Originally posted by Johnnymmo They should have just done AOC 2 instead. Done it right and redeemed themselves. They are a bunch of morans at Failcom. Shouldnt be aloud to waste investors money anymore
Remove the "C"
AO2, that shit would rule the world.
Better yet, just slap AO's skill and gear system to TSW, make the TSW world equal in size, that would be neat.
Still would not be a wow killer though, only blizzard can kill wow.
Still, 200k seems a lot less then what it deserves, for the single player aspects alone it is a great PC game.
The release time though seems to be the dumbest move in MMO history.
And yes, even dumber then SWG NGE!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by coxyroxy If FC tried to make a game based on making a good quility fun game (GW2) rather than about the money as they always seem to talk of, maybe they would have more success.No matter when a game is released or what is released along side, if its good people will buy and play it.
TSW has overall poor professional reviews, but excellent user reviews. SWToR had excellent professional reviews, but overall poor user reviews. If TSW was a bad game, overall user reviews wouldn't be so high. If SWToR was as good as the professional reviews, they would have kept more people than they did and they would have better overall user reviews.
The professional reviews drive game sales, and the user reviews show a game's retention. TSW has excellent retention, but poor sales.
I'm not going to play armchair analyst and try and decide what their problem was. It doesn't really matter, the damage is done. Funcom is more or less out of the MMORPG business and TSW will become something that it was never meant to be.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
This is really sad. Sad for MMO's not just Funcom. TSW tried to do something different and people didn't go for it, apparently.
Where it REALLY hurts EVERYBODY, even those who hate TSW... This is another example where a developer tried something different and the gaming populous rejected it.
This means, future developments for the next god knows how many years, will continue to be the same game you've been playing for the last 10 years, with a different skin and setting.
I feel bad for Funcom, because the game is good.
Despite the haters, the bashers and resident fanbois of any other games who make it their goal to hate anything that isn't their game of choice, The Secret World doesn't desrve the hate or lackluster sales it has received.
I'm willing to bet 90% of the people posting something here have never played the game. Sad.
Flame On.
Hey TSW Players http://www.unfair.co/ for Mission guides, Lore Locations and stuff....
If FC tried to make a game based on making a good quility fun game (GW2) rather than about the money as they always seem to talk of, maybe they would have more success.
No matter when a game is released or what is released along side, if its good people will buy and play it.
Come on, you know thats not true. Everyone is pulling cards like this because GW2 just released and everyone is in their honey moon phase with it.
The reality is TSW is a good game, definitely deserved more than 200k boxes sold. And if you need an example of a shit game that sold well, take a gander over at SW:TOR.
So many things affect box sales, marketing, having a popular IP, etc.
Do you think GW2 would be selling like hotcakes if they hadnt made GW1 prior to this? I.E. it was a completely brand new lore, IP, etc? Doubtful. It probably would still do well, but i doubt it would of sold like it is.
Right now the only game i can think of that sold well and still is doing ok that was based on a new IP was Rift.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
I personally LOVE this game!!! No subs fee MMO comes anywhere close to it in my eyes!!!
The customer service i have recieved from the funcom team has been spotless, tickets answered within their 4hour time they suggest they aim to answer them in.
Only thing that they lacked in was the advertising of the game, the game also isnt aimed @ kids that the majority of MMOs are aimed at.
I personally give the game and the funcom team a 10/10 for this awesome game, and would recommend it to my gamer friends anyday!!
Originally posted by Johnnymmo They should have just done AOC 2 instead. Done it right and redeemed themselves. They are a bunch of morans at Failcom. Shouldnt be aloud to waste investors money anymore
This game is already better than AoC and for the many of us they redeemed themselves with this game.
It had the smoothest MMO launch of the last years, had few bugs and issues. Overall a very polished game.
They just gambled and launched the game at the worst time possible, namely in early July. And on top of that hardly did any advertisement, relying too heavily on mouth to mouth and viral marketing.
If they stil manage to keep a solid pace at releasing new content, improving the game overtime, then this game has the chance to actually grow over time.
This game didn't cost the insane amount of money to develop like SW:TOR did and thus doesn't need 500k + subs to survive.
With the low amount of server hardware to maintain, a decent sized live development team, they can sustain this game and make a profit with just 100-200k subs.
