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[Editorial] Guild Wars 2: Review in Progress - Part Three

2

Comments

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    Originally posted by Shana77
    I love WvW but then i've seen the storm coming in the beta weekend events and was smart enough not to pick one of the more popular WvW servers. I only have 10 minute queues at most. Is it perhaps an option for the reviewers to transfer temporarily to another server to take one or two days testing the WvW? You can always transfer back after. 

    Same, I feel bad for those on overpopulated or PvP focused servers. It hasnt taken me longer than 20 minutes to get into any of the zones, including the eternal battlegrounds.

  • therez0therez0 Ridgecrest, CAPosts: 379Member

    I don't feel sorry for you jaded players on the 'PvP servers' .  I'm on the Norhtern Shiverpeaks server right now, and the queues are almot non-existant.  If you guys really wanted to do something about the queue times, you would spread out onto more servers instead of just complaining.

     

    Ditch the elitist attitude about PvP servers and just find a lower population server; everyone benefits, you get into WvWvW faster and the servers become more balanced at the same time.

  • Mariner-80Mariner-80 Winchester, VAPosts: 347Member

    Speaking of the UI, I like GW2, but I find the locked skill bar based on preset weapon skills rather annoying.

     

    I miss the flexibility of the skill bar system of GW1. It seems like, for each weapon I try (in GW2), there are a couple of skills I like, another skill I like but wish I could move to a different position on the skill bar, and at least one (sometimes two) skills I'd happily ditch altogether. I particularly dislike skills that launch my character forward, backward, and sideways.

     

    If we are going to have such skills, can we not at least put them where we want them?

  • evolpcevolpc Wauseon, OHPosts: 72Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Homitu
    Originally posted by evolpc
    Originally posted by Homitu
    Originally posted by evolpc
    Originally posted by BillMurphy
    Originally posted by evolpc

    Judge the game on its current merrits at the time of the review. If a feature is unavailable to be reviewed.... well then the recourse is very simple. Why go out of your way to avoid taking any points away?

    It's not about that, but rather about missing out the biggest part of it's PVP. I'd not be able to judge it at all, whereas I can judge a majority of the PVE content and sPVP, but not the big draw: WVW.  I can't judge it on its current merits, if I can't access all systems.  And I can't really take away points because a feature is popular either.  

    You sound a lot more like a fan than a journalist. Obviously you would not be taking away points because a feature is popular. That's another cop out. When looking at it objectively the feature is unavailable to be scored. The reason is irrelevant. It is one of the major features of the game and should be available, within reason, to all who purchase the game. If it is not then it is a shortcoming of the game design, which you are representing yourself as a reviewer of. You keep saying yourself that you can't access the systems to review them. However the game will receive a glowing, gushing review at press time. It seems intellectually dishonest.

    The only journalistically honest thing he can do here is exactly what he has done: state and explain the current shortcoming and wait until he can actually play that aspect of the game before he analyzes, you know, that aspect of the game.  It would be downright dishonest to give WvW a completely negative review as you seem to desire him to do when he has zero experience to go by.  The only journalistic obligation is to report the fact as it is, which right now for him is that he hasn't been able to access WvW because of queue times.  That is what it is.  It's a negative strike against WvW.  He reported it.  What more do you want? 

    What I want is for it to be a negative strike against WvWvW, just as you said yourself. Many customers are affected and unhappy about this shortcoming, myself included. I do not think it should be glossed over that this is a problem when he finally does review it. They do not do favors like that for other games. I suppose I will reserve further judgement for when he publishes the official review but I will not hold my breath. It is a great game but does not deserve a free pass on anything. If the game is really that great, favors like that will not be necessary will they?

    And that's exactly what he did.  His journalistic obligation is fulfilled for the time being, and I suspect a mention of the queue times will also be included in his full review of WvW when he gets to it.  If that review section is published without mention of the queues, then and only then will your present gripe be justified.  

    At present, it just looks like you've become so jaded by fanboys that you're actually trying to compensate in the opposite direction, which, of course, is equally as dishonest as blind fanboyism.  

