on making a decent MMO.
Sometimes I think the mmorpg.com gods get guys like this to post just for my own personal entertainment. You can say a lot about this game, but one of the things that is done very well is the Mob AI. I haven't seen anything like it in any other mmo and I've played all of them that are worth mentioning from the last 8 years or so.
I can't wait to start messing around in Agon once again, but in the meantime, I'm going enjoy the amusing and inevitable horse shit (like this little tidbit that I quoted) that will be all over this forum.
Thanks, mmorpg.com. Keep 'em comin'.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Mixed feelings here. Nothing new in this, and really a terribly excecuted "interview". You could have simply just linked the spotlight forum. So, I'm bitter that this info is worthless to anyone who knows DF
Still, I do get that lots of new potential players may read this, which is good and a couple questions cover things that would actually matter to them. The problem is, the rest don't apply to them, pretty much just the 2.
Basically what I'm saying is, even if you were trying to "educate" brand new people about DF, you still failed horribly and almost shamefully with the total # of questions you even bothered to ask. THIS is why your website is viewed by us as it is, because you've never given us anything meaningful, period.
Sometimes I think the mmorpg.com gods get guys like this to post just for my own personal entertainment. You can say a lot about this game, but one of the things that is done very well is the Mob AI. I haven't seen anything like it in any other mmo and I've played all of them that are worth mentioning from the last 8 years or so.
I can't wait to start messing around in Agon once again, but in the meantime, I'm going enjoy the amusing and inevitable horse shit (like this little tidbit that I quoted) that will be all over this forum.
Thanks, mmorpg.com. Keep 'em comin'.
Ho yeah, DF has the best AI.
Thats why you can kill the fire dragon with only 4 players, the devil with only 4 players and any other big bosses on your own.
If its not a boss, you can basically solo it all day if you dont get yourself too deep in their spawn radious. These mobs must be put on a godly leash to not cross that circle.
Solo wise, there is only 2 hard and intelligent mobs. Hand of khamset and Shadow knights. Anything else is too easy to kill. Eodrin are the biggest jokes.
You, saying that the AI has been done very well is like Blizzard saying that in order to improve raids, they must make it so only 4 players can complete all of them.
Thats why you can kill the fire dragon with only 4 players, the devil with only 4 players and any other big bosses on your own.
If its not a boss, you can basically solo it all day if you dont get yourself too deep in their spawn radious. These mobs must be put on a godly leash to not cross that circle.
Solo wise, there is only 2 hard and intelligent mobs. Hand of khamset and Shadow knights. Anything else is too easy to kill. Eodrin are the biggest jokes.
You, saying that the AI has been done very well is like Blizzard saying that in order to improve raids, they must make it so only 4 players can complete all of them.
I must have somehow missed the plethora of mmo titles the last several years that included half decent Mob AI. My bad. My mmo resume must have all been but a dream.
I wish you luck in the coming months, RBD. It's going to be a long and painful path to the other side. Good luck, and good to see you still slithering around
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
I think everyone missed the big news int his interview.Tasos spoke and it didn't turn into a Public Relations Nightmare.This in itself is massive progress for Aventurine and hopefully it is reflected in D:UW itself.
A lot of people keep commenting that they dont think that a full loot game can make it big but I disagree. Look at the success of Dayz which gives player that same sense of fear. Full loot gives players a sense of excitement that no other game has. Darkfall had a lot of problem but I think full loot wasn't one of them.
Maybe people would be willing to make characters with different skill sets if they all could be competitive, but for some odd reason, developers always make mages types weak to rogues and warriors weak to healers....etc. Why can't they make each skill set have counters and balances so that everyone can be competitive instead of everyone being forced to pick up the exact same skills. This is why I like class systems, most of them anyway, as they allow you to be the type of character you want without making you completely weak compared to everyone else.
Originally posted by arustyrobot A lot of people keep commenting that they dont think that a full loot game can make it big but I disagree. Look at the success of Dayz which gives player that same sense of fear. Full loot gives players a sense of excitement that no other game has. Darkfall had a lot of problem but I think full loot wasn't one of them.
