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People having trouble with the game's difficulty level.

MindTriggerMindTrigger La Quinta, CAPosts: 2,596Member

 

It is interesting, because what it sounds like to me is that some of you haven't figured out the ability and skill system, or you are working in areas that are too high for your current setup.

One thing that is not obvious in this game is that immediately trying to start a Deck path when you start a new character will often leave you too weak in the beginning.  What you have to do is go DPS as you are leveling up, and then start putting points into the Deck you want.  You have to think of it in stages.  Early build is first, where you are just trying to start establishing your character, and then your deck/elite builds which take much more time. DPS seems to be best for early builds, so put points there in the beginning to build up some combat ability.  You can get as much AP as you are willing to work for, and later on it comes much, much faster, so don't worry about your Deck.

I went for a Martial Artist deck in Dragon, which is a Tank.  However, it really doesn't become a Tank until towards the end of getting all the abilities.  Even as far as 2/3 of the way to completing the deck, it still wasn't an effective Tank.  Once I was done and had the deck and the ability to tweak it, it made a killer tank.

I've heard the same problems from people who try to go pure healer from the get-go, and you just can't do it solo.  You have to put points into DPS along the way so you are an effective character as you build up your Ability wheel.

Try to remember that you are going to end up with at least two builds in this game, and for most people, one of them is going to be DPS so you can "level" up.   The Decks are a little confusing, because it seems like they are giving you a path through the game, but for many of those decks, especially non-DPS decks, that just isn't true.

Something else that is really cool about this game, is getting to know your available Abilities and Gear.  I was running an elite dungeon last night, and we just couldn't get past this one boss.  Someone suggested that the tanks and healers switch out one piece of our respective tank and healer gear with a piece from our DPS gear so we could bump our group average DPS up a little.  We did this without changing anything else, and were immediately able to beat the boss after several previous failures.

This game is about being dynamic, and even when you are questing you may have to tweak your abilities and gear to better fit the mobs you are dealing with.  I think it's very fun, but it certainly doesn't hold your hand, especially in the beginning.

A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.

Comments

  • MindTriggerMindTrigger La Quinta, CAPosts: 2,596Member

    By the way, this doesn't apply to everyone.  Some decks are good at combat from early on up until the end, especially the DPS builds.  However, it's very easy to go in another direction with the Ability wheel and leave yourself weak.  If you do, go back to Kingsmouth and redo some quests. You can quickly pick up another 50AP doing that, and then add more abilities that will help you.

    It should also be noted the Decks are not the best builds in the game.  Far from it.  You get your cool outfit reward for completing them, but if you know your Ability wheel, you can also make vital tweaks to them to make them even better.  Nothing is set in stone on that Ability wheel.

    A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.

  • roby55roby55 LondonPosts: 11Member

    Big problem with new players is they keep using just ONE weapon .

    You HAVE to use 2 weapons at once.  By having  2 different weapon skills your  increasing  your damage dramatically because of  The secret worlds resource system  allowing you to Burst  the enemies twice  in quick sucessions . 

     

    Also it would be very helpfull to have a healing skill on your arsenal to reduce  downtime

  • DerrosDerros Posts: 1,077Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by roby55

    Big problem with new players is they keep using just ONE weapon .

    You HAVE to use 2 weapons at once.  By having  2 different weapon skills your  increasing  your damage dramatically because of  The secret worlds resource system  allowing you to Burst  the enemies twice  in quick sucessions . 

     

    Also it would be very helpfull to have a healing skill on your arsenal to reduce  downtime

    Dont know about other weapons, but with AR you really dont need to use 2 weapons, the leech attacks, plus an AR finisher is more than enough to keep you up and kill stuff.

     

    I do mix passives from many other weapons though.

  • tawesstawess LkpgPosts: 2,536Member Uncommon

    This gamre reminds me a lot of early EvE, it was pretty much.. here is your ship and over there is the universe. Now go and die like a happy little monkey. I respect FC for having the brasstackle to launch a game like this in this day and age, not the wisest of moves perhaps but they are sure to have a solid core fans that are devoted on the level of a extremist sect.

     

    Again, not what i would have done but it is their money to invest how they see fit and sinc ei am not a shareholder or investor i could not care less.

  • roby55roby55 LondonPosts: 11Member
    Originally posted by Derros
    Originally posted by roby55

    Big problem with new players is they keep using just ONE weapon .

    You HAVE to use 2 weapons at once.  By having  2 different weapon skills your  increasing  your damage dramatically because of  The secret worlds resource system  allowing you to Burst  the enemies twice  in quick sucessions . 

