No idea why people can't grasp simple concepts and jump to completely unrelated subjects.
$15 a month isn't much to pay. Would you pay $15 a month to get kicked in the teeth? No, Why not? Can't afford it?
The problem is the value, if DF was worth a monthly fee people would have stayed. Most didn't so... you can draw your own conclusions from that. My conclusion is that people didn't find it to be worth $15 a month.
DF:UW has a lot to prove before people can see it worth a monthly fee.
If it was simply about being able to afford $15 a month to play, then why aren't we paying a monthly sub for every MMO out there? Why aren't you playing WoW and MO? It's only $15 a month each, can you not afford it?
Do you see how asinine something like that sounds?
DarkFall was fun for a month or two but after the Huge server war there just wasn't much going on in comparison but to grind and grind some more. Didn't see a reason to pay a monthly fee to do that because I saw no value in it.
I see where you are coming from. Darkfall had some serious long term problems.
But... Many of us are desperate for a PvP game with some serious risk and challenge and sadly Mainstream MMOs just are cutting it,. Mainstream MMOs have neutered risk and challenge and keep trying to throw the same Carebear PvP arena and battleground at us and most of us are tired of Easy Mode casual games that reward everyone even when the lose.
So tons of people are willing to pay $ 15.00 for even a few months just to play a new Indie game that bucks the Adventure's Daycare that we keep seeing year after year..
If $15 a month is too much for a hobby you will probably spend a lot of time doing, then you need to get a job/paper round.
A free to play model doesn't fit with Darkfall, there's nothing the devs could sell that would be worth while buying without giving an in-game advantage over other players.
The game doesn't have the newest, shinest character models for people to want to purchase cosmetics.
Not everyone in DF can own a house so buying housing items is moot.
Exp bonuses are a competitive edge especially in the early meta game.
The ONLY thing I can see working is a PLEX system equilivent that lets players play for free aslong as they grind the money to buy them off players in-game. Even them it has the potential to mess up the economy with new gold magically appearing each month.
No idea why people can't grasp simple concepts and jump to completely unrelated subjects.
$15 a month isn't much to pay. Would you pay $15 a month to get kicked in the teeth? No, Why not? Can't afford it?
The problem is the value, if DF was worth a monthly fee people would have stayed. Most didn't so... you can draw your own conclusions from that. My conclusion is that people didn't find it to be worth $15 a month.
DF:UW has a lot to prove before people can see it worth a monthly fee.
If it was simply about being able to afford $15 a month to play, then why aren't we paying a monthly sub for every MMO out there? Why aren't you playing WoW and MO? It's only $15 a month each, can you not afford it?
Do you see how asinine something like that sounds?
DarkFall was fun for a month or two but after the Huge server war there just wasn't much going on in comparison but to grind and grind some more. Didn't see a reason to pay a monthly fee to do that because I saw no value in it.
They're not re-releasing DF1.0 as it was at launch. From your post you seem to be under that impression.
DF1.0 has some major flaws earlier on and that turned a lot of people off from paying £15/month. They've already addressed most of those flaws in DF1.0 and hopefully the rest in DF:UW. A much more refined version of the original is definately worth £15/month.
If $15 a month is too much for a hobby you will probably spend a lot of time doing, then you need to get a job/paper round.
A free to play model doesn't fit with Darkfall, there's nothing the devs could sell that would be worth while buying without giving an in-game advantage over other players.
The game doesn't have the newest, shinest character models for people to want to purchase cosmetics.
Not everyone in DF can own a house so buying housing items is moot.
Exp bonuses are a competitive edge especially in the early meta game.
The ONLY thing I can see working is a PLEX system equilivent that lets players play for free aslong as they grind the money to buy them off players in-game. Even them it has the potential to mess up the economy with new gold magically appearing each month.
No idea why people can't grasp simple concepts and jump to completely unrelated subjects.
$15 a month isn't much to pay. Would you pay $15 a month to get kicked in the teeth? No, Why not? Can't afford it?
The problem is the value, if DF was worth a monthly fee people would have stayed. Most didn't so... you can draw your own conclusions from that. My conclusion is that people didn't find it to be worth $15 a month.
DF:UW has a lot to prove before people can see it worth a monthly fee.
