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Well it was fun while it lasted...

ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member

Well I enjoyed my time up until recently in rift.

 

It wasnt the mechanics or raiding or any of that stuff.  It was the bullying and constant negativity that eventually pushed me to cancel. 

 

I just did not see the point in investing money into a game only to see that garbage, whether your a victim of bullying or witness it happen to someone else. 

 

It just sours the whole experience in my opinion.  Its a real shame though, really liked that game but after this.  I am pretty much disgusted with the idea of even logging in anymore.

 

I know most games have this as well, but from what I saw tonite, it was pretty much out there and I am surprised it was not moderated before it went out of control. 

 

Whats the deal Trion care to comment?  Aside from saying we can ignore and report?  Does that really do anything other than give the victim of bullying some false sense of satisfaction?  What about the other people who log in without knowing to ignore that person, do you think its ok to subject new people to this type of behavior?  Is this a new business strategy, hate on them and we will just give in and pay?  Better think again.

 

 

Message to people is simple, be mindful if not empathetic to a person, we really dont know them and saying such hurtful or hateful comments could do alot more damage than you know.   Just think about it, how you like that being said to someone you care about?

 

I like to tell people dont follow in the footsteps of ignorance. But we all know that song dont we.  For as long as I have been playing games, its seems to be same song and dance.  Things get out of control, feelings get hurt, cancel, move onto something else.  Change names, change servers, etc.   When will this cycle stop? 

 

Try not to flame too much, but honestly, why bully people in a game?  I know some call it trolling, but to take it to the level where its a personal attack and everyone jumps on board?  CMon really?  Is that necessary? 

 

Well I guess its good to concentrate on the positives from this experience.

 

I now have 14$ back on my credit card! 

 

I have a lot more free time to spend with people that dont bully me!  Thats a plus!

 

No more finding mystery food in my keyboard!  Kitteh will have to get up and eat somewhere else now.  Kitteh gets exercise!

 

Can go outdoors and stare at that big ball of light!

 

Im sure there lots of things I can do but the point is, when you bully someone, everyone becomes a victim whether its directed at you or not.   Those actions cause other actions, and when its negative based, they usually end up taking away from everything around it.  I think its physics related.  But whatever. 

 

Even the bully becomes the victim eventually, because they suddenly find themselves, alone.

 

 

Going to give TSW another shot, so good luck my friends and hope you negative types mature greatly!

-Peace!

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Comments

  • JeroKaneJeroKane OsloPosts: 5,353Member Uncommon

    You have those idiots in every single game sadly.

    The only thing you can do is report and ignore.

    In the end when everyone puts him on ignore, he will be left alone bullying with himself.

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon

    Very vague.  Bullied how?  Bullied by guildies  Bullied by people you grouped with?

     

    It can happen in any game you know.

  • ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member

    This is in general, I do not want to out anyone as I feel that would be a breach of those individuals privacy.  I am certain if they run across this post then they will know who they are.

     

     

    This was in the entire chat channel for the most part as well as in some groups, such as warfronts, conquests, and I have also seen this happen on other servers in Rift as well and I have yet to see a GM moderate chat to the extent of removing troublemakers.  I apologize for the long post but I did have a lot on my mind and primarily was trying to understand the fundamental concept of the bully, I really think they is more that can be discovered in efforts to circumvent that process and hopefully salvage a decent game in my opinion. 

     

    Now if a GM has done this and I am not aware and you<the people of this forum> has seen it, please set me straight.  Last thing I would want to do is cause a stir when there is indeed action being taken place.  This is based on my experiences alone and I am sure we all have similar or different experiences regarding the environment.

     

    Aside from the controls in place by the game developers, I am sure we have all seen when chat can go from civil to just plain rude.  People jump on the bandwagon so to speak and its almost like a mob mentality. 

     

    I also understand that almost every game out there has elements like this, thats just part of the way things are, the problem I was pointing out was my current experiences in Rift and basically how its gotten to the point where logging in and seeing this is actually depressing!  A customer should not feel that way let alone pay for it.

