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I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Originally posted by Aerowyn Originally posted by evolver1972
2. That is a question everyone has to decide for themselves. Like beauty, Pay2Win is in the eye of the beholder. I personally think the GW2 CS that I've seen doesn't cross that line. That doesn't mean that it won't in the future, but as of right now I don't think it does. If someone thinks it does they have a few choices: Don't play the game. Play the game while talking to the Devs about your issues with the CS in order to try to change it. Play the game anyway and ignore the CS. Play the game anyway, hate the CS and whine about it on mmorpg.com but don't do anything to change it.
true one person may see any sort of +xp item or anything of the sort pay 2 win. For me only time i consider a cash shop pay to win is if they can buy things(usually gear) that is more powerfull than anything you could obtain ingame for free hence in no way do I feel the cash shop being anything close to pay to win.
Yep, that's my personal opinion about CS's in general and GW2's specifically.
I've even heard the ridiculous argument that cosmetics are pay2win because of the in game prestige they can bring.....some people go way over the top I think.
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!
People just have completely different thresholds when it comes to what exactly "Pay to Gain an Advantage" counts as. For some, you would have to be selling high grade weaponry that cannot be obtained anywhere else. For others, it's as minor as simply getting an XP booster that lasts for an hour, or even lower than that, cosmetic gear.
Originally posted by Serin101 tip my hat off to you to finding all these links.
added another one in hot topics about raiding also added videos on all races character creation and a new video under The World showing off some great structures
To be perfectly honest, regarding the Cash Shop stuff, almost all of the gear based items are cosmetic.
An example of this are the boxing gloves here.
They just give cute animations that look cool with a different skill bar. As for Cash Shop buffs, the only one that can seem controversial is the Magic Find buff, because all the other ones (especially any EXP influencing ones) give so little in terms of exp. What were the numbers again? 50% more for a kill? Thats pathetically small. Killstreak? 100% for chain kills.....not really sure how that can be sustained for that long. Here's TotalBiscuit's view on the Cash Shop.
Starts reviewing the items at 28:41.
Hope this is helpful for the topic.
Originally posted by CujoSWAoA Its still just a Theme Park, And everyone is just going to work their way through all the content and then get bored with it. Then they'll come here and start talking about how bad it is.
We get it. You've seen it all before. I've been lurking alot and I've seen the hype followed by the disappointment as well, but that part of the process. It can't be avoided. As the saying goes.....
PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK! (That goes for all games. You're taking a chance that it will suck or get boring.)
Personally I'm going to enjoy my purchase of GW2. I really could care less about any future QQ. I love hanging out on the forums and being part of the pre-launch buzz and excitement.
TLDR: You're Jaded.
Originally posted by bcbully Originally posted by Aerowyn So many threads asking the same questions over and over and over. Same back and forth from people going round and around and around. Many sandbox fans hating on the game only because it's a themepark. Many spreading false information of what the game is and what it's not. So I put together a list of videos I feel show off and explain some of the best aspects of this game and what it has to offer. ENJOY Dynamic Events and PVE Structured PVP WvWvW PVP Personal Story Combat Crafting and Dye System The World Puzzles, Vistas, Extras
Wow you took a lot of time to make this. That being said, the same questions remain.
1. Does GW2 have a viable endgame? There was a game released less than 10 months ago that was crucified for not having a viable endgame.
2. Does the GW2 cash shop cross the line between fluff and pay to win?
You don't have to like the questions or me, but 1000's of posts on this forum alone validates that these two things are points on contention amongst gamers about GW2's fundamental design.
Nice post. I admire the effort.
I was just wondering if , 11 months ago, you could have put a list of videos like the OP did together for that game that released 10 months ago. I remember hearing how great beta was but I never saw much.
I am an old guy that is somewhat new to MMO's but it's the first time that I have seen a true open beta. Maybe it's because I am some what new.
A MMO is like life. It is something to cherish and enjoy upon in it journey. So why race to the end of it. In life at the end you die.
Originally posted by swordmark45 Just added your thread to my blog about videos just now. Don't know why I didn't think of it earlier when I first posted a reply to this thread
added couple more videos to my op:) specifically one about traits under the combat section oh and one on some of the mini pets under the extras section:)
Just added a voice cast video to the hot topic section since I have heard some complaints on the voices although I thought most I have heard did an excellent job.
