I am not happy with starting from level 1 but that is the way it works for all classes except for DK. I have level a couple of characters through some of the Cata changed zones and the zones do look interesting.
I do find the level 1-80 complaint amusing. Many (certainly on this site) have stated that Blizz has catered to casuals but casuals (like me) don't have the burning desire to rush to max level - it is the pvpers and the raiders - the non-casual players. Casual players enjoy the journey.
It really annoys me that modern MMO's have created this mentality of...
"I don't want to have to level a new character to catch up."
It makes no sense to me that games are designed with this mentality in mind. Because when you think about it, the content that you experience while leveling is probably like 95% of the game. Endgame stuff is normally just a few raids and maybe heroic dungeons or whatever...in either case it involves repeating content over...and over...and over. But the leveling content...that's the actual world! And MMO worlds are usually huge.
So this is so stupid to me...why do people view the vast majority of the game content as just a "grind" to get to that 5% end-game where they can repeat the same raids and dungeons over...and over...?
I think the answer lies in the fact that the game will not let you do end-game stuff until you are max level...which basically separates you from your friends. If you make a new character, you really can't play with your max level friends until you are max level. So you just view the largest portion of game content (leveling) as a "grind" because it's standing in the way of you, and what you really want to do, which is play with your buddies.
I really hope that newer games knock these ridiculous barriers between players down. If I want to make a new character, I should be able to play with my buddies from day 1.
I would agree with you, but levelling a new toon in wow is a pretty discouraging experience nowadays. Last time I tried too see what it was like the world was absolutely dead. Doing it the 7th time around is probably more punishment than gaming experience as it stands today.
I am Ok with the Monk starting at level one. I have never played the revamped 1-60 zones because I never had any reason to. This will be a good excuse.
1-60 Dungeons while levelling will be fine because an all Monk group should be viable.
The problem for me will be the 60-85 levelling. I wont be grinding those levels again but I might slowly level up via PVP or dungeons instead. Starting a monk at 55 does not appeal.
It really annoys me that modern MMO's have created this mentality of...
"I don't want to have to level a new character to catch up."
It makes no sense to me that games are designed with this mentality in mind. Because when you think about it, the content that you experience while leveling is probably like 95% of the game. Endgame stuff is normally just a few raids and maybe heroic dungeons or whatever...in either case it involves repeating content over...and over...and over. But the leveling content...that's the actual world! And MMO worlds are usually huge.
So this is so stupid to me...why do people view the vast majority of the game content as just a "grind" to get to that 5% end-game where they can repeat the same raids and dungeons over...and over...?
I think the answer lies in the fact that the game will not let you do end-game stuff until you are max level...which basically separates you from your friends. If you make a new character, you really can't play with your max level friends until you are max level. So you just view the largest portion of game content (leveling) as a "grind" because it's standing in the way of you, and what you really want to do, which is play with your buddies.
I really hope that newer games knock these ridiculous barriers between players down. If I want to make a new character, I should be able to play with my buddies from day 1.
I would agree with you, but levelling a new toon in wow is a pretty discouraging experience nowadays. Last time I tried too see what it was like the world was absolutely dead. Doing it the 7th time around is probably more punishment than gaming experience as it stands today.
That point is mute because at least for the first 3 months of the expansions there will be people everywhere on the medium to busy servers levelling their new panda and chosen class + monks of all shapes and sizes running around.
Personally I like it quiet most of the time because that means mostly I get the quest mobs to myself, instead of the area being somewhat bulldozed. Dungeons and PvP while levelling will also be busier.
Originally posted by Jaedor Originally posted by garrettForget Kung Fu Panda (I had one sentence about that).When writing this I realized that the biggest issue with the new class is starting at Level 1.After the Death Knight started at 55, honestly I see this as a step backwards for Warcraft.Veteran players should be able to start Monks at 55.
This. There's just no way I want to do it again. WTB 1-80 autolevel. Pst.
So what exactly do you "want" to do?
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Starting at level 1 does indeed suck. I told my Raiders, that, yes, we want a monk in the group but you need to be level 90 in about one week's time. You pretty much need to take a week off for that. In the end I leveled 2 chars to 80 on a linked account and will grant my monk 79 levels on release day. I'm happy for that solution.
It really annoys me that modern MMO's have created this mentality of...