     

    If I want that, then I will just watch the news, go to school, or try to sit with the cool people, etc.

     

    So I guess now the question has evolved, is it possible for a bully to co-exist within a gaming environment amongst other people who may or may not be affected by this virtual action or response?

     

    Also this raises a new question, could there be a misinterpretation of what is being read by one person vs another with a developmental problem such as the various ailments plaguing a persons ability to comprehend?

     

    That makes for an interesting argument in my opinion.

     

    Overall though, is it the games responsibility to moderate this virtual environment or keep the virtual environment in a particular balance?    I find the latter to be a true statement to a majority but overall is not capable without proper moderation whcih brings back to the beginning.  Thus the cycle I wrote about earlier, how far should a person go to repeat this cycle in the different games? 

     

    I felt that tonite was my enough stage, and quite frankly, that scares me as I have never been to this level before, sure I have left other games only to go back in a few months but this feeling is completely different.  I feel it is as a result of that bully behavior directed at me as well as other people. 

     

    I dont mean to pick on Rift, but it happened and happens in Rift quite frequently to the point where it warranted this dialogue.

    Just my cents rather.

     

    Sori to ramble, its late and I go off on tangents! :)

     

  • frestonfreston orensePosts: 521Member
    You are aware that rift has free server transfer, arent you? Give it a try on a rp server. Dont know why, but people tend to be more mature there.
  • Loke666Loke666 MalmöPosts: 17,962Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by FrodoFragins

    Very vague.  Bullied how?  Bullied by guildies  Bullied by people you grouped with?

    It can happen in any game you know.

    Of course it can but I can see why OP quit when it became too much.

    Personally is my advice to join a good guild and just turn off the OCC/general chat. If guildies act like that there are good mechanics since you can speak with an officer and have them either talk with the offender or just boot him. I lead a GW2 guild myself and we dont tolerate that kind of behavior.

  • majimaji ColognePosts: 1,995Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by JeroKane

    You have those idiots in every single game sadly.

    I agree. Though I think as well that the communities are more hostile, the younger the target audience is, and the more focused the game is on pvp.

    Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)

    Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,587Member Uncommon

    Why can I not help but think this has to do with a certina player who's character name starts with "I" and the intentional trolling that ensues?

    If this is related, I agree, it gets out of control and GMs need to get involved. It always escalates.

  • AusareAusare adamstown, MDPosts: 850Member
    Can not believe people these days are so weak willed that internet anonymous people can get to them. Ignore and report is fine. It is not like they are going to come beat you up.
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,587Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Ausare
    Can not believe people these days are so weak willed that internet anonymous people can get to them. Ignore and report is fine. It is not like they are going to come beat you up.

    If this is related to the situation I think it is, It goes beyond using ignore. It's pretty bad and the GMs really do need to get involved. And not just for the sake of the people involved but it really disrupts the entire community.

    If it isn't the same, then that means this is happening elsewhere too and that's even more reason, Trion needs to step in and passing out some temporary bans to send a message.

  • kevjardskevjards carlislePosts: 1,463Member
    when i first started lotro this happened to me ,but rather than quit i turned it on him/her.by broadcasting the name and linking evrything he was saying in /tells..he soon got the message when his kin warned him and tld by most members of the community to grow up..he did grow up and now we believe it or not we are friends..i dont know if he was having probs in RL,but he got the message.even if he was having trouble in RL you dont bring it into a game..never regretted stayingwith lotro.amazing game and also amazing community..laurelin server(rp)
  • Jerek_Jerek_ tulsa, OKPosts: 409Member
    Its hard to understand what the actual issue here is from this thread, but no matter what happened in a game I think its a mistake to let trolls push you out.  You could always make a new alt or use the transfer system to keep playing on a different server for a while, even change your characters name with it if you wanted.  Anyway, I hope you don't let trolls drive you away from something you enjoy, thats basically the ultimate victory for that kind of person.
  • BlackWatchBlackWatch OKC, OKPosts: 983Member

    The issue is pretty clear... the OP is sick/tired of the way that the community AND moderators allow the 'trade-chat-trash' to poison their games.