    After some introspection I have to agree with you. I am in a strange no man's land here. I have been so put off by the fanboys of this game that I am starting to jump all over the first signs of it everywhere I look. In the meantime I love the game myself. It's so confusing and complicated. Generally I have nothing bad to say about the game other than some minor annoyances but I am so tired of seeing fanboys bash people who are just trying to express legitimate concerns that it has caused me to despise the game on some level. This is a very interesting case study within the mmo space and one that I have never personally witnessed myself. Have any of you ever experienced this? One thing is for certain... the fanboys are doing this game more harm than good. And I owe Bill an apology. I should have given him the benefit of the doubt. I'm sure the review will be thorough. In the meantime I'll be in game having a blast!

  • arcwestarcwest lubbock, TXPosts: 61Member
    that's crazy jade quarry has such long Wvw queues. On Tranished Coast the longest I have ever seen is 15-20 minutes, maybe, but usually it's more like 5-10 minutes.
  • RocknissRockniss Youngstown, OHPosts: 1,034Member
    Why don't you just move servers, actually to review you should play on a good, bad, and med server
  • HeroEvermoreHeroEvermore salem, ORPosts: 672Member
    Love the review Bill. You are why I still frolick on these forums. You have a great way of not being biased to the extreme and I enjoy your thoughts. Thanks as always.

    Hero Evermore
    Guild Master of Dragonspine since 1982.
    Playing Path of Exile and deeply in love with it.

  • Loke666Loke666 MalmöPosts: 17,949Member Uncommon

    The game is still fun.

    My 2 main complaints are the broken events that seems to be more common in high zones and that the dungeons needs some more work. The dungeon bosses needs to be improved, some moves little and like to spamm a few attacks  while others are tough as nails and more unreliable.

    Take AC, the lovers are fine and tough, the archer is OK I guess but the rest felt uninspired. ANET can better than this. And I didnt say easy or anything but I just think the fights could be more fun.

    As for the auction house there really should be a function so you can search for items you can use.

    Otherwise are fixes going fine, they do something almost every day.

    And Bill, in our server can you often just jump in and play direct, rolling on one of the fullest servers just is a bad idea if you want to be able to play WvWvW. Go to a medium server and you should be able to finnish the review. :)

  • RocknissRockniss Youngstown, OHPosts: 1,034Member
    Game is fun, my complaints right now have to deal mostly with shadowstepping and warrior lunges, I have no control over how far the shadow step or lunge travels, yet half of the time I lunge or shadowstep past my target, its very annoying. Also thieves that dual wield daggers, gain the ability to leap over thier target, well half of the time I leap over and right out of range, its broken, I am also not a fan of spells going off even when target is out of range, I know there are good things about it like forcing the player to judge, but as a melee player, there are a lot of times I have found that I look like I am in range to hit and apparently the game does not think so, I can live with these blemishes in pve, but this game is mostly about pvp and in pvp this is not acceptable.
  • sonoggisonoggi tdot, ONPosts: 1,119Member
    Bill just transfer to another server noob ;) and finish your wvw impressions
  • dimasokdimasok toronto, ONPosts: 189Member

    Overall the game is great but there are several things I don't like:

     

    1) When I go back to a previous area, there is not enough incentive for me to explore. It drops me down to the level of the enemies, makes it really hard to kill enemies I should have a cakewalk killing and on top of it all, doesn't net me XP that is worthwhile at my current lvl which means that its only worth going back to previous unexplored areas (say if you're 70 to go back to 45) only when you reached the cap and by that point going for 100% completion should be the main priority anyways and anything else would be secondary. 

     

    I think there should be an option to turn off the "lower lvl in lower areas" so that I could have fun obliterating all the enemies since the XP it gives me right now is negligible and not worth the trouble.

     

    2) The dynamic events... are repetitive and do not really have an effect on the world. Same thing happening till the end of time until AN decides to replace them with different ones.

     

    Other than that, not much to complain about

     
     
     
  • terrantterrant Virginia Beach, VAPosts: 1,683Member
    Originally posted by dimasok

    Overall the game is great but there are several things I don't like:

     

    1) When I go back to a previous area, there is not enough incentive for me to explore. It drops me down to the level of the enemies, makes it really hard to kill enemies I should have a cakewalk killing and on top of it all, doesn't net me XP that is worthwhile at my current lvl which means that its only worth going back to previous unexplored areas (say if you're 70 to go back to 45) only when you reached the cap and by that point going for 100% completion should be the main priority anyways and anything else would be secondary. 

