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Worse Dungeon System I have ever played.

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  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by Lathial
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by eggy08
    Originally posted by Lathial
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    gotta learn combo fields.. if you get a group together that knows how to utliize combo fields well dungeons can be a blast

    Oh jeez, this is not true to my experience.  Aerowyn dont take this the wrong way but some things you post in these forums are just plain false.  Please explain what encounters in which dungeons are easier with specific combo fields and Ill try them out and personally appologize to you.

    Lath

    All of them?

    Combo fields increase damage, add healing to you allies, adds conditions and debuffs to your enemy and buffs and removes debbuffs to you and your allies.

    So I can't really see a fight where any one of these wouldn't help.

    Yeah, gotta agree. I mean a single blind spell usually only lasts for one attack. Throw down the right combo field and you can keep a mob blind for a lot longer. 

    http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combo

    Several rounds of a Blind boss can only be helpful. How about Might? That certainly helps in encounters.

    Dont take this the wrong way but blind was not the best example to use-  cause one or maybe two thiefs can already lock down a mob with blind.

    Shoot my thief can lock down aoe blind mobs for a long time.  Easymode-

    Lath

    I bet you I could spend 5 hours put together a compilation of what combo fields would be most effective in every dungeon and you would still go so what? Point is you can't just say xyz field works best in xyz situation it all depends on what classes you are with and what builds they are running.. but if you are playing with combo fields and encounters aren't getting easier you and your group aren't really utilizing them as you should.. then it really does become a l2p issue.

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • eggy08eggy08 erie, PAPosts: 525Member
    Originally posted by Lathial
    Originally posted by eggy08
    Originally posted by Lathial
    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    gotta learn combo fields.. if you get a group together that knows how to utliize combo fields well dungeons can be a blast

    Oh jeez, this is not true to my experience.  Aerowyn dont take this the wrong way but some things you post in these forums are just plain false.  Please explain what encounters in which dungeons are easier with specific combo fields and Ill try them out and personally appologize to you.

    Lath

    All of them?

    Combo fields increase damage, add healing to you allies, adds conditions and debuffs to your enemy and buffs and removes debbuffs to you and your allies.

    So I can't really see a fight where any one of these wouldn't help.

    Just saying..."all of them"..is like saying "learn to play".  Asking for specifics to very general statements should be easy enough if you know what your talking about?

     

    Lath

    Sorry but learn to play isn't the right word. I'd more say learn the concepts of combo fields. I don't get how I need to go into specifics about a buff/debuff to tell you that it is good in a fight. What games have you played that these have not been useful in any encounter?

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,602Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.
    A month or more ago people were saying "if you're a hardcore raider elitist then this game is not for you".


    Now people are saying "if you dont know every combo field and have voice communication coordinated tactics then you need to learn to play".


    You're right, no one wins.

  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.

    A month or more ago people were saying "if you're a hardcore raider elitist then this game is not for you".

     


    Now people are saying "if you dont know every combo field and have voice communication coordinated tactics then you need to learn to play".


    You're right, no one wins.

    Is anyone saying that though?  I mean, if I see a potential combo field laying on the ground, I'm definately throwing out my combo blaster or twirl finisher (Ima Thief).

  • eggy08eggy08 erie, PAPosts: 525Member
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.

    A month or more ago people were saying "if you're a hardcore raider elitist then this game is not for you".

     


    Now people are saying "if you dont know every combo field and have voice communication coordinated tactics then you need to learn to play".


    You're right, no one wins.

    Because you can't pug these right? Pretty sure I've pugged every single story mode and every single explorer mode I've done. Not voice chat or anything. So it's not hardcore raiding but it does require you to know your class a little. Don't understand how combo fields is a huge barrier for people to get the concept of. And if you leveled to 80, I'd assume that most can figure out their class by now. Nothing hardcore about it.

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.

    A month or more ago people were saying "if you're a hardcore raider elitist then this game is not for you".

     


    Now people are saying "if you dont know every combo field and have voice communication coordinated tactics then you need to learn to play".


    You're right, no one wins.

    Is anyone saying that though?  I mean, if I see a potential combo field laying on the ground, I'm definately throwing out my combo blaster or twirl finisher (Ima Thief).

    exactly.. no one said you need ot know everyone for every situation.. but you should know them and have a general idea of what combos you can put up and how they will help the group.. just basics of learning a game.. and it helps a lot in harder encounters

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • LathialLathial Denver, COPosts: 173Member Common
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.

