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Picking apples? In MY MMO? Really?

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  • evolver1972evolver1972 Port Orchard, WAPosts: 1,118Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    The difference is that most game designers only give you the picking apples quests....throughout the entire game.  In this case, these mundane quests are completely optional.

     

    On top of that, no one here claimed those renown hearts were the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I for one find them a little boring and only have done them if I want a change of pace.  Which, coincidentally, is exactly why they are there.

     

    You can go back to hating on GW2 now.

    In 17 levels of GW2, I killed waves of bandits, I killed waves of cenaurs, I escorted lots of  caravans, and I picked lots of berries.  I may or may not have killed a world boss or two.  At least from what I have seen, content variety is not GW2's strongsuite.  I don't think you can say GW2 offers any greater variety of quests than perhaps WoW or SW:TOR.

    Secondly, a change of pace is good, but the SW:TOR space minigame was also supposed to be a change of pace, yet people expected full-on freeform space travel.  My point is, if you're going to create content for a change of pace, at least make that change of pace fun and engaging.  If it's a boring mess, I'm going to call you out on it, which is what I'm doing right now.


    If you had called them out on the mundane tasks being  a boring mess in your opinion, that would have been fine.  Instead, what you did was take a cheap shot (a completely inaccurate one btw) at both the game's designers and its fanbase.

     

    That's cool if you think the "change of pace" is boring (I thought some of it was too).  However, one of the things said in that quote was that they are looking at the "boring ones" and trying to make them fun.  So, they're doing exactly what you want them to do and you turn around and say they're twisting things.  I don't really understand that "logic".

    image

    You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???

    Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!

  • romanator0romanator0 Glendora, CAPosts: 2,382Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    The difference is that most game designers only give you the picking apples quests....throughout the entire game.  In this case, these mundane quests are completely optional.

     

    On top of that, no one here claimed those renown hearts were the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I for one find them a little boring and only have done them if I want a change of pace.  Which, coincidentally, is exactly why they are there.

     

    You can go back to hating on GW2 now.

    In 17 levels of GW2, I killed waves of bandits, I killed waves of cenaurs, I escorted lots of  caravans, and I picked lots of berries.  I may or may not have killed a world boss or two.  At least from what I have seen, content variety is not GW2's strongsuite.  I don't think you can say GW2 offers any greater variety of quests than perhaps WoW or SW:TOR.

    Secondly, a change of pace is good, but the SW:TOR space minigame was also supposed to be a change of pace, yet people expected full-on freeform space travel.  My point is, if you're going to create content for a change of pace, at least make that change of pace fun and engaging.  If it's a boring mess, I'm going to call you out on it, which is what I'm doing right now.

    This is the problem, you are ignoring the context and focusing on the numbers. You're not looking at these things like you're  helping Farmer John protect his orchard or helping Rancher Sally pick apples for a pie, you're looking at it like you're just killing bandits and picking fruit as the ultimate purpose of what you're doing. You're ignoring what is supposed to make your actions fun and engaging and focusing purely on what you're doing without context. Because of that the problem inherintly lies with you and not the game. You can't call someone out on a game being boring when you are what is making the game boring.

    image

  • HomituHomitu Hometown, HIPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    You see how trolls can twist some words around and claim GW2 fans think what they do not?

  • JimmydeanJimmydean Ypsilanti, MIPosts: 1,270Member
    Originally posted by romanator0
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    The difference is that most game designers only give you the picking apples quests....throughout the entire game.  In this case, these mundane quests are completely optional.

     

    On top of that, no one here claimed those renown hearts were the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I for one find them a little boring and only have done them if I want a change of pace.  Which, coincidentally, is exactly why they are there.

     

    You can go back to hating on GW2 now.

    In 17 levels of GW2, I killed waves of bandits, I killed waves of cenaurs, I escorted lots of  caravans, and I picked lots of berries.  I may or may not have killed a world boss or two.  At least from what I have seen, content variety is not GW2's strongsuite.  I don't think you can say GW2 offers any greater variety of quests than perhaps WoW or SW:TOR.

    Secondly, a change of pace is good, but the SW:TOR space minigame was also supposed to be a change of pace, yet people expected full-on freeform space travel.  My point is, if you're going to create content for a change of pace, at least make that change of pace fun and engaging.  If it's a boring mess, I'm going to call you out on it, which is what I'm doing right now.

