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Why Are People Upset About GW2's Overwhelming Success?

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  • PsychowPsychow SF Giants Territory, CAPosts: 1,784Member
    Originally posted by BadSpock

    Yeah, people on MMORPG.com (myself included at times probably) have been dog'n on WoW for 8 years about how it's "dying" and how much it sucks - yet it likely still has more subs in the West than every other Western MMO combined.

    It's cool/edgy/fun to be against the big guys - sticking it to the man, avoiding the "mainstream" because you're too cool for what's popular... or something.

    I don't know, I'm old enough to not give two shits and I just play and enjoy and praise the games I like.

    But, got to admit, it is fun to dog on games I find extremely lackluster - it's only human to get that feeling of "wow that is so obviously bad/terrible how can these people like this? I MUST try and help/educate them on why I'm right and they are wrong."

    We're all just human...

     

    I thought you were half human and half Vulcan.

  • TheIronLegionTheIronLegion Columbia, SCPosts: 269Member
    Originally posted by Krytycal
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    Originally posted by Krytycal
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    maybe mmorpg.com is where these people congregate, which would explain the frequency of such strange threads, maybe it's their alts posting. but why would you be MAD about it bros? the game is epic, and even when u look at it completely objectively, at the very least it's above the average. 

    That's exactly the problem. The game is an above average themepark MMORPG, but people (including ANET) keep painting it like it's the Obama of the MMO genre when in reality it's just a different take on the same old, I mean, at least Obama was black.

    People don't like being lied to.

    no one is being lied to. the game delivered exactly what was promised. if not more. and it is the Obama of MMo's, to be perfectly honest. u cant deny that it's bringing huge change to the genre and setting the bar. just DE's on their own will require future competition to ditch the traditional questing system entirely, or be horribly ridiculed. 

    I guess that's where I and the fans disagree. I don't think GW2 introduces as many new major features as you think it does. DEs are not new considering they were major features in WAR and Rift, and many MMOs have used them in the past. I did my first "Dynamic Events" in CoH back in 2004-2005 with alien invasions. Again, not new. 

    Personally I think the only major element GW2 introduced was the lack of trinity. ANET went with mostly safe and familiar for everything else.

    I think you did something "like" a dynamic event, but not a dynamic event. Rifts in Rift were not dynamic events. They spawned up at location X and x amount of mobs came out. It didn't scale to the amount of people there so massive zergs could face roll them. Sure there were different sized rifts, but if you were alone or with a small group you were screwed. I think most people are confusing "events" with "Dynamic Events" in that events happen either at a set interval, or are planned to happen. Dynamic events (though are obviously planned as nothing can be truly dynamic) happen because something caused it to happen. Bandits rallied together and raided a farm, because they wanted the resources there; Charr are raiding a flame legion camp, because the flame legion attempted to invade their territory first. The NPC's and players do things for a reason and those things chain out (butterfly effect) into more events. It's quite interesting to watch.

    I don't remember closing a rift and then having that chain into something else. You just closed it and said "gg". Now if you didn't close it they went and took over whatever was close to them but thats as far as it went and there was very little reason for it other than that they were the bad guys.

    image

  • krakra70krakra70 karakas, IDPosts: 122Member
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    maybe mmorpg.com is where these people congregate, which would explain the frequency of such strange threads, maybe it's their alts posting. but why would you be MAD about it bros? the game is epic, and even when u look at it completely objectively, at the very least it's above the average. 

    What overwhelming success? The game has already peaked 8 days after its release. It's all downhill from here on.

  • Grimlock426Grimlock426 Sacramento, CAPosts: 159Member
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    Originally posted by Psychow
    Originally posted by SuperDonk

    Is GW2 really an overwhelming success though? Give it at leat another 3 or 4 months before declaring it one.

     

    That being said, I think many of us found the game to be dry, boring, and lacking in many ways. So while it might be a success to fans of the game, and possibly the accountants at Anet (but again, its too early to tell), the game is not the one to rule them all that many claimed before launch and still claim to this day.

     

    I was thinking the same thing. I'm already seeing guildies log on less and less and less.

    that speaks nothing to the quality of the game. they either 1) powerleveled so they could "end game" like all the other cool people, skipping 70% of the content, or 2) they didnt like the game to begin with, not doing their research, and buying the game anyways. 