Originally posted by SteeJanz
and this is something I don't understand people don't see when they compare games like swtor to this one. For swtor we had very limited dev videos and then finaly one beta weekend right before release(unless you got into CB) and people did not see much of the game at all. Over the past months a TON of footage of this game has come out and over 3 beta weekends plus several stress tests people have put a TON of time into the game already. To compare this to what people were shown of swtor prior to release is laughable.
oh I also changed the title of the thread not to confuse people that may take it the wrong way.
Nice post Aerowyn! Very helpful, and I will make my way through it all before headstart hopefully. So far, I've watched the mystic forge segment and it was entertaining.
I found the following portion disheveled:
Guild Wars 2 Complete Beginner Crafting Guide Part 2 (its 2 seperate links depending on where you click)
Thanks again for collecting all these videos for us!
Originally posted by Zooce Nice post Aerowyn! Very helpful, and I will make my way through it all before headstart hopefully. So far, I've watched the mystic forge segment and it was entertaining. I found the following portion disheveled: Guild Wars 2 Complete Beginner Crafting Guide Part 2 (its 2 seperate links depending on where you click) Thanks again for collecting all these videos for us!
thanks for finding that fixed it:)
Originally posted by Derpybird Originally posted by bcbully Wow you took a lot of time to make this. That being said, the same questions remain. 1. Does GW2 have a viable endgame? There was a game released less than 10 months ago that was crucified for not having a viable endgame. 2. Does the GW2 cash shop cross the line between fluff and pay to win? You don't have to like the questions or me, but 1000's of posts on this forum alone validates that these two things are points on contention amongst gamers about GW2's fundamental design. Nice post. I admire the effort.
WoW lost over a million players this past quarter and it has your traditional "endgame".
The thread on the consumption of content is now up to close to 300 pages on the WoW forums. It makes fascinating reading.
You talk like "end game" gear grinds are some kind of nirvana. They're not.
On average, until WoW introducted LFR, only between 5% and 10% of the playerbase ever killed a raid boss. The number of raiding players peaked in Wrath at somewhere between 15% and 20%, which is when I believe they started implementing the progressive content nerfs.
The percentage that actually completed a tier is much lower, with about 1.5% clearing normal firelands.
And I don't think that that people left "that game released 10 months ago" because of lack of endgame but because there was nothing to do. Ilum was broken. There were a handful of dailies you could grind. There were a few flashpoints you could run, if you could get a group together. And not much else. In short, I believe they quit because there wasn't much to actually do, not exclusively because there wasn't multi-tiered raid content.
So how about we just stop pretending that the kind of "end game" content that you're talking about is the make or break of any MMO.
And finally, let's stop pretending the "1000s of posts" are from unique individuals, as opposed to the same small collection of people claiming that the sky is falling.
Reading the first 3 pages of that WoW forum post just makes me because WoW's issue is the same thing that plagues all vertical progression style games in general and themeparks in particular. The only content worthy of delving into is the newest stuff because everything prior to that is outdated by higher stats and gear threadmills. It seriously boggles my mind that gamers think that any developer can implement even a minuscle amount of content to keep the players happy longterm. I've said it once and I'll say it for freaking ever...GW2 will not have this problem and will change the way companies go about doing business. VERTICAL PROGRESSION IS DEAD!
Ohh BTW thanks for the awesome job Aerowyn, although IMO it will still be lost on the trolls and haters alike but none-the-less an amazing job compiling some good videos and the majority of us fans appreciate it.
As for you bcbully.
1. Yes it is viable, because the level up portion is always the best part of a game. Hell SWTOR was a collasal flop but yet the level up portion is regarded as good to great. Seeing as GW2's endgame is promoted at level "1", it doesnt take a rocket scientist to extrapolate out that not having a fundemental transfer of game mechanics at level cap is a bad thing.
2. You've beaten the snot of p2w enough and its still not true on your 90876 post about it as it was the day you made your 1st post. P2W = Power greater then anyone else who doesnt use it.......NOT CONVENIENCE!!!!!!! GW2's cash shop is all about convenience and nothing more!
