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So TESO is a WoW Clone....

MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,257Member Uncommon
Well looking over this forum's activity, it seem like the community here views TESO as a WoW clone. This come sup in just about every thread.


But what I want to know is how/why is TESO being considered a WoW clone?



How is TESO considered a WoW clone but GW2 isn't?



TESO seems to share many features with GW2, except it has three faction PvP in the world shared by PvE. You still have active dodge and block mechanics like GW2, and you have class system like GW2, and I heard it has events, but not sure to what extent. Also TESO is being backed by some DAoC developers for PvP.



Sounds closest to GW2 than WoW. So how is it a WoW clone but not GW2?



Honesty, where does the WoW come into this at all?

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Comments

  • ShubawkssShubawkss Canton, GAPosts: 55Member

    I think many people are relating the two as clones because of the "Engine" and the developer's view point on being "Able to Access by Anyone!"

     

    Just my 2c.

  • laokokolaokoko TaipeiPosts: 2,003Member

    I suppose GW2 being b2p made people not calling it a wow clone.  That's probably the biggest reason.

    And if you want to say bad thing about GW2, you'll have a big b2p fan base behind your back waiting to stab you. 

  • MexorillaMexorilla Las Vegas, NVPosts: 313Member

    gw2 fans learned early on that calling a new game a WoW clone was the quickest way to rid this forum of any discussion that is not about gw2.  most people will follow behind the loudest voice.  right now the loudest voice is gw2.

  • OldManFunkOldManFunk BFE, KSPosts: 894Member
    Originally posted by laokoko

    I suppose GW2 being b2p made people not calling it a wow clone.  That's probably the biggest reason.

    And if you want to say bad thing about GW2, you'll have a big b2p fan base behind your back waiting to stab you. 

     

    GW2 isn't a WoW clone because of it's skill system, combat system, zoned world, fair and balanced sPvP, WvW, crafting system, AH features, and focus on events over quest hubs just to name a few features. Now I have to ask, am I wrong?

     

    As far as TESO being called a WoW clone, there are obviously some seriously pissed off Elder Scrolls fans who are upset that the game doesn't live up to their expectations and calling a game a WoW clone is one of the biggest insults you can use on this forum without getting moded.

     

    TESO isn't a WoW clone and neither is GW2.

  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,946Member Uncommon

    OP: I suggest spending some time reading developer interviews and you can answer your own question.

    The people that have said (or intimated) TESO is going to be a WoW clone are the developers themselves, and at the same time distanced TESO gameplay from that of the single player ES titles.

    They have made statements to that effect several times at various outlets, most of which are noted in this very forum.

    There is plenty of hate for what TESO is looking to be, but in this case, much of it appears to be well deserved.

     

  • MadnessRealmMadnessRealm Montreal, QCPosts: 2,716Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by OldManFunk
    Originally posted by laokoko

    I suppose GW2 being b2p made people not calling it a wow clone.  That's probably the biggest reason.

    And if you want to say bad thing about GW2, you'll have a big b2p fan base behind your back waiting to stab you. 

     

    GW2 isn't a WoW clone because of it's skill system, combat system, zoned world, fair and balanced sPvP, WvW, crafting system, AH features, and focus on events over quest hubs just to name a few features. Now I have to ask, am I wrong?

     

    As far as TESO being called a WoW clone, there are obviously some seriously pissed off Elder Scrolls fans who are upset that the game doesn't live up to their expectations and calling a game a WoW clone is one of the biggest insults you can use on this forum without getting moded.

     

    TESO isn't a WoW clone and neither is GW2.

    It could be argued that throwing out what makes a TES game what it is, and replacing it with the traditionnal stuff, is a form of "WoWification" which would in turn cause players to call it a WoW clone. 

     

    I mean let's face is, besides the names, TESO is nothing like a TES game. 

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    Your daily dose of common sense since 2009!

  • dariuszpdariuszp PrzeworskPosts: 182Member

    Not at all. I'm Guild Wars fan and I never saw this game as "wow clone". There is to many differences in character development, quest system, PVP, endgame, progression overall etc.