     

    I think there should be an option to turn off the "lower lvl in lower areas" so that I could have fun obliterating all the enemies since the XP it gives me right now is negligible and not worth the trouble.

     

    2) The dynamic events... are repetitive and do not really have an effect on the world. Same thing happening till the end of time until AN decides to replace them with different ones.

     

    Other than that, not much to complain about

     
     
     

    1)  Really? I took my level 19 Thief back to a level 1-15 zone (mostly hanging in a level 9ish area) to farm crafting mats. I got a level every 30-60 minutes or so. XP didn't seemt hat negligible.

     

    2) Repetitive, yes. No effect on the world...not permanent, but yes they do. Events can mean a village full of NPCs and vendors is there or not. It could mean a bridge is there to cut travel times across a large part of land and grant access to other events is there or not. And most importantly, events can spawn different events as you succeed or fail.

    I think peopole had it in their head (Not saying you, just saying some people that I've seen posting here) that DEs would be permanent. That if centaurs burned down this village, it's gone forever. You kill the bandits and they never, ever come back. That's horrible from an MMO design standpoint. All you need is a few events and a zone would become a barren wasteland.

    I can understand the want for persistance in an online world, but to some extent it just kills the ability for large masses of people to play the same game at different times and enjoy it.

     

    On to Bill's review...

     

    I'd mostly agree with this week's. WvW queue times are annoying; and not being able to sort armor by type (cloth, leather, etc) just seems silly. 

  • CyclopsSlayerCyclopsSlayer Minneapolis, MNPosts: 532Member
    - Crafting is amazingly easy to level with discoveries. So far I've taken Huntsman to 229 and Artificing to 130 and other than item refinements I have never had to mass craft any item.
    I often find it cheaper to buy the sub-components premade, than it is to buy the raw materials, for example Green Wood Logs, 21CP each, yet the Green Wood Planks were 6cp.
  • someforumguysomeforumguy HomePosts: 3,539Member Uncommon

    Yeah, once I learned that major xp comes from discoveries in crafting, I only sometimes had problems with the amount of trophies I need for mastery items. But I tend to fully complete areas I play in, so usually I have enough by the time I go back to craft. Together with the xp from crafting, you can be lvl80 way before you hit a lvl80 area.

  • dimasokdimasok toronto, ONPosts: 189Member
    Originally posted by terrant
    Originally posted by dimasok

    Overall the game is great but there are several things I don't like:

     

    1) When I go back to a previous area, there is not enough incentive for me to explore. It drops me down to the level of the enemies, makes it really hard to kill enemies I should have a cakewalk killing and on top of it all, doesn't net me XP that is worthwhile at my current lvl which means that its only worth going back to previous unexplored areas (say if you're 70 to go back to 45) only when you reached the cap and by that point going for 100% completion should be the main priority anyways and anything else would be secondary. 

     

    I think there should be an option to turn off the "lower lvl in lower areas" so that I could have fun obliterating all the enemies since the XP it gives me right now is negligible and not worth the trouble.

     

    2) The dynamic events... are repetitive and do not really have an effect on the world. Same thing happening till the end of time until AN decides to replace them with different ones.

     

    Other than that, not much to complain about

     
     
     

    1)  Really? I took my level 19 Thief back to a level 1-15 zone (mostly hanging in a level 9ish area) to farm crafting mats. I got a level every 30-60 minutes or so. XP didn't seemt hat negligible.

     

    2) Repetitive, yes. No effect on the world...not permanent, but yes they do. Events can mean a village full of NPCs and vendors is there or not. It could mean a bridge is there to cut travel times across a large part of land and grant access to other events is there or not. And most importantly, events can spawn different events as you succeed or fail.

    I think peopole had it in their head (Not saying you, just saying some people that I've seen posting here) that DEs would be permanent. That if centaurs burned down this village, it's gone forever. You kill the bandits and they never, ever come back. That's horrible from an MMO design standpoint. All you need is a few events and a zone would become a barren wasteland.