    You're being absurd.  I can give two examples of people I know, one has quit already and one is on the verge.  In the case of my friend who quit, he knew everything about the game and was eagerly looking forward to it, and the other is my wife who knew very little but went in with an open mind and wanted to like it.  In neither case did they power-level.  They both just found it boring and repetitive and not the savior they were looking for. 

    It's funny how blindly devoted some fans are that they can't possibly see who someone can not like a game unless they MUST BE PLAYING IT WRONG  or they wanted to dislike it from the start.   LOL!

  • IcewhiteIcewhite Elmhurst, ILPosts: 6,403Member
    Originally posted by smh_alot
    - if you hate a game that I hate, then you're a smart and intelligent critic

     

    - if you love a game that I hate, then you're a blind, delusional fanboi or a shill

     

    - if you love a game that I love, then you show good taste and are a true MMO gamer

     

    - if you hate a game that I love, then you're a bitter, smallminded hater and not a true lover of MMO's.

    -If you express no preference at all, one will be assigned to you (usually by the forum you're inhabiting at the moment).

    Not sure why attacking men constructed of straw is so appealing to so many people, but there it is.

    Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  • tank017tank017 Glendale, CAPosts: 2,192Member
    Id say WoW is an "overwhelming success"...GW2 has been out a couple weeks.With this mentality Rift,ToR,War,AoC, were overwhelming successes as well.
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,586Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Ponico
    Originally posted by GeezerGamer Feature "A" was promised and delivered. Even though it was in fact delivered, thus justifying the claim that it would be in the game, the end result is that feature A was supposed to change the game, but in the end, when you open the fancy packaging, it's still just a tie on father's day. It still doesn't change the fact that many people still feel (That's the key word) lied to.
    You know, for once, I "feel" that a company stayed very close to their claims, hype and promises. Everything that was said about GW2 is there in one form or the other. 

    Take SWTOR for example. There was some freaking features on the box that we're not even in the game at release lol. 

    Just imagine the guy that buys the game only to realize that 45% of the box is description is lying... 


    ArenaNet has done a remarkable job trying to maintain their integrity and stay true to their promices. I will give Kudos for that.

    But, the hype for this game brought the definition of ridiculous to new levels. And all the lines that defined GW2's features became blurred and distorted. And if someone dared interject a levelheaded "Hey wait a minute" opinion, they were squelched. In the end, I think it was the hype train that lead to the recent rash of negative posts. And ultimately, this makes ArenaNet a bit of a victim as well.

  • rygard49rygard49 Huntington Beach, CAPosts: 975Member

    For many on this forum, arrogance breeds discontent. In my opinion, none have been more arrogant about their game than GW2 fans. A statement such as, "If you don't like this game, you're doing it wrong." is the very definition of an arrogant fan taking an overzealous stance about a subjective experience.

    Success? In the short term, yes. Overwhelming success? There's that arrogance again.

    I don't think people are really upset about the success or failure of the game. I think people are just rubbed the wrong way by fans screaming nanananabooboo at the top of their lungs.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,586Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Psychow
    Originally posted by BadSpock Yeah, people on MMORPG.com (myself included at times probably) have been dog'n on WoW for 8 years about how it's "dying" and how much it sucks - yet it likely still has more subs in the West than every other Western MMO combined. It's cool/edgy/fun to be against the big guys - sticking it to the man, avoiding the "mainstream" because you're too cool for what's popular... or something. I don't know, I'm old enough to not give two shits and I just play and enjoy and praise the games I like. But, got to admit, it is fun to dog on games I find extremely lackluster - it's only human to get that feeling of "wow that is so obviously bad/terrible how can these people like this? I MUST try and help/educate them on why I'm right and they are wrong." We're all just human...
     

    I thought you were half human and half Vulcan.



    He's only showing us his bad side
    (See what I did there?)
  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member
    Originally posted by tank017
    Id say WoW is an "overwhelming success"...GW2 has been out a couple weeks.With this mentality Rift,ToR,War,AoC, were overwhelming successes as well.

    it took RIFT 3 months to sell 1 million units but otherwise i agree w you

    http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/07/rift-approaching-the-one-million-sell-through-mark/

     

  • TheSkimDotNetTheSkimDotNet Pittsburgh, INPosts: 274Member
    Is this another baiting thread? If you bait they will come. And they have.

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  • MMOwandererMMOwanderer LisbonPosts: 415Member
    Originally posted by Brizlyn

    I am MORE curious as to why people who don't like the game feel the need to go to the GW2 forums and bash the game.  If not bash, then express their negative take on the game.  Is it to make themselves feel better about what they feel was a bad purchase?

