Do all of you rift players forget that trion has not charged anything since release for all the content, features , ember isle ect. they have added?
..The 15 bucks a month you have been paying has gone to the updates and content you have been getting for the last year.Isnt that what your paying for?
I guarantee any other mmo would have charged you for all the content, feature updates.
Give me a break there asking 40 and if im correct this also includes the entire base game includes new players with 30 free days. So subtract 15 from 40 for the free month you pay 25 bucks.
After that im sure all content added for the next 6 month to a year will be your hard earned 15 dollars a month at work.
Rift players aren't the onse complaining, it's everyone who cries about why they don't play.
Most Rift players have a great releationship with Devs and Gms, often conversing with them on the TC. They care, and will always have me as a customer.
Do all of you rift players forget that trion has not charged anything since release for all the content, features , ember isle ect. they have added?
..The 15 bucks a month you have been paying has gone to the updates and content you have been getting for the last year.Isnt that what your paying for?
I guarantee any other mmo would have charged you for all the content, feature updates.
Give me a break there asking 40 and if im correct this also includes the entire base game includes new players with 30 free days. So subtract 15 from 40 for the free month you pay 25 bucks.
After that im sure all content added for the next 6 month to a year will be your hard earned 15 dollars a month at work.
Rift players aren't the onse complaining, it's everyone who cries about why they don't play.
Most Rift players have a great releationship with Devs and Gms, often conversing with them on the TC. They care, and will always have me as a customer.
Agreed. We have chats with the GMs in game all the time, they actually give a shit. The game has come a long long way from release,as a matter of fact I hated it then, now I think it s the best on the market.
That being said, all I was stating is that, for what this game is going up against (which is a HOST, a GANG of new quality F2P games by the end of the year), creating an xpac and remaining a P2P game (which is already a tough market to stay solid in), the price point is a bit dubious to me.
The xpac looks decent, but I just don't agree with that price point in an almost P2P-less market..
Because Trion is not going the micro transaction route right now. Top quality games not bleeding subscribers at an astounding rate are going to stay with the business model that has worked since UO in 1997 (People called Origin crazy thinking people would pay 9.99 a month for a game, uh ya...)
Rift earns every penny from me, because they release new material about every 8 or 9 weeks, give or take a few. This would not be possible without a monthly fee.
What is this slew of F2P games you are speaking of? GW2 which I also play, and which is a wonderful game with a huge world to explore, will not be able to provide the updates like Rift can. They will have to release it all in an expansion to recover costs. The cash shop will also bring in revenue, who knows how successful that will be.
If you want an MMO to live and breath, it needs income to survive, no way WOW or Rift can provide the level of service they now offer in a F2P model. No way.......
If you are Wow you can charge that much, if you are Rift, you are overpricing it. And no you should not have to pay for the expansion, you pay a sub fee to play.
Anyways, give me Eve any day in the week, never charged for any expansions ever.
Really? Are you positive? Are Trion employees supposed to post info like that on this website? You are a trion Employee, right? You must be if you are so sure what is right for them.
Originally posted by fivoroth Now people want xpacs for free? Dont know what to say. Thats just pathetic.
For free? What have I been paying for?
Originally posted by firewater4176
Do all of you rift players forget that trion has not charged anything since release for all the content, features , ember isle ect. they have added?
..The 15 bucks a month you have been paying has gone to the updates and content you have been getting for the last year.Isnt that what your paying for?
I guarantee any other mmo would have charged you for all the content, feature updates.
Give me a break there asking 40 and if im correct this also includes the entire base game includes new players with 30 free days. So subtract 15 from 40 for the free month you pay 25 bucks.
After that im sure all content added for the next 6 month to a year will be your hard earned 15 dollars a month at work.
They have been charging me a monthly fee. They have offered around $45 or so in additional rmt additional content in the form of account upgrades and special mounts. Since I'm an existing subscriber I don't get an additional month or anything else. I just get to pay $40 in addition to the nearly $300 I've already spent. By the way, new players pay $50 not $40.
It's a good game, but P2P seems to have died with Lineage. Now it's P2P + xpac fees + additional content. What more do I want? I want a straight forward payment model. If it is cash shop and micro transaction supported fine. If it is P2P then fine. But don't try and double dip with both.
You can tell my why I should throw my money at it all you want, but it gets the pass from me. When my account expires then I'm done and done with subscriptions.
you really should take an economics class or two. Rift isnt charging because they can, its because they have to.
Because Trion is not going the micro transaction route right now.
