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Guardians, Warriors and S&B Stereotypes

NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904
in Guild Wars 2

So,

Lately I have been craving playing a sword and board type character..
Ive tried doing this in a number of games outside Gw2 and ive found im almost always forced to the 'Tank role' if i wield a shield.

So after a quick overview of the Warrior type classes in gw2, it would seem that i would still be forced in to a defensive persona.

The guardian - has very clearly defined itself as a defensive profession, which is fine.

The warrior - Seems to have great potential to be a more traditional dps profession (don't start with the trinity bit, im just talking superficial feel here)
But looking at the skills i would get with a weapon+shieldit doesn't really scream damage. or an "aggressive force"

Core Questions:
Is it possible to play a s&b character and feel like a force to be reckoned with and not a sponge?

Recommendations and suggestions for achieving this?

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Comments

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,387
    Answer is no. Those shields are meant for defense.

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904

    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Answer is no. Those shields are meant for defense.

    I know this thread might seem abit silly when you first read it, Because a shield by its very nature is a defensive weapon. But in rl combat it can be versatile, You could crack someones head open with a 'shield bash" ect ect.

    Oh wells, Thanks for the reply.

    image
    TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,387
    Originally posted by Nitth

     

    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Answer is no. Those shields are meant for defense.

     

    I know this thread might seem abit silly when you first read it, Because a shield by its very nature is a defensive weapon. But in rl combat it can be versatile, You could crack someone head open with a 'shield bash" ect ect.

    Shields have offensive uses, but they are mainly for defense. Most shield skills comes with knock backs,which are defensive in nature, but in WvW can be great for interrupting on the attack.

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • KrytycalKrytycal Member Posts: 520

    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

  • AeliousAelious Member RarePosts: 3,521

    I play a Guardian and one of the best DPS options I've seen seems to be Sword/Torch.  The best part is that blowing blue fire at something is pretty great. (Edit: I'm level 13 ATM so keep that in mind)

     

    Sword

    http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sword#Guardian

    Shield

    http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield#Guardian

     

    Gives you somewhat of a comparison it seems.  f you click the specfic abilities they will give you a damage rating which will help answer your question.  I'm going to look myself lol.

  • NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904

    Originally posted by Krytycal
    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

    Thanks Ill have to have a look into that, Im not very familiar with these types of melee class in gw2 so ill have to research those things you mentioned.

    15% crit on 1h weapons? would that also augment the shields abilities?

    image
    TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  • KrytycalKrytycal Member Posts: 520
    Originally posted by Nitth

     

    Originally posted by Krytycal
    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

     

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

     

    Thanks Ill have to have a look into that, Im not very familiar with these types of melee class in gw2 so ill have to research those things you mentioned.

    15% crit on 1h weapons? would that also augment the shields abilities?

     

    Correct.

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,387
    Originally posted by Nitth

     

    Originally posted by Krytycal
    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

     

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

     

    Thanks Ill have to have a look into that, Im not very familiar with these types of melee class in gw2 so ill have to research those things you mentioned.

    15% crit on 1h weapons? would that also augment the shields abilities?

     

    I would have to disagree. You would do more damage with a offensive offhand weapon than a shield.

     

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • Stx11Stx11 Member Posts: 415

    I just did 10 levels on my warrior using Mace+Shield and Axe+Shield and I felt like a beast.

    I'm sure I could've on occasion killed faster dual-wielding or with a 2h-weapon but when I switched to those I found myself much squishier. Being able to solo Champions+Adds+random Respawns was pretty awesome.

    Mace+Shield is definitely slower paced and feels more "Tank-y" but Axe does some really nice damage with an AoE Flurry and a short-mid ranged Axe Throw. Haven't tried Sword+Shield yet as I'm waiting for a good one to drop.

    The Shield "5" Ability is pure-Tank/Survival (but also really handy against those Champions) but the "4" is a nice Shield Slam.

    Try it out and see if you like it.

  • Stx11Stx11 Member Posts: 415
    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Originally posted by Nitth
    Originally posted by Krytycal
    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

     

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

    I would have to disagree. You would do more damage with a offensive offhand weapon than a shield.

    You are missing the OP's point - he isn't asking for "Max DPS" he is asking if he can do decent damage and kill things relatively quickly with Weapon & Shield and the answer to that is potentially yes depending upon how it feels to him.

  • NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904

    Originally posted by Stx11
    Originally posted by MMOExposed Originally posted by Nitth Originally posted by Krytycal You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.   It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish. You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.
    I would have to disagree. You would do more damage with a offensive offhand weapon than a shield.
    You are missing the OP's point - he isn't asking for "Max DPS" he is asking if he can do decent damage and kill things relatively quickly with Weapon & Shield and the answer to that is potentially yes depending upon how it feels to him.

    Yes sorry i should of been more clear on this.

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  • KrytycalKrytycal Member Posts: 520
    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Originally posted by Nitth

     

    Originally posted by Krytycal
    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

     

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

     

    Thanks Ill have to have a look into that, Im not very familiar with these types of melee class in gw2 so ill have to research those things you mentioned.

    15% crit on 1h weapons? would that also augment the shields abilities?

     

    I would have to disagree. You would do more damage with a offensive offhand weapon than a shield.

     

    You would, but the point of this thread is not what does more damage, it is whether shields can work for offense oriented builds. The answer is yes, and I gave an example of both guardian and warrior offensive builds that can work with shields.

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,387
    Originally posted by Stx11
    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Originally posted by Nitth
    Originally posted by Krytycal
    You can play a DPS oriented guardian with one hand + shield and focus on swap. Grab the 15% critical chance trait for one-handed weapons. 60% bleed on critical rune. 100% burning on block. Strong emphasis on Virtue of Justice traits and go heavy in condition damage with some precision.

     

    It's a very good offensive guardian shield that can use shield with sword if you wish.

    You could do the same thing with Warrior and sword + shield, where you'll mostly focus on bleeds and condition damage, with shield as added survivability.

    I would have to disagree. You would do more damage with a offensive offhand weapon than a shield.

    You are missing the OP's point - he isn't asking for "Max DPS" he is asking if he can do decent damage and kill things relatively quickly with Weapon & Shield and the answer to that is potentially yes depending upon how it feels to him.

    Well all main hand weapons can deal damage, which over time can kill anything. So that kind of intention for the OP's question wouldnt make much sense unless it was in another context. As stated, shield and mainland can kill. But for a offensive build itdoesn't have the offensive abilities. For an attack, it can be used for things like interrupt, but to suggest a weapon swap, I would stil say you better off using a offensive offhand weapon over shield.

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • VirinVirin Member Posts: 32
    I have played guardian a bit. Trying to play each class to get a feel for them. Haven't gotten to warrior but with guardian sword/shield seems to work well for an offensive feel while mace is the more traditional "tank" like feel. I started with elementalist and the attune meant swapping got me into a habit so with the other classes look into weapon swaps. For example, with thief I like to start out short bow hit a few things swap to DD an jump in for some slap chop fun. Haven't nailed down guardian yet but on one occasion I did start 2h sword jump in aoe a ton of mobs and swap to s/sh for the rest
  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
    I would say yes, but within limits. A Guardian and a Warrior both can swap between two weaponsets on the fly. So you can set shield - 1h and then a 2hand weapon and swap within the fight, as the fight develops. That's the cool thing about GW2, the fight is dynamic and you adapt every moment. A Guardian can do 2h weapons and some do really good dmg. Other setups almost are a bit like healer. You really aren't that fixed as in other MMOs, and there is no aggro management, so you are never a mere sponge or meatshield.

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • MeowheadMeowhead Member UncommonPosts: 3,716

    If you're sticking to just ONE weaponset as a class that can swap (With the exception of thief since of the way initiative works), you're probably gimping yourself to some extent.

    If you work the sword/shield into a rotation using a more offensive other weapon set, you should be fine as damage.  Shields actually add to your damage total (Try unequipping your shield and going bare handed, you'll hit weaker), the reason why they're less damaging is simply because they don't add 2 more offensive skills.  So you only have 3 weapon attacks if you stick to sword/shield. 

  • rodingorodingo Member RarePosts: 2,870
    On the flip side, I know the op is talking about using the shield for offensive moves or damage, but as an interesting twist you can actually use one handed weapons for defense which is interesting.  For the warrior, a move for the mace if it is in the main hand can "block" for three seconds and build up addrenaline during that time. If you are hit ( I think melee only) during those three seconds you automatically block the hit and counter with your own hit.  The same move can be done with the sword in your off hand, but it's called parry or riposte or something.  So you could technically duel wield but be actually "tankier" than a warrior who is S&B.  I know the op was talking about shields, but I just wanted to chime in with this for the warrior.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

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