If it was simply about being able to afford $15 a month to play, then why aren't we paying a monthly sub for every MMO out there? Why aren't you playing WoW and MO? It's only $15 a month each, can you not afford it?
Do you see how asinine something like that sounds?
DarkFall was fun for a month or two but after the Huge server war there just wasn't much going on in comparison but to grind and grind some more. Didn't see a reason to pay a monthly fee to do that because I saw no value in it.
They're not re-releasing DF1.0 as it was at launch. From your post you seem to be under that impression.
DF1.0 has some major flaws earlier on and that turned a lot of people off from paying £15/month. They've already addressed most of those flaws in DF1.0 and hopefully the rest in DF:UW. A much more refined version of the original is definately worth £15/month.
I'm saying it needs to prove it before many find the value, anything can be said... repeatedly apparently. I'm not saying "everythings the same so F that", I'm saying that they are going to have to show that the monthly fee is warranted this time around. Even with that I'm not overly happy with some of the directions, they went directly against what the community wanted. For example, the Skill System... from what I saw most (including me) wanted something more akin to the system UO has for skills. Instead they incorporated "Classes" or "Roles" which ever you want to call it which is going to be seen by many as an even worse solution than you can have everything at once if you're willing to grind it.
So far, from what I've read and seen some things seem better, some things seem worse. This "new game" has a lot to prove before many will see the value of a monthly fee for it.
White Knight your payment model all you want, I for one will be trying DFUW no matter what payment model it has. DFUW is one of the very few MMO's that actually catch my attention in this sea of crap we call games. If it sucks o well. Back to waiting for a good MMO to be released.
I would agree with many of the others. . sandbox and F2P / freemium is not a good mix. I am sure there are ways to make it work at some point and someone will do this. . but not based on the current models. Especially a game with PvP everywhere. Costmetics would not make them enough money.
Also, I don't get how people can say "no game is worth $15 a month". . most new games (single player or with multiplayer options) are releaseing with regular box price and then selling DLC a week after release. . When I buy a boxed game I play it for a bout 3 months typically (a few expections: X3, Bethesda stuff etc.).
I ate a meal at a restaurant with my wife last night. . it was $60 for both of us. . I will crap it out today and I think it was worth it. It is relative. if you don't think ANY game is worth $15 a month then maybe you just don't like games that much? it is 50 cents a day. . I like F2P because I play casual but if they get this one right I will be subbing.
To restate my point, its the quality of the gameplay, UI, etc. that I am saying people will not pay for unless it is actually modernized and working. Why would we pay monthly for a buggy half game stil in development when we can play GW2 free and so many other games.
I would say that goe without saying. With any game and with any fee structure.
there is no point paying for a game that doesn't work nor is there any point playing a "free" game and wasting one's time.
the question is always "does this game's good points outweight the bad points where its' worth our time and/or money.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Maybe with their track record of not delivering on promises they should offer a good trial when the new game is released to show people it's worth paying for, if indeed it is.
To restate my point, its the quality of the gameplay, UI, etc. that I am saying people will not pay for unless it is actually modernized and working. Why would we pay monthly for a buggy half game stil in development when we can play GW2 free and so many other games.
I would say that goe without saying. With any game and with any fee structure.
there is no point paying for a game that doesn't work nor is there any point playing a "free" game and wasting one's time.
the question is always "does this game's good points outweight the bad points where its' worth our time and/or money.
+1 Sovrath. I think GW2 is not worth the box price. So I dont buy it. But I will pay a sub to Darkfall because I am interested in it and want to try it. Not like GW2. To me Darkfall 1 was far better than GW2 and I have given far more money to Aventurine that I will ever give ANet. Each of us have a different tastes in games. There is no wrong way.
The original Darkfall had me hooked for over 2 years and I had no problem dropping 15 dollars a month to play. I'd rather pay 15 a month than have to worry about some in game cash shop that ruins the game...
Darkfall 1 was a huge disappointment after we waited so many, many years for it. NOw I know we have no great MMORPG right now, but we do have good games such as GW2 with AAA graphics, sound and PVE.
If a game with the quality of GW2 has no monthly fee, I know for sure very, very few people will pay a monthly fee for this game. It will have better quality, but I am certain it will still be full of problems and it will not have modern graphics compared to games such as GW2 and the rest of the new games.