Remember, EVE Online started with a couple thousand subscribers and had a peak of roughly 350k subs about 1-2 years ago and that company has grown quite large and is doing financially really well. (CCP)
in worst case, 100k subs still means 1,5 million dollars raw income a month! And that is without the extra income from the cashshop!
That is 18 million a year on TSW subs alone.
And then they still have AoC and AO running, giving them some extra income too. Together with the cash shop.
So Funcom really isn't going anywhere. They have been around since the early days back in the 90's.
TSW failed in delivering fun. People played the beta, found out that funcom forgot to include a game with their software and here we are.
Everyone who talks about how great it is must be from another planet. It's not a good game, it didn't try to be different, it just wasn't fun. Proof is in the numbers. Even 1-2 weeks after launch you had people who were previously fanboys that were already bored with it.
I think that they screwed up with marketing and advertising. This also isnt a game for the spoon fed gamer, some of the missions require thought. this has lead to some frustration and leaving by some. but still the game is good. I hope that it does grow, but you never know in today financial climate. I
TSW failed in delivering fun. People played the beta, found out that funcom forgot to include a game with their software and here we are.
Everyone who talks about how great it is must be from another planet. It's not a good game, it didn't try to be different, it just wasn't fun. Proof is in the numbers. Even 1-2 weeks after launch you had people who were previously fanboys that were already bored with it.
No fun, no subs. Big surprise.
I think it's you that is from a different planet, as the USER Metra Critic Score tells a total different tale than what you are respresenting my friend.
haha GW2 had 400k concurant users during just the headstart to TSW's only 200k SOLD.
Those are some telling numbers.
Watch your thoughts; they become words. Watch your words; they become actions. Watch your actions; they become habits. Watch your habits; they become character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny. Lao-Tze
Looks like cartoon fantasy settings are the only games that sell...a damn shame. Sparkle pony power!
This is not good for the genre unless you love cartoon fantasy settings. Any company that tries to do anything outside that box is looking at less sales than they could have with kids content and whimsical fantasy settings.
I found the game to have a great concept but it's riddled with things that kill it for me. I couldn't bare playing it beyond a week or two. I never like to see devs laid off though, or studios going through hardships.
Best of luck to all involved.
And to those who do enjoy this game, if the company sees fit then a game can certainly exist and entertain a very small niche group. AC1 is still one of my favorite mmorpgs of all time, and has an extremely low playersbase and really always has. So if Funcom can work around some obstacles, your game should be fine as a niche I would think.
I wishthe game had been for me because I thoroughly enjoy Lovecraft and King, Poe, etc... so the concept was great for me. My ideas of what a mmorpg should be just didn't mesh well with the implementation, that's all.
Originally posted by Rusque TSW failed in delivering fun. People played the beta, found out that funcom forgot to include a game with their software and here we are.
Everyone who talks about how great it is must be from another planet. It's not a good game, it didn't try to be different, it just wasn't fun. Proof is in the numbers. Even 1-2 weeks after launch you had people who were previously fanboys that were already bored with it.
No fun, no subs. Big surprise.
There is plenty of fun to be had, And im not out of my mind by saying that.
You have the freedom to construct a character of your liking, and progress through various means:
Questing, Exploring, Crafting, Dungeons, Personal Story, lairs, Skill wheel progression, Vanity clothing, Gear progression, Structured pvp, Persistent pvp, Cabal interaction, roleplay and many others.
Now, Some people may not like these or are 'over them' But there are still alot of opportunity to have fun in this game.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Makes me sad that a mediocre game like GW2 sells so many copies whereas a game with a story and definitely new and interesting world sells only 200K. GW2 is what, learn 5 skills in a few levels, farm PQ's, rinse, repeat. How is that "fun"? I can see why they don't charge monthly fees, there's nothing there worth paying for beyond the box price (if that).
haha GW2 had 400k concurant users during just the headstart to TSW's only 200k SOLD.
Those are some telling numbers.
ArenaNet has also spend a significant amount of money on Advertising. Which will cut heavily on the profit of the box sales.
It's always a double edged sword my friend.
Ah yes all those TSW banners everywhere were probably spaces donated charitibly by the media....pfft. Neither game has really gone all out with traditional ATL marketing really.
That said back on topic. I'm not surprised, but not because of the game. Their latest shareholder report was one of the most "apologetic" I've ever seen, in fact, I don't think I've ever quite seen anything like it. And financial pr used to be my job.