    TES was consider (also by myself) as WoW clone just because developers on early stages didn't give us much information except that they said few things about accessible game, formula that people know, hero engine (that work under TOR that is pathetic wow clone in many ways) and few other things.

    So most of those people probably catch with TES on early terms and they didn't have new informations so they stay in their ignorance. 

    For me - TES is not WoW clone but also it's not TES. This game is nothing like TES except lore.

  • zipzapzipzap HelsinkiPosts: 123Member
    Originally posted by Mexorilla

    gw2 fans learned early on that calling a new game a WoW clone was the quickest way to rid this forum of any discussion that is not about gw2.  most people will follow behind the loudest voice.  right now the loudest voice is gw2.

    i like how ppl are blaming the GW2 fans for not calling it a WoW clone...

    anyway... the clone talk is BS... it doesnt mean anything it only shows that the player who wrote it is a hater for almost no reason. any1 can call any game a clone if they so wish... hell all games are pong clones coz they are games!! there will always be similarities in a genre. its only in the mmo genre ppl are using this lame excues to flames games. its quite seldom you see ppl screaming that a RTS game is a warcraft clone for an example

  • MadnessRealmMadnessRealm Montreal, QCPosts: 2,716Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Burntvet

    OP: I suggest spending some time reading developer interviews and you can answer your own question.

    The people that have said (or intimated) TESO is going to be a WoW clone are the developers themselves, and at the same time distanced TESO gameplay from that of the single player ES titles.

    They have made statements to that effect several times at various outlets, most of which are noted in this very forum.

    There is plenty of hate for what TESO is looking to be, but in this case, much of it appears to be well deserved.

     

    Pretty much spot on.

    The TES IP, which has existed since 1994 I think, is sort of a sacred cow for the fanbase it's build over all these years. The simple idea of removing major key features that made TES popular is akin to pissing on Freddy Mercury's grave....you don't freaking do that, and will be publicly hanged for doing such. Although Firor seems intent on hanging himself in this case.

    ------
    Your daily dose of common sense since 2009!

  • OldManFunkOldManFunk BFE, KSPosts: 894Member
    Originally posted by MadnessRealm

    It could be argued that throwing out what makes a TES game what it is, and replacing it with the traditionnal stuff, is a form of "WoWification" which would in turn cause players to call it a WoW clone. 

     

    I mean let's face is, besides the names, TESO is nothing like a TES game. 

    Yes, I'll give you that the MMO won't likely be much like its namesake... but to be honest there are a lot of game features that work really well in single player and coop games but not in MMOs. I can understand why a TES MMO that doesn't live up to its namesake would upset the fans but I've read over the feature list and it really doesn't seem to be quite as bad as a WoW clone... to me, maybe I'm wrong, though.

  • AriannaeAriannae Hiding somewhere in the mountains, AKPosts: 40Member
    Originally posted by MadnessRealm
    Originally posted by OldManFunk
    Originally posted by laokoko
     
     

     

    It could be argued that throwing out what makes a TES game what it is, and replacing it with the traditionnal stuff, is a form of "WoWification" which would in turn cause players to call it a WoW clone. 

     

    I mean let's face is, besides the names, TESO is nothing like a TES game. 

     

    It's this. This is the issue with it. I wouldn't necessarily call it a 'WoW clone', per se. But it destroyed any and all semblance to the Elder Scrolls series that the fans (Myself very much included) loved about the games. And I can honestly say, without a single doubt, that anyone that thinks otherwise has not touched an Elder Scrolls game and should not even be partaking in any form of discussion about it.

    The fact that multitudes of MMO players think that it is completely okay to come in and absolutely destroy what makes a game series what it is, while having absolutely no prior experience with said game(s) is absolutely disgusting. It would be like having American Football be turned into Soccer, because there was a mass exodus from Europe and they wanted the sport to change. I can guarantee you that there would be millions of -very- unhappy fans.

    I think it's less about the game being a WoW clone, and more about it being a bitchslap to the TES fans.

