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EA officially determines sub based games are dead.

tiefighter25tiefighter25 Winchester, MAPosts: 937Member

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/08/22/ea-coo-maintains-confidence-in-bioware/

According to EA the sub based model is dead. Perhaps this occured on Feb. 29th of 2012? In which case leap years are bad for sub based MMO's? I'm not sure, EA didn't go into details but they have exit surveys which definitively proove their assertion.

In all seriousness, it's spin statements like this, and their subsequent industry media bylines and articles that keep an unhealthy ammount of ire and discussion going about this title.

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Comments

  • grimalgrimal Stamford, CTPosts: 2,873Member Uncommon
    It's about time the big studios started admitting what many have known for some time.  This declaration is a win-win for all.
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,901Member Uncommon
    Dead? who knows, but there's a lot of cheaper competition out there for sub based games, and that competition will only get tougher when games like GW2, PS2, EQNext, etc release.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • OnomicOnomic TønsbergPosts: 196Member
    It don't belive its dead, but it is very hard for less then awsome games to charge it. You must have a product that is superb in retaining players. If you don't have that your better off with cash shop so you can get a much larger audience to spend a little over time.
  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,187Member Uncommon

    The pure sub-based model *is* essentially dead.  There is no major game title out right now that offers a pure sub-based payment option.  The closest is Lineage, but it is no longer available in the West.  The next would be EVE, but they also sell Isk so that isn't a pure sub model either although with "free" content updates it is close.  RIFT, WoW, and all the rest offer microtransaction content to supplement the subscription.

    I didn't really get that they said subscription is "officially dead".  I don't see any of their other subscription games heading towards F2P.  Do you?

     

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,978Member Uncommon

    They've misunderstood their exit interviews.  They assume that 40% won't pay a subscription, I maintain most of them will (since it really is a small amount of money) if the content is worth the buyers time.

    Apparently they failed to deliver on engaging long term content, but don't seem to realize it yet.

    Don't worry, when people don't stick around for the F2P version either, they'll understand the real issue.

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • ForumPvPForumPvP KingstownPosts: 871Member

    Sub based single player online game was dead cold  before it was even born,many people said that and much more people didnt believe.

     

     

     

    Let's internet

  • tiefighter25tiefighter25 Winchester, MAPosts: 937Member
    Originally posted by Torvaldr

    The pure sub-based model *is* essentially dead.  There is no major game title out right now that offers a pure sub-based payment option.  The closest is Lineage, but it is no longer available in the West.  The next would be EVE, but they also sell Isk so that isn't a pure sub model either although with "free" content updates it is close.  RIFT, WoW, and all the rest offer microtransaction content to supplement the subscription.

    I didn't really get that they said subscription is "officially dead".  I don't see any of their other subscription games heading towards F2P.  Do you?

     

    They didn't state is verbatim, but they did heavily immply that subscription based games are done and furthermore that this was the overriding reason why SWTOR is underperforming.

  • Creslin321Creslin321 Baltimore, MDPosts: 5,359Member

    Denial.

    SWTOR couldn't have possibly failed because it wasn't a very good game...it HAD to be the business model, that's the ticket!

    If the sub model were dead, WoW would not still have like 8 million active players.

    Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  • theAsnatheAsna AsnatownPosts: 321Member
    Originally posted by Kyleran

    ...

    Don't worry, when people don't stick around for the F2P version either, they'll understand the real issue. 

     

    Well. Some can only learn the hard way.

     

    SWTOR isn't that bad a game. But it's neither flesh nor fish. They included the gear treadmill like in other MMOs, but forgot to add those little things people expected (e.g. pazaac, swoop races, non-railed space, etc.). On the other side, despite the good story telling, they didn't have the time or resources to add those little things that truly make a single player CRPG more than just a hack&slash (e.g. more NPCs to interact with for lore / informations, different NPCs to not make the game world feel so static, KOTOR has shown what could have been done with the hacking skill, etc. ).

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,978Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Denial.

    SWTOR couldn't have possibly failed because it wasn't a very good game...it HAD to be the business model, that's the ticket!

    If the sub model were dead, WoW would not still have like 8 million active players.

    Shhh.... don't bring factual evidence into our hyperbole filled discussions.  image

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • ForumPvPForumPvP KingstownPosts: 871Member

    And  a bit more,they do have interesting combat system just because there is so many actions per character and you allmost need every single one of them in battle and it can make fighting quite interesting,BUT if its played by casual player ,lets say he presses buttons once per 2 seconds or maybe even uses mouse to use actionbars,he wont see the difference,BUT if he presses 3 times per second or is very fast in actions anyway ,it will cut actions and get global cooldown but actions wont launch he gets ability delays,its something that people dont see even in worst free to play games.

     

    Let's internet

  • NaeviusNaevius Houston, TXPosts: 334Member Uncommon
    If 40% of people cited subscription as a reason for leaving SWTOR... 60% gave a different reason. :)
  • OziiusOziius Baltimore, MDPosts: 1,388Member Uncommon

    This is just dangerous for a guy like me who has some disposable income. I play a ton of "free" games on my iPad with cash shops and I OVERWHELMINGLY spend more money in cash shops then I ever would on a $15 a month sub. 

