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GW 2 : Not really free (B2P)

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  • Creslin321Creslin321 Baltimore, MDPosts: 5,359Member

    Even if GW2 came out with a $60 expansion every 6 months, that does not make it remotely similar to a sub game that charges $10 a month.  There are a bunch of flaws with this argument:

    1.  I'm not forced to buy the expansion, and I can play the original game as much as I want without paying anything extra.  But in a sub game, you are forced into paying a sub.  In a sub game, if I buy the game and then play for 3 months, I will be paying for the full game price and 2 months sub, so $80 with our example.  If I do this in a B2P game, I will simply pay the inital price and that's it.  If I want to get an expansion later, I have that option.

    2.  Every single sub-game that I know of charges a box price for expansions anyway, so the argument is kind of moot.  So really, if you consider sub and B2P to be separate pricing models...then just about every sub game is also B2P.  You must buy the game/expansions to play AND pay a sub.  Also, many sub games have a CS too, so they are really triple dipping.

    Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  • laokokolaokoko TaipeiPosts: 2,003Member
    Originally posted by dellirious13
    Originally posted by RizelStar
    Originally posted by laokoko

    That's quite lame.  You DON'T need to pay extra for bank slots, bag slots, character slots.

    It's beginning to look like all those lame f2p games out there.

    Diablo 3 looks like a pay 2 win games with real money auction house.

    Where goes the buy 2 play model with no string attach.

    Fixed.

    Precisely. I will have all extra slots by the end of month 1, and will buy 0 gems. :) (even non-hardcore gamers could do this within 2-3 months, which is shorter than it would take one to earn enough gold in WoW at launch to buy all bank slots).

    Also, addressing the OP, even IF Anet would do an expansion every 6 months (which, as others said, won't happen, once a year maybe), that would STILL be less than a P2P game, because the P2P game would do the $60 for expansion as well as the normal sub fee.

    (Using GW1 compared to WoW as an example--GW1, even if they had released a new expansion every 6 months for 7 years, would cost a total of $700, with main game and 13 expansions! WoW during the same time, with only 4 expantions (im including MoP), would cost $260 for main game and expansions and then $1260 in sub fees, 1520, over twice as much as GW1! for almost 1/3rd of the content (and both games have events, etc etc)). :P

     

     

    EDIT: Basically, even if GW2 releases, i would STILL choose its B2P model over a P2P model, because i would still be getting more content for my money.

    I dont' need to buy character slots, bank slots, bag slots in other lame f2p games too.  I thought the point of b2p is we don't need to do things like that.  ok have a nice day.

  • sinloisinloi dunedin, FLPosts: 198Member Uncommon
    always hated it when people complain about games like this having microtransactions and expansions when p2p games like wow do the same thing. i was flat out told that the spectral mounts and mini pets for sale on wow do not count as micro transactions yet some how a new no stat outfit is pay to win in another game
  • Br3akingDawnBr3akingDawn a City, CAPosts: 1,358Member Uncommon
    even if GW2 isnt completely B2P. i dont care. still gonna play it. still going to buy their expansions. h8ters will be h8ters!

    image

  • sammandarsammandar San Antonio, TXPosts: 523Member
    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Even if GW2 came out with a $60 expansion every 6 months, that does not make it remotely similar to a sub game that charges $10 a month.  There are a bunch of flaws with this argument:

    1.  I'm not forced to buy the expansion, and I can play the original game as much as I want without paying anything extra.  But in a sub game, you are forced into paying a sub.  In a sub game, if I buy the game and then play for 3 months, I will be paying for the full game price and 2 months sub, so $80 with our example.  If I do this in a B2P game, I will simply pay the inital price and that's it.  If I want to get an expansion later, I have that option.

    2.  Every single sub-game that I know of charges a box price for expansions anyway, so the argument is kind of moot.  So really, if you consider sub and B2P to be separate pricing models...then just about every sub game is also B2P.  You must buy the game/expansions to play AND pay a sub.  Also, many sub games have a CS too, so they are really triple dipping.

    I completely agree; people too often ignore the "tripole dipping" going on with P2P games (such as WOW) while storming after B2P games (such as GW2) for having a CS and even expansions. They try and try to redo the math so P2P doesn't sound as horrible as it usually ends up being (for your wallet).

    Considering quality, gameplay, graphics, complexity, cost and "good old fun", bang for your buck, I would argue no one gives you a better deal than GW2.

  • GamerUntouchGamerUntouch smithville ON, ONPosts: 488Member

    It should be obvious why OP is wrong, but I'll explain.

     

    With a sub fee, you're probably getting very little content for 15 dollars a month.

    Maybe a raid if you're lucky, RIFT was known for putting out content really quickly and they had barely that.