A GOOD full loot game would succeed. Darkfall = too grindy, Mortal Online = still in "beta" state, Dark and Light = beta/closed
I had a blast playing darkfall, it was the one and only time I was able to replicate the enthusiasm I had in my first years of MMO experience. I only played seriously for about 3 months but they were very good months. I have kept an eye on df for years now and even had a few short forays back in. My biggest problem with getting back into it mainly the lack of specialization. Maxing out some weapon skills and a school of magic is a reasonable grind, expecially after the improvments they had made leveling. BUT I almost always found myself at a huge disadvantage in gear/skills and experience. If you put yourself against a good player with good gear and high to maxed skills in many or all magic schools, bow, weapon and char skills, you get destroyed without even a remote chance of killing them.
The changes they are making should in theory reduce some causes of huge disparity. It will still exist no doubt but nothing the average guy couldnt overcome with effort and and skill.
I have never read anything reguarding crafting and assume you can go jack-of-all/any trades if you want.
How can there still be so many secrets about this game. Supposedly it comes out in 2 months and they wont even elaborate more on the role system? Im calling BS on this game.
Dragnon - Guildmaster - Albion Central Bank in Albion Online
Originally posted by arustyrobot A lot of people keep commenting that they dont think that a full loot game can make it big but I disagree. Look at the success of Dayz which gives player that same sense of fear. Full loot gives players a sense of excitement that no other game has. Darkfall had a lot of problem but I think full loot wasn't one of them.
A GOOD full loot game would succeed. Darkfall = too grindy, Mortal Online = still in "beta" state, Dark and Light = beta/closed
Darkfall hasn't been "too grindy" in a long time, and Unholy Wars will change that even further.
Originally posted by Cecropia
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Ho yeah, DF has the best AI.
Thats why you can kill the fire dragon with only 4 players, the devil with only 4 players and any other big bosses on your own.
If its not a boss, you can basically solo it all day if you dont get yourself too deep in their spawn radious. These mobs must be put on a godly leash to not cross that circle.
Solo wise, there is only 2 hard and intelligent mobs. Hand of khamset and Shadow knights. Anything else is too easy to kill. Eodrin are the biggest jokes.
You, saying that the AI has been done very well is like Blizzard saying that in order to improve raids, they must make it so only 4 players can complete all of them.
I must have somehow missed the plethora of mmo titles the last several years that included half decent Mob AI. My bad. My mmo resume must have all been but a dream.
I wish you luck in the coming months, RBD. It's going to be a long and painful path to the other side. Good luck, and good to see you still slithering around
Darkfall does indeed have the best mob AI out there in the MMO space, as they act like actual players/living creatures that try to call for help, that circle around the enemy, that dodge, flank. Some can smell players, some can hear, some can only see at night. It's fantastic.
Originally posted by ZigZags How can there still be so many secrets about this game. Supposedly it comes out in 2 months and they wont even elaborate more on the role system? Im calling BS on this game.
People called BS on the original Darkfall too, and they turned out to be completely wrong.
What game releases a spell list 2 months before launch? We know how it will basically function. You choose a role, which limits your armor and weapons, and then you slot in abilities.
AV creditability is below zero, and I do not take their word seriously.
Why? Their last 3 expansions had every single feature they promised it would have. They're very good on their feature lists. They're bad at their ETAs, but so are Valve and Blizzard.
So they are making it easy mode then? Brilliant move, they will have no competition now, only every other MMO on the market.
We can hope this is more of a rebalancing. But seen this before in other MMO's and so far every MMO has boarded the easy MMO express which makes them just what their players had been trying to escape.
At the start even the PVE battles in DF were quite brutal and unfriendly (for noobs)... Even the goblins hit pretty hard and when the surroundings got a bit darker you could easily start dying way before you see anyone coming. Even if this is done a bit easier you always have the wandering PK's around the corner and have to look out for that.