Yea we all want PVP, sandbox, etc. but over $200 a year for games full of bugs and that are not AAA quality is not going to work.
To restate my point, its the quality of the gameplay, UI, etc. that I am saying people will not pay for unless it is actually modernized and working. Why would we pay monthly for a buggy half game stil in development when we can play GW2 free and so many other games.
Darkfall should be THE GAME! I want aventurine to finish the game and make sure the gameplay is top notch before release, if not they will probably just disappear if this game has the same fanbase and problems as the last.
This will be very hard for me to explain..
You do not understand a thing about what is needed.
After Darkfall I just don't see this company pulling this off. People expect top quality for box+monthly fee now. EVE works because it had the time it needed to grow into the high quality MMO it is now. Back when it was released box+sub was normal, even for sub par MMO's. If it would release now in the state it released back then, I wonder if it stood any chance now.
So I'm not saying a AAA FFA pvp sandbox can't be done, It is just that the bar has been set a lot higher for MMO releases. And I highly doubt that this company can pull it off.
DF UW is worth a montly fee and if you think otherwise, its cuz you know nothing better than wow and now, GW2 and this is simply cuz we got nothing better at the moment. Wow ruined the mmorpg genre by trying to cather to the mass and to do that, they made wow playable for everyone excluding the poor players.
If you play an mmo for the pve, wow and other clones might be good for you, but if you play for the pvp, i can see why you think DF UW doesnt deserve a monthly fee, cuz you dont know how the pvp plays out in DF.
The difference between mainstream mmo pvp and sandbox: For mainstream, instanced and some zones, pvp matters the most. In a sandbox, its everywhere. Theres not many good sandbox left and we are willing to pay for the last good one. Mainstream mmos has millions just like wow, so they go free in order to be succesful.
If $15 a month is too much for a hobby you will probably spend a lot of time doing, then you need to get a job/paper round.
A free to play model doesn't fit with Darkfall, there's nothing the devs could sell that would be worth while buying without giving an in-game advantage over other players.
The game doesn't have the newest, shinest character models for people to want to purchase cosmetics.
Not everyone in DF can own a house so buying housing items is moot.
Exp bonuses are a competitive edge especially in the early meta game.
The ONLY thing I can see working is a PLEX system equilivent that lets players play for free aslong as they grind the money to buy them off players in-game. Even them it has the potential to mess up the economy with new gold magically appearing each month.
No idea why people can't grasp simple concepts and jump to completely unrelated subjects.
$15 a month isn't much to pay. Would you pay $15 a month to get kicked in the teeth? No, Why not? Can't afford it?
The problem is the value, if DF was worth a monthly fee people would have stayed. Most didn't so... you can draw your own conclusions from that. My conclusion is that people didn't find it to be worth $15 a month.
DF:UW has a lot to prove before people can see it worth a monthly fee.
If it was simply about being able to afford $15 a month to play, then why aren't we paying a monthly sub for every MMO out there? Why aren't you playing WoW and MO? It's only $15 a month each, can you not afford it?
Do you see how asinine something like that sounds?
DarkFall was fun for a month or two but after the Huge server war there just wasn't much going on in comparison but to grind and grind some more. Didn't see a reason to pay a monthly fee to do that because I saw no value in it.
They're not re-releasing DF1.0 as it was at launch. From your post you seem to be under that impression.
DF1.0 has some major flaws earlier on and that turned a lot of people off from paying £15/month. They've already addressed most of those flaws in DF1.0 and hopefully the rest in DF:UW. A much more refined version of the original is definately worth £15/month.
I'm saying it needs to prove it before many find the value, anything can be said... repeatedly apparently. I'm not saying "everythings the same so F that", I'm saying that they are going to have to show that the monthly fee is warranted this time around. Even with that I'm not overly happy with some of the directions, they went directly against what the community wanted. For example, the Skill System... from what I saw most (including me) wanted something more akin to the system UO has for skills. Instead they incorporated "Classes" or "Roles" which ever you want to call it which is going to be seen by many as an even worse solution than you can have everything at once if you're willing to grind it.
So far, from what I've read and seen some things seem better, some things seem worse. This "new game" has a lot to prove before many will see the value of a monthly fee for it.