    I just move onto the next thing.

    A few games I ended up ditching were WOW (in first 2 months) and SWTOR (after 3 months).  Never once did I feel the need to go to those forums to express the reasons I didn't like the games.  I made the buy, I lived with the result.  Many people like those games, so be it.

    For some reason on these forums though, we have a lot of people who take time out of their lives to put down a game that is obviously already hugely popular and liked by many.  I don't think this is limited to GW2 in any way.

    I agree with the OP on this one, it's an interesting phenomenon and seems strange someone would spend their time focusing more on the negative rather than just moving on.

     

    -briz

    It's a forum for discussion.

    What you see as "bashing" is people stating what they feel is wrong with the game and it's features/mechanics.

    Also, we are gamers. We want good games to actually play. We want innovation, something that's different, good quality, etc.

    GW2 matches that for you? That's great, then go play it. We're not here bashing. We are having discussions. Are most of them negative? Probably, but then again, to many, an actually good mmorpg as yet to arrive.

    Many here await Archeage, like myself, for the possible long awaited sandbox. If it works, we'll be too busy playing aswell. Until then, we also like to talk about the genre, what we think is wrong, what could be better, etc.

    But hey, it's not like tons of mmos are failing, closing down, loosing money, merging servers, not having long lasting appeal, and could go on.

    Of course, it's just hating and bashing with no foundation. I like to post and comment on positive and negative topics. That is why i signed up.

  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by rygard49

    For many on this forum, arrogance breeds discontent. In my opinion, none have been more arrogant about their game than GW2 fans. A statement such as, "If you don't like this game, you're doing it wrong." is the very definition of an arrogant fan taking an overzealous stance about a subjective experience.

    Success? In the short term, yes. Overwhelming success? There's that arrogance again.

    I don't think people are really upset about the success or failure of the game. I think people are just rubbed the wrong way by fans screaming nanananabooboo at the top of their lungs.

    I can certainly agree with that sentiment.  However, I don't think the majority of the millions of people enjoying GW2 care what a "hater" thinks.  Some do but most don't.  They are too busy playing and enjoying the game.  I certainly don't care about the feelings of an insect I squash and that is exactly the way I see a hater.  Makes a buzzing noise and certainly can be a nuisance, but I bought some raid.

     

    Edit:  Oh oh...that came off as a bit arrogant.

  • SlampigSlampig Chantilly, VAPosts: 2,376Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    Originally posted by Krytycal
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    maybe mmorpg.com is where these people congregate, which would explain the frequency of such strange threads, maybe it's their alts posting. but why would you be MAD about it bros? the game is epic, and even when u look at it completely objectively, at the very least it's above the average. 

    That's exactly the problem. The game is an above average themepark MMORPG, but people (including ANET) keep painting it like it's the Obama of the MMO genre when in reality it's just a different take on the same old, I mean, at least Obama was black.

    People don't like being lied to.

    no one is being lied to. the game delivered exactly what was promised. if not more. and it is the Obama of MMo's, to be perfectly honest. u cant deny that. 

    Seeing the track record of Obama these past years I am not sure I would want people comparing my game to that pile of s**t.

    I think people are upset that the game really, at the core, has not changed much. They say they got rid of quest hubs, well, just run to the next heart on your map. That heart not only replaces the exclamation point but it is in essence a quest hub. They said dynamic events would have an impact. How can they have an impact when you can stand  there and do the same ones over and  over?

    You can use different words to cover up the fact that you are rehashing the same old thing, kind of like unemployment dropped for one month and that is a great sign that the economy is picking up, until you see that for the past 43 months unemployment has not fallen under 8%, although it was promised by Obama that it would.

    I guess in that sense then yes, GW2 IS the Obama of the MMO world.

    Add in the fact of the hacking problems and it is no wonder some people are not singing the praises. You just need to be a little open minded and you will see these problems for what they are. You will also see these people as not attacking the game but raising concerns that are legit.

    Then again after dealing with this community I am not holding out hope that anyone of them could be unbiased OR open minded...

    That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  • Requiem1066Requiem1066 londonPosts: 274Member

    Ofc you also have people who don't hate the game but find it highly amusing to windup and make fun of people who make threads such as this, purely because they find the reactions humerous ..

     

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  • GoldenArrowGoldenArrow TurkuPosts: 1,187Member

    GW2 is popular for all the wrong reasons.

    It wowifies the genre even further while also bringing the "Buy everything through RMT" to western mmorpgs.

