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Why Darkfall Online will always be a failure

124

Comments

  • TigerAeroTigerAero Fort Campbell, KYPosts: 127Member

    Full loot. That's why I finally threw the hat in. I was playing just under 4 months, never experienced the "full loot" aspect of the game and frankly didn't know it was. Then I did. And immediately uninstalled thereafter (after reading forums and realizing that was a "feature" of the game.)

     

    Meh, it's whatever. Solid game until (if you ever do) experience that aspect of it.

  • chryseschryses LondonPosts: 1,453Member Uncommon

    Darkfall is an interesting game for me.  I would consider myself the demographic for it but I could only play for 5 days before uninstalling.  What really got to me was the unhindered ganking and complete loss of gear.  I thought I was hardcore but that was a step too far.  I was really surprised at myself for not playing it. 

    Personally the best system I found for penalising and rewarding was in Neocron.  If you got killed a random selection of items were dropped in a security belt.  To access a security belt you had to hack it and you needed a skill to do so.  The higher the skill the easier it was.  However if you couldn't hack it quick enough, the same player could get back in time to defend it.

    So there was real loss, real gains but it was pretty hair raising.

    Another sore point for me and DF is the graphics. I love my pixels and some of the races/animations were way too wooden.

     

  • AdamTMAdamTM Frankfurt Am MainPosts: 1,376Member
    Originally posted by Nizur
    Originally posted by AdamTM
    Originally posted by Onigod

    Darkfall will become a succes in its own way.

    Thats an euphemism for failure.

    Its like the kid in school that get told it gets points for trying.

    How's that? You need to define "success". If it means 1 million+ players, then DF:UW will "fail". But that means EVE is a failure too. Along with many well-done, popular MMOs.

    Failure to me would be not being able to maintain a stable community again. Success to me would be a game with all of DF's plusses and none or very, very few of DF's minuses that keeps a stable population of 10k+ players.

    Well you didn't define the kind of success yourself.

    Pick your poison: critical success? financial success? etc.

    A population isn't what makes games successful.

    I'm pretty sure that Revelations 2012 sold more than 10k copies.

    image
  • GrayGhost79GrayGhost79 Webster, MAPosts: 4,813Member
    Originally posted by TigerAero

    Full loot. That's why I finally threw the hat in. I was playing just under 4 months, never experienced the "full loot" aspect of the game and frankly didn't know it was. Then I did. And immediately uninstalled thereafter (after reading forums and realizing that was a "feature" of the game.)

     

    Meh, it's whatever. Solid game until (if you ever do) experience that aspect of it.

    I actually liked the full loot aspect, the issue comes from the fact that you'd have people bypass it. Naked zerg gankers with nothing to lose, killing them was a waste of time because they simply had nothing to take :( 

     

  • TigerAeroTigerAero Fort Campbell, KYPosts: 127Member
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by TigerAero

    Full loot. That's why I finally threw the hat in. I was playing just under 4 months, never experienced the "full loot" aspect of the game and frankly didn't know it was. Then I did. And immediately uninstalled thereafter (after reading forums and realizing that was a "feature" of the game.)

     

    Meh, it's whatever. Solid game until (if you ever do) experience that aspect of it.

    I actually liked the full loot aspect, the issue comes from the fact that you'd have people bypass it. Naked zerg gankers with nothing to lose, killing them was a waste of time because they simply had nothing to take :( 

     

     

    I, on the other hand, had plenty because I was delved heavily into the crafting. Sucked hardcore to lose it all. I was 3 shotted no less from a ranged lol.

  • CecropiaCecropia Posts: 3,472Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by TigerAero

    I, on the other hand, had plenty because I was delved heavily into the crafting. Sucked hardcore to lose it all. I was 3 shotted no less from a ranged lol.

    You played for almost four months unaware that this was a full loot game, and then lost "it all" after one failed PVP encounter? What game did you think you were playing and what the hell were you wearing/carrying? I find it amazing you went so long without encountering any sort of "trouble". Sounds like you have some horseshoes up your ass. Advice: buy a lottery ticket tomorrow, and remember me.