Originally posted by eric_w66 Makes me sad that a mediocre game like GW2 sells so many copies whereas a game with a story and definitely new and interesting world sells only 200K. GW2 is what, learn 5 skills in a few levels, farm PQ's, rinse, repeat. How is that "fun"? I can see why they don't charge monthly fees, there's nothing there worth paying for beyond the box price (if that).
You're right. Google quests and gear grind at end game is where it's at. How silly of people to like something different from you!
Comments
Remove the "C"
AO2, that shit would rule the world.
Better yet, just slap AO's skill and gear system to TSW, make the TSW world equal in size, that would be neat.
Still would not be a wow killer though, only blizzard can kill wow.
Still, 200k seems a lot less then what it deserves, for the single player aspects alone it is a great PC game.
The release time though seems to be the dumbest move in MMO history.
And yes, even dumber then SWG NGE!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't k now why funcom freaking out so bad. 200k Is probably 150k more than what is currently playing AOC.
We all knew this was not going to be a wow killer. Oh well lots of folks want to see failcom fail and all this does is add fuel to the fire.
Meanwhile I been having fun playing it. It has an interesting story line, and I find it 10 times better than Aoc.
TSW has overall poor professional reviews, but excellent user reviews. SWToR had excellent professional reviews, but overall poor user reviews. If TSW was a bad game, overall user reviews wouldn't be so high. If SWToR was as good as the professional reviews, they would have kept more people than they did and they would have better overall user reviews.
The professional reviews drive game sales, and the user reviews show a game's retention. TSW has excellent retention, but poor sales.
I'm not going to play armchair analyst and try and decide what their problem was. It doesn't really matter, the damage is done. Funcom is more or less out of the MMORPG business and TSW will become something that it was never meant to be.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
This is really sad. Sad for MMO's not just Funcom. TSW tried to do something different and people didn't go for it, apparently.
Where it REALLY hurts EVERYBODY, even those who hate TSW... This is another example where a developer tried something different and the gaming populous rejected it.
This means, future developments for the next god knows how many years, will continue to be the same game you've been playing for the last 10 years, with a different skin and setting.
I feel bad for Funcom, because the game is good.
Despite the haters, the bashers and resident fanbois of any other games who make it their goal to hate anything that isn't their game of choice, The Secret World doesn't desrve the hate or lackluster sales it has received.
I'm willing to bet 90% of the people posting something here have never played the game. Sad.
Flame On.
Hey TSW Players http://www.unfair.co/ for Mission guides, Lore Locations and stuff....
I never heard anyone call it a WoW killer.
But it is probably the best MMO availabe right now, sales don't prove that a game is good or bad.
Look at CoD, massive sales, but crap game imo.
Now look at Okami, one of the best games in the past 10 years, but very low sales.
I would say that 200k for a modern sub-based MMO at launch is not shabby. Especially in the time-frame that it launched.
Unless, of course, you were dumb enough to shoot for WoWs numbers.................
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
200k is bad.
I bought a copy but it was because I was soooo bored waiting for GW2....
wonder how many others just bought a copy to past time before launch.
Come on, you know thats not true. Everyone is pulling cards like this because GW2 just released and everyone is in their honey moon phase with it.
The reality is TSW is a good game, definitely deserved more than 200k boxes sold. And if you need an example of a shit game that sold well, take a gander over at SW:TOR.
So many things affect box sales, marketing, having a popular IP, etc.
Do you think GW2 would be selling like hotcakes if they hadnt made GW1 prior to this? I.E. it was a completely brand new lore, IP, etc? Doubtful. It probably would still do well, but i doubt it would of sold like it is.
Right now the only game i can think of that sold well and still is doing ok that was based on a new IP was Rift.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
I personally LOVE this game!!! No subs fee MMO comes anywhere close to it in my eyes!!!
The customer service i have recieved from the funcom team has been spotless, tickets answered within their 4hour time they suggest they aim to answer them in.
Only thing that they lacked in was the advertising of the game, the game also isnt aimed @ kids that the majority of MMOs are aimed at.
I personally give the game and the funcom team a 10/10 for this awesome game, and would recommend it to my gamer friends anyday!!
This game is already better than AoC and for the many of us they redeemed themselves with this game.
It had the smoothest MMO launch of the last years, had few bugs and issues. Overall a very polished game.