Don't listen to this guy I remember him from the early days of DF. He was one of our "guild" crafters in Wessex that was funneled mats to level. Bad idea he quit like a month or two into the game leaving everyones hard work for nothing. Also, pretty sure he quit cause he didn't like "pvp" just wanted to pve and craft. Ya thats right I still remember you cause your a bitch and took our shit then bounced out like a pussy, go ahead and try to deny it I remember seeing you post here right after the incident and being like thats the mother fucker that took our shit and quit.
DF UW is worth a montly fee and if you think otherwise, its cuz you know nothing better than wow and now, GW2 and this is simply cuz we got nothing better at the moment. Wow ruined the mmorpg genre by trying to cather to the mass and to do that, they made wow playable for everyone excluding the poor players.
If you play an mmo for the pve, wow and other clones might be good for you, but if you play for the pvp, i can see why you think DF UW doesnt deserve a monthly fee, cuz you dont know how the pvp plays out in DF.
The difference between mainstream mmo pvp and sandbox: For mainstream, instanced and some zones, pvp matters the most. In a sandbox, its everywhere. Theres not many good sandbox left and we are willing to pay for the last good one. Mainstream mmos has millions just like wow, so they go free in order to be succesful.
No offense but you know zero about marketing. Why do you think Darkfall has such a low user base right now? Free to play is the future and it is inevitable. Any company expecting to survive off of monthly subs are doomed. EVE and WOW were released how many years ago, that's why they are able to maintain the same model.
Darkfall 1 was a huge disappointment after we waited so many, many years for it. NOw I know we have no great MMORPG right now, but we do have good games such as GW2 with AAA graphics, sound and PVE.
If a game with the quality of GW2 has no monthly fee, I know for sure very, very few people will pay a monthly fee for this game. It will have better quality, but I am certain it will still be full of problems and it will not have modern graphics compared to games such as GW2 and the rest of the new games.
Yea we all want PVP, sandbox, etc. but over $200 a year for games full of bugs and that are not AAA quality is not going to work.
To restate my point, its the quality of the gameplay, UI, etc. that I am saying people will not pay for unless it is actually modernized and working. Why would we pay monthly for a buggy half game stil in development when we can play GW2 free and so many other games.
Darkfall should be THE GAME! I want aventurine to finish the game and make sure the gameplay is top notch before release, if not they will probably just disappear if this game has the same fanbase and problems as the last.
Darkfall and GW2 are just 2 very different games. Now if WoDO or AA would release with no monthly fees things might be different but I dont see GW2 impacting the game much at all.
I do wish Avi would get a programmer as good as Jeff Strain though (who made GW2s engine), but besides having PvP fights with many plauers involved and both being fantasy they just have very little in common.
Darkfall 1 was a huge disappointment after we waited so many, many years for it. NOw I know we have no great MMORPG right now, but we do have good games such as GW2 with AAA graphics, sound and PVE.
If a game with the quality of GW2 has no monthly fee, I know for sure very, very few people will pay a monthly fee for this game. It will have better quality, but I am certain it will still be full of problems and it will not have modern graphics compared to games such as GW2 and the rest of the new games.
Yea we all want PVP, sandbox, etc. but over $200 a year for games full of bugs and that are not AAA quality is not going to work.
To restate my point, its the quality of the gameplay, UI, etc. that I am saying people will not pay for unless it is actually modernized and working. Why would we pay monthly for a buggy half game stil in development when we can play GW2 free and so many other games.
Darkfall should be THE GAME! I want aventurine to finish the game and make sure the gameplay is top notch before release, if not they will probably just disappear if this game has the same fanbase and problems as the last.
Darkfall and GW2 are just 2 very different games. Now if WoDO or AA would release with no monthly fees things might be different but I dont see GW2 impacting the game much at all.
I do wish Avi would get a programmer as good as Jeff Strain though (who made GW2s engine), but besides having PvP fights with many plauers involved and both being fantasy they just have very little in common.
I think that is what will make or break the game for me. I'd be perfectly willing to pay a monthly fee for Darkfall again, but only if I see a increase in performance. My game stuttered, had incredibly low FPS, and just ran all-around horrible. I'm not saying I have the best rig around, but every other game I play runs fine on maximum or almost maximum settings.
