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Bugs or Features? Lets not tell the "public" better to hide it away-

SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member

Wow, my mind is BLOWN right now... First please look at this very helpful thread on the official forum. 

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/threads/awakening-bug-and-feature-list.77761/

The following is thge first post in the thread (although the full thread is some good reading)

Well then
Theres lots of shit going on and I would like to get it Summarized

I will Post all Bugs and Problems including all new Features I notice in here
and hope you will help me along correcting me and making additions as the Hotfixes keep coming





Now then lets get Startet
Color Code
Green for Fixed to an Acceptable Degree
Yellow for things which are not 
Confirmed to be the Case for Several Players
Orange for things which are Confirmed to be happening to several different Players
Blue/Green for things which I need further Information on
Purple for stuff which is Opinion Based and might actually not be a Bug




______________
Category 1
Issues with the Enviroment
______________
Node Lags have Returned and are Annoying as Hell


Tindrem Structures are Bugged beyond any Description ....

Several areas of Water dont seem to be acceptet as an fishing place

Some times able to walk through NPCs, other times not.

I thought they hadnt add a sound for "town life", but they did. So another bug: the song has been played in the wrong places, at least for Fabernum and Tindrem (Fabernum its played closer to the cemetery, and Tindrem at mongrel point). For meduli and Bakti I didnt hear anything.


______________
Category 2
Pet Issues
______________

Chat is spammed when Feeding Pet or interacting with it

Horses are Falling through Bridges again while riding

Bull horses being named donkeys??

Pets following you while you are riding go slower than you. (So a horse not carrying a person is slower than a horse carrying a person).

Im not seeing pets moving from your way like patch notes said. 


______________
Category 3
NPC Issues
______________
When turning in old pet receipts at the equerry, there is a delay on receiving your pet. So don't spam the equerry with your old receipt as it will cause visual bugs.

Icons in the Trade Broker dont Work

Money from Trade Broker seems to have an Lag

NPC Vendors are sometimes bugged taking Money but not giving out the stuff

Trade Broker items disappear or get messed up on server 
restart.

Patch notes said with no skills, you can put 5 items on the Trade Broker. I was only able to put on 3 or 4 depending on the character.
Management not letting me sell as many extra items on the Trade Broker as was posted in the patch notes. (I have 100 in management and can only put 9 items on the Trade Broker).

Guards attack Blue players even after they have already lost the Grey Flag

Items you are selling at one trade broker show up in your sell window at other trade brokers and count towards your limit for other trade brokers. These items are not able to be purchased at other trade brokers or their sale canceled through other trade brokers.


______________
Category 4
Interface Issues
______________
Sometimes you can not stop reading, or see what book you are reading, as the book timer icon disappears.

The pet window does not display your pet points correctly, you need to use the command /petpoints.

When reading a new book to gain a skill, you will need to relog for the skill to show up.

Game has Lags upon opening any Menu

The UI is all kinds of bugged no idea why the devs claimed it was 'responsive' - its way more laggy than the old one.

Attribute's +, - and lock are not visually updating. Need to re-log to see it.

Books say they need much more time to finish than they actually do.

When "Always stay in targeting mode" is enabled, pressing use removes the target cross-hair.

In the skill window, all the open skill trees close when a skill changes or gets added.

Certain UI windows don't close and can still be used when you are too far away from the thing they are associated with (Trade Broker for example).

In key bindings, Toggle User Interface listed in place of Toggle Pet Window.

Main hotbar not showing the skills on it when first logging into game until cursor/interface mode is used once.

Opening the Skill Window causes "[Game] Invalid Chat" to be put in the chat window.

Compass covers all 4 directional letters (N, S, E, W) when going exactly in one of those directions. There are spike things covering them. I guess this is not a bug but bad design.




______________
Category 5
Skill and Crafting/Gathering related Issues
______________
At the moment, you can use the glassblowing skill without having the parent skill pottery.There are currently a few issues with magic and certain spells; e.g. corrupt and fulmination.

Underwater Gathering still not working correctly in most cases

Bow crafting recipes broken - they changed the names of bows from long to longbow (for example), thus breaking all recipes. Either update player recipes or change the bow tables back to the old name.

Armor crafting partially broken - can't drag steel into primary armor slot (incisium works, steel dont).