"I don't want to have to level a new character to catch up."
It makes no sense to me that games are designed with this mentality in mind. Because when you think about it, the content that you experience while leveling is probably like 95% of the game. Endgame stuff is normally just a few raids and maybe heroic dungeons or whatever...in either case it involves repeating content over...and over...and over. But the leveling content...that's the actual world! And MMO worlds are usually huge.
So this is so stupid to me...why do people view the vast majority of the game content as just a "grind" to get to that 5% end-game where they can repeat the same raids and dungeons over...and over...?
I think the answer lies in the fact that the game will not let you do end-game stuff until you are max level...which basically separates you from your friends. If you make a new character, you really can't play with your max level friends until you are max level. So you just view the largest portion of game content (leveling) as a "grind" because it's standing in the way of you, and what you really want to do, which is play with your buddies.
I really hope that newer games knock these ridiculous barriers between players down. If I want to make a new character, I should be able to play with my buddies from day 1.
I would agree with you, but levelling a new toon in wow is a pretty discouraging experience nowadays. Last time I tried too see what it was like the world was absolutely dead. Doing it the 7th time around is probably more punishment than gaming experience as it stands today.
That point is mute because at least for the first 3 months of the expansions there will be people everywhere on the medium to busy servers levelling their new panda and chosen class + monks of all shapes and sizes running around.
Personally I like it quiet most of the time because that means mostly I get the quest mobs to myself, instead of the area being somewhat bulldozed. Dungeons and PvP while levelling will also be busier.
It's moot for the short while it'll take peeps to get to 90 yep. Past the initial wave it's back to being deadlands. *shrug I don't plan to level a panda anyway so no probleem here!
Originally posted by Aeolron Meh the monk in eq and eq 2 and the friar in DAoC was done better, way better actualy. Plus when gw2 launches oh man it's going to spell some tough times for wow. I'll be in gw2 avoiding the devastation !
The monk is there because,the pandas are there. The pandas are there to attract very young players. The young players that have never experienced the game before. Level one is a great place to start if your someone that has never experienced the game. Thus we have level one monks. Thanks for playing !!!!
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
First Official Appearance of Pandaren - 2003 (Warcraft III: Frozen Throne)
I'm sick of the Kung Fu Panda nonsense. Pandaren have been around longer. Plus, there is nothing kiddie about them. They love to get drunk.
If we are going to complain about Kung Fu Pandas, we should complain about Orcs and Humans. They have been used in other places too, except Blizzard used someone else's idea for them. Pandaren were actually Samwise Didier's creation, not Hollywood's.
QFT!!!! I'm tired of this too!
Although they have the same roles, the way in which they do the roles are different. From what I can gather, the Monk Tank is an evasion tank. The Monk either avoids the damage or delays it over time so there are no huge hits on them. The Monk DPS is much like a rogue/cat form, except there is no build up and finisher moves, it's all dps, all the time. So it's not as spikey. The Monk Healing relies alot of getting in the mist of battle (pun intended). You don't stand in the background healing when it's needed. The only problem is I'm not sure if during raids if monk could be main healer based on the skills listed.
Edit: I'm going to make a Brewmaster. I loved Chen and the Brewmaster in WC3. I love evasion tanks. Warden in lotro, ninja in FFXI...I love em all.
Forget Kung Fu Panda (I had one sentence about that).
When writing this I realized that the biggest issue with the new class is starting at Level 1.
After the Death Knight started at 55, honestly I see this as a step backwards for Warcraft.
Veteran players should be able to start Monks at 55.
Yet another example of why designing your game around end-game and making the leveling process a boring slog through the same rote quests is a Bad Thing.
Originally posted by Ardwulf I don't think "dumbed down" is necessarily accurate either. But there's no question that a lot of character has been scrubbed out of the game in the name of streamlining and balance. One can always hope that some will cone back with the expansion, but I'm not holding my breath.
I think "dumbed down" is entirely accurate. They went from tons of skills in the original to what just a few now? If that is not "dumbed down" I don't know what is. Wow used to be hard, now it is boringly easy.
And of course they make it a lot easier now to switch skillsets than it used to be.