Performance will be a big factor in retaining subscribers. Out of every sandbox game I have played (Xsyon, Roma Victor, Darkfall, and others) almost all of them have suffered from serious performance issues. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with rendering seamless terrain and processing everything that is going on in a multiplayer environment (especially with twitch combat), and having to deal with a much more dynamic environment than your standard themepark MMO, but not everyone can afford top of the line rigs to stay competitive in PvP or massive seiges.
As of right now, with Darkfall's performance, going F2P would be a bad idea. A lot of gamers who favor F2P don't have dedicated gaming rigs, and most of them would jump ship if they had to play DF (in its current state). Maybe AV already introduced some engines optimizations for performance and I just haven't heard about it. If DF:UW ever goes F2P, it will definitely need to clean up its engine a bit. Even then, I still stand by my original thought that even if the game was more accessible, a standard F2P with an item shop and whatnot would not be practical in Darkfall. I would even go as far to say that I think it would alienate their entire playerbase/niche.
No offense but you know zero about marketing. Why do you think Darkfall has such a low user base right now? Free to play is the future and it is inevitable. Any company expecting to survive off of monthly subs are doomed. EVE and WOW were released how many years ago, that's why they are able to maintain the same model.
It has a low userbase because it is severely lacking in some core aspects. The payment model has nothing to do with it - if a game is good and designed for long-term play, people will pay for it. Sadly, DF1 failed to retain any significant playerbase early on due to poor design decisions. DF2 will hopefully remedy some of these fundamental flaws.
Making it FTP however would completely and utterly destroy any hope this game has of keeping a healthy population yet again, since it would mean PTW and leave only a tiny speck of carebear whales trying to out-shop each other to stay competitive. You simply can't base a FFA game on a cash shop, it destroys the whole concept (EVE has a cash shop ofc but it's only sells totally useless things, and that's why the game is still PTP).
You FTP-zealots need to move on, your bright future has already arrived and now it's becoming the past. A lot of people prefer quality MMOs with longevity and depth, and that usually comes with a sub.
You guys just need to get over it and play your crappy themeparks instead.
DF UW is worth a montly fee and if you think otherwise, its cuz you know nothing better than wow and now, GW2 and this is simply cuz we got nothing better at the moment. Wow ruined the mmorpg genre by trying to cather to the mass and to do that, they made wow playable for everyone excluding the poor players.
If you play an mmo for the pve, wow and other clones might be good for you, but if you play for the pvp, i can see why you think DF UW doesnt deserve a monthly fee, cuz you dont know how the pvp plays out in DF.
The difference between mainstream mmo pvp and sandbox: For mainstream, instanced and some zones, pvp matters the most. In a sandbox, its everywhere. Theres not many good sandbox left and we are willing to pay for the last good one. Mainstream mmos has millions just like wow, so they go free in order to be succesful.
No offense but you know zero about marketing. Why do you think Darkfall has such a low user base right now? Free to play is the future and it is inevitable. Any company expecting to survive off of monthly subs are doomed. EVE and WOW were released how many years ago, that's why they are able to maintain the same model.
I dont know much about marketing, but i atleast know that free to play games only works when the game sux, when the devs refuse to work on the game or when the game in question has been brought by a company who will work on the item mall part of the game and mostly for the asian players.
Speaking of asians, apparently, DF UW will only be free to play in Asia. The biggest free to play playerbase are there. We wont have to deal with the gold sellers this time lol. A niche company like AV doesnt need millions of players too. 4000+ is enough.
Also, if you still have GW2 in mind, remember that just like GW1, they will keep on releasing more and more expansions and they already have their item mall in place that is worst than anything. Pay x amount to gain x amount of gold for 10 hours. You might as well not play if you dont pay lol.
Buy gold or items is for me cheating to gain advantge. The only difference between item mall and blackmarket is in the fist case the dealer is the owner and controls the whole market.
The best scenario for players is p2p or an entirely free game with altruistic devs.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Comments
I see where you are coming from. Darkfall had some serious long term problems.
But... Many of us are desperate for a PvP game with some serious risk and challenge and sadly Mainstream MMOs just are cutting it,. Mainstream MMOs have neutered risk and challenge and keep trying to throw the same Carebear PvP arena and battleground at us and most of us are tired of Easy Mode casual games that reward everyone even when the lose.