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2Waiting on: TESONext Flop: Planetside 2Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I suggest you read this thread over on Vanguards new F2P model. That sir is the epitome of Pay To Win.
Originally posted by ellobo29 Enjoyed the game for the potentcial fun that could be had. Im not saying i had fun... but i could see myself having fun in this game if i subscribed but it had too many problems for me to actually spend money. I dont want to subscribe to ANY game this late in its development........what i want is a Quality F2P that i can occasionaly spend a dollar or 5 once in a while for a cosmetic item. Thats not what you get here.....too many restrictions for me to call this F2P. 1. Cant use top tier gear that you find as f2p... seriously what up with dat? gold drops are for subscription users only, fook dat! I find an item off random mob, say to myself oooh thats nice. try to equip it and game says i got to pay to equip an item i already felt i worked for..... 2 Severe bank restrictions,,, your personal inventory is reduced.... i say to myself ok no big deal... i expected that..... Then i find a bank.....YOU CANT EVEN USE HALF THE AVALIABLE SLOTS WTF! you only get 25 slots for free? seriously thats basicly unplayable. So you really believe im only going to find 25 usefull items in game that im going to want to keep around? thats insaine. 3. More then hafl the races and jobs are locked until you pay.....some of this i expected but lock ranger? REALLY? ya ok, whatever FU. 4. Finally the straw that broke the camels back is..... cant own a home without subscription, or real pay. im kinda dissapointed by this one.....some might not care but i did. 5. Restriction on how much gold you can have......SERIOUSLY? Lets be clear.... no one thing on my list is keeping me from playing its the accumalation. Aion might not be a good game but at least its 100% free.... all purchaseable items are cosmetic...... which is why i keep playing.... and occasionaly spend money. So thats the bad how about the good. Grapics on this game are amasing,,,,,, the clipping range and view distance is awesome i feel like i can see miles away. And there is something about the textures i like. Big game= explorers paradise...... maps are huge.... maybe biggest ive ever seen and there are 3 of em. like someone said in chat.... "You will probably play this game to 55 twice and never see all this game has to offer." Many things to do in game makes for sandboxy feel. You can level via Crafting (which i hear is extremely deep and engaging), or level via Adventuring (bashing brains in with my axe), or via Diplomacy. (watched a tutorial seemed interesting). So thats it.... i actually like the game...but id have to buy a subscription to enjoy it fully. and im just not in a place in my life where i want to subscribe to any game really. (just lost a job heh). But in all seriousness if it was just one thing i didnt like....id just spend the cash to unlock it and continue to enjoy the game....but its too much.....too much restriction..... Its like i dont feel SOE wanted me to stay and at least POPULATE the game.....it feels like a big FU. Try out the game for yourself.... let me know do you feel the same way? I hope somebody from SOE is reading this someday. And if they are....I just want them to know i will be spending more in the in-game item shop in guild wars2 and aion then i will in your silly little game because those company's know how to show me they REALLY want my business......
Originally posted by Aerowyn Originally posted by Distopia I'd say the premise of this thread is a challenge to anyone who feels that the longevity of this game is questionable. This is something that no one can know for sure, hence the endless back and forth the OP attempted to answer. The question isn't so much what type of game do they have planned, the question is will it foster long term play? These types of questions will always result in an endless back and forth pre-release. Nice list of videos, but I'd shy away from presenting such a collection as being the answer to the question above. Content is finite.
whats that have to do with my thread title the title was facetious the main question is what sets this game apart and I feel these videos show that. The game/endgame thing was just a poke at the constant threads we see on that question.. nowhere did I say ENDGAME PROOF INSIDE!
I was just going by your wording in the OP. It seemed you were presenting an answer to the endless round and round about endgame.
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It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at one's character in the face of logic and reason- Me
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Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Originally posted by MadKing Originally posted by CujoSWAoA Its still just a Theme Park, And everyone is just going to work their way through all the content and then get bored with it. Then they'll come here and start talking about how bad it is.
Thanks for sharing, you've contributed so much to this thread....
I don't get why people find fun in doing stuff like this, do we really need you to tell us that after release we will see trolls bashing the game? what are you a prophet of some sort?
No offence but I couldn't give a rats ass what others think. I bought this game for me not strangers I don't even know in real life.
