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  • ScalplessScalpless Member UncommonPosts: 1,426
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

  • seridanseridan Member UncommonPosts: 1,202
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by Nadia

    how many dungeons did you do?

    Two story, One explorable.

    And you believe the boosts would've helped in the dungeon?

    Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums

  • Masa1Masa1 Member UncommonPosts: 318
    Originally posted by DanitaKusor
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Anyone saying that these buffs are useless: They aren not!. Even 25% speed boost alone could grant a huge advantage over someone who doesn't have the same boost.

    To do what?

    Ok they can run faster... but what do they need to run towards to gain an advantage over another player?

    - A resource node? Nope...

    - A mob? Well I guess but how is that getting an advantage.  Any boss enemy that spawns that will drop good enough loot to worry about will have enough HP to survive until the slower players get there, and most likely enough damage to smack down the first person to arrive.

    - A location?  Well again probably not.  Anyway, with the number of way points in the game and the low cost of teleporting you can pretty much get anywhere very quickly once you have unlocked the waypoints.

    - WvW? Maybe, but again what in WvW can you do solo that running 25% faster will make a difference.  I guess you can run away *cough* coward *cough*.

    If you've played any PvP games before, you should know how important it is to move fast. You're just fooling yourself if you think that 25% movement speed boost doesn't make the difference.

  • GorillaGorilla Member UncommonPosts: 2,235
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

  • Masa1Masa1 Member UncommonPosts: 318
    Originally posted by Gorilla
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

    Gold>Gem price is going to skyrocket, because no one is going to sell their gems for gold with the current rate. So in the end it's going to be a hell to farm all the gold required for gems.

  • stragen001stragen001 Member UncommonPosts: 1,720

    *sigh* 

    This is such a minor issue it is rediculous.

    You go ahead and spend your $$ in the cash shop and get some incredibly minor boosts. What does that get you?

    You get to complete the game quicker? Well I dont want to complete the game quicker, I want to play it fully and enjoy it in all its glory rather than rushing through content

    You get to be better at 1vs1 combat? Well there isnt any 1vs1 PvP, and the bonuses arent allowed in SPvP. In WvW I will still beat you if we do end up in combat because I am more skilled than you.

     

    So what the big deal? Please fill in the blanks below:

     

    Buy Keys from Trading Post

    Open Chests and get bonuses

    ?

    Profit?

    Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  • wildclawwildclaw Member UncommonPosts: 46
    Originally posted by seridan

    And you believe the boosts would've helped in the dungeon?

    Definitely. The 25% movement speed,the health regeneration and the armor would have been huge.

    The damage one would have been useful in a couple of situations, but less so.

     

  • stragen001stragen001 Member UncommonPosts: 1,720
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by Gorilla
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

    Gold>Gem price is going to skyrocket, because no one is going to sell their gems for gold with the current rate. So in the end it's going to be a hell to farm all the gold required for gems.

    Then ANet will adjust the exchange rate. *Shrug*

    Please read the below post BEFORE trying to comment on how the Cash>Gem trade works

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5194343/thread/359948#5194343

    Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  • NadiaNadia Member UncommonPosts: 11,798
    Originally posted by dekou
    And I had more keys than chests. Of course, I only played for 40-ish hours, so your data is more extensive, but I doubt there's a 10:1 ratio. From what I've read, it's more like 4:3.

    ive never heard of keys being as rare as op claims -- but launch is 2 weeks away amd will see soon enough

  • DanitaKusorDanitaKusor Member UncommonPosts: 556

    Well I'm going to head to bed so I can get up at 3am for the stress test (sad I know) but one final thought to leave you on.  These boosts do not last through death.  So if you are thinking of spend RL money on keys to open chest to get these buffs to give you some tiny advantage in WvW then I'm going to find it very amusing when you are running 25% faster than the rest of your team and come around the corner of a keep and run straight into the enemy zerg... lets see what sort of advantage those boosts give you there.

    The Enlightened take things Lightly

  • seridanseridan Member UncommonPosts: 1,202
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by seridan

    And you believe the boosts would've helped in the dungeon?

    Definitely. The 25% movement speed,the health regeneration and the armor would have been huge.

    The damage one would have been useful in a couple of situations, but less so.