Zoology Book not gaining Zoology Skill

Taste Identification is missing

Refining doesnt work. The Primarys Materials are lost and the Catalysts go back to Inventory

Writing Books not working correctly
______________
Category 6
General Bugs and other stuff not fitting elsewhere
______________
Support for Mouse Keys 4 and 5 was removed 

Friendlist Bugs sometime not sending Invitations 

Can only pay taxes on houses up to 15 days in advance, not 20 like the patch notes said.

Logging out some times does not actually remove your character from the game (old problem).

Pressing UI/Mouse mode when cutting wood/mining stops the animation (old bug).
______________
Category 7
Missing Content
______________

New Armors and Weapons dont seem to be in yet

Also normal Clothing is yet to be seen

Seems there are no new Fishes and Plants Implemented (i never heard anything about Birds tough lol)

Feamle Citizens for the Citys are not here yet

Snooping book gone (maybe moved but I have not found it if so).

Bargaining/Haggling not working??

Weight no longer affecting attributes (like skinny, obese), or at least it is not shown.


______________
Category 8
Monsters and AI Issues
______________
Roaming Animals dont really seem to be Roaming but instead still seem to stand at the same spots all the time

Some Mobs without wings dont seem to be realizing that theyre supposed to be walking and not flying through the air 

Some Undead seem to be Stunned and dont react to anything nor move even if hit

Mobs who chased someone once stop roaming and stand still where they are


______________
Category 9
Balancing and Feature Issues
______________
Bandits are too strong and on top near Towns making em Noob Killers 

Even young and undeveloped Enemys deal alot of damage to New Players

Drag and drop looting is terrible idea... bring back the old right click looting. Right now people with loot macros will outloot people who dont have them (google darkfall auto loot macro). Dont give macroers the advantage over non-macroers.

Gathering amount per 1 Click was Increased but the Max Amount per Plant not which doesnt make much of a change to the actual content

It seems that the Support Chat is not always staffed


______________
Category 10
Combat Issues
______________
Foot archery is broken: bow that does 35-40 damage to mob from a mount will do 10-15 damage to the same mob on foot. This is the old bow bug FROM RELEASE - not sure how the hell the devs managed that.

Players still walk into air or into the floor during combat or warp around

Guards shoot through walls.

When hitted by a mob you dont scream and the hit detection effect dont show up, making harder to notice that you are been hit (old bug).



______________
Category 11
Inventory and Item Issues
______________
Stacked items can not be split.



When mounted, equipping or trying to change weapons through drag and drop, will get you stuck on your mount without being able to control it nor dismount.

Looting and Moving Items on Right Click doesnt work

Item Icons are bugging sometimes in the Inventory

Randomly, copper coins show up in your invintory after a transaction where it shouldn't. (Like selling an item for 1g on the Trade Broker, so you pay 10s and sometimes you get some copper coins back).

You cant stack items that you recentelly picked up, you have to close and open your bag so you can stack them.

If you are trying to cook and then realize that you need to split an item, after split it you have to close and open your bag in order to put them at cooking's window skill.


______________
Category 12
Game Crashes
______________

Game Crashes sometimes when Killing your own Pet

Client Crashes when Mounting up

Crash on crafting 2H Hammers

Game crashes or freezes randomly when Alt Tabbing.








I will Update the List regularily so just post any addition and or update or correction and I.ll make sure to move it up into the main post

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Finally there is an "Official response"- Here goes.....

This is from GM Discord-

Please be aware that bugs need to be reported to the bug tracker, found at the official forums. We do appreciate all the help you have give us, however reporting your bugs through the bug tracker allows us to move the bug report over to our internal one based on level of disruption to gameplay.

As long as the issues are being fixed, there is no need to have them publicly listed as this gives the wrong impression to the players that we are not working on the issues at hand. I am closing this thread with a friendly note to, please report the bugs to the bug tracker. This way, I can update them there and move them over internally."

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, what he is essentially saying is that 

as long as we are "working" on stuff, the problems need to be hidden from PUBLIC VIEW (i.e. Potential subscibers)

 

Now, allow me to point your attention to THIS THREAD.

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/threads/prediction-still-broken-wft-man.77928/

So, prediction ios still a mess and nothing is working as intended.