First of all, you should calm down.
Secondly. Why would anything you just said offend me?
Unless you were trying to.
But I failed to see anything Offensive in your post. Additionally, if you truly didn't give a "rats ass" about what others think, you would've ignored my post all together.
This thread does offer a lot of quality video links for Guild Wars 2. Lots of people will enjoy the OP's work in sorting these vids.
Originally posted by RizelStar Originally posted by bcbully Originally posted by Aerowyn So many threads asking the same questions over and over and over. Same back and forth from people going round and around and around. Many sandbox fans hating on the game only because it's a themepark. Many spreading false information of what the game is and what it's not. So I put together a list of videos I feel show off and explain some of the best aspects of this game and what it has to offer. ENJOY Dynamic Events and PVE Structured PVP WvWvW PVP Personal Story Combat Crafting and Dye System The World Puzzles, Vistas, Extras
#1: To be honest endgame is subjective beause believe it or not TSW, Tera, and SWTOR have been getting crucified for their endgame.
#2: Brah you getting really annoying about that whole "I still think there is P2W" [ACT]
If you have some common sense you can easily see it's not P2W, fuck the bullshit, I saw you in the latest P2W threads in GW2, someone would post misinformation and for some damn reason you would automactically believe it, then someone would counter the misinformation about pay to win and I know, yes I know you disregard it or act like you didn't read it but will somehow quote and either believe or take in consideration misinformation or a post that's crying "P2W."
I do be paying attention to details.
On this whole P2W b/s well I do admire the effort.
Who are you? Regardless it's kinda cool that you pay such attention to my detail, brah.
I didn't start this fire though. When you hype a game by telling people "The whole game is end game." The turn around and say "We do have a end game." That endgame will be evaluated.
When you have a cash for gold conversion system, and buffs purchasable with gems. People will question if/when, to what degree and in what manner that line was crossed.
Try to keep it civil man.
Originally posted by SteeJanz Nice post. I admire the effort.
No way not about that game. I just got bit by the hype bugged 2 months before release.
As for the orange it was sincere.
Originally posted by bcbully I didn't start this fire though. When you hype a game by telling people "The whole game is end game." The turn around and say "We do have a end game." That endgame will be evaluated.
Your writing here isn't all that great, but it reads like you're saying that the two statements, "the whole game is end game," and "we do have end game" are mutually exclusive. As though this indicates some sort of "flip-flop" on ArenaNet's part; but doesn't the statement "we do have end game, the whole game is end game" make sense? In other words, there is stuff to do at level 80: the same stuff you'll have been doing the whole time. There's no sudden shift in how you play the game.I apologize if that isn't what you meant, but that's how I interpreted it.
To get to the heart of your question though, I'll pose one back to you. What is end game? Is it not simply whatever you can do in the game once you've reached the level cap? If so, then I suggest that GW2 has as much end game as any other MMO, if not more. First of all there's PvP, both instanced and open world, with the latter being likely the best since DAoC and the former a potential e-sport. If PvE is more your style, there are achievements, map completion, titles, and you can still grind to get better gear through dynamic events and dungeons, if that's your thing. Really the only thing that seems to be missing is raiding, and that, I'm guessing, is what this is really about.
Too often people make the mistake of confusing raids with end game when that is simply not accurate. Raids are not the only type of content that qualify as end game. Personally I don't even think they're a particularly good or interesting type of content and I'm glad to see them go. The barrier they put in place to anyone unwilling or unable to make a significant commitment to the game is bad design and bad for the community, and it's not like they're some amazing bastion of infinitely replayable content. You still end up grinding the same raid over and over again, so other than the demand on players to treat the game like it's a job I really don't see how it's very different than an appropriately challenging 5-man dungeon. They mainly serve as a method for content delivery and character progression, and as long as the game can provide those through other avenues there's really no argument to be made for there being no end game. You can certainly say that there's no raiding, and if that's what you love then unfortunately I think that just means this game is not for you. However I find it pretty disingenous that there are so many posts decrying the lack of end game as a whole and not just the lack of raiding. Just because there's no raiding doesn't mean the game has no hope of longevity: there are plenty of ways to play and improve your character without it.
TL;DR: End game can be much more than just raiding.