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,257Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MadnessRealm

    Originally posted by OldManFunk
    Originally posted by laokoko
    I suppose GW2 being b2p made people not calling it a wow clone.  That's probably the biggest reason. And if you want to say bad thing about GW2, you'll have a big b2p fan base behind your back waiting to stab you. 

     

    GW2 isn't a WoW clone because of it's skill system, combat system, zoned world, fair and balanced sPvP, WvW, crafting system, AH features, and focus on events over quest hubs just to name a few features. Now I have to ask, am I wrong?

     

    As far as TESO being called a WoW clone, there are obviously some seriously pissed off Elder Scrolls fans who are upset that the game doesn't live up to their expectations and calling a game a WoW clone is one of the biggest insults you can use on this forum without getting moded.

     

    TESO isn't a WoW clone and neither is GW2.

    It could be argued that throwing out what makes a TES game what it is, and replacing it with the traditionnal stuff, is a form of "WoWification" which would in turn cause players to call it a WoW clone. 

     

    I mean let's face is, besides the names, TESO is nothing like a TES game. 

     

    Besides name, Guilld Wars 2 is nothing like GW1. WoW is nothing like Warcraft besides name. Not sure how TESO get bashed for not being TES.

    image

  • AriannaeAriannae Hiding somewhere in the mountains, AKPosts: 40Member
    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Originally posted by MadnessRealm
    Originally posted by OldManFunk
    Originally posted by laokoko
     

     

     

     

    Besides name, Guilld Wars 2 is nothing like GW1. WoW is nothing like Warcraft besides name. Not sure how TESO get bashed for not being TES.

    Arena Net produced Guild Wars 1 and is producing Guild Wars 2. Blizzard produced Warcraft, Warcraft II, Warcraft III and World of Warcraft.

    Bethesda produced the Elder Scrolls. Zenimax Online is producing TESO.

    That's fucked up.

  • ZylaxxZylaxx Erlanger, KYPosts: 2,574Member
    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Well looking over this forum's activity, it seem like the community here views TESO as a WoW clone. This come sup in just about every thread.

    But what I want to know is how/why is TESO being considered a WoW clone?

    How is TESO considered a WoW clone but GW2 isn't?

    TESO seems to share many features with GW2, except it has three faction PvP in the world shared by PvE. You still have active dodge and block mechanics like GW2, and you have class system like GW2, and I heard it has events, but not sure to what extent. Also TESO is being backed by some DAoC developers for PvP.

    Sounds closest to GW2 than WoW. So how is it a WoW clone but not GW2?

    Honesty, where does the WoW come into this at all?

    No way in hell is TESO a clone of WoW.  It has some common elements but it also has some common elements of GW2 and DAoC.  Plus it has plenty of innovation.  The people who say it is a clone are jsut haters who throw that phrase around like it means something when in all reality it doesnt.  The guys who hate it are jsut pissed because it isnt a Skyrim MMO. 

     

    Personally I would love a clone of Skyrim in MMO form but am plenty happy that it is doing some things its own way.  I truely look forward to the game.

    Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online

    Playing: GW2
    Waiting on: TESO
    Next Flop: Planetside 2
    Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.

    image

  • deamiandeamian Sandy, UTPosts: 65Member

    MMO's are considered clones of eachother because there is an insanely large number of over sensitive MMO players who lack imagination or forward thinking of any kind.

     

    Do you see racing games being compared like this? because they all have steering wheels in the cars..so they must be clones.

     

    And so it continues

  • HonnerHonner SydneyPosts: 504Member

    but there isn't any gameplay video of TESO yet? or am I wrong?... how can people argue for something that haven't seen yet?

  • StizzledStizzled Springfield, MOPosts: 1,264Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

     

    Besides name, Guilld Wars 2 is nothing like GW1. WoW is nothing like Warcraft besides name. Not sure how TESO get bashed for not being TES.

    The difference here is that going from GW1 to GW2, and from the Warcraft RTS series to WoW, was an upgrade, the devs pushed those IPs foward. They didn't rip anything from them, only added on. With TESO they're just ripping so many things out, the dumbed down MMO combat, strict classes, race locked factions, housing, etc., the list goes on and on. Not to mention that most IPs won't ever get more than one MMO attempt, meaning that this is it, there's basically no hope of ever seeing a true ES MMO.

