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What many MMORPGs are missing.

xikribxikrib Richmond, INPosts: 17Member

I've tried out many MMO's in the passed 4 or 5 years. Everything from Runescape to Guild Wars 2. I have noticed, however, that many MMO's are missing out on something that I love.

I love having skills like fishing, woodcutting, mining, cooking, etc. like Runescape has. Many MMO's don't have this. It's what keeps me going back to Runescape (plus the new combat system they're adding). I love how you could level up all these skills, make money off of it, and get better equipment/wood/fish etc. to make plenty of different things.

All in all, I just wish more MMO's had the type of skills Runescape had tha you could actually level up or at least something very close to that. It gives a more lifelike experience in the game.

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Comments

  • ReallyNow10ReallyNow10 Pile It High Town, LAPosts: 2,010Member Common
    Originally posted by xikrib

    I've tried out many MMO's in the passed 4 or 5 years. Everything from Runescape to Guild Wars 2. I have noticed, however, that many MMO's are missing out on something that I love.

    I love having skills like fishing, woodcutting, mining, cooking, etc. like Runescape has. Many MMO's don't have this. It's what keeps me going back to Runescape (plus the new combat system they're adding). I love how you could level up all these skills, make money off of it, and get better equipment/wood/fish etc. to make plenty of different things.

    All in all, I just wish more MMO's had the type of skills Runescape had tha you could actually level up or at least something very close to that. It gives a more lifelike experience in the game.

    Agreed.  Some of the non-combat skills/spells/abilities are the most immersive options in MMORPG gaming.  Makes you feel like your character is more than just a combat puppet, but part of a world.

  • XAPKenXAPKen Northwest, INPosts: 4,941Member Uncommon

    I like those too.  I'm surprised how many games don't even have basic click together crafting from gathered resources.

     

    For me these activities set the MMORPG apart from being just a game.  The more things I can do the better.  Even if I don't do them all, I like to have options.


    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now turned Amateur Game Developer.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  Realm Lords 2 on MMORPG.com
  • FredomSekerZFredomSekerZ Long Beach, CAPosts: 1,156Member

    You're asking for a deep, complex and rich virtual worlds.

    Unfortunatly, mmorpgs today are all about "action action action fight fight fight combat combat combat".

    In-depth crafting, rich stories, immserive open wolrds, community orinted, etc is not what the mass makert wants. Because it's too hard and grind and it's not super super mega fun right off the bat.

  • xikribxikrib Richmond, INPosts: 17Member
    Originally posted by XAPGames

    I like those too.  I'm surprised how many games don't even have basic click together crafting from gathered resources.

     

    For me these activities set the MMORPG apart from being just a game.  The more things I can do the better.  Even if I don't do them all, I like to have options.

    I completely agree. If Runescape had something like... Wild Star or Torchlight 2 graphics with TERA or Vindictus like combat and movement, that would be the ultimate MMO for me.

  • CarnafexCarnafex Morris, ILPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by xikrib

    <snip>Everything from Runescape to Guild Wars 2...

    I love having skills like fishing, woodcutting, mining, cooking, etc. like Runescape has. <snip>

    Although wood-cutting is only in a few AAA-MMOs (GW2 being one of them), most all the recent AAA-MMOs have all those skills and then some.   

  • SythionSythion Salem, ORPosts: 422Member

    Not trying to invalidate your opinion or anything here, there is certainly room for "crafty" games, which should usually trend towards teh sandbox side of things, however I personally hate it when games waste their time and resources on this because mmo players claim it is necessary in every game.

    I have enough mundanity in my own life. In an mmo I want to be a hero, and do awesome and difficult things that many others are not capable of. I do not want to make 100 chairs and try to market them with or without an auction house, or sit in a flipping bar dancing with two phallic tentacles hanging from the back of my head.

    image
  • xikribxikrib Richmond, INPosts: 17Member
    Originally posted by Sythion

    Not trying to invalidate your opinion or anything here, there is certainly room for "crafty" games, which should usually trend towards teh sandbox side of things, however I personally hate it when games waste their time and resources on this because mmo players claim it is necessary in every game.

    I have enough mundanity in my own life. In an mmo I want to be a hero, and do awesome and difficult things that many others are not capable of. I do not want to make 100 chairs and try to market them with or without an auction house, or sit in a flipping bar dancing with two phallic tentacles hanging from the back of my head.

    Haha nicely put. I just really enjoy doing those things and wish some games could put them in there. I like the feeling of living in another world.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,788Member Uncommon

    Adding non-combat features that are done well is great.  Adding the same features done badly is not.  Thet question isn't whether a game has crafting or whatever.  It's whether the side features are any good.

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common
    Originally posted by Quizzical

    Adding non-combat features that are done well is great.  Adding the same features done badly is not.  Thet question isn't whether a game has crafting or whatever.  It's whether the side features are any good.

    Yup. Haven't seen those impelemented in an appealing way. Very often they are just additional grinds and annoyances.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

    You're asking for a deep, complex and rich virtual worlds.

