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Originally posted by MMOExposed Originally posted by adam_nox Originally posted by Magnetia The full potiential of PvE is still being wasted by players. So many people just let teh NPC run off and nobody follows them. I've only started following them again and found myself enjoying them more. Even I was subject to running away after an event finished. WE NEED TO LEARN TO FOLLOW NPCS AND STICK AROUND.
give specific examples.
Event under water which wanted players to collect dwarves artifacts, and turn them in to a Norn collector. Once finished, the guy ask to be escorted back to the inn. Then later the next part starts which is attacked by rogues trying to steal them. Next another escort. On and on.
Wow that event sounds super exciting and innovative...follow NPC's?!?! unheard of and groundbreaking!
IDK - The "grind" debate always comes down to "are you having fun".
Running from heart to heart doing basically the same thing at each, mining 100's of nodes, doing DE after DE that have little variation doesn't seem like a grind at all if you are having fun. On the other hand if you are bored then it seems grindy.
My personal opinion is that its dreadfully boring so I quit playing the game.
Originally posted by Mardukk Grinding is ok. This is an MMO. I'm pretty sure you have countless console games you can play to have rewards for no time put in. I have not idea why most gamers these days want to rip through these game in record time...........it's ok to not finish a game in one month. This game could not be less grindy and last more than two weeks. Honestly some people really need to stop playing MMO's because devs have been listening to you people for far too long. And now they designing games that I can half ass my way through in two months and then I get to buy another game, thanks short attention span crowd.
+1 peeps who whines about mmo games in general being grindy wich they all always have been shoould stop playing them and move to console games.
I always say if the game feels like a grind then your getting bored of it... and this is exactly how it is for me an the PVE.. Some of the most boring i have come accross for quite some time..
They are all basic kill or collect quests but instead of a number of things to collect or kill you havea bar to fill and usually takes twice as long as standard MMORPG quests... go collect barrels and bring them back up to me.. of course only 1 at a time.. after the 5th barrel my brains have fallen out..
The one good thing is you can just skip all that crap and do PVP.. oh wait no you cant unless you want to queue for an hour LOL
Originally posted by adam_nox Originally posted by Magnetia The full potiential of PvE is still being wasted by players. So many people just let teh NPC run off and nobody follows them. I've only started following them again and found myself enjoying them more. Even I was subject to running away after an event finished. WE NEED TO LEARN TO FOLLOW NPCS AND STICK AROUND.
a chain DE in the norn starting area
Kickstarter: Stuff I'm supporting
People that say it's grindy, don't understand what "grind" means, and somehow i doubt they even ever played a true grinder before.
If you don't like a particular heart or DE type, don't do it. This is something people still don't seem to get about GW2. Don't like something? skip it! There is no quest chain that needs to be completed in order to proceed (except, the personal story, and even that isn't required). There are a lot of DE's i really like doing, and some heart quests have funny particulars. However, if i see a collection DE pop up, i'll skip 3/5 times. And most heart quests i ignore and will get them when i feel like it, or hope they'll auto complete with a DE.
Originally posted by kDeviL It felt a little bit grindy to me for a little bit as well. DE's and more fun things to happen at later levels but here's what I did when it felt like it was a bit grindy. Just go to any random area, and let yourself get lost, Don't go for hearts or map completions, just walk around, explore caves and crap and join in all the DE's you see happening. Doing this has made leveling SO much more fun for me.
If you focus on exploration and Dynamic events, you'll likely end up completing most of the Heart quests anyway.
The events and hearts in a specific area generally follow the same theme -
So a heart might be to kill Centuars, destroy traps, and salvage stolen goods.
The DE's in the area will have you killing Centaurs while defending/escorting/attacking a location or NPC etc.
So you do the DE's, the Hearts fill up and finish too.
The same topic that appears about every MMORPG and will continue to do so.
Mostly it's not a games fault but until the players mentality of " OMG I need to hit max level asap " changes then things will remain the same.
Give it another week and you will start to see multiple " I'm lvl 80 and the game lack's content " Threads.
A lot of people treat games a fast food, and gorge themselves as quick as possible before moving on to their next meal .. It's not the game fault and if that's how people wish to spend their money then good luck to them. But mostly their views can be discounted for what they are.
Coming from a lvl 21 Necro, I'm not feelinmg the grind, since there is quite a lot to do. Some hearts are not quite as interesting as others, but you don't have to do them. Between hearts, the dynamic events, viewpoints, gathering and random killing, and the story, its all been quite varried. Underwater areas have a different feel from being outside as well. Then you have duneons which I haven't seen yet. I haven't even touched PvP either, since I want to really understand everything before jumping in. I have little interest in crafting also, which nets nice experience as well. INever felt the need to sit in any spot at all. This is NOT DAOC where you had spawn camping for HOURS!!! Now that was a grind. Not since WOW have I wanted to explore anything in a MMO. There is real motivation to scrounge the map. The incentives are more obvious then WOW was, which was more for personal gain or finding a hidden away quest. In GW2, the rewards are well defined, once you understand how the whole system works. Pretty satisfied.