Hartsman said they have consider it. Its coming. But he also said that the money will be put back into the game. And I believe him. I also think SoE puts the cash shop money back into the game too. When you have the sub numbers Rift has, P2P just isnt enough to keep full support.
Do all of you rift players forget that trion has not charged anything since release for all the content, features , ember isle ect. they have added?
..The 15 bucks a month you have been paying has gone to the updates and content you have been getting for the last year.Isnt that what your paying for?
I guarantee any other mmo would have charged you for all the content, feature updates.
Give me a break there asking 40 and if im correct this also includes the entire base game includes new players with 30 free days. So subtract 15 from 40 for the free month you pay 25 bucks.
After that im sure all content added for the next 6 month to a year will be your hard earned 15 dollars a month at work.
Rift players aren't the onse complaining, it's everyone who cries about why they don't play.
Most Rift players have a great releationship with Devs and Gms, often conversing with them on the TC. They care, and will always have me as a customer.
Agreed. We have chats with the GMs in game all the time, they actually give a shit. The game has come a long long way from release,as a matter of fact I hated it then, now I think it s the best on the market.
Yea i meant to say ex rift players the ones who enjoy rift arent complaining oops my bad!
Not a very competitive expansion price for a P2P mmo trying to survive in an otherwise F2P landscape..
I'm sure this was not meant for new players, so perhaps they will rely on the dedicated base to support this.. If they fail to, RIFT may be following in the SWTOR footsteps in the near future.
LOL! Have you seen the expansion prices of LOTRO? Or DDO for that matter?
And Turbine delivered and still delivers way less than what this expac offers.
LOTRO Mines of Moria expac was the only expansion worth it's money. Every expac after that has been lackluster and ridiculously overpriced.
That was true when they were still P2P though and not just F2P. Turbine gouged for crappy content when they were still sub based and continued their shoddy philosophy into F2P. The difference is that with RIFT long time loyal customers paid $50+ for the game plus all the sub fees and now they have to pay some more? Either the sub model can provide sufficient revenue or it can't, but enough with the double dipping. I can justify paying $50 a year for an expac and a few bucks for some game cash when I don't pay a service monthly, but when I pay them $10 - $15/mo then no way.
If TRION wants to drop their sub fee then I'll be one of the first to pick up the xpac in their account shop or if they want to provide all the content for the sub fee then I would remain subscribed. Not both.
It has always been like that!
Mines of Moria was $50 at that time when LOTRO was still P2P.
EverQuest 2 has always charged $40-$50 dollars for their yearly expansions on EQ1/EQ2 !
WoW always and still does charge $40 dollars for their expansions.
TRION doesn't do anything different here. They actually do better.
They have delivered a ton of free content updates since launch and now they launch an expansion that will more than double the size of the entire game world.
That more than justifies as a paid expansion in my eyes.
Originally posted by Vyeth Games like Lotro, that went F2P, can sustain themselves off of xpac prices because the core game is free. Guild Wars could sustain itself off of addons (even though each one was its own game theoretically) because there was no monthly fee..
Core game is free in LOTRO? Since when? There are few free areas(starting for each race + lone lands) but every other will send you to store. Same for every expansion - moria, mirkwood and isengard. Add crafting guilds, mount, bags, currency cap, trait slots and you paid quite some for the core free game.
Even if you had bought the core game bfore FTP you didn't get access to all the other areas. It's the reason I stopped playing it. Dumb payment system.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Because Trion is not going the micro transaction route right now.
Hartsman said they have consider it. Its coming. But he also said that the money will be put back into the game. And I believe him. I also think SoE puts the cash shop money back into the game too. When you have the sub numbers Rift has, P2P just isnt enough to keep full suppored
Please don't take one comment out of context, Scott said in that same interview they have NO plans in going that route. There is nothing wrong with how they currently bill, it is not gonna change, it works.
Seriously guys? Paying for expansions is something new, unexpected and even offensive? TBH I'd rather pay TRION twice as much than buy next WoW expansion. They have great devs, they are social people, they push out a lot of good content, events and even sometimes do the events with the players. I have a title for playing in charity event, I have a hat that you could anly get at events and in special promotion... I have a title for killing a dev:D Also, you have a FREE mobile app with loot that goes to your in-game mailbox, you can play any of your 20- characters even if you don't sub (and even if you had a sub before), you have a simple wardrobe system that doesnt force you to merge items together etc etc. The x-pac comes with 2 times the size of landmass added, one new tree for each class, housing system, epic gigantic enemies roaming the land... TBH even after playing GW2 I can't wait for Storm Legion. That said I hope it will be stand-alone for new players. WoW's way of expac on an expac on an expac is really confusing for new peeps and Blizz JUST discovered that (geniuses!).