Yes we knew thgey said there "would be bugs" but this is insane- Especially since they are attempting to "hide" the true state of the game to garner a few more subs.

PATHETIC,

EDIT: Will the small team excuse work this time? With SV's track record how long until even a miniscule amount of these bugs will be fixed? Did they push this out too quickly to get a (hopeful) bump in subs before the stockholders meeting? Was this Xpac worth 8 MONTHS of no patches or bug fixes from the ALREADY EXISTING BUGS? Was this a good XPAC?

Tune in next time- Same Bat time, same Bat channel...

Comments

  • FastSlothFastSloth ParisPosts: 132Member

    Ya. I saw that. Didn't even bother to read the whole thread because the other threads give you a summary. And this one:

     

    http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/threads/what-hasnt-been-broken.77758/

    "What HASN'T been broken".

     

    We are quickly getting closer to Henrik's ragequit posting.. :D

  • KostKost Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,975Member
    Originally posted by FastSloth

    We are quickly getting closer to Henrik's ragequit posting.. :D

    That isn't happening anytime soon when as long as he still has some suckers playing the game that he can bilk out of a subscription fee every month.

    He'll drive the train just like he been this last few years, filling people with false hopes and propaganda to get them to continue playing month after month, until it finally (and not a moment too soon) derails completely and crashes into the mountain.

     

  • HancakesHancakes flint, MIPosts: 1,045Member

    "As long as the issues are being fixed, there is no need to have them publicly listed as this gives the wrong impression to the players that we are not working on the issues at hand."

     

    In other words lets brush this under the rug too, Henrik already told the investors how happy the players were with the patch. image

    They delayed the patch 8 months, yet still delivered another package of fail.

  • psykobillypsykobilly NYC, NYPosts: 338Member

     

    I have always been a stong proponent of full disclosure bug listing.  Back when the bug tracker was open to the public and viewable by all, you could see the problems and understand the workarounds.  The devs would respond directly to the issues and the public could bump up priority issues - the system worked.      

    I was the first to say that closing the bug tracker to the public was a terrible idea, and I was right.

    The bottom line is that you have to blame the guy at the top: Henrik Nystrom is an absolutely terrible CEO, with abysmal management skills.  So many of these issues could have been avoided with proper management in place - the guy is just not very bright.

     

     

     

  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by Hancakes

    "As long as the issues are being fixed, there is no need to have them publicly listed as this gives the wrong impression to the players that we are not working on the issues at hand."

     

    In other words lets brush this under the rug too, Henrik already told the investors how happy the players were with the patch. image

    They delayed the patch 8 months, yet still delivered another package of fail.

    Wow- even with all the insane censorship over there some really amusing post(s) are making it through.

    Heres one 

     

     

    <blockquote ugc="" basehtml"="">I just think the approach SV took towards mobs is retarded. I think the conversation went something like this:

    Hmmmm, we need to make MOBs stronger, should we make them more cunning and improve their AI, fix their glitchy behavior and eliminate invisible mobs that magically walk through walls and hit you from miles away?

    Naw lol lets just beef up their hp x1000 and make them hit for 50-80 everytime. Also we should make it so they block even when they are casting and or shooting arrows LOLOLOLOL.

    Fuck you starvault.

     

    From THIS thread http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/threads/bandits-extremely-overpowered.77512/page-11

    Yeah, they are buried in bugs and this time I do not think there is any tiome left to recover (or patience from the remaining subs) Its BAD.

     

     
  • FastSlothFastSloth ParisPosts: 132Member
    Originally posted by Kost
    Originally posted by FastSloth

    We are quickly getting closer to Henrik's ragequit posting.. :D

    That isn't happening anytime soon when as long as he still has some suckers playing the game that he can bilk out of a subscription fee every month.

    He'll drive the train just like he been this last few years, filling people with false hopes and propaganda to get them to continue playing month after month, until it finally (and not a moment too soon) derails completely and crashes into the mountain.

     

    Don't think so, as SV isn't being kept alive by subscriptions but by Henrik's daddy. (And by alive I mean undead.) Well, now I don't exactly know how rich he is, but if he could really afford to throw out $300,000 at his megalomaniac son every quarter, then I'm sure he could as well hire a proper dev team for him?