    A month or more ago people were saying "if you're a hardcore raider elitist then this game is not for you".

     


    Now people are saying "if you dont know every combo field and have voice communication coordinated tactics then you need to learn to play".


    You're right, no one wins.

    Is anyone saying that though?  I mean, if I see a potential combo field laying on the ground, I'm definately throwing out my combo blaster or twirl finisher (Ima Thief).

     I agree- I use them myself with all my toons when I see the opportunity.  However, no dungeon or encounter - at least what ive done- has "needed" any combo to achieve victory.  And for them to be really effective you would need voice and practice.  Which for the most part PuG's are not doing.

     

    Lath

  • eggy08eggy08 erie, PAPosts: 525Member
    Originally posted by Lathial
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    honestly think the most interesting thing is people have been crying up and down games need content that benefit from coordination and teamwork... gw2 dungeons provide this and are blasted for it.. oh well guess no one ever wins here.

    A month or more ago people were saying "if you're a hardcore raider elitist then this game is not for you".

     


    Now people are saying "if you dont know every combo field and have voice communication coordinated tactics then you need to learn to play".


    You're right, no one wins.

    Is anyone saying that though?  I mean, if I see a potential combo field laying on the ground, I'm definately throwing out my combo blaster or twirl finisher (Ima Thief).

     I agree- I use them myself with all my toons however, no dungeon or encounter - at least what ive done- has needed any combo to achieve victory.  And for them to be really effective you would need voice and practice.  Which for the most part PuG's are not doing.

     

    Lath

    Noone ever said you absolutley needed them to win the fight. I don't know where you read that. They clearly stated it "helps" the fight and "helps" you kill mobs faster and keep people up longer. It in no way is ever needed to kill anything, but is there instead to make fights easier.

    And, no, you don't need voice and practice to use combo fields. They are clearly mapped out for you. And most are intuitive as how they are used. For insteace, on my warrior I have a massive AOE fire move that when people shoot throu it puts burning debuff on the boss. Doesn't take a lot of practice for me to figure out where that goes. Or on my ranger when people need a heal or remove debuffs I run over and use my heal on them and then shoot throu the heal to get regen. Again, it's more or less given how to use them. That honestly requires no practice or skill to figure it out, nor does it require you to say to your teammates "hey, I'm going to put down this fire field. shoot throu it for more deepz.". It's more like, /toss down fire field, people shoot boss through it and put fire debuff on boss or use skills that can utilize the fire in melee.

  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,602Member Uncommon

    Its amazing how this topic has progressed.


    Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from:
    "gotta learn combo fields"
    "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game"
    "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving"
    "combo fields make a huge difference"

    To:
    " it 'helps'"


    Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

    Its amazing how this topic has progressed.


    Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from:
    "gotta learn combo fields"
    "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game"
    "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving"
    "combo fields make a huge difference"

    To:
    " it 'helps'"


    Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".

    haha it's funny how you twist what people say.. but whatever floats your boat I guess.. it's simple combo fields help a LOT but they are NOT needed to complete content.. also you do not NEED to understand every combination to utilize them well.. they are also NOT hard to understand and use within a PUG.. hope that clears things up..

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • eggy08eggy08 erie, PAPosts: 525Member
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

    Its amazing how this topic has progressed.


    Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from:
    "gotta learn combo fields"
    "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game"
    "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving"
    "combo fields make a huge difference"

    To:
    " it 'helps'"


    Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".

    1. Combo fields are not hard to learn that they are helpful.

    2. Combo fields are a big mechanic in this game. "help" is a generic term, but I never stated how much it does. I just stated that it is not necessary to win fights, which it is not.

    3. 4. same as 2

    Edit: Next time I will use the word, best mechanic in the game or something like that. I'm not going to give a quantifier on how helpful it is, becuase its different for each situation.

  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,602Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Aerowyn
    Originally posted by Xiaoki Its amazing how this topic has progressed. Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from: "gotta learn combo fields" "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game" "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving" "combo fields make a huge difference" To: " it 'helps'" Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".
    haha it's funny how you twist what people say.. but whatever floats your boat I guess..

    I didnt twist anything.


    Did I twist your words in any way when you said "gotta learn combo fields"?

  • gelraengelraen Vancouver, BCPosts: 227Member
    Originally posted by eggy08
    Noone ever said you absolutley needed them to win the fight. I don't know where you read that. They clearly stated it "helps" the fight and "helps" you kill mobs faster and keep people up longer. It in no way is ever needed to kill anything, but is there instead to make fights easier.