They just gambled and launched the game at the worst time possible, namely in early July. And on top of that hardly did any advertisement, relying too heavily on mouth to mouth and viral marketing.
If they stil manage to keep a solid pace at releasing new content, improving the game overtime, then this game has the chance to actually grow over time.
This game didn't cost the insane amount of money to develop like SW:TOR did and thus doesn't need 500k + subs to survive.
With the low amount of server hardware to maintain, a decent sized live development team, they can sustain this game and make a profit with just 100-200k subs.
Remember, EVE Online started with a couple thousand subscribers and had a peak of roughly 350k subs about 1-2 years ago and that company has grown quite large and is doing financially really well. (CCP)
in worst case, 100k subs still means 1,5 million dollars raw income a month! And that is without the extra income from the cashshop!
That is 18 million a year on TSW subs alone.
And then they still have AoC and AO running, giving them some extra income too. Together with the cash shop.
So Funcom really isn't going anywhere. They have been around since the early days back in the 90's.
They will rebound and continue on.
TSW failed in delivering fun. People played the beta, found out that funcom forgot to include a game with their software and here we are.
Everyone who talks about how great it is must be from another planet. It's not a good game, it didn't try to be different, it just wasn't fun. Proof is in the numbers. Even 1-2 weeks after launch you had people who were previously fanboys that were already bored with it.
No fun, no subs. Big surprise.
The negative signal being send to other developers, maybe to stick with WoW clone.
Guess FC never recover from their AoC disasters, all the best to the staffs...
RIP Orc Choppa
I have enjoyed this game.
I think that they screwed up with marketing and advertising. This also isnt a game for the spoon fed gamer, some of the missions require thought. this has lead to some frustration and leaving by some. but still the game is good. I hope that it does grow, but you never know in today financial climate. I
I think it's you that is from a different planet, as the USER Metra Critic Score tells a total different tale than what you are respresenting my friend.
haha GW2 had 400k concurant users during just the headstart to TSW's only 200k SOLD.
Those are some telling numbers.
Watch your thoughts; they become words.
Watch your words; they become actions.
Watch your actions; they become habits.
Watch your habits; they become character.
Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
Lao-Tze
ArenaNet has also spend a significant amount of money on Advertising. Which will cut heavily on the profit of the box sales.
It's always a double edged sword my friend.
Looks like cartoon fantasy settings are the only games that sell...a damn shame. Sparkle pony power!
This is not good for the genre unless you love cartoon fantasy settings. Any company that tries to do anything outside that box is looking at less sales than they could have with kids content and whimsical fantasy settings.
I found the game to have a great concept but it's riddled with things that kill it for me. I couldn't bare playing it beyond a week or two. I never like to see devs laid off though, or studios going through hardships.
Best of luck to all involved.
And to those who do enjoy this game, if the company sees fit then a game can certainly exist and entertain a very small niche group. AC1 is still one of my favorite mmorpgs of all time, and has an extremely low playersbase and really always has. So if Funcom can work around some obstacles, your game should be fine as a niche I would think.
I wishthe game had been for me because I thoroughly enjoy Lovecraft and King, Poe, etc... so the concept was great for me. My ideas of what a mmorpg should be just didn't mesh well with the implementation, that's all.
There is plenty of fun to be had, And im not out of my mind by saying that.
You have the freedom to construct a character of your liking, and progress through various means:
Questing, Exploring, Crafting, Dungeons, Personal Story, lairs, Skill wheel progression, Vanity clothing, Gear progression, Structured pvp, Persistent pvp, Cabal interaction, roleplay and many others.
Now, Some people may not like these or are 'over them' But there are still alot of opportunity to have fun in this game.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
No one ever said it was a wow killer and it was never deigned to be...
Its still one of the best themepark mmorpgs on the market and certainly the best this year... but we all like different things..
Ah yes all those TSW banners everywhere were probably spaces donated charitibly by the media....pfft. Neither game has really gone all out with traditional ATL marketing really.
That said back on topic. I'm not surprised, but not because of the game. Their latest shareholder report was one of the most "apologetic" I've ever seen, in fact, I don't think I've ever quite seen anything like it. And financial pr used to be my job.
Edit; dont answer that i dont care.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
You're right. Google quests and gear grind at end game is where it's at. How silly of people to like something different from you!