     

    There will be an end some time soon. You can't even take Henrik's "bla bla everything's going great" as a sign of his will to continue - he's simply stuck, he can't say anything else. :D

  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by FastSloth
    Originally posted by Kost
    Originally posted by FastSloth

    We are quickly getting closer to Henrik's ragequit posting.. :D

    That isn't happening anytime soon when as long as he still has some suckers playing the game that he can bilk out of a subscription fee every month.

    He'll drive the train just like he been this last few years, filling people with false hopes and propaganda to get them to continue playing month after month, until it finally (and not a moment too soon) derails completely and crashes into the mountain.

     

    Don't think so, as SV isn't being kept alive by subscriptions but by Henrik's daddy. (And by alive I mean undead.) Well, now I don't exactly know how rich he is, but if he could really afford to throw out $300,000 at his megalomaniac son every quarter, then I'm sure he could as well hire a proper dev team for him?

     

    There will be an end some time soon. You can't even take Henrik's "bla bla everything's going great" as a sign of his will to continue - he's simply stuck, he can't say anything else. :D

    -This is an interesting point you have raised.

    How can SV be loosing 300K per QUARTER? Thats over a Million yearly  in Loss. That seems extreme for SV having what, 3 paid employees, small office space (which was downgraded) etc... I just dont see the Overhead which amounts to CLOSE to these losses. What is Henricks yearly salary and is there where the major "loss" is coming from?

    I know little of the Swedish Stock market but know a TON of tricks companies in the USA use to show "loss" and from what I have seen the Swedish system is far worse that the USA's concerning what is divulged and public.

    EDIT: we also nknow MO has at minimum 500 subs- At only $15.00/month (its actually more) thats a MINIMUN of an additiopnal $7500 monthly income from subs. ..So add that into this 300K per QUARTER loss and we are hitting around a Million and a Half per year to BREAK EVEN- With that low amount of employee overhead....I dont get it. What am I missing here?

    EDIT 2: Anyone remember almost at the release of MO (right after Open Beta I think) Henrick  was all talking aboiut how SV was going to branch out into other games? I think it was another stockholder meeting when things were "a succesful launch and SV can now begin thinking of branching out into new games"- Or something.

    Anyone have that quote- It would be stellar to read it here with a date attached . =)

  • ArcheAgeFanArcheAgeFan new york, NYPosts: 46Member

    Good lord, my jaw literally dropped scrolling through long list of expansion bugs.

    I would swear this game is still in beta, Goood lord. That is sooooo many bugs not sure if i want to try it out now id wait for archeage. But god look at all that bug jesus christ.

    Im speechless right now for sure, no words can describe what you wrote op. They should be ashamed of themselves.

  • ToferioToferio RandomPosts: 1,403Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
     

    EDIT 2: Anyone remember almost at the release of MO (right after Open Beta I think) Henrick  was all talking aboiut how SV was going to branch out into other games? I think it was another stockholder meeting when things were "a succesful launch and SV can now begin thinking of branching out into new games"- Or something.

    Anyone have that quote- It would be stellar to read it here with a date attached . =)

    The exact quote was that the SV halts development of "other titles" to entirely focus on MO as it had some grave bugs. I've always thought it was just poor form of damage control of the situation back then, to give false impression of SV focusing on something that little bit extra, despite that they should have had all their focus on MO to begin with.

  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by ArcheAgeFan

    Good lord, my jaw literally dropped scrolling through long list of expansion bugs.

    I would swear this game is still in beta, Goood lord. That is sooooo many bugs not sure if i want to try it out now id wait for archeage. But god look at all that bug jesus christ.

    Im speechless right now for sure, no words can describe what you wrote op. They should be ashamed of themselves.

    Yeah- Whats worse though is that list isnt complete nor does it mention the Bugs which were in game (and features turned off/not working properly) from before this latest Patch- This is only the NEW BUGS =O

    But the worse part is their wanting this censored from the Public and placed in a subscriber only Forum- They do not want the bugs "discussed" where a potential subsciber could read what they are in for.

    Fortunatly though, the Forum is ablaze with complaints. They were not givena Patch or Bug fix in 8 months and THIS is what they finally got. Bugs are still in the game from Day 1 and features still turned off. Thie "epic" city of Tindrem which was hyped since Closed Beta is finally here as wll and its...Underwhelming.