I think Anet has done a pretty damn good job overall, since I haven't been impressed by any MMOs since 2004-05. From a PvE perspective, there not much more that can be provided. I haven't really noticed any major difficulty when fighting equal con mobs, like some others have mentioned, but its certainly NOT a cakewalk either like the past few MMOs I've played. A few adds WILL make you think and its very possible to challenge yourself and attack mobs a few levels above to add further challenge.
Wow fucking wow.
After all the debates and many people always pointing it out there's still mass of posters (and some that are seen around often) that have NO CLUE what so ever what term grind means.
Grind is not something you can pick up and put in your pocket. Grind is a state of your mind. If I say killing 10 monsters is a grind to me, than IT IS a grind (to me). [mod edit]. I got it it's not for you but it doesn't mean it's not for me. You are not a center of universe.
If OP feels like than that's exactly how it is. Stop telling him it isn't. Rather give him ideas or your own views that might open up his mind.
The hearts are the same old shit. The DEs appear to get more interesting and chained (well...some anyways) at higher levels. Kind of a mixed bag on PvE in this game. Some parts such as the exploration and some DEs really stand out in design. Others...probably seem stale and dull simply because of the ones that are done well.
I mean the main thing here was in the presentation of the quest design. When you break it all down though it is going to be the same that you have in any game. So if you're tired of doing those types of endeavors you find in an mmo then regardless the presentation Anet goes for it is going to be the same old grind to you.
So does it get better? Kind of...with DEs not with hearts. However, you do have dungeons come into play at higher levels which is a nice change of pace as well.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Originally posted by StarI Wow fucking wow. After all the debates and many people always pointing it out there's still mass of posters (and some that are seen around often) that have NO CLUE what so ever what term grind means. Grind is not something you can pick up and put in your pocket. Grind is a state of your mind. If I say killing 10 monsters is a grind to me, than IT IS a grind (to me). Everyone else can fuck of telling me it's not. I got it it's not for you but it doesn't mean it's not for me. You are not a center of universe. If OP feels like than that's exactly how it is. Stop telling him it isn't. Rather give him ideas or your own views that might open up his mind. Seriously, people stop skipping fucking classes and life and gtfo internet.
Nice attitude. If you can't say something nice - please keep it to yourself.
Yes, grind is a state of mind - if the person is still stuck in the WoW/Tera/Rift/TOR grind mentality everything will feel like a grind.
I myself try to approach each game as a new adventure. It is how the game plays that makes it feel grindy. I defintely don't feel the grind in GW2.
"In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum
Grind is all in the eye of the beholder. If you are playing the game just to level and you go from heart to heart and just do random DE's that pop up, basically only caring about filling up progress bars, it may feel like a grind.
If, on the other hand, you play the game to explore, look for the stories behind DEs, investigate strange caves that you find, and talk to NPCs to get the lore behind hearts...you will just find yourself leveling naturally and it may not feel grindy at all.
The key here is to not focus on progress bars when you play. If all you care about is filling a bar, then ANY game will feel like a grind. If you want an example of non-grindy play, here are some things my cousin and I did last night...
We found a huge pyramid structure with these (relatively) high level golem mobs that spawned every now and then. There were these huge lightning generators that you could use to kill the golems we actually got some decent exp just doing this...it was fun whenever the golems spawned we were like "To the lightning generators!"
Then, while just gallavanting around there the Inquest attacked and tried to steal the golems...we miserably failed at stopping them, but after the even the NPCs that owned the golems said they would raid the Inquest lab and take them back. So we followed the NPCs there and had a huge battle with the Inquest to get the golems back...lots of fun.
ANother thing we did is we just randomly explored a cave and found a huge locked door. There was a device next to the door and I put a crystal that I had found earlier into the device...the door opened and an event started where we had to find the lost treasure of this necromantic golemancer! Lots of fun, difficult event and best part was that we actually caused it to happen.
We kept on like this for a while and actually wound up getting to like level 10 and 11 just by exploring stuff. When you stop starting and progress bars and actually look around, the game has a lot to offer
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
Originally posted by botrytis Nice attitude. If you can't say something nice - please keep it to yourself.
Take your own advice than and keep it for yourself - you're not being nice to me.
Originally posted by Vapors Hey, not long ago i started to play gw2. And its alround okay, but 1 basic question will this heartquests or even some dynamic quest, stay so grindy in the later game? Im pretty much annoyed on level10 already of the 100 waves mob spawns or killing 20 mobs until my heartquest finishes. After level 10 i only pvped, cuz i was really dissapointed of the pve until level 10. Maybe its my opinion or something but tell me please if this stays like that
Depends on your interest in PvE. I dont finish heartquests in one go depending on what I have to do. What I love about GW2 is I dont have to finish it. I can go off exploring. I can craft. A plethora of other things. Eventually I come back and finish the heart. This fits my style of play perfectly but may not work for you.