     

    Also it would be very helpfull to have a healing skill on your arsenal to reduce  downtime

    Dont know about other weapons, but with AR you really dont need to use 2 weapons, the leech attacks, plus an AR finisher is more than enough to keep you up and kill stuff.

     

    I do mix passives from many other weapons though.

    What you said is also True  I did try the pistol/AR build and Im finding using just weapon just fine , But for the rest of the non guns weapons its deffinetly better to use 2weapons at once

  • MindTriggerMindTrigger La Quinta, CAPosts: 2,596Member
    Originally posted by Derros
    Originally posted by roby55

    Big problem with new players is they keep using just ONE weapon .

    You HAVE to use 2 weapons at once.  By having  2 different weapon skills your  increasing  your damage dramatically because of  The secret worlds resource system  allowing you to Burst  the enemies twice  in quick sucessions . 

     

    Also it would be very helpfull to have a healing skill on your arsenal to reduce  downtime

    Dont know about other weapons, but with AR you really dont need to use 2 weapons, the leech attacks, plus an AR finisher is more than enough to keep you up and kill stuff.

     

    I do mix passives from many other weapons though.

    I agree with both of you, and in many areas, you have to have some aoe dps on tap for groups of mobs.  If you are standing their chipping away at one mob at a time in a group of five of them, you are doing it wrong.  I think people are taking a "set it and forget it" approach and are failing when they hit certain areas with different kinds of mobs and groups of mobs.  You have to actually notice what is going wrong, and tweak your setup when you hit something you are having trouble with. 

    A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.

  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko RotterdamPosts: 3,845Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Derros
    Originally posted by roby55

    Big problem with new players is they keep using just ONE weapon .

    You HAVE to use 2 weapons at once.  By having  2 different weapon skills your  increasing  your damage dramatically because of  The secret worlds resource system  allowing you to Burst  the enemies twice  in quick sucessions . 

     

    Also it would be very helpfull to have a healing skill on your arsenal to reduce  downtime

    Dont know about other weapons, but with AR you really dont need to use 2 weapons, the leech attacks, plus an AR finisher is more than enough to keep you up and kill stuff.

     

    I do mix passives from many other weapons though.

    Yes, you probably CAN get through Kingsmouth with only AR.

    BUT you are wasting the dps that you could get from using a consumer skill from a second weapon. Because most builders provide resources for both weapons, that 2nd weapon consumer is essentially "free" dps.

  • DaezAsterDaezAster new york, NYPosts: 803Member

    One of the things I like about combat in this game is how effortlessly you can mix up two weapons. You don't have to swap weapons. I started with ar/shotty and think this is a good starter set. The ar is great for kiting leeching and dps while the shotty is great for hinders and mobs with it's cone attacks. 

  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,616Member Uncommon

    For solo questing....

     

    1. Build for AOE damage

    2. A "survival" build > DPS build... you don't need to tweak your build for different types of mobs as often.

    3. Build for AOE damage

    4. Have 4 active DPS skills and use the other 3 for self-heals...preferably self-heals with a damage (to them) component, This is why the rifle is so popular in survival builds.

    5. Whatever you're building, spend 37 points in the top green miscellaneous abilities asap to get Sleight of Hand. It's an independent 640 HP heal on a 35 second cooldown (potions have a 90 second CD) Use that as one of your 3 self-heals.

    6. Your Green Talisman breakdown should be about 50:50 or 60:40 DPS/Heal. Blue talismans are a different story since they're concentrated: you'll need to add 1 or 2 "tank" (i.e. + HP) talismans to the mix when using blues (or purples.)

    7. The HP you need in a zone depends on 2 factors: how hard the mobs hit you (duh!) AND how fast you self heal. I see people running around the 2nd Transylvania zone with 6 or 7K HP... I have 3700 and it works just fine due to my constant self-heal & mitigation.

    8. Build for AOE damage.

    9. Some "solo quests" really are group quests in disguise. The "protect the sasquatch from the miners" one in blue mountain is the first one of those you'll run into. But...

    10. In any "protect the ____" missions, let them take the aggro if you can. These ain't the typical "die if looked-at-funny" wimp NPCs from other MMOs.

    11. Use passives that enhance the DPS or Heal of your actives, give you self heals or bubbles depending on conditions, mess-up the enemy. Like...

    12. If you're melee DPS, you want to afflict, weaken, penetrate and crit. If you want to kite (risky business here due to densities) look also for hindering abilities in addition to the ones above. Think of penetrate as "the other critical" max damage is achieved with pen + crit.

    13. Build for AOE damage.

     

    All I can think of. image

  • sycofiendsycofiend Frederick, MDPosts: 128Member

    I have been having a lot of Fun doing horizontal weapon skills and trying to figure out what works, what doenst and most importantly what I enjoy.