    We all know the types.

    Can I turn off trade-chat/general-chat/local-chat/city-chat?  Sure.  But... why?  So i can feel like I'm playing another single player game?  So I can miss out on people that are broadcasting and forming groups for activities? 

     

    Again, I would pay an extra $5 a month for a 'mature' server.  By 'mature', I mean, a server that's intended for 'adults' and is heavily policed by moderators. 

     

    image

  • Jerek_Jerek_ tulsa, OKPosts: 409Member
    Originally posted by BlackWatch

    The issue is pretty clear... the OP is sick/tired of the way that the community AND moderators allow the 'trade-chat-trash' to poison their games.

    We all know the types.

    Can I turn off trade-chat/general-chat/local-chat/city-chat?  Sure.  But... why?  So i can feel like I'm playing another single player game?  So I can miss out on people that are broadcasting and forming groups for activities? 

     

    Again, I would pay an extra $5 a month for a 'mature' server.  By 'mature', I mean, a server that's intended for 'adults' and is heavily policed by moderators. 

     

    It sounded like there was something more specific going on than that to me.  If its as simple as what you are saying then I guess he is out of luck.  if you can't handle that kind of thing, aren't willing to ignore it, and refuse to turn the channel off then you have decided to let trolls dictate your ability to enjoy a game.

  • ChannceChannce Sacramento, CAPosts: 570Member
    sorry you were bullied, i would have simply put those idiots on /ignore.  Sometimes i think an /allow list would be better than an /ignore tho.

    When I said i had "time", i meant virtual time, i got no RL "time" for you.

  • VirusDancerVirusDancer Brandon, FLPosts: 3,649Member

    If it's something that goes beyond what a simple ignore resolves, then it's obviously crossed over into the realm of harrassment.  At that point, it's a case of sending in the ticket.  If it's not resolved at that point, then it becomes a case of contacting customer service.  Again, if it's not addressed at that point - it's a case of contacting corporate.  There are many laws in place that a game company will not want to face the consequences of legal actions, both civil and criminal, in regard to such matters so they will address them...

    ...as long as that is what is actually taking place.

    I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?

    Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%

  • ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member

    This is not about how strong a persons willpower is.  This is about bullying in an online environment.  Does it matter if a strong willed person gets bullied?  Does that make it ok in your opinion?

     

    What about a person without the ability to balance willpower in that environment.  More and more people are subjected to this type of unwanted behavior everyday and if I am not mistaken, rules are being updated to curb this type of behavior down to the point of it being illegal.

     

    The idea of anonymously bullying another person and thinking well no one will ever know who they are.  Those days are long gone.  The recordkeeping and logging, current trends in tracking software can make it fairly easy to find the source.  Computer forensics has come a great deal of distance based on your current world trends and needs, for example, terrorism, money transfers, use of throw away phones.  Alll these things have capabilities now of being tracked and located.

     

    Its just a matter of time and up to the office that is responsible to ensure enforcement does happen. 

     

    Interesting concept you speak of though, that If I am making a dialogue then I am weak willed?   Would I be correct in how I read your statement?

     

      On what basis do you draw this conclusion?  I would like to know for reference only and I am in no way calling you out, if you dont feel comfortable replying here please send me a private message and we can dialogue in private but I would like to share the overal subject criteria of our conversation so other people could benefit from t his learning experience.

     

    On the note about coming to a person house to beat them up, that could happen, with todays technology it is not outside the realm of possibility an individual could use tools to identify a target and then attack them physically.  It has happened in the past several years,  main stream media has mention things like this.

     

  • ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member
    Originally posted by GeezerGamer

    Why can I not help but think this has to do with a certina player who's character name starts with "I" and the intentional trolling that ensues?

    If this is related, I agree, it gets out of control and GMs need to get involved. It always escalates.

    I understand your curiousness, everyone would love to know particulars but to do so would be in violation of my ethical viewpoints towards a persons privacy. 