     

    As for it being called a WoW clone, I dunno, I can't honestly say that I've read people saying it that much. I've seen a lot of people crying about it being a themepark (which isn't the same thing as being a WoW clone) and not a sandbox. Honestly, it being a themepark doesn't bother me, it's the least of my concerns with the game.


  • Garvon3Garvon3 Worcester, MAPosts: 2,898Member

    Well first, they mention WoW several times in almost every interview.

    Second, the PvE side of things is going to focus on singleplayer questing, phasing, and instancing.

    The poor DAoC guy thats running the show seems to be trying to get in the good features of DAoC PvE but the execs are probably stone walling him. He managed to squeak public dungeons in, but we have instanced dungeons too, which means public dungeons will be useless.

  • FuryVFuryV BlahblahblahPosts: 341Member Uncommon

    Wtf is up with these stupid thread titles all the time?  You go into a thread like this thinking you'll be shown facts relating to the thread title, only to discover that's not the case at all.

    Thread title should have been "WHY is TESO considered a WoW clone?"  Not "TESO IS A WOW CLONE".

  • QuicklyScottQuicklyScott BristolPosts: 433Member

    They're all WoW clones with just a few different mechanics.  Even GW2 is a WoW clone.

     

    You start off, you quest and level up, you hit max level then regurgitate developer provided content until you're bored.  WoW clone.

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  • HonnerHonner SydneyPosts: 504Member
    Originally posted by QuicklyScott

    They're all WoW clones with just a few different mechanics.  Even GW2 is a WoW clone.

     

    You start off, you quest and level up, you hit max level then regurgitate developer provided content until you're bored.  WoW clone.

    if you go that way they are EQ clones including WoW

  • Garvon3Garvon3 Worcester, MAPosts: 2,898Member
    Originally posted by deamian

    MMO's are considered clones of eachother because there is an insanely large number of over sensitive MMO players who lack imagination or forward thinking of any kind.

     

    Do you see racing games being compared like this? because they all have steering wheels in the cars..so they must be clones.

     

    And so it continues

    They're called clones because they're very clearly clones. It's not hard to tell when a game has been lifting ideas from another one. Us MMO vets were around to see vastly different MMOs with their own individuality. To us, most modern day "themeparks" seem like clones because they share 95% of the same features and design, while we're used to MMOs that shared maybe 10% of the same design.

    Modern MMO players see games like LotRO and AoC as non WoW clones because, from their perspective, they're radically different from WoW. To those of us used to seeing more unique games...

     

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,257Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Stizzled

    Originally posted by MMOExposed
      Besides name, Guilld Wars 2 is nothing like GW1. WoW is nothing like Warcraft besides name. Not sure how TESO get bashed for not being TES.

    The difference here is that going from GW1 to GW2, and from the Warcraft RTS series to WoW, was an upgrade, the devs pushed those IPs foward. They didn't rip anything from them, only added on. With TESO they're just ripping so many things out, the dumbed down MMO combat, strict classes, race locked factions, housing, etc., the list goes on and on. Not to mention that most IPs won't ever get more than one MMO attempt, meaning that this is it, there's basically no hope of ever seeing a true ES MMO.

     

    As for it being called a WoW clone, I dunno, I can't honestly say that I've read people saying it that much. I've seen a lot of people crying about it being a themepark (which isn't the same thing as being a WoW clone) and not a sandbox. Honestly, it being a themepark doesn't bother me, it's the least of my concerns with the game.

     

    Huh? Dumbing down the combat? When did Elder Scrolls have good combat? Even Skyrim's combat was bashed by the general community. Seem people forget that.


    Also it has active blocking and dodging mechanics now, and better spells to fight with rather than all that useless filler junk found in Oblivion and Skyrim.



    Also race factions are in Skyrim as well. Where you been? The story was a all out war between races. This fit well with the multiplayer side of the game. Since TES doesn't have multiplayer at all. What's to model this after?