    In 4 months you aren't getting 60 dollars worth of updates.

     

    Now, if GW2's expansions are 60 dollars (can't see it being that much, that's the cost of a standalone game), they'd need to be 60 dollars worth of content, it isn't monthly small updates, it's an entire expansion. Factions and Nightfall were standalone games remember.

  • AzureProwerAzurePrower AustraliaPosts: 1,508Member Uncommon

    Is there another way to get the extra bank slots, etc. other than through the cash shop?

  • GamerUntouchGamerUntouch smithville ON, ONPosts: 488Member
    Originally posted by AzurePrower

    Is there another way to get the extra bank slots, etc. other than through the cash shop?

    You CAN buy gems with gold, someone would need to buy the gems first though.

  • sammandarsammandar San Antonio, TXPosts: 523Member
    Originally posted by GamerUntouch
    Originally posted by AzurePrower

    Is there another way to get the extra bank slots, etc. other than through the cash shop?

    You CAN buy gems with gold, someone would need to buy the gems first though.

    I would wait a couple weeks after release to start looking at buying gems with gold. Most likely gems will be outrageously overpriced in first coupe of weeks after release.

  • GamerUntouchGamerUntouch smithville ON, ONPosts: 488Member
    Originally posted by sammandar
    Originally posted by GamerUntouch
    Originally posted by AzurePrower

    Is there another way to get the extra bank slots, etc. other than through the cash shop?

    You CAN buy gems with gold, someone would need to buy the gems first though.

    I would wait a couple weeks after release to start looking at buying gems with gold. Most likely gems will be outrageously overpriced in first coupe of weeks after release.

    Actually they'd probably be the cheapest since it'd be the initial rush of people buying them.

  • sammandarsammandar San Antonio, TXPosts: 523Member
    Originally posted by GamerUntouch
    Originally posted by sammandar
    Originally posted by GamerUntouch
    Originally posted by AzurePrower

    Is there another way to get the extra bank slots, etc. other than through the cash shop?

    You CAN buy gems with gold, someone would need to buy the gems first though.

    I would wait a couple weeks after release to start looking at buying gems with gold. Most likely gems will be outrageously overpriced in first coupe of weeks after release.

    Actually they'd probably be the cheapest since it'd be the initial rush of people buying them.

    If I have gems to sell and people are jumping over each other for a shot at buying one of my gems, how much do you think i'm going to overprice what is a hot and incredibly desirable commodity... I'm going to make them pay dearly!

    Supply and Demand. Considering the fact that gems are purchased with real money, people selling gems are going to want to maximize the value of their investment; in other words, overpricing.

    I would wait. Wait till the market balances itself, the demand decreases a bit and the prices of gems drops.

    Edit: reminds me of Facebok's initially overpriced stock value; just be patient, play the game and wait for the value of gems to go down, then I would start buying.

  • warmaster670warmaster670 Simcoe, ONPosts: 1,384Member

    How does content down the road make it not buy to play? i buy the game, i play it, it dosnt matter if $5000 worth of expansions are released, theres nothing to stop me form logging in with my base game, and playing it, for free.

     

    Box sale+expansions, or box sale +monthly fee+expansio0ns, ya i wonder which one is better....

    Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
    Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.

  • HonnerHonner SydneyPosts: 504Member
    Originally posted by GamerUntouch
    Originally posted by sammandar
    Originally posted by GamerUntouch
    Originally posted by AzurePrower

    Is there another way to get the extra bank slots, etc. other than through the cash shop?

    You CAN buy gems with gold, someone would need to buy the gems first though.

    I would wait a couple weeks after release to start looking at buying gems with gold. Most likely gems will be outrageously overpriced in first coupe of weeks after release.

    Actually they'd probably be the cheapest since it'd be the initial rush of people buying them.

    I think first will be much more demand of gold, because gems can be buy instantly but the gold need to be farm and that need a while.

  • eye_meye_m Notta Chance, ABPosts: 3,133Member Uncommon
    The greatest thing about being unclear on a concept, is it doesn't stop you from making threads about it while you pretend you have a point.

    All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

    I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.

    I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,065Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by GrumpyCharr
    Originally posted by Scellow

    Hi all,

     

    GW 2 has a special buisness model Buy(once)2Play

     

    But it's not really that

     

    Like GW 1 an Add-on will come every 6month so 60$ /6 = 10$ a month

     

    Add-on in guild war universe are importance if you haven't you will be forgoten by all new content ..

     

     

    Just my opinion

     

     

    And sorry for my bad english i'm french :)

    In 7 Years of guild wars they released two additional stand-alone boxes and one expansion.  Not $10/month ... not even close.  GW2 won't do that anyways.

    But then thats because they stopped creating new content for the gaem after 2/3 years.