    And, no, you don't need voice and practice to use combo fields. They are clearly mapped out for you. And most are intuitive as how they are used. For insteace, on my warrior I have a massive AOE fire move that when people shoot throu it puts burning debuff on the boss. Doesn't take a lot of practice for me to figure out where that goes. Or on my ranger when people need a heal or remove debuffs I run over and use my heal on them and then shoot throu the heal to get regen. Again, it's more or less given how to use them. That honestly requires no practice or skill to figure it out, nor does it require you to say to your teammates "hey, I'm going to put down this fire field. shoot throu it for more deepz.". It's more like, /toss down fire field, people shoot boss through it and put fire debuff on boss or use skills that can utilize the fire in melee.

    I think it's an interesting point about combo fields and how and why the are essential.  It's tough to throw around the word "essential" with stuff like that, because it's very vague as to what people mean and very much counter to the game's apparent philosophy to say that you MUST do it.  In some ways, people are saying you should take advantage of combo fields -- both yours and others.  In other ways, I think people mean that you should be using your own skills which lay down fields, as well as learning to recognize what the fields of other classes look like.  So in that way, it's too simple to say "use combo fields or die" --it's more complex that that.  You must learn and understand "fields" in general, because they are as essential to the GW2 group dynamic as healers and tanks were in previous MMOs.

    I can give though a concrete example from my run last night in Twilight Arb.   I was using my guardian alt, and use three particular consecrations which happened to also be combo fields.  

    The first was Purging Flames, which will "Create a ring of fire that burns foes and cures conditions on allies."  

    The second was Wall of Reflection, which will "Protect the targeted area with a wall of mystic power that reflects projectiles."

    The third -- which is just the bread and butter of a greatsword wielding guardian -- is Symbol of Wrath.

    In many trash first in TA, either you are dealing with a lot of poison and bleeds which are spraying around you from all directions, or you are being assailed by fuckin' annoying arrows from ranged.   This means that I am, and my whole team is, getting bled, poisoned, or ranged in most fights.  Of course, now I could say that we would have wiped many times if I hadn't been laying down Purging Flames during heavy poison/bleed encounters, or Symbol of Wrath near champions or bosses.  I could also say that if I hadn't been strategically placing Wall of Reflection between the group and the ranged archers, allowing us to first burn down the melee, we also would have wiped.

    Is this true?  Were these moves essential?  That's hard to say, beause it's not only up to me to do these things, it's also up to the group.  But my awareness of these things, and the awareness of the rest of the group of what Purging Flames looks like on the ground (so they know to run into it... or shoot through it) sure does help a damn lot.  It's that get ticked down by the poison and wipe.

    This isn't even taking it to the second level of understand how your abilities react to each of the combo fields on the ground. Knowing that a blast or leap finisher will interact with that ring of Purging Flames on the ground to grant  Retaliation, for example.  There is a pretty huge meta game with the interactions going on which takes a lot of understanding.

    It's not like any one of these things is essential perhaps, but I would argue that they are the very key to success in the dungeons.  They're of course not the only factor, but they're certainly a big part of the game.  Getting something like Retaliation on you, for example, isn't going to save you from some attacks, but it will certainly add mitigation.  Then you might get Aegis added to that from someone, and have your bleeds stripped of by someone else, and regeneration by another.  All these little things add up.

  • eggy08eggy08 erie, PAPosts: 525Member
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Aerowyn

    Originally posted by Xiaoki Its amazing how this topic has progressed. Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from: "gotta learn combo fields" "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game" "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving" "combo fields make a huge difference" To: " it 'helps'" Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".
    haha it's funny how you twist what people say.. but whatever floats your boat I guess..
    I didnt twist anything.

     


    Did I twist your words in any way when you said "gotta learn combo fields"?

    You twisted my words and assumed that "helps" is only a fraction of anything. So yes, you twisted it to meet your own argument. I said helps because it in fact does that, it helps, but isn't the end all skill to get you to win. Period.

  • GrayGhost79GrayGhost79 Webster, MAPosts: 4,813Member
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by maskedweasel
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by TsaboHavoc
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
     

     

    I think that would be contradictory...  if I thought Guardians were so overpowered, then I wouldn't have offered to face you in PvP.  Its no lie that Guardians are known for their survivability, especially in PvE -- and how is that an excuse for anything?  If nothing else it would prove me wrong if you were able to get through a dungeon or a PvP match completely unscathed.