    This is the problem, you are ignoring the context and focusing on the numbers. You're not looking at these things like you're  helping Farmer John protect his orchard or helping Rancher Sally pick apples for a pie, you're looking at it like you're just killing bandits and picking fruit as the ultimate purpose of what you're doing. You're ignoring what is supposed to make your actions fun and engaging and focusing purely on what you're doing without context. Because of that the problem inherintly lies with you and not the game. You can't call someone out on a game being boring when you are what is making the game boring.

    True, we all remember how fun the quests were in SWTOR because NPCS told us all about them!

  • romanator0romanator0 Glendora, CAPosts: 2,382Member
    Originally posted by Jimmydean
    Originally posted by romanator0
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    The difference is that most game designers only give you the picking apples quests....throughout the entire game.  In this case, these mundane quests are completely optional.

     

    On top of that, no one here claimed those renown hearts were the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I for one find them a little boring and only have done them if I want a change of pace.  Which, coincidentally, is exactly why they are there.

     

    You can go back to hating on GW2 now.

    In 17 levels of GW2, I killed waves of bandits, I killed waves of cenaurs, I escorted lots of  caravans, and I picked lots of berries.  I may or may not have killed a world boss or two.  At least from what I have seen, content variety is not GW2's strongsuite.  I don't think you can say GW2 offers any greater variety of quests than perhaps WoW or SW:TOR.

    Secondly, a change of pace is good, but the SW:TOR space minigame was also supposed to be a change of pace, yet people expected full-on freeform space travel.  My point is, if you're going to create content for a change of pace, at least make that change of pace fun and engaging.  If it's a boring mess, I'm going to call you out on it, which is what I'm doing right now.

    This is the problem, you are ignoring the context and focusing on the numbers. You're not looking at these things like you're  helping Farmer John protect his orchard or helping Rancher Sally pick apples for a pie, you're looking at it like you're just killing bandits and picking fruit as the ultimate purpose of what you're doing. You're ignoring what is supposed to make your actions fun and engaging and focusing purely on what you're doing without context. Because of that the problem inherintly lies with you and not the game. You can't call someone out on a game being boring when you are what is making the game boring.

    True, we all remember how fun the quests were in SWTOR because NPCS told us all about them!

    I'm not entirely sure if you're being sarcastic or not because people actually did say that the questing in TOR was better because of the cutscenes.

    image

  • JimmydeanJimmydean Ypsilanti, MIPosts: 1,270Member
    Originally posted by romanator0
    Originally posted by Jimmydean
    Originally posted by romanator0
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    The difference is that most game designers only give you the picking apples quests....throughout the entire game.  In this case, these mundane quests are completely optional.

     

    On top of that, no one here claimed those renown hearts were the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I for one find them a little boring and only have done them if I want a change of pace.  Which, coincidentally, is exactly why they are there.

     

    You can go back to hating on GW2 now.

    In 17 levels of GW2, I killed waves of bandits, I killed waves of cenaurs, I escorted lots of  caravans, and I picked lots of berries.  I may or may not have killed a world boss or two.  At least from what I have seen, content variety is not GW2's strongsuite.  I don't think you can say GW2 offers any greater variety of quests than perhaps WoW or SW:TOR.

    Secondly, a change of pace is good, but the SW:TOR space minigame was also supposed to be a change of pace, yet people expected full-on freeform space travel.  My point is, if you're going to create content for a change of pace, at least make that change of pace fun and engaging.  If it's a boring mess, I'm going to call you out on it, which is what I'm doing right now.

    This is the problem, you are ignoring the context and focusing on the numbers. You're not looking at these things like you're  helping Farmer John protect his orchard or helping Rancher Sally pick apples for a pie, you're looking at it like you're just killing bandits and picking fruit as the ultimate purpose of what you're doing. You're ignoring what is supposed to make your actions fun and engaging and focusing purely on what you're doing without context. Because of that the problem inherintly lies with you and not the game. You can't call someone out on a game being boring when you are what is making the game boring.

    True, we all remember how fun the quests were in SWTOR because NPCS told us all about them!

    I'm not entirely sure if you're being sarcastic or not because people actually did say that the questing in TOR was better because of the cutscenes.

    Well hopefully GW2 is an amazing success just like SWTOR.

  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Amory, MSPosts: 2,544Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by romanator0
    Originally posted by Jimmydean
    Originally posted by romanator0
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    The difference is that most game designers only give you the picking apples quests....throughout the entire game.  In this case, these mundane quests are completely optional.