    Things not going well and it could NOT have happened to a more deserving company than SV. The C.E.O should have been replaced a year and half ago and yet the pattern continues on to the detriment of this game .

  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by Toferio
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
     

    EDIT 2: Anyone remember almost at the release of MO (right after Open Beta I think) Henrick  was all talking aboiut how SV was going to branch out into other games? I think it was another stockholder meeting when things were "a succesful launch and SV can now begin thinking of branching out into new games"- Or something.

    Anyone have that quote- It would be stellar to read it here with a date attached . =)

    The exact quote was that the SV halts development of "other titles" to entirely focus on MO as it had some grave bugs. I've always thought it was just poor form of damage control of the situation back then, to give false impression of SV focusing on something that little bit extra, despite that they should have had all their focus on MO to begin with.

    Thanks- I knew it was something like that. Wonder what  other titles they were working on, 2 and half years later I have not heard a peep about them =/

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLPosts: 4,507Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
     

    -This is an interesting point you have raised.

    How can SV be loosing 300K per QUARTER? Thats over a Million yearly  in Loss. That seems extreme for SV having what, 3 paid employees, small office space (which was downgraded) etc... I just dont see the Overhead which amounts to CLOSE to these losses. What is Henricks yearly salary and is there where the major "loss" is coming from?

    I know little of the Swedish Stock market but know a TON of tricks companies in the USA use to show "loss" and from what I have seen the Swedish system is far worse that the USA's concerning what is divulged and public.

    EDIT: we also nknow MO has at minimum 500 subs- At only $15.00/month (its actually more) thats a MINIMUN of an additiopnal $7500 monthly income from subs. ..So add that into this 300K per QUARTER loss and we are hitting around a Million and a Half per year to BREAK EVEN- With that low amount of employee overhead....I dont get it. What am I missing here?

    EDIT 2: Anyone remember almost at the release of MO (right after Open Beta I think) Henrick  was all talking aboiut how SV was going to branch out into other games? I think it was another stockholder meeting when things were "a succesful launch and SV can now begin thinking of branching out into new games"- Or something.

    Anyone have that quote- It would be stellar to read it here with a date attached . =)

     The report lists values in SEK (Swedish Kronars).  I think 1 SEK = 15 cents US.. so that's about $45,000

     

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • SaintPhilipSaintPhilip Bree, MIPosts: 713Member
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
     

    -This is an interesting point you have raised.

    How can SV be loosing 300K per QUARTER? Thats over a Million yearly  in Loss. That seems extreme for SV having what, 3 paid employees, small office space (which was downgraded) etc... I just dont see the Overhead which amounts to CLOSE to these losses. What is Henricks yearly salary and is there where the major "loss" is coming from?

    I know little of the Swedish Stock market but know a TON of tricks companies in the USA use to show "loss" and from what I have seen the Swedish system is far worse that the USA's concerning what is divulged and public.

    EDIT: we also nknow MO has at minimum 500 subs- At only $15.00/month (its actually more) thats a MINIMUN of an additiopnal $7500 monthly income from subs. ..So add that into this 300K per QUARTER loss and we are hitting around a Million and a Half per year to BREAK EVEN- With that low amount of employee overhead....I dont get it. What am I missing here?

    EDIT 2: Anyone remember almost at the release of MO (right after Open Beta I think) Henrick  was all talking aboiut how SV was going to branch out into other games? I think it was another stockholder meeting when things were "a succesful launch and SV can now begin thinking of branching out into new games"- Or something.

    Anyone have that quote- It would be stellar to read it here with a date attached . =)

     The report lists values in SEK (Swedish Kronars).  I think 1 SEK = 15 cents US.. so that's about $45,000

     

    Thank you- And that makes a whole lot more sense. I still cant understand a loss that large with the current employees (there are only 3 right?)- But meh =/

  • RainBringerRainBringer AucklandPosts: 150Member

    Well how is this any different from Release, Epic1, Dawn, Epic2, saviour patch #xxx?

     

    Im sure by now, the hardcore fangirls playing this game have come to embrace bugs and shit that SV throws at them time and time again, its all a part of the MO "charm" as some call it.

     

     

     

    I can even see the next MO expansion in the near distant future, something along the lines of Mortal Online : Resurrection.