    "Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb

  • eXizzLeeXizzLe detriot, MIPosts: 29Member

    lol what a confusing thread 

    loot gained > loot lost

    welcome to darkfall, it's that simple! full loot isn't a big deal! it's set up really nicely! 

  • MrLichTwitchMrLichTwitch C-town, PAPosts: 13Member
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by king0fmars

    Bunny hopping as it exist in current darkfall will not be in Darkfall Unholy Wars. The main difference is you can die from fall damage in Darkfall Unholy Wars and you can't in the current version. However when you die in DFUW and nobody ganks you instead of bleeding out you are revived. AV said they expect and are ready for the players to find ways to abuse the spells but are willing to patch anything that isn't in line with the spirit of darkfall.

    In short, don't expect to out ran by someone on foot while using a bluetail or swimmers catching up to boats in naval battles.

    They added an ability that will allow you to avoid fall damage all together. So you are correct in the fact that  it won't exist as it does now, because its been enhanced. 

    Wow. Holy misinformation! That ability has a long cool down so you can't use it a lot. Also, a Community Liason on the DF forums has said that this ability "acts as an airbrake", so how does airbraking(ie stopping in mid air) enhance bunny hopping when bunny hopping works off of the speed that you build up? If you use that spell while bunny hopping, you're gonna just about stop dead. Bunny stopping anyone????

    Furthermore, Fall damage can incapacitate you in DF:UW, unlike the original Darkfall. So you can bunny hop yourself into incapacitation in DF:UW. So I'm still wondering how bunny hopping has been enhanced.

  • Spool1Spool1 AucklandPosts: 20Member
    If you don't want to play a full loot hardcore game, then dont play a full loot hardcore game. This is not a game for casuals. Just like high end PVP in Eve Online is not for casuals.
  • kadepsysonkadepsyson sun prairie, WIPosts: 1,937Member

    I enjoy PVP and don't mind full loot.

    However, I'm not going to pay money for a game when the developers use that money to shut down the game I'm playing in order to release a new one so they can charge me again for it.  Very shady tactic.

     

    Just because it's one of a very few number of options for a fantasy full loot game, doesn't mean it's a success, or even any good.  It's just the alternatives are worse or don't exist.

     

    I'm looking forward to certain similar games, but by competent ethical developers.

    El Psy Congroo

  • DrokaFonDrokaFon Sallys Legs, LAPosts: 19Member
    Originally posted by kadepsyson

    I enjoy PVP and don't mind full loot.

    However, I'm not going to pay money for a game when the developers use that money to shut down the game I'm playing in order to release a new one so they can charge me again for it.  Very shady tactic.

     

    Just because it's one of a very few number of options for a fantasy full loot game, doesn't mean it's a success, or even any good.  It's just the alternatives are worse or don't exist.

     

    I'm looking forward to certain similar games, but by competent ethical developers.

        I'm pretty sure i read an official post somewhere saying if you have an active Darkfall Account in good standing you will not have to purchase the game,  You will still have to pay a sub of course and your character will most likley not be Xfered over because that would ruin the game from day one.  It'd be like WoW releasing a tournament season and only a handfull of the good players would start with a full set of top tier gear....( i know i just compared DF to WoW and i should be shot for that but its hte only thing i can come up with off hand.)

       So if you are upset about losing your character, which is totally understandable because i myself have a DF character that is pretty skilled up.....I'm sorry, but if you look at the game/community as a whole then it makes sense and is good for the game.  Higher pop = more fights = more risk = more fun. (and plus you'll have an advantage over people just starting out because you already know everything about the game and the little tricks to have an upperhand :D)

  • kadepsysonkadepsyson sun prairie, WIPosts: 1,937Member
    Originally posted by DrokaFon
    Originally posted by kadepsyson

    I enjoy PVP and don't mind full loot.