     

    On top of that, no one here claimed those renown hearts were the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I for one find them a little boring and only have done them if I want a change of pace.  Which, coincidentally, is exactly why they are there.

     

    You can go back to hating on GW2 now.

    In 17 levels of GW2, I killed waves of bandits, I killed waves of cenaurs, I escorted lots of  caravans, and I picked lots of berries.  I may or may not have killed a world boss or two.  At least from what I have seen, content variety is not GW2's strongsuite.  I don't think you can say GW2 offers any greater variety of quests than perhaps WoW or SW:TOR.

    Secondly, a change of pace is good, but the SW:TOR space minigame was also supposed to be a change of pace, yet people expected full-on freeform space travel.  My point is, if you're going to create content for a change of pace, at least make that change of pace fun and engaging.  If it's a boring mess, I'm going to call you out on it, which is what I'm doing right now.

    This is the problem, you are ignoring the context and focusing on the numbers. You're not looking at these things like you're  helping Farmer John protect his orchard or helping Rancher Sally pick apples for a pie, you're looking at it like you're just killing bandits and picking fruit as the ultimate purpose of what you're doing. You're ignoring what is supposed to make your actions fun and engaging and focusing purely on what you're doing without context. Because of that the problem inherintly lies with you and not the game. You can't call someone out on a game being boring when you are what is making the game boring.

    True, we all remember how fun the quests were in SWTOR because NPCS told us all about them!

    I'm not entirely sure if you're being sarcastic or not because people actually did say that the questing in TOR was better because of the cutscenes.

    There are no cutscenes in GW2 outside of your personal story, and considering you just happen upon dynamic events rather than having any real reason to be in that location, how exactly does the context of the DEss in GW2 stand out any more than the quests do in WoW?  If anything, I am less attached to the gameworld because I have no interaction with NPCs.  Playing GW2 is just a matter of roaming around an overland map until an orange circle pops up on your minimap.

  • MeowheadMeowhead New Carlisle, INPosts: 3,716Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    There are no cutscenes in GW2 outside of your personal story, and considering you just happen upon dynamic events rather than having any real reason to be in that location, how exactly does the context of the DEss in GW2 stand out any more than the quests do in WoW?  If anything, I am less attached to the gameworld because I have no interaction with NPCs.  Playing GW2 is just a matter of roaming around an overland map until an orange circle pops up on your minimap.

     D:  Talk to those NPCs, man.  They WANT to talk to you.  You can talk to them before, during and after dynamic events.  You can start dynamic events that way.  You can continue dynamic event chains by talking to NPCs.  These NPCs have text, you know!  Spoken lines and ones you can read.

    I bet the NPCs are wondering why you never talk to them.  They're probably just assuming you're RPing a surly mute.

    There's quite a lot of NPC text actually, you're just not clicking on them and hearing it.  They often do a great job of explaining what you're doing and why. :)

    One of the main differences is just that, unlike a quest giver in a normal game, they're perfectly willing to accept that committing centaur genocide counts as 'killing centaurs' rather than you needing to talk to them to make it official that you did it. :)

  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Amory, MSPosts: 2,544Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Meowhead
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    There are no cutscenes in GW2 outside of your personal story, and considering you just happen upon dynamic events rather than having any real reason to be in that location, how exactly does the context of the DEss in GW2 stand out any more than the quests do in WoW?  If anything, I am less attached to the gameworld because I have no interaction with NPCs.  Playing GW2 is just a matter of roaming around an overland map until an orange circle pops up on your minimap.

     D:  Talk to those NPCs, man.  They WANT to talk to you.  You can talk to them before, during and after dynamic events.  You can start dynamic events that way.  You can continue dynamic event chains by talking to NPCs.  These NPCs have text, you know!  Spoken lines and ones you can read.

    I bet the NPCs are wondering why you never talk to them.  They're probably just assuming you're RPing a surly mute.

    There's quite a lot of NPC text actually, you're just not clicking on them and hearing it.  They often do a great job of explaining what you're doing and why. :)

    One of the main differences is just that, unlike a quest giver in a normal game, they're perfectly willing to accept that committing centaur genocide counts as 'killing centaurs' rather than you needing to talk to them to make it official that you did it. :)

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

  • Skyy_HighSkyy_High Ithaca, NYPosts: 138Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    You see how Anet can twist some words around, and then their fanbase thinks the mostmundane tasks in the game are the greatest things since sliced bread?