     

    Me playing my mesmer,  I have damn good survivability,  I stay at range, and all my pets do the damage,  I can go invisible, reflect ranged damage, and put out so much condition damage its staggering.  It pairs well with a guardian,  and guardians are some of the toughest to kill in PvP for a mesmer due to the high heal/defense ratio and the mesmers traditionally low DPS and even lower defensive ability.     The only thing worse than running a mesmer would be if you wanted me to run an elementalist in PvP,  it would be all DPS on defense.

    Just for you this is what I did. I joined a pug and sat my daughter down who has never done a dungeon in GW2. I coached her while she did the run. The pug had zero deaths, and zero repair bills. Took all of 20 minutes. She did hit my fraps button a few times because shes not use to my setup so it did cut off here and there but not durring any of the fights I think. She's been playing MMO's for years so don't think she is a complete newb. 

    In any case, it's gonna take hours to finish uploading the videos but when they are ready I will post links here. 

    So, story mode is cake for me and apparently CM story mode is cake for my daughter who hasn't done a single dungeon. Videos to follow... 

    As promised.... 

    My 17 year old daughter doing CM story mode for the first time. 

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4E_FgzJ664&feature=youtu.be

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFtqd7yR6eg&feature=youtu.be

     

  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,602Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by eggy08
    Originally posted by Xiaoki   Originally posted by Aerowyn Originally posted by Xiaoki Its amazing how this topic has progressed. Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from: "gotta learn combo fields" "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game" "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving" "combo fields make a huge difference" To: " it 'helps'" Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".
    haha it's funny how you twist what people say.. but whatever floats your boat I guess..
    I didnt twist anything.   Did I twist your words in any way when you said "gotta learn combo fields"?
    You twisted my words and assumed that "helps" is only a fraction of anything. So yes, you twisted it to meet your own argument. I said helps because it in fact does that, it helps, but isn't the end all skill to get you to win. Period.

    You're saying I twisted your words when I paraphrased "it 'helps'". And your response to that is it doesnt help as in small nor big, it helps as in helps because it helps.


    You're doing a fine job of twisting your own words.

  • eggy08eggy08 erie, PAPosts: 525Member
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by eggy08

    Originally posted by Xiaoki  

    Originally posted by Aerowyn

    Originally posted by Xiaoki Its amazing how this topic has progressed. Just look at the attitude towards combo fields. They went from: "gotta learn combo fields" "combo fields is a massive mechanic in this game" "Combo fields is the reason where you are not surviving" "combo fields make a huge difference" To: " it 'helps'" Simply amazing. Like how 1 comment can make something go from a "massive mechanic" to something that "helps".
    haha it's funny how you twist what people say.. but whatever floats your boat I guess..
    I didnt twist anything.   Did I twist your words in any way when you said "gotta learn combo fields"?
    You twisted my words and assumed that "helps" is only a fraction of anything. So yes, you twisted it to meet your own argument. I said helps because it in fact does that, it helps, but isn't the end all skill to get you to win. Period.
    You're saying I twisted your words when I paraphrased "it 'helps'". And your response to that is it doesnt help as in small nor big, it helps as in helps because it helps.

     


    You're doing a fine job of twisting your own words.

    You stated that my words of "it helps" contradicts the other words in the series. Which it doesn't. You twisted it to your own meaning of it helps meaning that it is less important than previously stated, which isn't true. I stated that I only used that word to generalize what the combo fields do, instead of saying it is the end all.

  • TithenonTithenon Fountain, COPosts: 109Member
    Boy, the OPs description of drawing bad guys -a mob is a group of bad guys, not a single bad guy... English, folks- in sounds like how things used to be in WoW prior to my quitting that game.  I played from Christmas 2004 to June or July 2006 in that piece of crap and, once I finished exploring every square inch I could get to, I quit the game and never looked back.  That was, primarily, because whomever was designing the dungeons had NO clue, whatsoever, what role-playing was about and, thus, designed a console gamers dungeon.  I'm sorry to hear the GW2 devs seem to have gone back to the old way of doing things.
  • ChrisReitzChrisReitz Newport, KYPosts: 115Member
    Well if you dont like it quit playing cause I dont see them chaning the whole dungeon agro cause you dont like it. This is something they probably would never change and their is no point of making a thread and complaining about it. I feel like I wasted 3 mins of my life reading what you wrote and typing this in a thread that will die probably in 2 days.
  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel houston, TXPosts: 7,277Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by maskedweasel
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by TsaboHavoc
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
     

     

    I think that would be contradictory...  if I thought Guardians were so overpowered, then I wouldn't have offered to face you in PvP.  Its no lie that Guardians are known for their survivability, especially in PvE -- and how is that an excuse for anything?  If nothing else it would prove me wrong if you were able to get through a dungeon or a PvP match completely unscathed.