     

    I have not contacted these individuals and have not asked for persmission to post trasnscripts or names of the offending parties plus, since Trion says they are investigating this, I do not want to tip off these people to that fact as well.  I would prefer to let them get caught in the act and dealt with in whatever way Trion deems necessary.

     

    I very much appreaciate your feedback on the subject matter and I can only say that there are plenty of occurrences in this past week alone that has been witnessed to or affected by this type of behavior.

     

     

    I think as a whole, the majority of people would not tolerate this behavior but heres the question for you if you dont mind, would you stop this behavior from happening to a total stranger on a server.  The scenario is this, you login, and right from the start you see the 1-29 chat or the 50 chat alive with commottion, people going back and forth and eventually you come to the conclusion they are targetting one person.    Now this one person is continually responding and of course the others are just baiting, you might see or two ringleaders trading shots but overall it is degrading to that invidual. 

     

    Now recognize that we know when someone is just being a troll to start something versus a person who is on the defensive.  The way to tell is by emotional responses vs abstract nonsense response.

     

    At least by my references that seems the way it goes.  If I am wrong or soemone else has a better explanation to recognize then please share with us.

     

    What would be your response and there really is no right or wrong answer and if you dont feel comfortable answering then I respect your decision.  

    Either case thank you very much for participating, I find these kinds of dialogues a learning experience for myself as well as others.

  • ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member

    Also,

     

    I would appreciate if a representative from Trion could comment on this and explain to us what controls are in place to keep this from happening to someone else?  Something other than the blanket statement of /report /ignore  or turning off channels.  Sure that hides it from someone that being offended but what about the person that has not been targetted yet?    What about the future customers and subscribers that are going to be subjected to this?

     

    These are mechanics in the game to handle offensive things, a bully operates outside these controls.    Personally from what my analysis on the past few months, this system should be upgraded to handle this type of behavior on a scale that is much faster than the current features.  I think those features are good for spammers.  Bots that put out data to a mass audience.

     

    What about a thinking, intelligent if you will person that is targtting specific people whether in PUGs, CQ, WF, gen chat etc.

     

    With the new exapansion coming out in Novemeber, I really would like assurances from Trion that this environment will be moderated to the extent it needs to be so the majority of the normal players are not subjected to this behavior, whether be the victim or the witness to it.

     

    Or dont respond and I will take that as Trion does not care to address it with a response.  In either case lack of a response is how we got here!  So keep that in mind ...

  • VirusDancerVirusDancer Brandon, FLPosts: 3,649Member
    Originally posted by Scarletgreen

    Also,

    I would appreciate if a representative from Trion could comment on this and explain to us what controls are in place to keep this from happening to someone else?

    .../snip...

    Or dont respond and I will take that as Trion does not care to address it with a response.  In either case lack of a response is how we got here!  So keep that in mind ...

    Um.... look around - this is MMORPG.com.  It's not forums.riftgame.com...

    I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?

    Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%

  • YansheeYanshee Panama City Beach, FLPosts: 55Member

    It's the internet. They 'bullied' or 'trolled' you, and you quit. They won.

    Over almost 9 years of SWG and several years and 30k pvp kills on my spy I've had everything from incoherant rants to outright death threats. I've got screen shots upon screen shots of dialog that would really curl your hair if a bit of "Rift bullying" got under your skin.

    They are simply just the impotent rantings of of a few socially crippled morons with nothing better to do but inflate their pathetic epeens by attempting to make you miserable, and guess what? It worked....

  • ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member

    When I look around I see my room.

     

    Trion and other game companies frequent review websites to watch for trends and changes.  Its a retail thing.

     

    If I was to post this on a Trion homepage it would be moved within hours, which is why most people come to review websites in order to get a full picture of a game.

     

    I also chose this venue since it has a high number of people from various games and I think most will agree this behaviour needs to be addressed on a larger scale.    I also like input from various people, we have a plethora of intelligence and concepts that can share without fear of being locked or moved in the interest of a company.

     

    The other reason is to give a consumer a review of what my experience was like and since several others see this as well could save someone else the trouble of going through this mess.