    However, I'm not going to pay money for a game when the developers use that money to shut down the game I'm playing in order to release a new one so they can charge me again for it.  Very shady tactic.

     

    Just because it's one of a very few number of options for a fantasy full loot game, doesn't mean it's a success, or even any good.  It's just the alternatives are worse or don't exist.

     

    I'm looking forward to certain similar games, but by competent ethical developers.

        I'm pretty sure i read an official post somewhere saying if you have an active Darkfall Account in good standing you will not have to purchase the game,  You will still have to pay a sub of course and your character will most likley not be Xfered over because that would ruin the game from day one.  It'd be like WoW releasing a tournament season and only a handfull of the good players would start with a full set of top tier gear....( i know i just compared DF to WoW and i should be shot for that but its hte only thing i can come up with off hand.)

       So if you are upset about losing your character, which is totally understandable because i myself have a DF character that is pretty skilled up.....I'm sorry, but if you look at the game/community as a whole then it makes sense and is good for the game.  Higher pop = more fights = more risk = more fun. (and plus you'll have an advantage over people just starting out because you already know everything about the game and the little tricks to have an upperhand :D)

    So.. based on what you are saying, it's the same game, just wiping the characters and releasing it again... so why not just patch or expansion the current game and do a character wipe?  Or are they the same thing?

    El Psy Congroo

  • winterwinter El Paso, TXPosts: 2,276Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by kadepsyson

    I enjoy PVP and don't mind full loot.

    However, I'm not going to pay money for a game when the developers use that money to shut down the game I'm playing in order to release a new one so they can charge me again for it.  Very shady tactic.

     

    Just because it's one of a very few number of options for a fantasy full loot game, doesn't mean it's a success, or even any good.  It's just the alternatives are worse or don't exist.

     

    I'm looking forward to certain similar games, but by competent ethical developers.

     This^^

     and thank you for stating it better then I probably could

  • DarkcrystalDarkcrystal st clair shores, MIPosts: 809Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tatercake

    well what i dint like about it was i was all into it at first then i get my credit card bill and i see the charge for the game and then a 1 dollor charge ya i know just 1 dollor  but what was it for so i calle dthem and was hello what is this charge on my credit card they told me a long huge story and in the end i was well so you mean to tell me you charge me full amount for the game  and monthly fee then every month i just get charged a 1 doollor fee for nothing and he was  well pretty much correct i was please cancel my sub i do not wish to play a game form a company that lies and steals my money even  if it only 1 dollor a month it was not right of them and  then he was oh well we will refund you the dollor please dont to late done  not playing with corrupt  cmpanys that steal your money

     

    Companys do not say  , oh we take money for no reason, wrong, not buying that for a second, being in the field, and for a small company they never ever do this, there is a reason, it prolly was because of your bank they charge a foreign exchance fee which is your fault.. Bank else where.

  • DarkcrystalDarkcrystal st clair shores, MIPosts: 809Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DrokaFon
    Originally posted by kadepsyson

    I enjoy PVP and don't mind full loot.

    However, I'm not going to pay money for a game when the developers use that money to shut down the game I'm playing in order to release a new one so they can charge me again for it.  Very shady tactic.

     

    Just because it's one of a very few number of options for a fantasy full loot game, doesn't mean it's a success, or even any good.  It's just the alternatives are worse or don't exist.

     

    I'm looking forward to certain similar games, but by competent ethical developers.

        I'm pretty sure i read an official post somewhere saying if you have an active Darkfall Account in good standing you will not have to purchase the game,  You will still have to pay a sub of course and your character will most likley not be Xfered over because that would ruin the game from day one.  It'd be like WoW releasing a tournament season and only a handfull of the good players would start with a full set of top tier gear....( i know i just compared DF to WoW and i should be shot for that but its hte only thing i can come up with off hand.)