     

    Me playing my mesmer,  I have damn good survivability,  I stay at range, and all my pets do the damage,  I can go invisible, reflect ranged damage, and put out so much condition damage its staggering.  It pairs well with a guardian,  and guardians are some of the toughest to kill in PvP for a mesmer due to the high heal/defense ratio and the mesmers traditionally low DPS and even lower defensive ability.     The only thing worse than running a mesmer would be if you wanted me to run an elementalist in PvP,  it would be all DPS on defense.

    Just for you this is what I did. I joined a pug and sat my daughter down who has never done a dungeon in GW2. I coached her while she did the run. The pug had zero deaths, and zero repair bills. Took all of 20 minutes. She did hit my fraps button a few times because shes not use to my setup so it did cut off here and there but not durring any of the fights I think. She's been playing MMO's for years so don't think she is a complete newb. 

    In any case, it's gonna take hours to finish uploading the videos but when they are ready I will post links here. 

    So, story mode is cake for me and apparently CM story mode is cake for my daughter who hasn't done a single dungeon. Videos to follow... 

    As promised.... 

    My 17 year old daughter doing CM story mode for the first time. 

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4E_FgzJ664&feature=youtu.be

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFtqd7yR6eg&feature=youtu.be

     

     

    Not to nitpick on it,  but you didn't show the first door pull after the robot boss who is extremely easy post patch,  but that first door pull is usually the toughest pull in that dungeon, and its conspicuously missing from this video.  Secondly,  you had a team of 3 guardians and a warrior,  its not unheard of to find a PUG like that,  but not a single light armored character and 4 heavy armored characters 3 of which that can heal on a Dungeon that requires you to stand and fight then run (snipers deal substantially more damage on moving targets).  

     

    Regardless,  no players went down in the parts of the video that you showed, and I honestly don't care that much to delve any deeper into it.  I offered to see things first hand instead of a second hand video and you declined, and thats fine.

     

    "Loan me a Dragon I wanna see space"


    image

  • RyukanRyukan Mason, MIPosts: 706Member Uncommon

    Actually I think the WORST dungeon system is any dungeon system that locks you out of a boss fight if you die. Being able to run back to the fight and get back in the action if you die is great compared to sitting in a lockout ring or behind a "wall" waiting for the rest of the party to hopefully complete it or more likely die.

    I will agree that the dungeons feel a bit too hard especially for PUGgin even in the story mode.

  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel houston, TXPosts: 7,277Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ryukan

    Actually I think the WORST dungeon system is any dungeon system that locks you out of a boss fight if you die. Being able to run back to the fight and get back in the action if you die is great compared to sitting in a lockout ring or behind a "wall" waiting for the rest of the party to hopefully complete it or more likely die.

    I will agree that the dungeons feel a bit too hard especially for PUGgin even in the story mode.

    I think SWTOR did that a few times on certain bosses.. if you died or got disconnected on a boss.. you had to wait for everyone to wipe before you could get back in and fight them.  I agree that I don't like it... but sometimes the additional challenge of getting it done all together can be rewarding too.

    "Loan me a Dragon I wanna see space"


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  • GrayGhost79GrayGhost79 Webster, MAPosts: 4,813Member
    Originally posted by maskedweasel
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by maskedweasel
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
    Originally posted by TsaboHavoc
    Originally posted by GrayGhost79
     

     

    I think that would be contradictory...  if I thought Guardians were so overpowered, then I wouldn't have offered to face you in PvP.  Its no lie that Guardians are known for their survivability, especially in PvE -- and how is that an excuse for anything?  If nothing else it would prove me wrong if you were able to get through a dungeon or a PvP match completely unscathed.

     

    Me playing my mesmer,  I have damn good survivability,  I stay at range, and all my pets do the damage,  I can go invisible, reflect ranged damage, and put out so much condition damage its staggering.  It pairs well with a guardian,  and guardians are some of the toughest to kill in PvP for a mesmer due to the high heal/defense ratio and the mesmers traditionally low DPS and even lower defensive ability.     The only thing worse than running a mesmer would be if you wanted me to run an elementalist in PvP,  it would be all DPS on defense.