    I can understand the want for persistance in an online world, but to some extent it just kills the ability for large masses of people to play the same game at different times and enjoy it.

     

    On to Bill's review...

     

    I'd mostly agree with this week's. WvW queue times are annoying; and not being able to sort armor by type (cloth, leather, etc) just seems silly. 

    1) It is negligible. Taking my lvl69 to a previously unexplored lvl45 area... is nearly useless.

     

    2) Well, I sort of knew that the DE wouldn't be permanent, and I understand why it couldnt be from an MMO design standpoint.. still though, a truly online persistent world would be a big step forward.

     

    My other problem with the XP is that some enemies take AGES to kill (i.e. champions) and yet the XP you get from them is nearly the same as you get form killing a regular mob. They REALLY need to change that. I can maybe understand that they factor in to the event XP, but what if they're not part of the event and are randomly scattered around? Why the hell would I bother with them? Say what you will about TOR (and many others) but they knew how to handle champion level enemies and knew better than to give the same xp you get for regular mobs

     

    Oh and they REALLY need to fix this clipping issues! I've never gotten stuck in an mmo before as much as I get stuck here. Stuck in spawning structures (because I happen to be in the wrong place and can't teleport until all enemies are killed, etc) mostly.

  • dontadowdontadow Detroit, MIPosts: 1,044Member
    Originally posted by dimasok
    Originally posted by terrant
    Originally posted by dimasok

    Overall the game is great but there are several things I don't like:

     

    1) When I go back to a previous area, there is not enough incentive for me to explore. It drops me down to the level of the enemies, makes it really hard to kill enemies I should have a cakewalk killing and on top of it all, doesn't net me XP that is worthwhile at my current lvl which means that its only worth going back to previous unexplored areas (say if you're 70 to go back to 45) only when you reached the cap and by that point going for 100% completion should be the main priority anyways and anything else would be secondary. 

     

    I think there should be an option to turn off the "lower lvl in lower areas" so that I could have fun obliterating all the enemies since the XP it gives me right now is negligible and not worth the trouble.

     

    2) The dynamic events... are repetitive and do not really have an effect on the world. Same thing happening till the end of time until AN decides to replace them with different ones.

     

    Other than that, not much to complain about

     
     
     

    1)  Really? I took my level 19 Thief back to a level 1-15 zone (mostly hanging in a level 9ish area) to farm crafting mats. I got a level every 30-60 minutes or so. XP didn't seemt hat negligible.

     

    2) Repetitive, yes. No effect on the world...not permanent, but yes they do. Events can mean a village full of NPCs and vendors is there or not. It could mean a bridge is there to cut travel times across a large part of land and grant access to other events is there or not. And most importantly, events can spawn different events as you succeed or fail.

    I think peopole had it in their head (Not saying you, just saying some people that I've seen posting here) that DEs would be permanent. That if centaurs burned down this village, it's gone forever. You kill the bandits and they never, ever come back. That's horrible from an MMO design standpoint. All you need is a few events and a zone would become a barren wasteland.

    I can understand the want for persistance in an online world, but to some extent it just kills the ability for large masses of people to play the same game at different times and enjoy it.

     

    On to Bill's review...

     

    I'd mostly agree with this week's. WvW queue times are annoying; and not being able to sort armor by type (cloth, leather, etc) just seems silly. 

    1) It is negligible. Taking my lvl69 to a previously unexplored lvl45 area... is nearly useless.

     

    2) Well, I sort of knew that the DE wouldn't be permanent, and I understand why it couldnt be from an MMO design standpoint.. still though, a truly online persistent world would be a big step forward.

     

    My other problem with the XP is that some enemies take AGES to kill (i.e. champions) and yet the XP you get from them is nearly the same as you get form killing a regular mob. They REALLY need to change that. I can maybe understand that they factor in to the event XP, but what if they're not part of the event and are randomly scattered around? Why the hell would I bother with them? Say what you will about TOR (and many others) but they knew how to handle champion level enemies and knew better than to give the same xp you get for regular mobs

     

    Oh and they REALLY need to fix this clipping issues! I've never gotten stuck in an mmo before as much as I get stuck here. Stuck in spawning structures (because I happen to be in the wrong place and can't teleport until all enemies are killed, etc) mostly.