Originally posted by Creslin321 Grind is all in the eye of the beholder. If you are playing the game just to level and you go from heart to heart and just do random DE's that pop up, basically only caring about filling up progress bars, it may feel like a grind. If, on the other hand, you play the game to explore, look for the stories behind DEs, investigate strange caves that you find, and talk to NPCs to get the lore behind hearts...you will just find yourself leveling naturally and it may not feel grindy at all.
ive been doing the latter
i skip most heart quests and i visit many racial areas while exploring - i dont even seek out DEs
im feeling no grind at all; im just overwhelmed by a HUGE game world
Is it grind? I don't know. What I do know is often I just tell myself I'll walk down the road and grab that teleporter.... an hour and half later I'm halfway across the new zone with an extra level and 3 silver richer, all the while the text in the corner of my screen nags me that I'm already 6 levels above what my story quest is and I should really find the time to go back and talk to Logan.
It's a grind if you aim for something and it takes longer than you expect to get there.
So far, GW2 has been a matter of starting out aiming for something and 5min later you already forgot that you were even aiming at.
Originally posted by MMOExposed Originally posted by Mardukk Grinding is ok. This is an MMO. I'm pretty sure you have countless console games you can play to have rewards for no time put in. I have not idea why most gamers these days want to rip through these game in record time...........it's ok to not finish a game in one month. This game could not be less grindy and last more than two weeks. Honestly some people really need to stop playing MMO's because devs have been listening to you people for far too long. And now they designing games that I can half ass my way through in two months and then I get to buy another game, thanks short attention span crowd.
Grind is not ok. Especially for many who Anet marketed no grinds in GW2, to.
Grinding is such a thing of the past in this genre. The industry should have known that by now when they saw what Blizzard changed about the EQ formula to make World Of Warcraft.
LOL what? WoW is more of a grind than GW2 though I will say it is less grindy than some others.
I'm sorry...but finding levelling grindy in this game seems to be a stretch of the imagination or you just want everything handed to you on a silver platter. Sometimes I think I can walk around in game and sneeze and get xp. You get it from gathering, you get it from crafting, you get it from discovering new things, you get it from achievements, you get it from WvWvW, you get it from DE's. Hearts? Please. I have done them without trying because a lot of the time they are damn smack where the DE's are taking place so you end up doing two in one stroke.
What else can you expect to help you with the so called grind? You can stay in the freaking newbie area and still get xp. Why you would I have no clue but it's possible. To call this game a grind is ridiculous. I played games that defined the word 'grind' and this isn't even in their ballpark. No one seems to want to put in even a little effort for anything anymore, shesh. This is far from being like a second job unlike some other games in the past.
your definition of grind?
Originally posted by Vapors Aw okay, so i will stay level 10 and will rush my pvp level hehe, i can remember people said the pve quests are the best ever time ago-.- well what ever pvp is also fine. thanks for your answer
It kinda depends on who you are, some players like some aspect others other aspects.
Do the parts you think is fun and ignore the rest.
Simple escort quest: Protect Moa chicks heading to Beetleton.
The quest finishes at the gate, yet you are able to follow the chicks to the carnival.
At said carnival, there is dialog exchanged... and the Moa Birds do the freakin' chocobo dance from FF7
It was absolutely hilarious, and even still probably one of the lesser of the polish and "little things" they added into the game after each event.
Though ultimately, I'll agree that the "grind to 80 quickly" mentality does negatively effect a game that is not about it. The so-called "questing" in this game is perhaps the best you can get, and better than anything thus far in the 15 years I've been around this Genre. Granted, I don't treat it as questing, but rather that I'm on some high adventure exploring each place repeatedly, and finding new things each time. It's about as realistic you can get to being in character, and that character existing in a living and breathing world where they are simple adventurers who explore and things just happen around them.
My most favorite portion of such would be that the only places that are truly safe are the name cities; I've died a dozen or so times from AFK in seemingly safe areas or outposts due to events just activating with raids to the towns or an echo of the pasts with ghosts, or a world boss just popping up and destroying everything.
I absolutely love the Adventure and just doing things as they come, as well as listening to all the dialog and results of the things shortly thereafter as opposed to just heading to the next for the sole purpose of making it a game about levels, when it's (to me and most likely the intent of the game) a game about just having fun on the road (the PvE portion, at least).
Did you realize that you are calling combat grind? do you really expect every mob encounter to have different mechanics?
But as usual people love to complain instead of enjoyng a great game.
__________________________________Remember the good old days when devs made games just for the sake of making a great game?They are forever gone now all they care is about how much they can earn from them, if they can't make millions they won't make that game.
REMEMBER THE OLD DAYS AND REGRET THEY HAVE PASSED.