    Unfortunatly, mmorpgs today are all about "action action action fight fight fight combat combat combat".

    In-depth crafting, rich stories, immserive open wolrds, community orinted, etc is not what the mass makert wants. Because it's too hard and grind and it's not super super mega fun right off the bat.

    No it is not hard. How hard is it to click click click on a rock to mine? How hard it is to draw a map?

    Don't confuse what people are NOT interested in doing from hard. Downing a hard mode boss is harder than any of those things.

    But you got the fun part right. If it is not fun, why would i want to spend my precious play time on it?

  • LithuanianLithuanian vilniusPosts: 206Member Uncommon

    I'm not into advertising...but Istaria does have that deep crafting system. Some 44 skils, from Papermaking to Alchemy, then some 16 craft schools*  that uses these skills. Equipment from training tool to triple-socketed mithril or adamantium. Each resource requires certain ability and skill to gather and then another ability and skill to produce stuff. The only thing is money -you will rarely make any fortune by selling, say 50 cedar (basic tree, found almost everywhere) logs, but may try to sell cedar stuff, be it weapons or tools, or even find player, who pays for adding stuff to his plot.

    Fishing? Positive, differtent types of fishes and players who make food - they must go for fish, as well as gather some flora specimens and some of them are buyable with in-game currency only.

    Woodcutting? You won't survive without this in Istaria: tools, weapons, construction  stuff are made and you need to chop tree first.

    Making food (cooking etc) is something that may give one some money, just bacause players may alweays need food, especially higher levelled ones.

    *excluding Dragons, these have 3 separate craft schools.

  • LarsaLarsa NurembergPosts: 990Member
    Originally posted by xikrib

    I've tried out many MMO's in the passed 4 or 5 years. Everything from Runescape to Guild Wars 2. I have noticed, however, that many MMO's are missing out on something that I love.

    I love having skills like fishing, woodcutting, mining, cooking, etc. like Runescape has. Many MMO's don't have this. It's what keeps me going back to Runescape (plus the new combat system they're adding). I love how you could level up all these skills, make money off of it, and get better equipment/wood/fish etc. to make plenty of different things.

    All in all, I just wish more MMO's had the type of skills Runescape had tha you could actually level up or at least something very close to that. It gives a more lifelike experience in the game.

    Non-combat activities are practically gone from the current crop of themepark games. There might be a bit of crafting around but it's usually too little to make crafting worthwhile and far too little to get an in-game economy going.

    You'll have to look at sandbox MMORPGs to find what you're looking for.

    I maintain this List of Sandbox MMORPGs. Please post or send PM for corrections and suggestions.

  • unfetteredunfettered philadelphia, PAPosts: 93Member

    fallen earth?

  • Garvon3Garvon3 Worcester, MAPosts: 2,898Member
    Originally posted by xikrib

    I've tried out many MMO's in the passed 4 or 5 years. Everything from Runescape to Guild Wars 2. I have noticed, however, that many MMO's are missing out on something that I love.

    I love having skills like fishing, woodcutting, mining, cooking, etc. like Runescape has. Many MMO's don't have this. It's what keeps me going back to Runescape (plus the new combat system they're adding). I love how you could level up all these skills, make money off of it, and get better equipment/wood/fish etc. to make plenty of different things.

    All in all, I just wish more MMO's had the type of skills Runescape had tha you could actually level up or at least something very close to that. It gives a more lifelike experience in the game.

    Skills like that, fluff and extra options, you'll only find them in older MMOs, from before WoW released. Or maybe Vanguard.

     

    MMOs these days are designed with very few options. Just nothing but questing to max level.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Garvon3

     

    MMOs these days are designed with very few options. Just nothing but questing to max level.

    What are you smoking? It is LFD and questing to max level.

  • legendsololegendsolo gentPosts: 81Member
    Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

    You're asking for a deep, complex and rich virtual worlds.

    Unfortunatly, mmorpgs today are all about "action action action fight fight fight combat combat combat".

    In-depth crafting, rich stories, immserive open wolrds, community orinted, etc is not what the mass makert wants. Because it's too hard and grind and it's not super super mega fun right off the bat.

    thats one of the reasons i cant enjoy todays mmo's, i dont want an interactive movie but a virtual world where i can live in.

    for a non combat loving mmo player there isnt much out there...really wish i could enjoy them but doing quest after quest killing mobs isnt my cup of tea.

    i dont need fancy graphics, action combat  or being a hero on an epic adventure just a living virtual world with a basic set of non combat features, seems im asking too much...

    image
  • KhaerosKhaeros Monroe, NYPosts: 452Member

    There's a point when menial skills go too far (Firemaking, and even woodcutting to a lesser extent). 

  • PyrateLVPyrateLV Las Vegas, NVPosts: 1,096Member Common
    Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

    You're asking for a deep, complex and rich virtual worlds.

    Unfortunatly, mmorpgs today are all about "action action action fight fight fight combat combat combat".

    In-depth crafting, rich stories, immserive open wolrds, community orinted, etc is not what the mass makert wants. Because it's too hard and grind and it's not super super mega fun right off the bat.