    I am enjoying the hell out of the questing and story, so I have been in no rush to clear it all, and only up to QL6 content.

    But I have repeated many of the first 3 area quests , treatign them like dailies I suppose, so that I can go back and work wiht different weapons and builds.

    Then I take what I like and move to a harder area with it.

    (I too will drop gear when doing older content to make it more fun)

    I guess I am hooked,  The two games I currently have active subs are EVE and this.

     

     

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member

    I do think the deck builds were missed opportunities.  Decks should have been restricted to the inner ring, to give new players a start on how to layout skills.  As it is, by the time you complete a deck you are past any point of a learning curve and more able to build your own stuff...

    You make me like charity

  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,616Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by asmkm22

    I do think the deck builds were missed opportunities.  Decks should have been restricted to the inner ring, to give new players a start on how to layout skills.  As it is, by the time you complete a deck you are past any point of a learning curve and more able to build your own stuff...

    Exactly right. Decks were supposedly created to help new players transition to this skill system from what they're used to in other themeparks. But they're so heavy on outer wheel skills that anyone who gets far enough to complete one doesn't really need the help any more.

     

    There was an old thread in the TSW beta boards that was an "inner wheel challenge." Reading that was a much better transition into TSW for me than following any deck. In this fashion they are little more than a completion goal for an outfit reward.

  • BigRock411BigRock411 Barrington, ILPosts: 299Member
    Originally posted by Iselin
    Originally posted by asmkm22

    I do think the deck builds were missed opportunities.  Decks should have been restricted to the inner ring, to give new players a start on how to layout skills.  As it is, by the time you complete a deck you are past any point of a learning curve and more able to build your own stuff...

    Exactly right. Decks were supposedly created to help new players transition to this skill system from what they're used to in other themeparks. But they're so heavy on outer wheel skills that anyone who gets far enough to complete one doesn't really need the help any more.

     

    There was an old thread in the TSW beta boards that was an "inner wheel challenge." Reading that was a much better transition into TSW for me than following any deck. In this fashion they are little more than a completion goal for an outfit reward.

    I agree, the decks seem pointless by the time you actually fill one out.

    The inner circle skills are pretty much dummy proof by design, maybe this wasnt its original design but then they changed it later..

  • EvilGeekEvilGeek londonPosts: 1,227Member Uncommon

    Lots of good information here, it so horribly easy to gimp yourself early on, leading to a lot of frustration. Someone mentioned using passives from different weapons, highly recommend people look across all weapons to see what they can use to supplement their build, majority of passives don't require their weapon equipped, running as Blood/AR doesnt stop you from equipping a Pistol passive.

    Also agree about the decks, they should have been first wheel based, some of that solo content can be really unforgiving quite early in the game, if you've specced early in to healing you're going to struggle. I'm just now working towards a deck build, at QL7/8, AP's are coming thick and fast in Egypt, it's almost like you're better off ignoring decks until later.

    image
  • sycofiendsycofiend Frederick, MDPosts: 128Member
    Originally posted by EvilGeek

    Lots of good information here, it so horribly easy to gimp yourself early on, leading to a lot of frustration. Someone mentioned using passives from different weapons, highly recommend people look across all weapons to see what they can use to supplement their build, majority of passives don't require their weapon equipped, running as Blood/AR doesnt stop you from equipping a Pistol passive.

    Also agree about the decks, they should have been first wheel based, some of that solo content can be really unforgiving quite early in the game, if you've specced early in to healing you're going to struggle. I'm just now working towards a deck build, at QL7/8, AP's are coming thick and fast in Egypt, it's almost like you're better off ignoring decks until later.

     

    Agree, Blood has a lot of passives I use, even though I rarely equip a blood focus.

    Been obsessed wiht Guns, AR, Shotty, and Pistol, depending on the situation/.

  • DaezAsterDaezAster new york, NYPosts: 803Member
    Originally posted by EvilGeek

    Lots of good information here, it so horribly easy to gimp yourself early on, leading to a lot of frustration. Someone mentioned using passives from different weapons, highly recommend people look across all weapons to see what they can use to supplement their build, majority of passives don't require their weapon equipped, running as Blood/AR doesnt stop you from equipping a Pistol passive.

    Also agree about the decks, they should have been first wheel based, some of that solo content can be really unforgiving quite early in the game, if you've specced early in to healing you're going to struggle. I'm just now working towards a deck build, at QL7/8, AP's are coming thick and fast in Egypt, it's almost like you're better off ignoring decks until later.

    Agree, passives are one of the more interesting elements of the skill wheel. I think most people will pick the weapons that appeal to them early and maybe not find other weapons as rewarding even when more useful.