    Tis a very simple game with a highly detailed political gameplay. You as the player, need to make a bookface account and Like MO and you get closer to getting a beta invite to the expansion if it ever launches. If you go ahead and buy SV stocks then your chances of receiving Resurrection Beta Disks also increases by decimal fractional values. And if you do all the aforementioned while subbing for more accounts you`ll stand a chance to win a grand prize of a date and romantic dinner with a famous underwear model from Sweden (hint: its not a female).

     

    So as you can see its a very simple yet intricate gameplay but please learn to put up with the bugs that Mortal Online : Resurrection might bring along, like beta invites not getting sent after you Like MO with fake bookface accounts, Beta disks not getting sent after you flush money buying SV stocks and underwear model not showing up after you pay for your own plane ticket and get to Sweden to partake in a fictional romantic date for fangirls.

    Also Conditions Apply.

    image
  • SHOE788SHOE788 Ankeny, IAPosts: 700Member
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
     

    -This is an interesting point you have raised.

    How can SV be loosing 300K per QUARTER? Thats over a Million yearly  in Loss. That seems extreme for SV having what, 3 paid employees, small office space (which was downgraded) etc... I just dont see the Overhead which amounts to CLOSE to these losses. What is Henricks yearly salary and is there where the major "loss" is coming from?

    I know little of the Swedish Stock market but know a TON of tricks companies in the USA use to show "loss" and from what I have seen the Swedish system is far worse that the USA's concerning what is divulged and public.

    EDIT: we also nknow MO has at minimum 500 subs- At only $15.00/month (its actually more) thats a MINIMUN of an additiopnal $7500 monthly income from subs. ..So add that into this 300K per QUARTER loss and we are hitting around a Million and a Half per year to BREAK EVEN- With that low amount of employee overhead....I dont get it. What am I missing here?

    EDIT 2: Anyone remember almost at the release of MO (right after Open Beta I think) Henrick  was all talking aboiut how SV was going to branch out into other games? I think it was another stockholder meeting when things were "a succesful launch and SV can now begin thinking of branching out into new games"- Or something.

    Anyone have that quote- It would be stellar to read it here with a date attached . =)

     The report lists values in SEK (Swedish Kronars).  I think 1 SEK = 15 cents US.. so that's about $45,000

     

    Thank you- And that makes a whole lot more sense. I still cant understand a loss that large with the current employees (there are only 3 right?)- But meh =/

    I believe they have 5 employees. Remember they also license the unreal engine, too.

    The vision was bad and the implementation terrible. It's looking pretty grim for SV

  • CroniteLoreCroniteLore EnglandiumPosts: 99Member
    SV is slow burn (duh), so we'll all have a lot more time to take pot shots at them.

    "In MO, even the haters are hardcore!" - ltank

  • ToferioToferio RandomPosts: 1,403Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SaintPhilip
     

    Things not going well and it could NOT have happened to a more deserving company than SV. The C.E.O should have been replaced a year and half ago and yet the pattern continues on to the detriment of this game .

    I dont think it is possible to replace CEO even if they wanted as he owns the company and 51% of stock.

  • cirsyndiccirsyndic BeogradPosts: 261Member
    Loans. They must be paid. Especially when you take loans to cover loans to cover loans.
  • HancakesHancakes flint, MIPosts: 1,045Member
    Originally posted by RainBringer

    Well how is this any different from Release, Epic1, Dawn, Epic2, saviour patch #xxx?

     

    Its not...same old excuses, laughable marketeers and false claims.  Thats part of the problem, Starvault keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again. 

  • CroniteLoreCroniteLore EnglandiumPosts: 99Member

    Same Doom, Boom and Gloom BS from people not really in the know.  Same ppl that were saying SV was RIP more than two years ago.

    Uber Yawn.

    "In MO, even the haters are hardcore!" - ltank

  • psykobillypsykobilly NYC, NYPosts: 338Member
    Originally posted by cirsyndic
    Loans. They must be paid. Especially when you take loans to cover loans to cover loans.

    No one actually believes that SV is being backed by loans... venture capital, banking, or otherwise.  What institution would loan money to SV?

    Either they are lying about the amount of money they are losing on their financial reports, or they are being gifted the money to cover expenses.

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