To add to all this, you drop your stuff for others to loot when you die and have to run back to your grave site to get your gear back if any is left... As a noob, running naked to your grave to the middle of a PVE hotspot was quite a harsh lesson to learn at first. And UI didn't make emptying the grave any easier either... The learning curve isn't as steep as in Eve, the game is easy to learn, but it is not your typical button masher. You play DF after years of WoW -> You die! It is as simple as that.
If this first part of the cruel world is made a little easier, it will benefit the game as people won't be too turned off by the first run in with a PVE mob, let alone many of them...
There is a certain down side to "easier start" too, if you aren't as vulnerable at the start, you will most likely be a juicier target for the PK people... More loot to drop as you are in less danger = False sense of security...
I liked my time in Darkfall... It was and is a fun game. It is just a huge time sink. If they make it less of a "sink" and more of a "battleground" I'm all for it!!! In this game, death has consequences.
The exploits and hacks that plagued the game were fixed a long long time ago.
They're adding momentum and wobble to slow down the wild melee we have now and make it more skillful.
They're redoing the entire crafting system to make it more sandbox.
Adding lots more large scale PvE encounters including actual dungeon bosses, dungeon tiers/traps, roaming world bosses.
Removing the master of all trades, role system where you choose two of four branches within the school and then choose a limited amount of abilities. Only allowed to wear appropiate armour, no more Heavily armoured super archer melee crafter mages.
Redone the entire world...
Multicore support, load lag fixed, better graphics, better sounds
more more more
AV are doing an amazing job, half of you crying on here seem to be completely unaware of what they're doing. Only PvP features?? Do some research.
No vids, must b va0rware, cry cry cry. Actually their community laison has had to take time off personal reasons atm. I have no doubt they plan to release some form of ingame footage / trailer but we're definately going to have to wait for it. That's AV's way.
All this crap about AV not delivering as well... they have ALWAYS delievered the promised features with expansions. Funhulks were the only let down lol.
Originally posted by Johnie-Marz I am confused, are they basically saying Darkfall was just one big beta test?
As much as Warhammer Online was a beta test for SWTOR or Guild Wars 1 for Guild Wars 2... It was a game that has been online now for 3+ years... If you were totally ignorant you could claim EverQuest 1 was beta test for WoW.
Online games come and go. If it was easier to create a new game than to mold the old one, then more power to them. We will get all sorts of new bells and whistles along with it. DF graphics were never that top notch, so an upgrade there is more than welcome etc.
Comments
I am very much looking forward to DF:UW , It will be bringing a group of players together that I havent had the pleasure of playing with in awhile.
Heres to hoping that do it right, and keep it right
Uhh, melee combat is arguably the most skill-based aspect of Darkfall's combat system. Tasos mentioned melee in that contex because he's attempting to bring back the people who ran around like chickens with their heads cut off, ie. the people who didn't know what they were doing.
I have been following this game for some time.
AV creditability is below zero, and I do not take their word seriously.
2 months time is the last mile period before the release. so every system should be in place and working. and we should get soon TONS of gameplay footage.
in the meantime , I have not seen a SINGLE gameplay footage from AV the mighty.
kind of strange do not you think…
now, what a about the closed Beta ? they did not even said that there is a Beta going on. how can you expect to release a new title without Beta testing it ??? and I am not saying a word about an open Beta..LOL
OK, lets put aside the footage and Beta, cause I know that they are probably beyond busy with the Asian market and other projects…all I want is gameplay info. I want to know about races ,classes ,abilities ,fighting system, magic system,crafting, sandbox elements, flagging , naval war and more.
surely if the game is about the get released, they have all these info on the palm of their hands. and not releasing it has no sense at all. (or they do not want new players to play their game).
the last joke for the meantime: AV do not even give a horse shit about their current smallish player base. all these dedicated troopers want to know is a very easy answer for a crucial issue. and they are asking this question for more than a year (maybe even more than two years): “WHAT ABOUT OUR CURRENT CHARS: NAMES, ABILITIES,LOOT,HOUSING)”. it’s such a trivial issue for AV , as their new game is about to get released , and all systems are in place. they surely know about it. and they surely have made a decision.