    Yeah pretty much this

    Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
    Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
    Playing: Skyrim
    Following: The Repopulation
    I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
    ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)

  • MiyuukunMiyuukun Broadview Heights, OHPosts: 8Member
    Originally posted by legendsolo
    Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

    You're asking for a deep, complex and rich virtual worlds.

    Unfortunatly, mmorpgs today are all about "action action action fight fight fight combat combat combat".

    In-depth crafting, rich stories, immserive open wolrds, community orinted, etc is not what the mass makert wants. Because it's too hard and grind and it's not super super mega fun right off the bat.

    thats one of the reasons i cant enjoy todays mmo's, i dont want an interactive movie but a virtual world where i can live in.

    for a non combat loving mmo player there isnt much out there...really wish i could enjoy them but doing quest after quest killing mobs isnt my cup of tea.

    i dont need fancy graphics, action combat  or being a hero on an epic adventure just a living virtual world with a basic set of non combat features, seems im asking too much...

    Perhaps these "interactive movies" shouldn't even been called MMO's at all.  They're basically single player games with some multiplayer features added and oh, by the way, gaming companies get to charge you a monthly fee to play them.  Box sales + money coming in monthly until the hapless consumers catch on to our scheme - can life get better?  I submit that it cannot....

  • FredomSekerZFredomSekerZ Long Beach, CAPosts: 1,156Member
    Originally posted by legendsolo
    Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

    You're asking for a deep, complex and rich virtual worlds.

    Unfortunatly, mmorpgs today are all about "action action action fight fight fight combat combat combat".

    In-depth crafting, rich stories, immserive open wolrds, community orinted, etc is not what the mass makert wants. Because it's too hard and grind and it's not super super mega fun right off the bat.

    thats one of the reasons i cant enjoy todays mmo's, i dont want an interactive movie but a virtual world where i can live in.

    for a non combat loving mmo player there isnt much out there...really wish i could enjoy them but doing quest after quest killing mobs isnt my cup of tea.

    i dont need fancy graphics, action combat  or being a hero on an epic adventure just a living virtual world with a basic set of non combat features, seems im asking too much...

    I don't mind combat at all. I love action combat system. But what trully annoyes me is that it takes priority above and beyond anything else, including all the activities it associates with. Questing, story, dungeons, pvp. All the rest is even more shoe-horned than pvp into pve games.

    I'd love an mmorpg where the bulk of the content is sandboxy (not owpvp with no laws of course) with awesome combat and battles to be something you can only do from time to time in short burst. Like 20% of the game. The rest would be a player driven world

  • SythionSythion Salem, ORPosts: 422Member
    Originally posted by Miyuukun

    Perhaps these "interactive movies" shouldn't even been called MMO's at all.  They're basically single player games with some multiplayer features added and oh, by the way, gaming companies get to charge you a monthly fee to play them.  Box sales + money coming in monthly until the hapless consumers catch on to our scheme - can life get better?  I submit that it cannot....

    And perhaps these "sandbox" games shouldn't even be called mmorpg's at all. They're basically just life simulators for people who are lacking such things in a real life, with some lame combat features added. I propose we refer to them as MMOSims from here on out.

    image
  • jmcdermottukjmcdermottuk LiverpoolPosts: 976Member Uncommon

    Apart from the "action" aspect detracting from your non combat content you also have to look at things like the gear treadmill. What's the point of spending all that time and money developing gathering and crafting systems and then immediatly making it redundant by including dropped loot that far surpasses anything that can be crafted?

     

    Not since SWG and DAoC has there been an MMO that I can think of where player crafted items were the best available. Except for EVE, but that's a sandbox rather than a theme-gimme-uber-stuff-now-park.

  • IcewhiteIcewhite Elmhurst, ILPosts: 6,403Member

    First answer that sprung to mind was "Optimism", followed by "Courtesy".  Crafting was honestly pretty far down the list of possible answers.

    Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  • MrlogicMrlogic Posts: 178Member
    Originally posted by xikrib

    I've tried out many MMO's in the passed 4 or 5 years. Everything from Runescape to Guild Wars 2. I have noticed, however, that many MMO's are missing out on something that I love.

    I love having skills like fishing, woodcutting, mining, cooking, etc. like Runescape has. Many MMO's don't have this. It's what keeps me going back to Runescape (plus the new combat system they're adding). I love how you could level up all these skills, make money off of it, and get better equipment/wood/fish etc. to make plenty of different things.

    All in all, I just wish more MMO's had the type of skills Runescape had tha you could actually level up or at least something very close to that. It gives a more lifelike experience in the game.

    Does not both WoW and GW2 have this?Havent tried Runescape so those are my only references. 

  • KiljaedenasKiljaedenas New Westminster, BCPosts: 468Member

    Runescape's crafting system is pretty good, but god damn is that one hell of a grindathon of a game! You have to grind bloody everything. I played it for a couple of years, got bored, decided to try it again a couple of months ago to see how it had evolved and then got a computer virus from it. Fun times :(.

    Where's the any key?

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