       So if you are upset about losing your character, which is totally understandable because i myself have a DF character that is pretty skilled up.....I'm sorry, but if you look at the game/community as a whole then it makes sense and is good for the game.  Higher pop = more fights = more risk = more fun. (and plus you'll have an advantage over people just starting out because you already know everything about the game and the little tricks to have an upperhand :D)

    So Diablo 1 2 and 3 are shady then to, because they charged people for a new game like DFO is gonna do...

     

    Asheron call 1 did this they made a new game, and shut it down, and took your money so every company that makes a new version is shady, where do you people come up with this..

     

    So you go to work for 2 years and work for free OK?????   kids today..!

  • NizurNizur Austin, TXPosts: 1,417Member
    Originally posted by AdamTM
    Originally posted by Nizur
    Originally posted by AdamTM
    Originally posted by Onigod

    Darkfall will become a succes in its own way.

    Thats an euphemism for failure.

    Its like the kid in school that get told it gets points for trying.

    How's that? You need to define "success". If it means 1 million+ players, then DF:UW will "fail". But that means EVE is a failure too. Along with many well-done, popular MMOs.

    Failure to me would be not being able to maintain a stable community again. Success to me would be a game with all of DF's plusses and none or very, very few of DF's minuses that keeps a stable population of 10k+ players.

    Well you didn't define the kind of success yourself.

    Pick your poison: critical success? financial success? etc.

    A population isn't what makes games successful.

    I'm pretty sure that Revelations 2012 sold more than 10k copies.

    I thought I had defined it, but I'll state it clearer. Success to me would be whatever stable population is needed for AV to continue development and maintenance of the game and all that entails (staff fees, server maintenance, office space, etc).

    I used 10k as a base, but I have no real idea what number of subs they would need. 10k * $10/month = $1.2m/year. Also 10k would at least make the game itself busy and populated enough to be a lot of fun.

    EDIT: I think it's an understood that in order for AV to keep a stable population of any kind, they'll need to deliver the goods with UW. Also, if the sub is $15/month then they get $1.8m/year. Even better.

    Current: None
    Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR
    Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu
    Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN

  • DrokaFonDrokaFon Sallys Legs, LAPosts: 19Member
    Originally posted by kadepsyson
    Originally posted by DrokaFon
    Originally posted by kadepsyson

    I enjoy PVP and don't mind full loot.

    However, I'm not going to pay money for a game when the developers use that money to shut down the game I'm playing in order to release a new one so they can charge me again for it.  Very shady tactic.

     

    Just because it's one of a very few number of options for a fantasy full loot game, doesn't mean it's a success, or even any good.  It's just the alternatives are worse or don't exist.

     

    I'm looking forward to certain similar games, but by competent ethical developers.

        I'm pretty sure i read an official post somewhere saying if you have an active Darkfall Account in good standing you will not have to purchase the game,  You will still have to pay a sub of course and your character will most likley not be Xfered over because that would ruin the game from day one.  It'd be like WoW releasing a tournament season and only a handfull of the good players would start with a full set of top tier gear....( i know i just compared DF to WoW and i should be shot for that but its hte only thing i can come up with off hand.)

       So if you are upset about losing your character, which is totally understandable because i myself have a DF character that is pretty skilled up.....I'm sorry, but if you look at the game/community as a whole then it makes sense and is good for the game.  Higher pop = more fights = more risk = more fun. (and plus you'll have an advantage over people just starting out because you already know everything about the game and the little tricks to have an upperhand :D)

    So.. based on what you are saying, it's the same game, just wiping the characters and releasing it again... so why not just patch or expansion the current game and do a character wipe?  Or are they the same thing?

       Well, I'm not a game developer or part of the AV team but i can take an educated guess lol...Maybe there is a few reasons.

    (1) It isn't the same exact game, They ahve changed alot of aspects and fixed alot of hte bugs.  It'd be like Re-releasing Star wars galaxies Pre-Cu, polished and less buggy, Althought it is hte same game at the core (same lore, concept, combat style, blah blah blah) , they have fixed and polished so much that it will feel different and hopefully be a much better product.