So tons of people are willing to pay $ 15.00 for even a few months just to play a new Indie game that bucks the Adventure's Daycare that we keep seeing year after year..
lol, well it join the long list of MMOs we have seem die in a fire over the last few years... AOC, SWG, Vanguard, SWOTR and soon GW2.
They're not re-releasing DF1.0 as it was at launch. From your post you seem to be under that impression.
DF1.0 has some major flaws earlier on and that turned a lot of people off from paying £15/month. They've already addressed most of those flaws in DF1.0 and hopefully the rest in DF:UW. A much more refined version of the original is definately worth £15/month.
Yup now scumbags are screaming that B2P is the only thing they accept.
WoW ruined western MMOs.
GW2 ruined the balance in MMOs.
God I hate non-gamers and their tiny brains.
I'm saying it needs to prove it before many find the value, anything can be said... repeatedly apparently. I'm not saying "everythings the same so F that", I'm saying that they are going to have to show that the monthly fee is warranted this time around. Even with that I'm not overly happy with some of the directions, they went directly against what the community wanted. For example, the Skill System... from what I saw most (including me) wanted something more akin to the system UO has for skills. Instead they incorporated "Classes" or "Roles" which ever you want to call it which is going to be seen by many as an even worse solution than you can have everything at once if you're willing to grind it.
So far, from what I've read and seen some things seem better, some things seem worse. This "new game" has a lot to prove before many will see the value of a monthly fee for it.
You label people as scumbags, based on a difference of opinion.
You make two blanket generalizations, neither of which are accurate.
You belittle other individuals by making the claim that someone who isn't a gamer is less intelligent than someone who is.
A credit to society, you are not. Time to grow up champ.
I would agree with many of the others. . sandbox and F2P / freemium is not a good mix. I am sure there are ways to make it work at some point and someone will do this. . but not based on the current models. Especially a game with PvP everywhere. Costmetics would not make them enough money.
Also, I don't get how people can say "no game is worth $15 a month". . most new games (single player or with multiplayer options) are releaseing with regular box price and then selling DLC a week after release. . When I buy a boxed game I play it for a bout 3 months typically (a few expections: X3, Bethesda stuff etc.).
I ate a meal at a restaurant with my wife last night. . it was $60 for both of us. . I will crap it out today and I think it was worth it. It is relative. if you don't think ANY game is worth $15 a month then maybe you just don't like games that much? it is 50 cents a day. . I like F2P because I play casual but if they get this one right I will be subbing.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
I would say that goe without saying. With any game and with any fee structure.
there is no point paying for a game that doesn't work nor is there any point playing a "free" game and wasting one's time.
the question is always "does this game's good points outweight the bad points where its' worth our time and/or money.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
+1 Sovrath. I think GW2 is not worth the box price. So I dont buy it. But I will pay a sub to Darkfall because I am interested in it and want to try it. Not like GW2. To me Darkfall 1 was far better than GW2 and I have given far more money to Aventurine that I will ever give ANet. Each of us have a different tastes in games. There is no wrong way.
Darkfall Unholy Wars
This will be very hard for me to explain..
You do not understand a thing about what is needed.
After Darkfall I just don't see this company pulling this off. People expect top quality for box+monthly fee now. EVE works because it had the time it needed to grow into the high quality MMO it is now. Back when it was released box+sub was normal, even for sub par MMO's. If it would release now in the state it released back then, I wonder if it stood any chance now.
So I'm not saying a AAA FFA pvp sandbox can't be done, It is just that the bar has been set a lot higher for MMO releases. And I highly doubt that this company can pull it off.
DF UW is worth a montly fee and if you think otherwise, its cuz you know nothing better than wow and now, GW2 and this is simply cuz we got nothing better at the moment. Wow ruined the mmorpg genre by trying to cather to the mass and to do that, they made wow playable for everyone excluding the poor players.
If you play an mmo for the pve, wow and other clones might be good for you, but if you play for the pvp, i can see why you think DF UW doesnt deserve a monthly fee, cuz you dont know how the pvp plays out in DF.