     

    The genre is getting WORSE and WORSE by the minute.

  • MMOwandererMMOwanderer LisbonPosts: 415Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by rygard49
     

    I can certainly agree with that sentiment.  However, I don't think the majority of the millions of people enjoying GW2 care what a "hater" thinks.  Some do but most don't.  They are too busy playing and enjoying the game.  I certainly don't care about the feelings of an insect I squash and that is exactly the way I see a hater.  Makes a buzzing noise and certainly can be a nuisance, but I bought some raid.

    The majority of people playing all mmorpgs don't care for either haters or fanboys or forum discussions. Regardless, the games still have their own flaws, problems, not so awesome features, and failing to generate profit. What's your point?

    We're here to discuss and debate. Welcome to the internet. If people only see these things as mindless bash and hate fests, that's their problem.

     

  • TheIronLegionTheIronLegion Columbia, SCPosts: 269Member
    Originally posted by krakra70
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    maybe mmorpg.com is where these people congregate, which would explain the frequency of such strange threads, maybe it's their alts posting. but why would you be MAD about it bros? the game is epic, and even when u look at it completely objectively, at the very least it's above the average. 

    What overwhelming success? The game has already peaked 8 days after its release. It's all downhill from here on.

    peaked according to who? you?

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  • KellerKeller UtrechtPosts: 254Member
    Originally posted by rygard49

    For many on this forum, arrogance breeds discontent. In my opinion, none have been more arrogant about their game than GW2 fans. A statement such as, "If you don't like this game, you're doing it wrong." is the very definition of an arrogant fan taking an overzealous stance about a subjective experience.

    Success? In the short term, yes. Overwhelming success? There's that arrogance again.

    I don't think people are really upset about the success or failure of the game. I think people are just rubbed the wrong way by fans screaming nanananabooboo at the top of their lungs.

    I agree with this. The most used word was "innovating". Then they list some innovating features and let me repeat those:

    • Downed State : seen in Darkfall
    • Dynamic Events : seen in Rift (and even in some way the worldbosses on pvp servers in WoW)
    • Dodging : seen in TERA
    • Manual Aiming : seen in TERA and Darkfall (and what I heard from guildies is that most attacks are tab targetted in GW2)
    Okay maybe the removal of the "Holy Trinity". But hey in Darkfall you would use your self-heal and never really relied on dedicated healers. 
     
    Guildwars 2 a good game. Yes, I believe so. Enough players are enjoying it. The savior of the mmo-industry? Don't know. GW2 is certainly not aiming at me. Maybe it could have lured me in like 4 years ago. Now I look for different features, more sanbox and less themepark:
     
    • World PvP, no lobby pvp (like arenas)
    • Player Housing or Guild Halls (cities)
    • Niche character builds
    • Friendly Fire
    • Manual Aiming
    • Limited amount of resources (players/guilds have to fight for good locations)
    So maybe you understand now why I am passing on GW2 or at least waiting till it is 5 euro in the discount-bin.
     
  • Bad.dogBad.dog Belleville, ONPosts: 1,108Member
    Originally posted by rygard49

    For many on this forum, arrogance breeds discontent. In my opinion, none have been more arrogant about their game than GW2 fans. A statement such as, "If you don't like this game, you're doing it wrong." is the very definition of an arrogant fan taking an overzealous stance about a subjective experience.

    Success? In the short term, yes. Overwhelming success? There's that arrogance again.

    I don't think people are really upset about the success or failure of the game. I think people are just rubbed the wrong way by fans screaming nanananabooboo at the top of their lungs.

    LOL I've actually seen that said to folks but it was in the TSW forums ...I' don't understand why someone who doesn't play GW2 would care what was said one way or the other .If the op posted  in some others game forums it might be a debate and a little arrogant ...but posting in GW2 forums about GW2 seems normal enough for me .

  • Angier2758Angier2758 Mt. Prospect, ILPosts: 1,011Member
    Originally posted by TheIronLegion
    Originally posted by krakra70
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    maybe mmorpg.com is where these people congregate, which would explain the frequency of such strange threads, maybe it's their alts posting. but why would you be MAD about it bros? the game is epic, and even when u look at it completely objectively, at the very least it's above the average. 

    What overwhelming success? The game has already peaked 8 days after its release. It's all downhill from here on.

    peaked according to who? you?

     Kraka has an agenda keep in mind; screams of shill or a player who has an axe to grind.