    (2) Marketing - From a marketing standpoint you will make more money by admitting your faults and re-releasing a "New" game.  So instead of saying....It's still Darkfall jsut alot better we promise!, it's more along hte lines of listen we know we had a great concept, but we screwed it up, we have revamped the game and are putting it back on the market as a New game, not some Game that came from a beta test that we actually called a game in the first place. (thats prolly confusing but i'm tired and hopfully you get it lol).....It'd be like Kraft releasing a new line of mac and cheese, everyone goes out buys it and is disapointed because it taste like crap, after years of selling it they revamp their recipe, but keep the product the exact same name/look/negativity that comes with the original name and say, Guys listen i know we gave you diarheaa but this time youll love it WE PROMISE!!!! , instead they learn form their mistake and market the same product, revamped, under a new name.

    (3) As i said im not a game dev, but maybe if htey are running on a new engine, it was alot easier to just take the good code from DF1, patch it in and rewrite the code that needed work (liek textures and smoothness and combat and so on) into their new engine/code....But this could all be bullshit because again i have no clue  what im talkign about, just takign a guess.

    (4) As for The upper hand lets go back to the mac n cheese, damn im hungry, You buy the new product and althoguht it says to add 1 cup of milk, you know that it taste better with 1.5 cups of milk. Boom you are more satisfied then the customer that never tried the original product, and althoguh they are loving the shit out of the new product, YOU are loving it more.

     

     

    Sorry if this is a wall of text and makes no sense or is a huge contradiction....im pretty tired, but my question to you is, if you don't have to pay for the new game will you play or is it more of you losing your character (which is understandable)?

    Because if you don't care about losing your character and starting from scratch on a new game you get for free? i can't see you being upset at all, but if it really boils down to you being upset about not being able to xfer over your fully maxed toon with all your items/gold, then i understand.  (not flaming you  at all for this either i get it...working hard and investing time into something to get it taken away out of the blue is a horrible feeling)

  • kadepsysonkadepsyson sun prairie, WIPosts: 1,937Member
    Originally posted by Darkcrystal

    So Diablo 1 2 and 3 are shady then to, because they charged people for a new game like DFO is gonna do...

     

    Asheron call 1 did this they made a new game, and shut it down, and took your money so every company that makes a new version is shady, where do you people come up with this..

     

    So you go to work for 2 years and work for free OK?????   kids today..!

    I can still play Diablo 1, 2, and 3.  I can still play Asherons Call 1 - they didn't shut it down to get people to play their new version.

    In Darkfalls case it's more of an "Oops!  Do-over!" than "Here is the sequel!"

    El Psy Congroo

  • dooneydooney MandurahPosts: 69Member

    Darkfall is the best game ever.

  • Rorschach1797Rorschach1797 BernasendenstadtPosts: 19Member
    are u really comparing a company like AV with Blizzard? OFC blizzard can easily afford to keep the Diablo servers online.
  • kadepsysonkadepsyson sun prairie, WIPosts: 1,937Member
    Originally posted by Rorschach1797
    are u really comparing a company like AV with Blizzard? OFC blizzard can easily afford to keep the Diablo servers online.

    No, I wasn't.  After all, had you read back a bit, I didn't bring up Diablo or Blizzard, another poster did.

    El Psy Congroo

  • 7star7star SeoulPosts: 405Member
    Originally posted by elvrage

    to players that never involved themselves in it. 

    DF had many flaws. I'm not trying to deny that. What it didn't have was shitty gameplay. DF is the only game that I  have ever logged into for the first time, and I felt like I was actually controlling my character instead of it controlling me. I was amazed at the world around me. I started in Monkfield on a male human, and I immediately started exploring. First the city and then the surroundings. I found a dungeon within 5 minutes of exploring and got my ass kicked by the mobs inside. I then respawned with nothing and started again. This time I found goblins. I love goblins. I spent probably 30 minutes killing goblins before depositing what I considered to be good loot. I then started exploring some more. I found a few gatherers and had a conversation with one about the game. He gave me some pointers and directed me towards killing trolls.