The difference between mainstream mmo pvp and sandbox: For mainstream, instanced and some zones, pvp matters the most. In a sandbox, its everywhere. Theres not many good sandbox left and we are willing to pay for the last good one. Mainstream mmos has millions just like wow, so they go free in order to be succesful.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
Don't listen to this guy I remember him from the early days of DF. He was one of our "guild" crafters in Wessex that was funneled mats to level. Bad idea he quit like a month or two into the game leaving everyones hard work for nothing. Also, pretty sure he quit cause he didn't like "pvp" just wanted to pve and craft. Ya thats right I still remember you cause your a bitch and took our shit then bounced out like a pussy, go ahead and try to deny it I remember seeing you post here right after the incident and being like thats the mother fucker that took our shit and quit.
PS. talkin about grayghost
No offense but you know zero about marketing. Why do you think Darkfall has such a low user base right now? Free to play is the future and it is inevitable. Any company expecting to survive off of monthly subs are doomed. EVE and WOW were released how many years ago, that's why they are able to maintain the same model.
Darkfall and GW2 are just 2 very different games. Now if WoDO or AA would release with no monthly fees things might be different but I dont see GW2 impacting the game much at all.
I do wish Avi would get a programmer as good as Jeff Strain though (who made GW2s engine), but besides having PvP fights with many plauers involved and both being fantasy they just have very little in common.
I think that is what will make or break the game for me. I'd be perfectly willing to pay a monthly fee for Darkfall again, but only if I see a increase in performance. My game stuttered, had incredibly low FPS, and just ran all-around horrible. I'm not saying I have the best rig around, but every other game I play runs fine on maximum or almost maximum settings.
Performance will be a big factor in retaining subscribers. Out of every sandbox game I have played (Xsyon, Roma Victor, Darkfall, and others) almost all of them have suffered from serious performance issues. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with rendering seamless terrain and processing everything that is going on in a multiplayer environment (especially with twitch combat), and having to deal with a much more dynamic environment than your standard themepark MMO, but not everyone can afford top of the line rigs to stay competitive in PvP or massive seiges.
As of right now, with Darkfall's performance, going F2P would be a bad idea. A lot of gamers who favor F2P don't have dedicated gaming rigs, and most of them would jump ship if they had to play DF (in its current state). Maybe AV already introduced some engines optimizations for performance and I just haven't heard about it. If DF:UW ever goes F2P, it will definitely need to clean up its engine a bit. Even then, I still stand by my original thought that even if the game was more accessible, a standard F2P with an item shop and whatnot would not be practical in Darkfall. I would even go as far to say that I think it would alienate their entire playerbase/niche.
One does not simply telnet into Mordor.
It has a low userbase because it is severely lacking in some core aspects. The payment model has nothing to do with it - if a game is good and designed for long-term play, people will pay for it. Sadly, DF1 failed to retain any significant playerbase early on due to poor design decisions. DF2 will hopefully remedy some of these fundamental flaws.
Making it FTP however would completely and utterly destroy any hope this game has of keeping a healthy population yet again, since it would mean PTW and leave only a tiny speck of carebear whales trying to out-shop each other to stay competitive. You simply can't base a FFA game on a cash shop, it destroys the whole concept (EVE has a cash shop ofc but it's only sells totally useless things, and that's why the game is still PTP).
You FTP-zealots need to move on, your bright future has already arrived and now it's becoming the past. A lot of people prefer quality MMOs with longevity and depth, and that usually comes with a sub.
You guys just need to get over it and play your crappy themeparks instead.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
I dont know much about marketing, but i atleast know that free to play games only works when the game sux, when the devs refuse to work on the game or when the game in question has been brought by a company who will work on the item mall part of the game and mostly for the asian players.
Speaking of asians, apparently, DF UW will only be free to play in Asia. The biggest free to play playerbase are there. We wont have to deal with the gold sellers this time lol. A niche company like AV doesnt need millions of players too. 4000+ is enough.
Also, if you still have GW2 in mind, remember that just like GW1, they will keep on releasing more and more expansions and they already have their item mall in place that is worst than anything. Pay x amount to gain x amount of gold for 10 hours. You might as well not play if you dont pay lol.
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Buy gold or items is for me cheating to gain advantge. The only difference between item mall and blackmarket is in the fist case the dealer is the owner and controls the whole market.
The best scenario for players is p2p or an entirely free game with altruistic devs.
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