     

    I did both Explorable and Story version of Ascalonian Catacombs and never wanted that little extra damage/armor. Switching our playstyles and playing better was enough to defeat the dungeon. Also you do know that those buffs last for 1 hour, our run didn't take 1 hour, it took a lot more do you know how many boosts you'd need just for those (very small) bonuses? I find them useless to be honest, if they come my way from regular play (and they will) I won't delete them, but I won't hunt for them, because in my opinion they are worthless as a means to make a run easy. Sure it might make a run a tiny bit easier but it won't miraculously allow mistakes or a group of really bad players to do the dungeon. Mistakes will still wipe the group, improper playign as well, therefore there is no need to actively hunt for those boosts.

    Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums

  • sammandarsammandar Member Posts: 523
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by seridan

    I don't think that extra damage (+10%) and mitigation (-10%) will make a player better. Bad players will stay bad players no matter their equipment, they won't make the dungeons a lot easier, proper playing and character building is still a lot more important than a damage boost.

    So what happens if both players are just as skillful and 1 has the boosts while the other one doesn't have??? TELL ME.

    Yellow: No two players are ever the same. Please don't use semantics to create a closed-system scenario where two theoritical players are essentally equal, whilst ignoring the element of reality, thus resulting in only one possible outcome. No scenario, is ever "closed", no two players are ever the same (talent, skill, good/bad days), and there is never only one possible outcome.

    I've played in all the BWE's and in all the stress tests. I have mainly focused my gameplay in WVW, so as not to spoil PVE surprises (my peronsal choice - to each his own). In WVW, I have played against players who had obvious advantages over me, higher level (if you pay attention it's easy to tell), better gear and even buffs. Not once was I automatically defeated just because other players had said advantages over me. Yes, I died a lot (mainly cuase I'm overtly aggressive and find myself in difficult situations to get out off), but I also killed a lot (I've become very good at pvp'ing in wvw; i.e. combat strategy, not hiding behind other player's skirts).

    As for SPVP, it won't matter because all players will be equal and in PVE eveyone is playing/working together (especially in dungeons). The only area where there is the possibility of an "unfair advantage" is in WVW; and Anet devs have already told us (SPOILER ALERT) that WVW will be unbalanced and "unfair". Catch is, the point of WVW is not competitive pvp (balanced pvp, we have SPVP for that), the point of WVW is to have fun beating (and yes, getting beaten) players from other servers; sure, even with a certain element of competition (server rankings). If players really want to be serious about their PVP, they should stick with SPVP (not that WVW is serious), but if players want to have fun in various ways (zergs, small team raiding, and major/minor siege warfare) then WVW is for you.

    Just my two cents... cheers!

  • DaezAsterDaezAster Member UncommonPosts: 788
    I had gotten a few chest over one weekend, then a key to open the chest. Upon opening the chest I got another key, a minipet, and a karma boost. What is in the chest is random so you couldn't reliably buy said items and they are not in the cash shop so a player can't actually buy these items. What you could buy is a chance to obtain said items but it's still a gamble. The op has already been proven wrong and then moved the bar which is grasping at straws IMO.....
  • seridanseridan Member UncommonPosts: 1,202
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by dekou
    And I had more keys than chests. Of course, I only played for 40-ish hours, so your data is more extensive, but I doubt there's a 10:1 ratio. From what I've read, it's more like 4:3.

    ive never heard of keys being as rare as op claims -- but launch is 2 weeks away amd will see soon enough

    Keep in mind that sometimes you can find keys inside chests. If you are lucky you can open 2-3 chests with ONE key

    Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums

  • crazynannycrazynanny Member Posts: 173

    I have no idea why so many people here try to make those chests as fair and completely normal balanced thing, while they are yet another typical cash shop item like in many other MMOs. Key drop rate isn't and won't be high enough to obtain it in game(without some serious grinding) because then no one would use cash shop to get them. Seen that countless times already in other MMOs. Sure you can believe in fairies, santa and think it'll be different here, but it's all about $$$ in the end.

    For me that doesn't bode well for GW2, unless there will be backhlash in the community loud enough to make those chests more convinience than advantage or simply to get rid them completely. Because the only thing chests do is breaking immersion by directing you to cash shop - "Hey what's that, how I open this? Well you get your credit card and...". And sadly so far I see fairytells about how they are okay(or this can't be true) because it's anet and GW2...

  • stragen001stragen001 Member UncommonPosts: 1,720
    Originally posted by DaezAster
    I had gotten a few chest over one weekend, then a key to open the chest. Upon opening the chest I got another key, a minipet, and a karma boost. What is in the chest is random so you couldn't reliably buy said items and they are not in the cash shop so a player can't actually buy these items. What you could buy is a chance to obtain said items but it's still a gamble. The op has already been proven wrong and then moved the bar which is grasping at straws IMO.....