  • DrDwarfDrDwarf TeesidePosts: 475Member

    If you are too dumb to do a web search for some professional decks/builds/info it serves you right if you pick up the in game decks.

    The rest of us are laughing at you.

  • mysticmousemysticmouse LOVELAND, COPosts: 107Member Uncommon

    I did not find the game to be to hard, in fact it was much easier than the old days of daoc when soloing could make you lose more xp than you gained for the day when you died. with a decent build soloing was fine and if you where teamed up with a buddy you could zip though a zones missions really fast.

    My issue with the game is that I found combat to be boring overall , the zones too small, and  fighting too many of the same type of mobs over and over . repeating quests was ok once or twice but after that yuck!

    I had a lot of fun in Kingsmouth, some in savage coast but after that not so much.

  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,281Member Uncommon
    New players should have trouble in new games. Crazy huh?
  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,281Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DrDwarf

    If you are too dumb to do a web search for some professional decks/builds/info it serves you right if you pick up the in game decks.

    The rest of us are laughing at you.

    And the rest are laughing at those who google "profesional" builds....

  • ThemePorkThemePork Boston, MAPosts: 312Member
    Originally posted by tawess

    This gamre reminds me a lot of early EvE

    TSW is no way near as hard to get into as the no-tutorial EvE.

    People complaining about TSW's difficulty are most probably children with ADD or just people who don't have the patience and curiosity to learn something new.

    Sure it has a slight learning curve since it isn't a full-on WoW clone like most other recent games but it doesn't require a rocket scientist's IQ either.

  • Ren128Ren128 BrisbanePosts: 68Member Uncommon

    I think quite a few people don't realise that you can use abilities from other weapons (ones you aren't using) as long as they don't have a weapon pre-requisite. Early on, regardless of what you're running with weapon wise, you should really pick up "Lick Your Wounds" for soloing.

     

    Another thing is gear. Often upgrade (higher QL) pieces drop but got the wrong secondary stats. What some people don't realise, is that you can drop a rune to change those stats to something more useful.  Or if you have issues with getting certain slot (head slot seems to be hardest to get) you can just make it. Its not as if you need to level up crafting like in most other games.

     

    But really, if they are having issues they should just ask in General. Unless they're totally rude/bitchy about it, people will give them hints. Seen it happen a few times on the weekend.

     

  • Ambros123Ambros123 Neverneverland, TNPosts: 877Member

    I foresaw a lot of headache in builds in beta and the whole "1000s of deck possibilities" comment as utter BS in one of FC vids as many don't have the synergy needed as certain weapons mesh well with certain weapons and horribely with oithers. 

    There will be popular builds/decks that people will follow like in GW1.  Really see TSW as a mirror of GW1 skill system mechanics.  People google a popular build and roll with that like a ranger going with the typical R/Rt Splinter Barrage build.  Certains zones/mobs will change up a build slightly to be more effective.

    Some people are used to go all out defense or heal and wouldn't think about getting some DPS which would lead to problems like the OP's in the dungeon.  But still swapping out one piece of gear (or two if you count both healer and tank) I don't think it will affect an encounter that much if at all.

  • UsualSuspectUsualSuspect CardiffPosts: 1,243Member
    Originally posted by Iselin

    Exactly right. Decks were supposedly created to help new players transition to this skill system from what they're used to in other themeparks. But they're so heavy on outer wheel skills that anyone who gets far enough to complete one doesn't really need the help any more.

    I think decks should be seen as a guideline at the start of the game. It's like they're saying, this is a deck, it has these abilities, look how they connect with criticals being boosted by this passive to create stronger criticals. Now you can work toward this deck, but please look at how the skills you're buying can link in the same way.

    The thing is, people don't want to actually.. you know.. think. They see a deck and think, "Ooh, I want to be that character class.", not even realising there aren't any character classes. So they plod along, buying random abilities, then wonder why they keep dying.

    Another problem are people who can't seem to get out of the WoW mindset of grind quests, advance, race to end game. Like last night there was someone in Savage Coast who was grumbling about how hard the mobs were, how he can't even solo two yellow mobs, etc. Yellows? I'm in the same place and everything was light blue to me. Why? Because I wasn't rushing, I'd actually gone back to repeat a few quests for extra points, I'd picked up as many side quests as I could, and so on. He had skills of 3 in his weapons, I have 7s, it's no wonder he was having so much trouble.

    When people finally get 'classes' out of their heads, examine the skill wheel a bit more and, more importantly, stop rushing to some imaginary end game, then I think they'd find the difficulty is actually set just right.

  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Amory, MSPosts: 2,544Member Uncommon
    Honestly, I prefer games where I can complete all content with a single spec.  Switching specs to enjoy a different playstyle is another matter entirely though.
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