    1. To have fun

    2. See Answer #1.  

     

    There's so much to do in the game,  if your only complaint is you have to wait to get in a feature they said would be limited to only 500 per time on a server then that's got to be amazing. Especially since it must be a good enough feature to keep people busy and in the game.  If you don't like the que time on yoru server, switch servers.  Can't say i've had to wait too long on Tarnished Coast. 

    Reading your posts, this sounds like just not the game for you.  Leveling by killing a bunch of monsters is not what the game is about.  It's also not about leveling in general. If your only concern is you can't level by grinding tough mobs, you probably should be on the lookout for the Tuesday WOW Panda expansion.  Which will have awesome new tough mobs to grind two and brand new Raids to grind too.  
  • DalanoDalano missoula, MTPosts: 116Member

    Great review.

    Might want to fix the "Rought Spots" typo though.

    Playing: FFXIV, EVE

  • BillMurphyBillMurphy Managing Editor Berea, OHPosts: 2,356MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

    @Dalano: Thanks!

    And I just might temporarily switch servers... I went to JQ with our MMORPG.com guild, and I'd hate to not WvW with them, but since it'd only be temporary it might be my best option.

  • adamlin747adamlin747 Midland, MIPosts: 23Member

    Well I hope this game does well for those that like it.  I'd like to see Blizzard lose a bunch of subscriptions since all they want to do is rest on their laurels and feed off the cash cow.  However, this game isn't for me, and I just wanted to post so others know why so those who have not bought it can make an informed decision. 

     

    First the good:  I loved the graphics, fighting was fun and pretty involved for me compared to most games.  Having quests be part of a larger environment was cool and the opening battles *spolier* against the centaur are fun that is when this game really shines.  Didn't do alot of the pvp because I prefer world pvp not battleground type stuff.  (BY world pvp I mean while questing getting attacked etc.)

    Now the bad (admittedly for me this was few but enough to make me delete the game.)  I found for me personally the game was more of a grind then any game I have played in a long time.  This was because the story (outside of personal story which occurs every few levels) is almost non-existent.  You go from one spot to the next near a heart and just kill stuff till it fills up and move on.  Even when you go to find out what the heart is for it is rarely engaging or interesting.  I prefer to feel like I am doing something for a reason and I guess I am more of a quest hub type person.  I believe RIFT did this better with there dynamic rifts on top of having quest hubs. 

    My other complaint (besides no open world pvp and the one stated above) is that the community seems lacking you just zerg the world monsters and the gain from this is small.  In my mind it is not that fun to just attack enmasse and overwhelm through sheer numbers and then when done get no reward really other than xp which you get from everything in this game anyway.

    These were my personal issues and I hope it helps someone who is on the fence.  GW2 is a great game it is just not for me or people who prefer a little more RPG and community/party based system like me.

  • Reas43Reas43 New York, NYPosts: 297Member

    "No, I’m nowhere near the cap, and yes I still can’t get into WvW unless I’m online for 2-3 hours, but I’ll be damned if I’m still not having plenty of fun with everything else the game has to offer. There may be folks who are less than impressed. We have a few of them here on our forums. I can appreciate their views even if I don’t share them. For my own value, GW2 has been the most fun I’ve had with a launched MMO since 2004."

    Now seriously, what's the entire point of "reviews in progress" if your outcome is already made?

    "No, I have not experienced most of the game, and there are some aspects that are entirely our of my reach by virtue of its design and population - but it's the best game since 2004!!!!1"

    Hilarious.  Let's see if 9 months down the line you'll be repeating the TSW post-mortem "I don't know what to say, I still stand by the 8.5 score we gave it (9+ for GW2)."

  • samboleonsamboleon iiPosts: 4Member

    hi all, im just asking your opinion that can my PC run GW2 with this sh*t ?

    amd athlon 64 x2 4800 2,4GHz, 2GB ram, 280 GTX 1GB

    i would like to play sooooo much but dont want to buy the game without confirmation.

    i know there are some system req. released, but i would like to know all of your experience of the game with your hardware, thanks in advance.