    This is the standard MO of a troll.... we should be used to it by now. When their argument is disproved, they move the goalposts..... 

    Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  • sammandarsammandar Member Posts: 523
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by wildclaw

    It is the difference between reasonable and unreasonable time expenditure. But I guess you didn't have the time to read my post.

    you are basing these assumptions soley on your BWE experiences that keys will be hard to get

    how many dungeons did you do?

    So you wildclaw, above everyone else, get to decide what is reasonable and unreasonable time expenditure? I don't see how you get to decide that for me, or anyone else for that matter. And Nadia is right, not only are your assumptions... assumptions and not facts, but they are in essence subjective and they are solely based on your own BWE experiences.

    Case in point, argue an opinion as an opinion, not as fact.

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • Masa1Masa1 Member UncommonPosts: 318
    Originally posted by stragen001
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by Gorilla
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

    Gold>Gem price is going to skyrocket, because no one is going to sell their gems for gold with the current rate. So in the end it's going to be a hell to farm all the gold required for gems.

    Then ANet will adjust the exchange rate. *Shrug*

    Please read the below post BEFORE trying to comment on how the Cash>Gem trade works

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5194343/thread/359948#5194343

    And? They don't adjust it manually. It moves according to purchases. If no one sells gems for Y gold, but people are still buying gems with gold, the price increases all the time.

  • sammandarsammandar Member Posts: 523
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by stragen001
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by Gorilla
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

    Gold>Gem price is going to skyrocket, because no one is going to sell their gems for gold with the current rate. So in the end it's going to be a hell to farm all the gold required for gems.

    Then ANet will adjust the exchange rate. *Shrug*

    Please read the below post BEFORE trying to comment on how the Cash>Gem trade works

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5194343/thread/359948#5194343

    And? They don't adjust it manually. It moves according to purchases. If no one sells gems for Y gold, but people are still buying gems with gold, the price increases all the time.

    Players don't sell gems to other players for their gold and. Players exchange gems for gold from Anet and players exchange gold for gems from Anet. Anet will decide the exchange rate, not the players. John Smith is the economist dev for GW2 and though I'm sure they have multiple automatic mechanisms in place to "run" GW2's economy, there is and will always be someone behind the curtain pulling levers.

  • stragen001stragen001 Member UncommonPosts: 1,720
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by stragen001
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by Gorilla
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

    Gold>Gem price is going to skyrocket, because no one is going to sell their gems for gold with the current rate. So in the end it's going to be a hell to farm all the gold required for gems.

    Then ANet will adjust the exchange rate. *Shrug*

    Please read the below post BEFORE trying to comment on how the Cash>Gem trade works

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5194343/thread/359948#5194343

    And? They don't adjust it manually. It moves according to purchases. If no one sells gems for Y gold, but people are still buying gems with gold, the price increases all the time.

    Although there has been no official word on the below(taken from the above post, which clearly you didnt read) you would have to be very naive to beleive that if the system wasnt working how they wanted it, ANet wouldnt intervene. Sure they want it to work as a free market, but if its not working as intended, they will fix it. You do not buy gold or gems from other players, you buy both from ANet, and ANet set the exchange rate. 

     

    Q. Are there safe guards so that the exchange rates don't get rediculously high or low?

    A. It hasn't been confirmed but it is assumed that ArenaNet have considered this as a possibility and have done something, or will do something, to avoid it. 

    Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  • Masa1Masa1 Member UncommonPosts: 318
    Originally posted by sammandar
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by seridan

    I don't think that extra damage (+10%) and mitigation (-10%) will make a player better. Bad players will stay bad players no matter their equipment, they won't make the dungeons a lot easier, proper playing and character building is still a lot more important than a damage boost.

    So what happens if both players are just as skillful and 1 has the boosts while the other one doesn't have??? TELL ME.

    Yellow: No two players are ever the same. Please don't use semantics to create a closed-system scenario where two theoritical players are essentally equal, whilst ignoring the element of reality, thus resulting in only one possible outcome. No scenario, is ever "closed", no two players are ever the same (talent, skill, good/bad days), and there is never only one possible outcome.

    I've played in all the BWE's and in all the stress tests. I have mainly focused my gameplay in WVW, so as not to spoil PVE surprises (my peronsal choice - to each his own). In WVW, I have played against players who had obvious advantages over me, higher level (if you pay attention it's easy to tell), better gear and even buffs. Not once was I automatically defeated just because other players had said advantages over me. Yes, I died a lot (mainly cuase I'm overtly aggressive and find myself in difficult situations to get out off), but I also killed a lot (I've become very good at pvp'ing in wvw; i.e. combat strategy, not hiding behind other player's skirts).