BUT NO…AV are mute about it.
last question from me: HOW DO YOU EXPECT ME AND MY PALS TO BUY YOUR GAME /PRODUCT AS A ZERO CREDITABLITY COMPANY (DUE TO THE ABOVE)???
maybe AV will give some answers, but more likely they do not.
Good luck with your new game…LOL
I tried Darkfall but I really didn't have the time to dedicate to it. Also the graphics and interface really bugged me. The inventory and endless dragging did my head in.
They have stated they have updated the graphics and now the interface so I will watch it closely.
Even if I don't play it I really hope this game gets a solid player base as its an indy firm trying something different and its really the only MMO that caters for the hard core MMO gamer (to my knowledge). If we lose these indy firms and their unique games, then we will all be forced to eat big corp cookie cutters.
Only downfall is the size of the firm, the testing and QA must be so hard before launch.
If you have ever worked on a project the size of this with a very small team you will know all of the answers to your questions. I have been in a situation like this and I can guarantee you, we published, highlighted, alerted no one in the entire firm because every second was pumped into finishing the project. AV are not going to make some fancy video or promo like EA or Blizzzard because they don't have the people or money to do so. I always felt SWTOR developers should have spent no time on making the awesom video promo footage and concentrated on making a decent MMO.
LMAO. Ed Zitron is that you, homie?
Sometimes I think the mmorpg.com gods get guys like this to post just for my own personal entertainment. You can say a lot about this game, but one of the things that is done very well is the Mob AI. I haven't seen anything like it in any other mmo and I've played all of them that are worth mentioning from the last 8 years or so.
I can't wait to start messing around in Agon once again, but in the meantime, I'm going enjoy the amusing and inevitable horse shit (like this little tidbit that I quoted) that will be all over this forum.
Thanks, mmorpg.com. Keep 'em comin'.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Mixed feelings here. Nothing new in this, and really a terribly excecuted "interview". You could have simply just linked the spotlight forum. So, I'm bitter that this info is worthless to anyone who knows DF
Still, I do get that lots of new potential players may read this, which is good and a couple questions cover things that would actually matter to them. The problem is, the rest don't apply to them, pretty much just the 2.
Basically what I'm saying is, even if you were trying to "educate" brand new people about DF, you still failed horribly and almost shamefully with the total # of questions you even bothered to ask. THIS is why your website is viewed by us as it is, because you've never given us anything meaningful, period.
Ho yeah, DF has the best AI.
Thats why you can kill the fire dragon with only 4 players, the devil with only 4 players and any other big bosses on your own.
If its not a boss, you can basically solo it all day if you dont get yourself too deep in their spawn radious. These mobs must be put on a godly leash to not cross that circle.
Solo wise, there is only 2 hard and intelligent mobs. Hand of khamset and Shadow knights. Anything else is too easy to kill. Eodrin are the biggest jokes.
You, saying that the AI has been done very well is like Blizzard saying that in order to improve raids, they must make it so only 4 players can complete all of them.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
I must have somehow missed the plethora of mmo titles the last several years that included half decent Mob AI. My bad. My mmo resume must have all been but a dream.
I wish you luck in the coming months, RBD. It's going to be a long and painful path to the other side. Good luck, and good to see you still slithering around
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
A GOOD full loot game would succeed. Darkfall = too grindy, Mortal Online = still in "beta" state, Dark and Light = beta/closed
dwarves and alfar will be removed from the game sadly. Terrible decision.
I had a blast playing darkfall, it was the one and only time I was able to replicate the enthusiasm I had in my first years of MMO experience. I only played seriously for about 3 months but they were very good months. I have kept an eye on df for years now and even had a few short forays back in. My biggest problem with getting back into it mainly the lack of specialization. Maxing out some weapon skills and a school of magic is a reasonable grind, expecially after the improvments they had made leveling. BUT I almost always found myself at a huge disadvantage in gear/skills and experience. If you put yourself against a good player with good gear and high to maxed skills in many or all magic schools, bow, weapon and char skills, you get destroyed without even a remote chance of killing them.