This my kind of class. The freedom to spec how I want to fill any role I want. I love my Paladin in WoW and watched him change over the years from a Hybrid to being forced to play one role at a time. With no freedom to fill any role needed to keep the team going. I was fine with the hybrid tax of not being able to be the best at any role but the freedom of the class is what made me want to play it.
WoW IMO is buring it self out with geare treadmill and classes that are so pigon holed there is no freedom any more. Every spec is the same now. Every fire mages has the same spec, every Holly pally is the same. The saying is true, 'Only WoW can kill WoW!'
"First is the diluting down of the game into a very base format, especially in regards to character format."
Yes and no. You see they dumbed it down but kept all the bad parts. The dungeon/raid only progression, the dead on the outside world setting, and finally the trinity which has been a problem since day one for this game and many others.
"I guess that is just it, Warcraft really has become too big and too streamlined to make any drastic changes to the design."
Not really, that's their ongoing excuse tho for not adding essential upgrades until they lose 2 mil players all at once then suddenly they added new game features that have been requests by RP players since it's launch.
"On a final note, I think leveling a character from 1-80 is a lot to ask most folks that have played WoW for ages. Why not let there be an option to start at 60? Hell, even 70 at this point? In a time where upcoming games are literally trying to change the MMO genre as a whole, Blizzard seems to be on rinse and repeat mode in terms of game mechanics for World of Warcraft. Hopefully the next expansion will really bring the game into the next decade, but by then it may be too late. "
Yep it will be too late. They've already begun the process of alienating their players with their D3 greedy practices. Titan will most likely be their only hope when the dust from the annual pass settles. It's not going to be a pretty crash when it happens either. Leveling in that game is over-rated and boring. Instead of them forcing long time players to start at level 1 they should start at 60 at the very least, but they are too greedy to let that happen, the longer someone is online the more monthly fees they gather.
They can introduce as many classes as they want, I hate the system.
I hate that my Warrior does as much damage as a mage. The tanks all have the same hp, the dds do the same damage and all the healers heal the same amount.
WoW has no hybrids, buff-classes or off-tanks. You either go full dps, full tank or full damage and that's just boring.
The Druid is the best example. Druids could be a class that could adapt to a situation by shape-shifting. Instead, you are either a 100% bear, a 100% moonkin or a 100% healer.
Came back to mess in WoW until GW2 launch. The panda mess has no pull to make me play again, seriously. I only play now in pvp. I found the raid and questing to be boring and predictable so at least pvp is different everytime. I definately can't see myself playing a game with pandas running around everywhere, though I do like the idea of a monk class (old D&D fan). Blizzard has (imo) brought WoW to the point of no return for more and more people, myself being one of them. If they would have added any other playable class besides a panda or somehow made a third faction would have been better than this, now that the main storyline has come to a conclusion from the Warcraft lineage.
yeah after all these years of wow i cant really understand why people actually play this game still , it offers about the least amount of content of any other triple A game yet they charge more money then anything else. You guys been raiding dragon soul for what now 8 months with no updates? before that firelands for 5 months? Seriously Blizzards sucks stop supporting those tards , give it to another more deserving company, there is plenty out there.
Comments
I am not happy with starting from level 1 but that is the way it works for all classes except for DK. I have level a couple of characters through some of the Cata changed zones and the zones do look interesting.
I do find the level 1-80 complaint amusing. Many (certainly on this site) have stated that Blizz has catered to casuals but casuals (like me) don't have the burning desire to rush to max level - it is the pvpers and the raiders - the non-casual players. Casual players enjoy the journey.
After grouping with those DKs, i firmly believe that all class should start from level 1!
RIP Orc Choppa
I would agree with you, but levelling a new toon in wow is a pretty discouraging experience nowadays. Last time I tried too see what it was like the world was absolutely dead. Doing it the 7th time around is probably more punishment than gaming experience as it stands today.
I am Ok with the Monk starting at level one. I have never played the revamped 1-60 zones because I never had any reason to. This will be a good excuse.
1-60 Dungeons while levelling will be fine because an all Monk group should be viable.
The problem for me will be the 60-85 levelling. I wont be grinding those levels again but I might slowly level up via PVP or dungeons instead. Starting a monk at 55 does not appeal.
That point is mute because at least for the first 3 months of the expansions there will be people everywhere on the medium to busy servers levelling their new panda and chosen class + monks of all shapes and sizes running around.