     

     

  • travamarstravamars Dallas, TXPosts: 417Member Common
    Originally posted by evolpc
    Originally posted by BillMurphy
    Originally posted by evolpc

    Judge the game on its current merrits at the time of the review. If a feature is unavailable to be reviewed.... well then the recourse is very simple. Why go out of your way to avoid taking any points away?

    It's not about that, but rather about missing out the biggest part of it's PVP. I'd not be able to judge it at all, whereas I can judge a majority of the PVE content and sPVP, but not the big draw: WVW.  I can't judge it on its current merits, if I can't access all systems.  And I can't really take away points because a feature is popular either.  

    You sound a lot more like a fan than a journalist. Obviously you would not be taking away points because a feature is popular. That's another cop out. When looking at it objectively the feature is unavailable to be scored. The reason is irrelevant. It is one of the major features of the game and should be available, within reason, to all who purchase the game. If it is not then it is a shortcoming of the game design, which you are representing yourself as a reviewer of. You keep saying yourself that you can't access the systems to review them. However the game will receive a glowing, gushing review at press time. It seems intellectually dishonest.

    If it was a low budget game company with a feature like this not working it would be getting terrible reviews.

    I think they decided this game would get great a great reveiw before launch, and even a bad launch and crappy game wont change reviews.

    But hey...the guy said he played it for 10 hours. Most people are bored to death by then.

  • eddieg50eddieg50 Tolland, CTPosts: 1,613Member Uncommon
      Sorry guys to busy playing and solving the fantastic quests of TSW to bother much with GW2, but maybe after 6 months or so I will get around to trying it
  • therez0therez0 Ridgecrest, CAPosts: 379Member
    Originally posted by samboleon

    hi all, im just asking your opinion that can my PC run GW2 with this sh*t ?

    amd athlon 64 x2 4800 2,4GHz, 2GB ram, 280 GTX 1GB

    i would like to play sooooo much but dont want to buy the game without confirmation.

    i know there are some system req. released, but i would like to know all of your experience of the game with your hardware, thanks in advance.

     

     

    From [url= https://buy.guildwars2.com/en/]Buy Guild Wars 2[/url]:

    Minimum System Requirements*

    * Due to potential changes, system requirements may change over time, and you may be required to upgrade your current system (or obtain a new system) to continue to play the game.

    • Windows® XP Service Pack 2 or better
    • Intel® Core™ 2 Duo 2.0 GHz, Core i3, AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 or better
    • 2 GB RAM
    • NVIDIA® GeForce® 7800, ATI Radeon™ X1800, Intel HD 3000 or better (256MB of video RAM and shader model 3.0 or better)
    • 25 GB available HDD space
    • Broadband Internet connection
    • Keyboard and mouse

     

    Looks like you just barely skooched in the reqs.

     
  • FozzikFozzik Arnold, MDPosts: 538Member

    The game is popular, for sure...but the fact that players chose to jump onto a few servers in massive numbers instead of spreading out more evenly really can't be considered a design flaw...especially since ArenaNet provides a very quick and easy solution to that problem.


    So the mmorpg.com guild chose to locate themselves on one of the two most crowded servers... why not move the whole guild?


    There are plenty of servers with no queues, very little zerging in events, and plenty of room in WvWvW for an organized guild to really make a difference for the server. The problem is simply mob mentality, and stubbornness on the part of players. Many of the largest and most organized guilds all decided to crowd onto a few servers, and this created a mass of followers who want the easy wins in PvP...and queue times are the completely predictable result.


    Please don't take points away from the game (or talk negatively about it in a review) simply because you CHOOSE not to take advantage of the easy and simple solutions provided. As an individual or a guild. Home world transfers are free. I can tell you for sure that my server, Ferguson's Crossing, has no queues at all, and could really use the help of a few organized guilds for WvW. I'm personally enjoying the fact that things are much less crowded, and that if I ever choose to take part in WvW, I won't have to wait...and I'll be able to potentially make a big impact, rather than sitting for hours only to be player_033289 in the Borg collective.

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