Shrug.. Of course this conversation is going places.. I was not referring to past xpacs of past games when the market was different.. Hell I remember paying this much for my many Everquest xpacs.. Not bashing anyone for enjoying Rift.. Not bashing anyone for paying whatever they want to play Rift.. Not telling anyone they can't buy.. Not telling anyone they cannot play.. I was expressing my opinion based on the current situation in the P2P market, that if I was the CEO over at Trion, I would have thought prices differently..
Just like that little game over at Heatwave Interactive that chose to go P2P and even charge for a box.. People argued that "it was normal" , this that and a third, but the fact that remained and what was the ultimate factor in whether the game sank or swam was exactly that..
I am not bashing anyone who spent money on Gods And Heroes, not even telling them that they were wrong for showing their support.. My opinion was, that the game was not going to fare well in the market at that price point..
Akin to being an armchair coach during football season and seeing a bad play unfold, calling a fumble or interception before the ball is even hiked.. I may be wrong, but it is my opinion..
Call me cheap, stupid, a leftist idiot whatever have you.. But I stand by it..
I was expressing my opinion based on the current situation in the P2P market, that if I was the CEO over at Trion, I would have thought prices differently..
Which is why you are not.....
I think they know what they are doing, if they had any fear of it being priced too high, they would lower it. they know the price is fair, as do the consumers that buy it.
Trion is a notch below Blizzard at the top of the MMO mountain, they are not stupid.
I was expressing my opinion based on the current situation in the P2P market, that if I was the CEO over at Trion, I would have thought prices differently..
Which is why you are not.....
I think they know what they are doing, if they had any fear of it being priced too high, they would lower it. they know the price is fair, as do the consumers that buy it.
Trion is a notch below Blizzard at the top of the MMO mountain, they are not stupid. They are still climbing, and have yet to reach their potential.
The expansion is way underpriced for what Rifters are going to be getting. P.S. Trion can over charge their players and trust me the Rift playebase would not mind simply because the playebase wants to support Trion. The rift forums are testement to that.
I was expressing my opinion based on the current situation in the P2P market, that if I was the CEO over at Trion, I would have thought prices differently..
Which is why you are not.....
I think they know what they are doing, if they had any fear of it being priced too high, they would lower it. they know the price is fair, as do the consumers that buy it.
Trion is a notch below Blizzard at the top of the MMO mountain, they are not stupid.
And like I said, that is fine.. Criticism is nothing I am afraid of.. You are allowed to tell me how far below the totem pole me and my opinion are, but I will not falter.. They will do what they want to do and I understand that, but that will not stop me from saying what I believe and that is what I have done..
That's how it was at release, basically. No reason why this would be any different.
Also, loads of folks already got the X-Pac for free when they bought the year long sub for $120. That deal is looking like the best deal in MMO gaming for a while.
Please don't take one comment out of context, Scott said in that same interview they have NO plans in going that route. There is nothing wrong with how they currently bill, it is not gonna change, it works.
It works, up to a certain level of accounts. With the amount of people Trion has working on the game, there comes a point where its simply not profitable enough to do sub only. The only other games that are below 250k subs that are p2p are the games that are much older and have a fraction of the staff that Rift has.
If Storm Legion brings people back (and they stick around) than there probably wont be a cash shop beyond the occasional mount they do now. If SL only pleases the current fans than Trion might have to consider plan B. Hopefully they don't have to, and if they do that people are understanding of it. I think a cash shop is more likely than f2p, I don't see Trion going that route but who knows.
Yes, this is just conjecture on the most part, including Rift's sub numbers being below 250k but its hard to imagine they aren't at this point. Storm Legion will definitely deliver for fans of Rift as it is now. Will it deliver for those that are on the fence? Dimensions are a huge plus on paper, they sound absolutely amazing. The fact that they didnt address the dire need for leveling alternatives will hurt it. The game world needed to be 'tripled', but not added to the top, instead divided up amongst all levels.
Call me cheap, stupid, a leftist idiot whatever have you.. But I stand by it..
I just think you don't understand the economics of things is all. Trion absolutely LOVES PR. They will do anything to get good PR, they play the media more than any MMORPG company I have ever seen (not talking about advertising, obviously blizzard does that best...but Trion is astonishingly PR minded). They would release a free expansion for the MASSIVE goodwill PR if they could. But they simply can't afford a free expansion. They pump too much money into the game.
Lol, peopel still whining they have to pay for a x pac, where have you been all these years It s standard practice and price. Trion pumps a ton of free stuff into their game, paying 40 for a xpack is nothing.