The changes they are making should in theory reduce some causes of huge disparity. It will still exist no doubt but nothing the average guy couldnt overcome with effort and and skill.
I have never read anything reguarding crafting and assume you can go jack-of-all/any trades if you want.
Dragnon - Guildmaster - Albion Central Bank in Albion Online
www.albioncentralbank.enjin.com
Darkfall hasn't been "too grindy" in a long time, and Unholy Wars will change that even further.
Darkfall does indeed have the best mob AI out there in the MMO space, as they act like actual players/living creatures that try to call for help, that circle around the enemy, that dodge, flank. Some can smell players, some can hear, some can only see at night. It's fantastic.
People called BS on the original Darkfall too, and they turned out to be completely wrong.
What game releases a spell list 2 months before launch? We know how it will basically function. You choose a role, which limits your armor and weapons, and then you slot in abilities.
Why? Their last 3 expansions had every single feature they promised it would have. They're very good on their feature lists. They're bad at their ETAs, but so are Valve and Blizzard.
So they are making it easy mode then? Brilliant move, they will have no competition now, only every other MMO on the market.
We can hope this is more of a rebalancing. But seen this before in other MMO's and so far every MMO has boarded the easy MMO express which makes them just what their players had been trying to escape.
At the start even the PVE battles in DF were quite brutal and unfriendly (for noobs)... Even the goblins hit pretty hard and when the surroundings got a bit darker you could easily start dying way before you see anyone coming. Even if this is done a bit easier you always have the wandering PK's around the corner and have to look out for that.
To add to all this, you drop your stuff for others to loot when you die and have to run back to your grave site to get your gear back if any is left... As a noob, running naked to your grave to the middle of a PVE hotspot was quite a harsh lesson to learn at first. And UI didn't make emptying the grave any easier either... The learning curve isn't as steep as in Eve, the game is easy to learn, but it is not your typical button masher. You play DF after years of WoW -> You die! It is as simple as that.
If this first part of the cruel world is made a little easier, it will benefit the game as people won't be too turned off by the first run in with a PVE mob, let alone many of them...
There is a certain down side to "easier start" too, if you aren't as vulnerable at the start, you will most likely be a juicier target for the PK people... More loot to drop as you are in less danger = False sense of security...
I liked my time in Darkfall... It was and is a fun game. It is just a huge time sink. If they make it less of a "sink" and more of a "battleground" I'm all for it!!! In this game, death has consequences.
Darkfalls PvE is challening.
The world is huge to explore.
The exploits and hacks that plagued the game were fixed a long long time ago.
They're adding momentum and wobble to slow down the wild melee we have now and make it more skillful.
They're redoing the entire crafting system to make it more sandbox.
Adding lots more large scale PvE encounters including actual dungeon bosses, dungeon tiers/traps, roaming world bosses.
Removing the master of all trades, role system where you choose two of four branches within the school and then choose a limited amount of abilities. Only allowed to wear appropiate armour, no more Heavily armoured super archer melee crafter mages.
Redone the entire world...
Multicore support, load lag fixed, better graphics, better sounds
more more more
AV are doing an amazing job, half of you crying on here seem to be completely unaware of what they're doing. Only PvP features?? Do some research.
No vids, must b va0rware, cry cry cry. Actually their community laison has had to take time off personal reasons atm. I have no doubt they plan to release some form of ingame footage / trailer but we're definately going to have to wait for it. That's AV's way.
All this crap about AV not delivering as well... they have ALWAYS delievered the promised features with expansions. Funhulks were the only let down lol.
As much as Warhammer Online was a beta test for SWTOR or Guild Wars 1 for Guild Wars 2... It was a game that has been online now for 3+ years... If you were totally ignorant you could claim EverQuest 1 was beta test for WoW.
Online games come and go. If it was easier to create a new game than to mold the old one, then more power to them. We will get all sorts of new bells and whistles along with it. DF graphics were never that top notch, so an upgrade there is more than welcome etc.