     

    We can expect about 1 big expansion pack every year from Arenanet.  On top of that there will be digital content available through the Gemshop. 

     

    There however is one thing i dont get, why would anyone (OP) create an account to tell us this old outdated news?

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • rykim86rykim86 winnipeg, MBPosts: 236Member
    Originally posted by laokoko
    Originally posted by dellirious13
    Originally posted by RizelStar
    Originally posted by laokoko

    That's quite lame.  You DON'T need to pay extra for bank slots, bag slots, character slots.

    It's beginning to look like all those lame f2p games out there.

    Diablo 3 looks like a pay 2 win games with real money auction house.

    Where goes the buy 2 play model with no string attach.

    Fixed.

    Precisely. I will have all extra slots by the end of month 1, and will buy 0 gems. :) (even non-hardcore gamers could do this within 2-3 months, which is shorter than it would take one to earn enough gold in WoW at launch to buy all bank slots).

    Also, addressing the OP, even IF Anet would do an expansion every 6 months (which, as others said, won't happen, once a year maybe), that would STILL be less than a P2P game, because the P2P game would do the $60 for expansion as well as the normal sub fee.

    (Using GW1 compared to WoW as an example--GW1, even if they had released a new expansion every 6 months for 7 years, would cost a total of $700, with main game and 13 expansions! WoW during the same time, with only 4 expantions (im including MoP), would cost $260 for main game and expansions and then $1260 in sub fees, 1520, over twice as much as GW1! for almost 1/3rd of the content (and both games have events, etc etc)). :P

     

     

    EDIT: Basically, even if GW2 releases, i would STILL choose its B2P model over a P2P model, because i would still be getting more content for my money.

    I dont' need to buy character slots, bank slots, bag slots in other lame f2p games too.  I thought the point of b2p is we don't need to do things like that.  ok have a nice day.

    Do you understand the difference between the development of a B2P game like Gw2 and a F2P game from Asia?  You obviously don't.

  • heartlessheartless Brooklyn, NYPosts: 4,993Member

    I don't see the issue here. Most games charge a subscription and a box price for their expansions. So in most cases it's $15 a month + $50 for the expansion.

    GW2 will probably be $60 for the expansion, whenever it comes. Still a win in my book.

    image

  • CaldrinCaldrin CwmbranPosts: 4,533Member Uncommon

    yes OP your right..

     

    There will be exp packs that you have to pay for thats fair enough they need to make money... plus they have the cash shop that will have items that people will want to buy so most will end up spending cash there as well.. its just another way to make money..

    No game is really free they always need a way to make money otherwise whats the point lol.. GW2 will need to make more than GW as GW2 running costs will be a lot more...

  • Freedom4u2Freedom4u2 Quebec, QCPosts: 27Member Uncommon

    Because devs should totally work on extensions for free... I'm already thankfull enough not to pay a 15$/month to play this game, so if they charge me a 40$/extension, I'll be more than willing to give it to them.

     

    As for the gem store, it's entirely optionnal, as you can trade gold for gems. So I'll just have to do a couple of events and trade the gold I earned for gems and buy the stuff I need, which mean absolutely nothing. The XP and Karma buff are way not worth it (100% XP from mobs... which is like 120/enemy when you need 10k/level XD)

    image

  • laokokolaokoko TaipeiPosts: 2,003Member
    Originally posted by rykim86
    Originally posted by laokoko
    Originally posted by dellirious13
    Originally posted by RizelStar
    Originally posted by laokoko

    That's quite lame.  You DON'T need to pay extra for bank slots, bag slots, character slots.

    It's beginning to look like all those lame f2p games out there.

    Diablo 3 looks like a pay 2 win games with real money auction house.

    Where goes the buy 2 play model with no string attach.

    Fixed.

    Precisely. I will have all extra slots by the end of month 1, and will buy 0 gems. :) (even non-hardcore gamers could do this within 2-3 months, which is shorter than it would take one to earn enough gold in WoW at launch to buy all bank slots).

    Also, addressing the OP, even IF Anet would do an expansion every 6 months (which, as others said, won't happen, once a year maybe), that would STILL be less than a P2P game, because the P2P game would do the $60 for expansion as well as the normal sub fee.

    (Using GW1 compared to WoW as an example--GW1, even if they had released a new expansion every 6 months for 7 years, would cost a total of $700, with main game and 13 expansions! WoW during the same time, with only 4 expantions (im including MoP), would cost $260 for main game and expansions and then $1260 in sub fees, 1520, over twice as much as GW1! for almost 1/3rd of the content (and both games have events, etc etc)). :P

     

     

    EDIT: Basically, even if GW2 releases, i would STILL choose its B2P model over a P2P model, because i would still be getting more content for my money.