  • The_KorriganThe_Korrigan EastPosts: 2,630Member
    Originally posted by Jyiiga
    I have real theory for you. These boards are populated with a lot of niche gamers. Gamers that enjoy things like Darkfall or Mortal Online (etc). Many of these gamers are hurt that their game of choice has the population of Monowi Nebraska. So they come here and find a highly successful game, a game that does not fit their idea of a good game and bash it. 

    I missed that gem on first read.

    Jyiiga obviously won the thread :)

    If you wonder why I don't answer your posts, it's most likely because you are on my block list - so don't waste your time.

    image

  • ZigZagsZigZags Modesto, CAPosts: 328Member
    Originally posted by sonoggi
    maybe mmorpg.com is where these people congregate, which would explain the frequency of such strange threads, maybe it's their alts posting. but why would you be MAD about it bros? the game is epic, and even when u look at it completely objectively, at the very least it's above the average. 

    You're right, its "above average" but its not "EPIC" the game just came out and you're still drunk. Even I said SWTOR was "epic" 4 weeks in and so did SOOOOOOOO many others....but it actually was the worst ever. So ya. Take a breathe, remove this post and reconsider reposting it after 3 months.

    Now: Skyrim
    Later: ?
    Played: M59, UO, EQ, Runescape, DAOC, SB, EQ2, WoW, EVE, Darkfall, AoC, FFXI, FFXIV, WAR, SWTOR
    BOYCOTTING: EA/BioWare/Origin/SOE

  • koljanekoljane BelgradePosts: 127Member Uncommon

    When you compare GW1 and GW2 and take yers in the middle you cant realy say GW2 is EPIC.

    Only thing that is EPIC about GW2 is the man power and marketing used to fool ppl and misled them. 

    I have newer ever saw such a HYPE about any MMORPG and brutal attitude of the web sites (MMORPG is included) that literaly band anyone who said anything bad about GW2, that were making so much articles only giving + and not a single - to a game.

    Game is generaly Good and only better then GW1 and Aion and that is a true fact.

    There is nothing new or revolutionary in it. 

    ONE fact:

    80% you spend in combat while playing the game and on that field there is nothing new, not only that everything has beed seen in any other MMORPG but it have lot of flaws even there.

    People say WOW made standard in there cause it was the only game so it was easy to put standard even that is not good?? OK, fair enough. But why after almost 8 years no one made combat system better that much that we can call it EPIC or revolutionary.

    From my point only TERA made interesting combat system and Secret World made big freedom in aranging your playstyle, but no one gave big colums about that at all.

    Now about braking holy trinity..... seriously !!!

    We have: Tank, Healer and DPS

    GW2 made big break and have: Control, Support and DPS and how we call that?????

    In holy trinity you realy have a roll in their revolutionary system you have headles chicken that is bouncing trough the party (like when your tank is dead and mobs are running around and killing the rest of the party).

    Basicly, everyone have a self heal, everyone is tank, dps and support and you need to keep YOURESLF not to be hit and rez the guy next to you for the 7th time during the fight cause he cant move from fire.

    If you exclude PvP you realy do not need to be part of any group do do things in game even in party in dungeon you feel that you must only take care about yourself.

    I cant call that a good thing but that is my personal opinion.

     

  • rygard49rygard49 Huntington Beach, CAPosts: 975Member
    Originally posted by Bad.dog
    Originally posted by rygard49

    For many on this forum, arrogance breeds discontent. In my opinion, none have been more arrogant about their game than GW2 fans. A statement such as, "If you don't like this game, you're doing it wrong." is the very definition of an arrogant fan taking an overzealous stance about a subjective experience.

    Success? In the short term, yes. Overwhelming success? There's that arrogance again.

    I don't think people are really upset about the success or failure of the game. I think people are just rubbed the wrong way by fans screaming nanananabooboo at the top of their lungs.

    LOL I've actually seen that said to folks but it was in the TSW forums ...I' don't understand why someone who doesn't play GW2 would care what was said one way or the other .If the op posted  in some others game forums it might be a debate and a little arrogant ...but posting in GW2 forums about GW2 seems normal enough for me .

    I actually come to the forums here because I'm interested in the game and it's success, as well as the enjoyment of some of the debates here. I go to other game forums as well, for the same reason. Interest and enjoyment.

    And yes, I've seen GW2 fans in other game forums saying, "your game is subpar, GW2 is amazing because..." That's bound to draw folks from that forum here, and vice versa. Happens all the time.

This discussion has been closed.