     

    How would you do it though, do you think posting on a review website is a good venue?  Any suggestions would be very much appreciated as I value everyones feedback, good or bad.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,587Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Scarletgreen
    Originally posted by GeezerGamer

    Why can I not help but think this has to do with a certina player who's character name starts with "I" and the intentional trolling that ensues?

    If this is related, I agree, it gets out of control and GMs need to get involved. It always escalates.

    I understand your curiousness, everyone would love to know particulars but to do so would be in violation of my ethical viewpoints towards a persons privacy. 

     

    I have not contacted these individuals and have not asked for persmission to post trasnscripts or names of the offending parties plus, since Trion says they are investigating this, I do not want to tip off these people to that fact as well.  I would prefer to let them get caught in the act and dealt with in whatever way Trion deems necessary.

     

    I very much appreaciate your feedback on the subject matter and I can only say that there are plenty of occurrences in this past week alone that has been witnessed to or affected by this type of behavior.

     

     

    I think as a whole, the majority of people would not tolerate this behavior but heres the question for you if you dont mind, would you stop this behavior from happening to a total stranger on a server.  The scenario is this, you login, and right from the start you see the 1-29 chat or the 50 chat alive with commottion, people going back and forth and eventually you come to the conclusion they are targetting one person.    Now this one person is continually responding and of course the others are just baiting, you might see or two ringleaders trading shots but overall it is degrading to that invidual. 

     

    Now recognize that we know when someone is just being a troll to start something versus a person who is on the defensive.  The way to tell is by emotional responses vs abstract nonsense response.

     

    At least by my references that seems the way it goes.  If I am wrong or soemone else has a better explanation to recognize then please share with us.

     

    What would be your response and there really is no right or wrong answer and if you dont feel comfortable answering then I respect your decision.  

    Either case thank you very much for participating, I find these kinds of dialogues a learning experience for myself as well as others.

    In no way Am I trying to dig to find out the dirt or low down on a prticular player. But what I have witnessed is a bad situation that is out of control and does need Trion to step in. It's not going to stop otherwise and it doesn't just impact those involved. It impacts everyone who has to see this nonsense.

     

    And for those who think that bullying in an MMO doesn't have real life consequences or is just as simple as putting someone on ignore.

    Try this one.

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/14/view/forums/thread/345119/New-EVE-drama-.html

  • munsil42munsil42 West Rutland, VTPosts: 80Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by GeezerGamer

    Why can I not help but think this has to do with a certina player who's character name starts with "I" and the intentional trolling that ensues?

    If this is related, I agree, it gets out of control and GMs need to get involved. It always escalates.

     

    Scary thing is the person you are thinking of is probably the same one as me....first person that popped in my head too.

    image
  • ScarletgreenScarletgreen somewhere, NYPosts: 21Member
    Originally posted by Yanshee

    It's the internet. They 'bullied' or 'trolled' you, and you quit. They won.

    Over almost 9 years of SWG and several years and 30k pvp kills on my spy I've had everything from incoherant rants to outright death threats. I've got screen shots upon screen shots of dialog that would really curl your hair if a bit of "Rift bullying" got under your skin.

    They are simply just the impotent rantings of of a few socially crippled morons with nothing better to do but inflate their pathetic epeens by attempting to make you miserable, and guess what? It worked....

    Good point, but I quit because I felt the company Trion was not doing enough to protect people from bullying behavior overall.

    This wasnt just me, this is a course of a week only and witnessing this happen to several people.  Reports were filed, screenshots, etc.  The offending players continued right on.   I have seen GM as they are called log in and pose Q/A to players so I know they can log in and see this same stuff happening.

     

    The point I am trying to make is enough is enough already.  And you good sir deserve much better treatment than what you received and I feel it has affected you.  I can read it in your words.    Yoda would say, so much pain there is!

     

    Negativity of any form should never be the answer or response to such things.  That can only lead to more anger, more aggression, fear, etc. 