    I dont' need to buy character slots, bank slots, bag slots in other lame f2p games too.  I thought the point of b2p is we don't need to do things like that.  ok have a nice day.

    Do you understand the difference between the development of a B2P game like Gw2 and a F2P game from Asia?  You obviously don't.

    I'm asian so I know.  But I'm comparing it to the hybrid western games.  Aka lotro etc.  And dont' hate on the asian f2p games.  You just think it sucks and have low quality.  But the reality is the most profitable games besides wow are all asian f2p games which you guys probably never heard of.

    Take a look at forbes top 10 most profitable games of 2010.  I'm sure the 2nd and 3rd you probalby never even heard of.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,829Member Uncommon

    OMG THERE IS NO CONTENT, IN 2 MONTHS EVERYONE WILL BE DONE!

    OMG THEY ARE DROWNING US IN CONTENT! THERE IS NOT ENOUGH MONEY IN THE WORLD TO PAY FOR ALL THE XPACKS!

     

    Just another day in the marvelous world of GW2.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by laokoko
    Originally posted by rykim86

    I dont' need to buy character slots, bank slots, bag slots in other lame f2p games too.  I thought the point of b2p is we don't need to do things like that.  ok have a nice day.

    Do you understand the difference between the development of a B2P game like Gw2 and a F2P game from Asia?  You obviously don't.

    I'm asian so I know.  But I'm comparing it to the hybrid western games.  Aka lotro etc.  And dont' hate on the asian f2p games.  You just think it sucks and have low quality.  But the reality is the most profitable games besides wow are all asian f2p games which you guys probably never heard of.

    Take a look at forbes top 10 most profitable games of 2010.  I'm sure the 2nd and 3rd you probalby never even heard of.

    Why would we care about what's popular in Asia?

    Anyway, what you're missing is that the bank slot expansions, etc. are really not needed in GW2. You get five bags by default. That's 100 slots + your first bag's 30 slots. If you buy two bag slots more you'll reach the maximum of seven bags. That'll increase your storage by 40 slots, or ~30%. It doesn't quadruple your storage like in many crappy F2P games.

  • laokokolaokoko TaipeiPosts: 2,003Member
    Originally posted by dekou
    Originally posted by laokoko
    Originally posted by rykim86

    I dont' need to buy character slots, bank slots, bag slots in other lame f2p games too.  I thought the point of b2p is we don't need to do things like that.  ok have a nice day.

    Do you understand the difference between the development of a B2P game like Gw2 and a F2P game from Asia?  You obviously don't.

    I'm asian so I know.  But I'm comparing it to the hybrid western games.  Aka lotro etc.  And dont' hate on the asian f2p games.  You just think it sucks and have low quality.  But the reality is the most profitable games besides wow are all asian f2p games which you guys probably never heard of.

    Take a look at forbes top 10 most profitable games of 2010.  I'm sure the 2nd and 3rd you probalby never even heard of.

    Why would we care about what's popular in Asia?

    Anyway, what you're missing is that the bank slot expansions, etc. are really not needed in GW2. You get five bags by default. That's 100 slots + your first bag's 30 slots. If you buy two bag slots more you'll reach the maximum of seven bags. That'll increase your storage by 40 slots, or ~30%. It doesn't quadruple your storage like in many crappy F2P games.

    Obviously I don't know what I'm talking about.  I actually need to play the game first to know if it get tedious without buying extra bag slots.

    So all of you playing, you don't have "any problem" with running out of bag space quickly?  I heard some complaints on people in beta about running out of bag space quickly.

    (ps, you guys started the talk about other f2p games first, and asians etc).

    (ps another, I thought the default is main bag slot + 4 more), and you can buy 3 more slots with gems or cash not 2 more slots.  That's 50%-60% bigger bag?

  • alf2oooalf2ooo milanPosts: 135Member
    Originally posted by eyelolled
    The greatest thing about being unclear on a concept, is it doesn't stop you from making threads about it while you pretend you have a point.

    /this

    Have a nice day.

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by laokoko

    So all of you playing, you don't have "any problem" with running out of bag space quickly?  I heard some complaints on people in beta about running out of bag space quickly.

    (ps another, I thought the default is main bag slot + 4 more), and you can buy 3 more slots with gems or cash not 2 more slots.  That's 50%-60% bigger bag?

    Maybe it's 4 bags and 3 from cash shop. I'm not 100% sure

    There are merchants everywhere, gold isn't that important, you can transfer your crafting supplies to your storage from anywhere in the world, you don't get much junk loot and there are no pots. So no, I didn't have any problems with storage. During the beta, I didn't even use my bank's non-material slots for anything. In fact, one of my characters had only two 4 slot bags for some reason and I played without noticing that for many hours.

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