Originally posted by Lorkii Lol, peopel still whining they have to pay for a x pac, where have you been all these years It s standard practice and price. Trion pumps a ton of free stuff into their game, paying 40 for a xpack is nothing.
Well Eve does 2 expansions a year and never charges and last I heard they are doing great. So it is not standard practice and this expansion is way over priced.
I've been paying them an annual sub fee. That comes to at least $100/year. What has my sub money been going towards? I can play Guild Wars (and now GW2) along with my F2P games and not spend anywhere near that much per year and still get a lot of content.
It's not that I can't afford a sub fee (I obviously have one) it is that no game out now is worth the sub fee + all the other expac and microtransactions they charge too. It's not about affording. It's about wasting money when you're not playing and the total cost of playing any given game.
What I love about the F2P model is that they have to create interesting compelling content to keep me playing and paying. With P2P I have to pay up front and hope I get my money's worth and that I like the design decisions.
Trion is a great dev studio and RIFT is a great game, but I am done with subs and double dipping.
LOL there are games out their worth a sub fee, EvE Online being one. Rift I find worth it as well because they are always trying to make the game better. Heck for all of its content Runescape is even worth the 7 bucks a month. Name another hobby you can spend 15 bucks a month on and have as many hours of entertainment. P2P is really cheap. Alot of people go " oh I cant afford to pay that", but then you see them go to the movies 2 or 3 times a week or eat out like every other day. 1 trip to the movies with your girl or friends is gonna cost more than that and same thing for eating out unless all you do is use a dollar menu at a fast food resturant. im not saying do not do these things, but dont complain about 15 bucks a month when you spend 200 bucks a month going to the movies or whatever. You see what I mean? Real life is important and a game should never come first but its really a small fee compared to others....
Comments
Agreed, if its accesable on the Internet and its a game and it not free, people think its over priced.
Rift players aren't the onse complaining, it's everyone who cries about why they don't play.
Most Rift players have a great releationship with Devs and Gms, often conversing with them on the TC. They care, and will always have me as a customer.
Agreed. We have chats with the GMs in game all the time, they actually give a shit. The game has come a long long way from release,as a matter of fact I hated it then, now I think it s the best on the market.
Because Trion is not going the micro transaction route right now. Top quality games not bleeding subscribers at an astounding rate are going to stay with the business model that has worked since UO in 1997 (People called Origin crazy thinking people would pay 9.99 a month for a game, uh ya...)
Rift earns every penny from me, because they release new material about every 8 or 9 weeks, give or take a few. This would not be possible without a monthly fee.
What is this slew of F2P games you are speaking of? GW2 which I also play, and which is a wonderful game with a huge world to explore, will not be able to provide the updates like Rift can. They will have to release it all in an expansion to recover costs. The cash shop will also bring in revenue, who knows how successful that will be.
If you want an MMO to live and breath, it needs income to survive, no way WOW or Rift can provide the level of service they now offer in a F2P model. No way.......
Really? Are you positive? Are Trion employees supposed to post info like that on this website? You are a trion Employee, right? You must be if you are so sure what is right for them.
you really should take an economics class or two. Rift isnt charging because they can, its because they have to.
Hartsman said they have consider it. Its coming. But he also said that the money will be put back into the game. And I believe him. I also think SoE puts the cash shop money back into the game too. When you have the sub numbers Rift has, P2P just isnt enough to keep full support.
Yea i meant to say ex rift players the ones who enjoy rift arent complaining oops my bad!
It has always been like that!
Mines of Moria was $50 at that time when LOTRO was still P2P.
EverQuest 2 has always charged $40-$50 dollars for their yearly expansions on EQ1/EQ2 !
WoW always and still does charge $40 dollars for their expansions.
TRION doesn't do anything different here. They actually do better.
They have delivered a ton of free content updates since launch and now they launch an expansion that will more than double the size of the entire game world.
That more than justifies as a paid expansion in my eyes.
Even if you had bought the core game bfore FTP you didn't get access to all the other areas. It's the reason I stopped playing it. Dumb payment system.
Please don't take one comment out of context, Scott said in that same interview they have NO plans in going that route. There is nothing wrong with how they currently bill, it is not gonna change, it works.