Personally I like it quiet most of the time because that means mostly I get the quest mobs to myself, instead of the area being somewhat bulldozed. Dungeons and PvP while levelling will also be busier.
This. There's just no way I want to do it again. WTB 1-80 autolevel. Pst.
So what exactly do you "want" to do?
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
It's moot for the short while it'll take peeps to get to 90 yep. Past the initial wave it's back to being deadlands. *shrug I don't plan to level a panda anyway so no probleem here!
Well, that didn't take long...
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
lol@WoW. Played it off and on. The monk is meh, played it in beta...same old shit. Essentially it is a druid mechanic wise.
Originally posted by Arskaaa
"when players learned tacticks in dungeon/raids, its bread".
QFT!!!! I'm tired of this too!
Although they have the same roles, the way in which they do the roles are different. From what I can gather, the Monk Tank is an evasion tank. The Monk either avoids the damage or delays it over time so there are no huge hits on them. The Monk DPS is much like a rogue/cat form, except there is no build up and finisher moves, it's all dps, all the time. So it's not as spikey. The Monk Healing relies alot of getting in the mist of battle (pun intended). You don't stand in the background healing when it's needed. The only problem is I'm not sure if during raids if monk could be main healer based on the skills listed.
Edit: I'm going to make a Brewmaster. I loved Chen and the Brewmaster in WC3. I love evasion tanks. Warden in lotro, ninja in FFXI...I love em all.
Yet another example of why designing your game around end-game and making the leveling process a boring slog through the same rote quests is a Bad Thing.
unless im mistaken,
the versatility of the monk shares more w the paladin
melee dps / tank / healer
druid:
melee dps (feral) / caster dps (boomkin) / tank / healer
EQ2 fan sites
I think "dumbed down" is entirely accurate. They went from tons of skills in the original to what just a few now? If that is not "dumbed down" I don't know what is. Wow used to be hard, now it is boringly easy.
And of course they make it a lot easier now to switch skillsets than it used to be.
This my kind of class. The freedom to spec how I want to fill any role I want. I love my Paladin in WoW and watched him change over the years from a Hybrid to being forced to play one role at a time. With no freedom to fill any role needed to keep the team going. I was fine with the hybrid tax of not being able to be the best at any role but the freedom of the class is what made me want to play it.
WoW IMO is buring it self out with geare treadmill and classes that are so pigon holed there is no freedom any more. Every spec is the same now. Every fire mages has the same spec, every Holly pally is the same. The saying is true, 'Only WoW can kill WoW!'
"First is the diluting down of the game into a very base format, especially in regards to character format."
Yes and no. You see they dumbed it down but kept all the bad parts. The dungeon/raid only progression, the dead on the outside world setting, and finally the trinity which has been a problem since day one for this game and many others.
"I guess that is just it, Warcraft really has become too big and too streamlined to make any drastic changes to the design."
Not really, that's their ongoing excuse tho for not adding essential upgrades until they lose 2 mil players all at once then suddenly they added new game features that have been requests by RP players since it's launch.
"On a final note, I think leveling a character from 1-80 is a lot to ask most folks that have played WoW for ages. Why not let there be an option to start at 60? Hell, even 70 at this point? In a time where upcoming games are literally trying to change the MMO genre as a whole, Blizzard seems to be on rinse and repeat mode in terms of game mechanics for World of Warcraft. Hopefully the next expansion will really bring the game into the next decade, but by then it may be too late. "
Yep it will be too late. They've already begun the process of alienating their players with their D3 greedy practices. Titan will most likely be their only hope when the dust from the annual pass settles. It's not going to be a pretty crash when it happens either. Leveling in that game is over-rated and boring. Instead of them forcing long time players to start at level 1 they should start at 60 at the very least, but they are too greedy to let that happen, the longer someone is online the more monthly fees they gather.
They can introduce as many classes as they want, I hate the system.
I hate that my Warrior does as much damage as a mage. The tanks all have the same hp, the dds do the same damage and all the healers heal the same amount.
WoW has no hybrids, buff-classes or off-tanks. You either go full dps, full tank or full damage and that's just boring.
The Druid is the best example. Druids could be a class that could adapt to a situation by shape-shifting. Instead, you are either a 100% bear, a 100% moonkin or a 100% healer.