    Also housing in TES wasn't big deal since the world was scripted for that. That doesn't work well in a MMO that has large population. Look at DR and MO. These locations would be dominated by a certain group of players. Only other option is to make it Instanced. Which defeats the point.




    Also the main appeal of TES was the exploration in PvE (since it has no PvP). I don't see how you can't explore in TESO.

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  • MadnessRealmMadnessRealm Montreal, QCPosts: 2,716Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MMOExposed
    Originally posted by MadnessRealm
    Originally posted by OldManFunk
    Originally posted by laokoko

    I suppose GW2 being b2p made people not calling it a wow clone.  That's probably the biggest reason.

    And if you want to say bad thing about GW2, you'll have a big b2p fan base behind your back waiting to stab you. 

     

    GW2 isn't a WoW clone because of it's skill system, combat system, zoned world, fair and balanced sPvP, WvW, crafting system, AH features, and focus on events over quest hubs just to name a few features. Now I have to ask, am I wrong?

     

    As far as TESO being called a WoW clone, there are obviously some seriously pissed off Elder Scrolls fans who are upset that the game doesn't live up to their expectations and calling a game a WoW clone is one of the biggest insults you can use on this forum without getting moded.

     

    TESO isn't a WoW clone and neither is GW2.

    It could be argued that throwing out what makes a TES game what it is, and replacing it with the traditionnal stuff, is a form of "WoWification" which would in turn cause players to call it a WoW clone. 

     

    I mean let's face is, besides the names, TESO is nothing like a TES game. 

     

    Besides name, Guilld Wars 2 is nothing like GW1. WoW is nothing like Warcraft besides name. Not sure how TESO get bashed for not being TES.

     

    There's a big difference in perception. GW2 is seen as an improvement to GW1 as well as an attempt to move away from the traditional model common to our industry.  The Warcraft IP (WC1 to WC3) was not an RPG to begin with. In this case there'd be a lot less resistance towards the creation of an MMO based on the IP. Blizzard also did not make the mistake of taking out of the game, but rather to heavily expand upon it through a different medium.

     

    TES on the other hand, is an IP that many players have been wishing to see in the multiplayer/MMO-sphere for a while now. TES is, much like Warcraft is, a very well-established IP. Unlike Warcraft however, TES is an open-ended RPG with a vast lore and features that have really set TES apart. I think this is the main reason why we see such resistance towards TESO. TESO isn't content with the MMO portion, they're replacing the whole RPG part as well.  TESO has also not decided to follow the lore all that much, so you end up with Factions that contains races that shouldn't necessarily be together. A combat system that is quite the opposite of what TES has offered from the beginning. Exploration and Lore set on the side. The more fleshed-out AI is also left out (Radiant AI). Features like housing are left out (because they're too hard according to Matt Firor).

     

    Essentially, if you read Matt Firor's interviews, you'll quickly get the feeling that he doesn't care all that much about TES. He's making DAoC 2 and slapping the TES name on top of it. You'll also see why they're leaving features out (such as housing as mentionned in the previous post, where Firor claimed that it would be too hard to implement). This is why TESO is getting bashed.

    ------
    Your daily dose of common sense since 2009!

  • Garvon3Garvon3 Worcester, MAPosts: 2,898Member
    Originally posted by MadnessRealm
    Originally posted by MMOExposed

     

    Essentially, if you read Matt Firor's interviews, you'll quickly get the feeling that he doesn't care all that much about TES. He's making DAoC 2 and slapping the TES name on top of it. You'll also see why they're leaving features out (such as housing as mentionned in the previous post, where Firor claimed that it would be too hard to implement). This is why TESO is getting bashed.

    I wish he was making DAoC 2. But he's not. He may be trying to replicate the PvP, but the PvE is straight from WoW.

    DAoC had housing. DAoc did NOT have instancing, solo quests, phasing, and all that garbage.

    The only DAoC feature he mentioned was public dungeons, which are pointless when shared with instanced dungeons. In all his interviews he talks about WoW.

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