Seriously guys? Paying for expansions is something new, unexpected and even offensive? TBH I'd rather pay TRION twice as much than buy next WoW expansion. They have great devs, they are social people, they push out a lot of good content, events and even sometimes do the events with the players. I have a title for playing in charity event, I have a hat that you could anly get at events and in special promotion... I have a title for killing a dev:D Also, you have a FREE mobile app with loot that goes to your in-game mailbox, you can play any of your 20- characters even if you don't sub (and even if you had a sub before), you have a simple wardrobe system that doesnt force you to merge items together etc etc. The x-pac comes with 2 times the size of landmass added, one new tree for each class, housing system, epic gigantic enemies roaming the land... TBH even after playing GW2 I can't wait for Storm Legion. That said I hope it will be stand-alone for new players. WoW's way of expac on an expac on an expac is really confusing for new peeps and Blizz JUST discovered that (geniuses!).
Shrug.. Of course this conversation is going places.. I was not referring to past xpacs of past games when the market was different.. Hell I remember paying this much for my many Everquest xpacs.. Not bashing anyone for enjoying Rift.. Not bashing anyone for paying whatever they want to play Rift.. Not telling anyone they can't buy.. Not telling anyone they cannot play.. I was expressing my opinion based on the current situation in the P2P market, that if I was the CEO over at Trion, I would have thought prices differently..
Just like that little game over at Heatwave Interactive that chose to go P2P and even charge for a box.. People argued that "it was normal" , this that and a third, but the fact that remained and what was the ultimate factor in whether the game sank or swam was exactly that..
I am not bashing anyone who spent money on Gods And Heroes, not even telling them that they were wrong for showing their support.. My opinion was, that the game was not going to fare well in the market at that price point..
Akin to being an armchair coach during football season and seeing a bad play unfold, calling a fumble or interception before the ball is even hiked.. I may be wrong, but it is my opinion..
Call me cheap, stupid, a leftist idiot whatever have you.. But I stand by it..
Which is why you are not.....
I think they know what they are doing, if they had any fear of it being priced too high, they would lower it. they know the price is fair, as do the consumers that buy it.
Trion is a notch below Blizzard at the top of the MMO mountain, they are not stupid.
And like I said, that is fine.. Criticism is nothing I am afraid of.. You are allowed to tell me how far below the totem pole me and my opinion are, but I will not falter.. They will do what they want to do and I understand that, but that will not stop me from saying what I believe and that is what I have done..
$40 now for enthusiastic "early adopters".
$30 in a month or two.
$15 on sale somewhere by three months out.
That's how it was at release, basically. No reason why this would be any different.
Also, loads of folks already got the X-Pac for free when they bought the year long sub for $120. That deal is looking like the best deal in MMO gaming for a while.
It works, up to a certain level of accounts. With the amount of people Trion has working on the game, there comes a point where its simply not profitable enough to do sub only. The only other games that are below 250k subs that are p2p are the games that are much older and have a fraction of the staff that Rift has.
If Storm Legion brings people back (and they stick around) than there probably wont be a cash shop beyond the occasional mount they do now. If SL only pleases the current fans than Trion might have to consider plan B. Hopefully they don't have to, and if they do that people are understanding of it. I think a cash shop is more likely than f2p, I don't see Trion going that route but who knows.
Yes, this is just conjecture on the most part, including Rift's sub numbers being below 250k but its hard to imagine they aren't at this point. Storm Legion will definitely deliver for fans of Rift as it is now. Will it deliver for those that are on the fence? Dimensions are a huge plus on paper, they sound absolutely amazing. The fact that they didnt address the dire need for leveling alternatives will hurt it. The game world needed to be 'tripled', but not added to the top, instead divided up amongst all levels.
I just think you don't understand the economics of things is all. Trion absolutely LOVES PR. They will do anything to get good PR, they play the media more than any MMORPG company I have ever seen (not talking about advertising, obviously blizzard does that best...but Trion is astonishingly PR minded). They would release a free expansion for the MASSIVE goodwill PR if they could. But they simply can't afford a free expansion. They pump too much money into the game.
Well Eve does 2 expansions a year and never charges and last I heard they are doing great. So it is not standard practice and this expansion is way over priced.
LOL there are games out their worth a sub fee, EvE Online being one. Rift I find worth it as well because they are always trying to make the game better. Heck for all of its content Runescape is even worth the 7 bucks a month. Name another hobby you can spend 15 bucks a month on and have as many hours of entertainment. P2P is really cheap. Alot of people go " oh I cant afford to pay that", but then you see them go to the movies 2 or 3 times a week or eat out like every other day. 1 trip to the movies with your girl or friends is gonna cost more than that and same thing for eating out unless all you do is use a dollar menu at a fast food resturant. im not saying do not do these things, but dont complain about 15 bucks a month when you spend 200 bucks a month going to the movies or whatever. You see what I mean? Real life is important and a game should never come first but its really a small fee compared to others....