    As for SPVP, it won't matter because all players will be equal and in PVE eveyone is playing/working together (especially in dungeons). The only area where there is the possibility of an "unfair advantage" is in WVW; and Anet devs have already told us (SPOILER ALERT) that WVW will be unbalanced and "unfair". Catch is, the point of WVW is not competitive pvp (balanced pvp, we have SPVP for that), the point of WVW is to have fun beating (and yes, getting beaten) players from other servers; sure, even with a certain element of competition (server rankings). If players really want to be serious about their PVP, they should stick with SPVP (not that WVW is serious), but if players want to have fun in various ways (zergs, small team raiding, and major/minor siege warfare) then WVW is for you.

    Just my two cents... cheers!

    Just like you didn't bother to answer my question and instead wrote a wall of text, i'm not going to read your wall either.

     

    We both know the answer for my question, you are just too scared to admit it.

     

    So I repeat my question (in case some sane person wants to answer):

    So what happens if both players are just as skillful and 1 has the boosts while the other one doesn't have??? TELL ME.

  • RizelStarRizelStar Member UncommonPosts: 2,773
    Originally posted by Dietengu
    Originally posted by Vannor

    I've only read the first post so I dunno if it's already been said but all those bonuses can be gained by buying food from vendors, from the tradepost or from crafting them yourself using cooking. Including XP ones. Start a human, go to the nearest vendor once in the main world... they have food items with a stat bonus and XP buff on them for 12c each. That's right from the start. I'm sure all races have some nearby.

    This^  http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Food

    lol I realized this last stress test.

    I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

    I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

    P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)

    Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  • Masa1Masa1 Member UncommonPosts: 318
    Originally posted by stragen001
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by stragen001
    Originally posted by Masa1
    Originally posted by Gorilla
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by wildclaw
    Originally posted by stragen001

    Wildclaw - your OP is very misleading. As people have said before, you cannot buy these items directly in the cash shop at all. They are rewards from Black Lion Chests. 

    You contend that the ratio of chest drops to the ratio of key drops is way to high..... I say differently. In BWE3 I got a total of 8 Black Lion Chest drops, and a total of 4 Keys. 

    That seems pretty reasonable to me

    We have already established that black lion chests are tradeable on the trading post. That means that the cash shop keys can be directly turned into the content of said chests.

    Can't keys also be sold on the trading post?

    I'd like to know that too? You can buy keys with gold anyway,   trade gold for gems and buy keys.

    i appreciate the OPs concern but the sky is certainly not falling just yet!

    Gold>Gem price is going to skyrocket, because no one is going to sell their gems for gold with the current rate. So in the end it's going to be a hell to farm all the gold required for gems.

    Then ANet will adjust the exchange rate. *Shrug*

    Please read the below post BEFORE trying to comment on how the Cash>Gem trade works

    http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5194343/thread/359948#5194343

    And? They don't adjust it manually. It moves according to purchases. If no one sells gems for Y gold, but people are still buying gems with gold, the price increases all the time.

    Although there has been no official word on the below(taken from the above post, which clearly you didnt read) you would have to be very naive to beleive that if the system wasnt working how they wanted it, ANet wouldnt intervene. Sure they want it to work as a free market, but if its not working as intended, they will fix it. You do not buy gold or gems from other players, you buy both from ANet, and ANet set the exchange rate. 

     

    Q. Are there safe guards so that the exchange rates don't get rediculously high or low?

    A. It hasn't been confirmed but it is assumed that ArenaNet have considered this as a possibility and have done something, or will do something, to avoid it. 

    The word ASSUMED. I don't ASSUME anything, I only hope for the worst: There won't be any safe guards.

  • Masa1Masa1 Member UncommonPosts: 318
    Originally posted by RizelStar
    Originally posted by Dietengu
    Originally posted by Vannor

    I've only read the first post so I dunno if it's already been said but all those bonuses can be gained by buying food from vendors, from the tradepost or from crafting them yourself using cooking. Including XP ones. Start a human, go to the nearest vendor once in the main world... they have food items with a stat bonus and XP buff on them for 12c each. That's right from the start. I'm sure all races have some nearby.

    This^  http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Food

    lol I realized this last stress test.

    Damage reduction? Speed boost? Damage increase? Wiki knows it all: NO, NO and NO.

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