    Just for you this is what I did. I joined a pug and sat my daughter down who has never done a dungeon in GW2. I coached her while she did the run. The pug had zero deaths, and zero repair bills. Took all of 20 minutes. She did hit my fraps button a few times because shes not use to my setup so it did cut off here and there but not durring any of the fights I think. She's been playing MMO's for years so don't think she is a complete newb. 

    In any case, it's gonna take hours to finish uploading the videos but when they are ready I will post links here. 

    So, story mode is cake for me and apparently CM story mode is cake for my daughter who hasn't done a single dungeon. Videos to follow... 

    As promised.... 

    My 17 year old daughter doing CM story mode for the first time. 

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4E_FgzJ664&feature=youtu.be

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFtqd7yR6eg&feature=youtu.be

     

     

    Not to nitpick on it,  but you didn't show the first door pull after the robot boss who is extremely easy post patch,  but that first door pull is usually the toughest pull in that dungeon, and its conspicuously missing from this video.  Secondly,  you had a team of 3 guardians and a warrior,  its not unheard of to find a PUG like that,  but not a single light armored character and 4 heavy armored characters 3 of which that can heal on a Dungeon that requires you to stand and fight then run (snipers deal substantially more damage on moving targets).  

     

    Regardless,  no players went down in the parts of the video that you showed, and I honestly don't care that much to delve any deeper into it.  I offered to see things first hand instead of a second hand video and you declined, and thats fine.

     

    As I said shes not use to my setup so hit the fraps button here and there in the beginning. The rest goes on uninterupted after I showed her which button not to mess with. I've done this story mode with 2 mesmers, 2 elementalists and a rouge + me with the same results as well as several other profession combinations. Hell once I ran through with 4 engineers and myself. 

    Pre-patch and Post-patch CM story mode is cake. I simply provided proof of it. As I said, it's cake and I proved my point so... not really much else to say lol. 

  • JetrpgJetrpg Whitehouse, OHPosts: 2,376Member
    Originally posted by Kumate

    This game by far has blown me away in almost every category, the gameplay is fun and the world is bueatiful.  The Dynamic events are a great way to level because there is no go fletch quest hubs and so on, but last night I tried a dungeon for the first time.

    I was a a level 50 Ranger doing a level 40 CM story mode.  I had heard the horror stories of how unorganized, zerg fest they were but I kept telling myself I've played MMO's for so long that it can't be that bad.  It was, the lack of a trinity was clear right away.

    When entering the zone we started thru the story.  First mob is a Golem, solo, and didn't go to bad.  One death by a warrior but we got him up fast.  I'm thinking ok, not to shabby.  Second group of mobs is where it all went downhill.  Your first pull there is about 4-5 mobs.  Each one of them are "elite" which means even if all 5 of us are attacking it, it takes about 45-60 seconds to burn it down.  Except there is no way to do ANYTHING about the other 4 beating on you.  There is no tanking, no offtanking, no CC that is worth it.  Most CC in this game last 3 seconds maybe.  So needless to say, nearly every pull was a wipe.  We spent as much time rezing people as we did fighting.  

    We beat the dungeon, but our strat was to all attack one mob, burn it down hopefully before we wiped, and come back and do it again.  We would burn the barrel placers first and so on. 

    I know that CM was made harder recenetly, but this was just storymode.  I felt like I didn't learn anything from the story because I was to busy cringing at this system.  There was NOTHING FUN about this dungeon.  We also had a person quit and we had to replace them during this dungeon because he said (sorry guys..this dugeon system is horrible..I am going to uninstall). 

     

    My character was setup for PVE and grouping.  I had healing spring with some points into healing, search and rescue to help with rezing and the healing spirit.  There was no way to heal thru that damage.  We also had a guardian and that helped some but just prolonged how long it took us to wipe. 

    I miss my healers, tanks, and true CC.  I lost motivation to level now because I do enjoy PVE more then PVP and knowing that is all I have to look forward to in dungeons is quite dishearting.  I love every other aspect of this game, crafting, quest, pvp, graphics, but this is to core of a system for me to overlook.  There is a difference between core mehanics and difficulty.  The core mechanics on dungeons is just broke.  Even if they made it super easy and a zerg fest, there would still be no "skill" to the system.  It is either boring no pay attention killing, or just a wipe and res as fast as you can event.  I miss strategy.

     

    Whats even wrost is dungeons exp IS NOW NOT WORTH ANYTHING. eASILY THE HARDEST CONTENT WITH NO REWARD.... FAIL.

     

    PS i love gw2 but anet messed up bad on this one.

    "Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine

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