     

    It's obviously not a problem for everyone and as long as I can control myself, it will be better for me also... issue is.. I can't...LOL. 

  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kyleran
    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Denial.

    SWTOR couldn't have possibly failed because it wasn't a very good game...it HAD to be the business model, that's the ticket!

    If the sub model were dead, WoW would not still have like 8 million active players.

    Shhh.... don't bring factual evidence into our hyperbole filled discussions.  image

    Exactly.   Subscription based games are not dead.   Look at EVE, people that play EVE and pay for two and three accounts at a time?   Subscription based games are not dead.   The only reason so many games fail is not because they have a sub...it is because they are bad games.   

    image
  • VesaviusVesavius BristolPosts: 7,639Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Denial.

    SWTOR couldn't have possibly failed because it wasn't a very good game...it HAD to be the business model, that's the ticket!

    If the sub model were dead, WoW would not still have like 8 million active players.

     

    And Rift wouldn't still be healthy and actively and robustly developing on an ongoing basis.

     

    I have said the same as you do here before... I am bored of the revenue model being used as a scapegoat for bad games.

     

    EA can suck my nut sack though tbh. Whatever they say I tend to believe the opposite is true.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,587Member Uncommon

    Has someone told EA there is a difference between a dead game and a dead business model?

  • NephaeriusNephaerius Baltimore, MDPosts: 1,539Member Uncommon

    It's not just SWTOR here.  EA is also the publisher for Funcom's TSW and all signs point to the fact that's in the tank now too.

    Either way, I actually agree with EA.  There's literally no game I will ever pay a sub for again.  If I had no other options I would rather go without playing an MMO and enjoy all the other games available to me instead.  IMO sub fees simply are not justifiable.  There's nothing "better" about MMOs than any other game, they don't require any more electricity or service to run or maintain their servers than huge multiplayer games out there, I'm charged for content in the majority of games as it's released despite having paid for the development of that content with my sub, there are no less bots, there is no less gold spam, communities are not any better.....

    This is not a money cost issue.  I have plenty of cash as a grown adult with full time employment and a graduate level of education.  The subscription could be $0.01 and I would still refuse to pay it.  The issue is one of value for my dollar.  I see no benefit from my subscription dollars spent in any game and I have played pretty much any subscription based MMO you can name.  I'm better off playing an MMO without a sub (current quality titles: LotRO, DDO, Fallen Earth, Aion, etc), spending in game the amount I want as I please or not spending at all, and meanwhile spending the $15 sub money on a new Steam game every month.

    This is clearly all my opinion, but for me and others like me there's simply no suitable justification for a sub in 2012. 

    Steam: Neph

  • AnirethAnireth Posts: 599Member Uncommon
    Well, at least it wasn't piracy that "killed" SWTOR. Blaming it on the payment model is a refreshing idea.

    I'll wait to the day's end when the moon is high
    And then I'll rise with the tide with a lust for life, I'll
    Amass an army, and we'll harness a horde
    And then we'll limp across the land until we stand at the shore

  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Naevius
    If 40% of people cited subscription as a reason for leaving SWTOR... 60% gave a different reason. :)

    I'll wager that most of that 40% said something like "I cannot justify paying a subscription for this single player game."

    image
  • AlotAlot BredaPosts: 1,948Member
    Go cry some more EA, I doubt anyone would care.
  • theAsnatheAsna AsnatownPosts: 321Member
    Originally posted by Creslin321

    ...

    If the sub model were dead, WoW would not still have like 8 million active players.

     

    I'm not sure which payment system WoW uses in asia. But if you look only its american and european customer base then the resulting number could have been reachable by bEAware & Tortanic.

  • RednecksithRednecksith Madison heights, MIPosts: 1,238Member
    Once again EA execs show that they just simply don't understand a damn thing about games or gamers. It would be funny if it weren't so sad.
  • achesomaachesoma Portland, ORPosts: 1,000Member Uncommon

    You got to love the corporate mind.  image

    It's funny because I see the same kind of thought process by suit-monkeys with business degrees in my line of work and I'm in a completely different field.  Do business colleges teach people how to be know-it-alls that live in denial?

    image

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,587Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Teala
    Originally posted by Naevius If 40% of people cited subscription as a reason for leaving SWTOR... 60% gave a different reason. :)
    I'll wager that most of that 40% said something like "I cannot justify paying a subscription for this single player game."

    I'd love to look over all the comments people cited for canceling SWTOR.

    I'd also be willing t obet that of that 40%, a huge portion of those cases, the reasons cited could be prefaced with:

    "For the money,......" and not change the meaning of why they quit.

    Meaning It wasn't that there WAS a subscription in the 1st place, but that the game itself simply didn't justify it.

  • theAsnatheAsna AsnatownPosts: 321Member
    Originally posted by Teala
    Originally posted by Naevius
    If 40% of people cited subscription as a reason for leaving SWTOR... 60% gave a different reason. :)

    I'll wager that most of that 40% said something like "I cannot justify paying a subscription for this single player game."

     

    If I didn't use game time cards I would have written:

    "Either deliver a decent MMO or deliver a decent single player CRPG."

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