    I went back to the city, equipped my fancy goblin gear, and ran towards the troll spawns. On my way there I encountered two Orks  who were in some of the most scary gear that I had seen yet. They were taunting me and growling at me while calling me demeaning names in public chat. Their taunts were something of the lines of "human make good steak". I luckily still had my noobie protection so they were unable to devastate me, but unfortunately they were able to find a human within 100 meters of myself that didn't have his little ring of invulnerability. What I witnessed made me uninstall every other game on my computer.

    Good post, OP.  I came here ready to fight because you were talking shit about my precious (what I thought from your thread title).

     

    I guess you made me find out I'm a fanboi. 

     

    Darkfall is a game people believe in, in spite of how they feel about the developers. I think we DF fans have a love-hate relationship with AV, but we are ready to love at the first chance we are given. 

     

    I love this game and what it can be more than any other I've ever played.

  • GrayGhost79GrayGhost79 Webster, MAPosts: 4,813Member
    Originally posted by MrLichTwitch
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by king0fmars

    Bunny hopping as it exist in current darkfall will not be in Darkfall Unholy Wars. The main difference is you can die from fall damage in Darkfall Unholy Wars and you can't in the current version. However when you die in DFUW and nobody ganks you instead of bleeding out you are revived. AV said they expect and are ready for the players to find ways to abuse the spells but are willing to patch anything that isn't in line with the spirit of darkfall.

    In short, don't expect to out ran by someone on foot while using a bluetail or swimmers catching up to boats in naval battles.

    They added an ability that will allow you to avoid fall damage all together. So you are correct in the fact that  it won't exist as it does now, because its been enhanced. 

    Wow. Holy misinformation! That ability has a long cool down so you can't use it a lot. Also, a Community Liason on the DF forums has said that this ability "acts as an airbrake", so how does airbraking(ie stopping in mid air) enhance bunny hopping when bunny hopping works off of the speed that you build up? If you use that spell while bunny hopping, you're gonna just about stop dead. Bunny stopping anyone????

    Furthermore, Fall damage can incapacitate you in DF:UW, unlike the original Darkfall. So you can bunny hop yourself into incapacitation in DF:UW. So I'm still wondering how bunny hopping has been enhanced.

    Well, if you can't understand how an airbrake can enhance bunny hopping I'm not sure I have the time to explain it to you in a way that you could grasp. I mean the draw back imposed on bunny hopping is that you can become incapacitated, an aire brake means you won't become incapacitated... I hope that was a simple enough explanation of what I mean. 

    Secondly what missinformation are you reffering to? 

    There is an airbrake... you even confirmed there was... It does enhance bunny hopping because now you can do a massive bunny hop and land with your health in tact. Which of this isn't true? 

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member
    Originally posted by Cecropia
    Originally posted by TigerAero

    I, on the other hand, had plenty because I was delved heavily into the crafting. Sucked hardcore to lose it all. I was 3 shotted no less from a ranged lol.

    You played for almost four months unaware that this was a full loot game, and then lost "it all" after one failed PVP encounter? What game did you think you were playing and what the hell were you wearing/carrying? I find it amazing you went so long without encountering any sort of "trouble". Sounds like you have some horseshoes up your ass. Advice: buy a lottery ticket tomorrow, and remember me.

    I'm somewhat skeptical about the claim.

     

    EDIT: Nothing wrong with bunnyhopping!

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • Effin_RabbitEffin_Rabbit Pittsburgh, PAPosts: 772Member Uncommon
    Will they add perma-death though? That would make it worth playing for the type of game it is in my opinion. It would be nice to see the combat updated to feel more like mortal online/skyrim-ish because what i remember of it felt like daggerfall.
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