     

    I think your worth more than those words because you cared enough to respond and provide a pick me up, and I appreciate that, I really do.  But remember, 2 negative things do not make 1 right thing.

     

    If I were to take a mold and filled that mold with clay, if I applied too much pressure, and was too abrasive with it, my final product would come out broken, shattered, defective, it would not hold fruit or water successfully.  IT would be a bad foundation.

     

    The only way we can get to a good foundation is recognizing where the problems are and fixing those problems so our future does not repeate our past mistakes.

     

    I am not sure if I heard that from a movie, maybe it was Star Wars but yeah Spies rock man and I salute you.

     

  • VirusDancerVirusDancer Brandon, FLPosts: 3,649Member
    Originally posted by Scarletgreen

     

    How would you do it though, do you think posting on a review website is a good venue?  Any suggestions would be very much appreciated as I value everyones feedback, good or bad.

    I already outlined the steps that one would normally take in such a situation in this very thread...

    Stating that if Trion does not respond to a post you made here, that you will fabricate a reply on their behalf - well, seriously?

    There still have been absolutely no details about the bullying situation, but to an extent - those do not really matter.  It's a subjective thing - what Person A might see as bulying may not be bullying to Person B.

    One can view the RIFT CoC/ToS here: http://www.trionworlds.com/en/legal/terms-of-use

    Here's a snippet on chat/interaction...

    B. Rules Related to "Chat" and Interaction With Other Users

    Communicating on the Site, in a Game or through the Service with other users and Trion representatives, whether by text, voice or any other method, (collectively, “Chat”) is an integral part of the Game and the Service.

    You understand that, by using the Chat features, you may be exposed to communications (including in written, verbal, electronic, digital, machine-readable or other form) that you might find objectionable. You understand that any content sent or appearing through a Chat feature is the sole responsibility of the individual(s) transmitting such content. This means that you, and not Trion, are entirely responsible for all content that you transmit. Under no circumstances will Trion or its third party providers be liable for any errors or omissions in any content or for any loss or damages of any kind incurred as a result of the access to, downloading, viewing, listening, use of or inability to use any content, including User Content.

    When engaging in Chat, you may not:

    1. Transmit or post any content or language which, in the sole and absolute discretion of Trion, is deemed to be offensive, including without limitation content or language that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, hateful, sexually explicit, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable, nor may you use a misspelling or an alternative spelling to circumvent the content and language restrictions listed above;
    2. Carry out any action with a disruptive effect, such as intentionally causing the Chat screen to scroll faster than other users are able to read, or setting up macros with large amounts of text that, when used, can have a disruptive effect on the normal flow of Chat;
    3. Disrupt the normal flow of dialogue in Chat or otherwise act in a manner that negatively affects other users, including without limitation posting commercial solicitations and/or advertisements for goods and services available outside of the Game universe;
    4. Sending repeated unsolicited or unwelcome messages to a single user or repeatedly posting similar messages in a Chat area, including without limitation continuous advertisements to sell goods or services;
    5. Communicate or post any user's personal information in the Game, or on websites or forums related to the Game, except that a user may communicate his or her own personal information in a private message directed to a single user;
    6. Harass, threaten, stalk, embarrass or cause distress, unwanted attention or discomfort to any user of the Game or the Site;
    7. Participate in any action that, in the sole and absolute opinion of Trion, results or may result in an authorized user of the Game or the Site being "scammed" or defrauded out of gold, weapons, armor, or any other items that user has earned through authorized game play in the Game (including but not limited to participation in player-run casinos, including those that utilize the roll mechanic); or
    8. Impersonate any real person, including without limitation any "game master" or any other Trion agent or employee, nor may you communicate in the Game, or on the Site or Service in any way designed to make others believe that your message constitutes a Server message or was otherwise posted by any Trion agent or employee.
    It's pretty straightforward - the standard, if you will.  So if you feel that 10.B.1 and 10.B.6 have been violated - I would go through what I suggested earlier in the thread.
     
    You may have to accept though, that what you feel is bullying - does not qualify as bullying - based on industry and legal standards....

    I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?

    Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%

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