     

    I wonder how many hours most of the posters here spent criticizing other games for their mundane quest design.

    There's a huge difference between "all of the quests in the first 10 hours are mundane" and "I can choose to complete this heart container by watering some plants...or I can just go kill stuff instead before doing another epic town-saving DE." 

    The former is boring, because the quests in traditional MMOs are literally all you have early on (besides grinding mobs) to progress. The latter is not boring, because you can always choose to ignore the content and do something else more interesting, or just complete the content via combat. 

    Some people, yourself apparently included, are so intent on proving how blind fanbois are that they gloss over important details in a misguided attempt to poke fun at people who dare to agree with professional game designers about good game development. 

     

    As for your last post...what? Do you really not see the difference between these two situations:

    1) Farmer Joe is standing in his field dutifully waiting for you to pass by and talk to him so he can tell you about his daughter being kidnapped. After you return her (or, more likely, she won't accompany you back to the farm, she'll just stay where she is and tell you that she'll make it back on her own, but thanks for killing all the bandits!), Farmer Joe will immediately start telling the next adventurer about his poor kidnapped daughter. 

    2) Farmer Joe runs up to you wildly yelling about his kidnapped daughter. You can either choose to be the intrepid hero who sets off without another word to rescue his daughter, or you can talk to Joe to get more backstory about the event. After you rescue the daughter, she'll accompany you back to Farmer Joe, at which point he'll offer a number of his fresh produce for sale to everyone in the area, and you may even be able to follow his daughter back to her favorite stream where she swears she saw something glinting in the water....setting off a different chain of events. 

    How does the latter NOT provide for a more immersive PvE experience? 

  • EvilGeekEvilGeek londonPosts: 1,227Member Uncommon

    A change of pace is good. I'm not the kind of gamer that just wants combat, what I want is to be challenged and to be entertained. A good game for me has downtime activities, it's part of the reason I enjoy crafting, it's not combat but it's an activity keeping me in the world, chatting with my guildies, having fun and playing the game.

    If you want wall to wall combat then go ahead, no ones going to stop you and there's plenty of it, PvE and PvP, but there are also plenty of other things to do. GW2 aims to provide as much choice as possible, what's wrong with that? There's a consistency of design that makes all the differing content fit within the world, that's important, picking apples is just picking apples unless you connect the dots and see how it makes sense, in the same way fighting off centaurs makes sense, Tyria has a story, your choice on how involved you get in that, food is important I hear :)

    image
  • MeowheadMeowhead New Carlisle, INPosts: 3,716Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

     Au contraire.  I am only willing to agree that it doesn't do any better job of getting YOU immersed.

    I personally was more immersed, by a variety of things and reasons, none of which are neccessarily pertinent to you.  I'm not here to convert you or anything.

    What I will say is that doesn't mean one of us is right and one of us is wrong, we just played/enjoyed the game in different ways.  Having more fun than you doesn't make me right, anymore than you enjoying some other game I don't doesn't make you more right.  It just means I'm having more fun in this one particular game, and therefore it's probably better suited for me, rather than you.

    The real question is how people will take it overall.  I'm not so filled with hubris as to suggest that all right thinking men and women of this world will hold my viewpoint.

    How about this.  Let's agree that you're not feeling the extra immersion and that I am, and therefore I'm logically going to probably be enjoying GW2 more? :)  It's SORT of like what you said we were agreeing on, except in my version we have different opinions because we're different people.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Seeing and hearing it happen is not immersive at all...

    I wonder why are people so affraid of GW2...

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread PshPosts: 5,501Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by Meowhead
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    There are no cutscenes in GW2 outside of your personal story, and considering you just happen upon dynamic events rather than having any real reason to be in that location, how exactly does the context of the DEss in GW2 stand out any more than the quests do in WoW?  If anything, I am less attached to the gameworld because I have no interaction with NPCs.  Playing GW2 is just a matter of roaming around an overland map until an orange circle pops up on your minimap.

     D:  Talk to those NPCs, man.  They WANT to talk to you.  You can talk to them before, during and after dynamic events.  You can start dynamic events that way.  You can continue dynamic event chains by talking to NPCs.  These NPCs have text, you know!  Spoken lines and ones you can read.

    I bet the NPCs are wondering why you never talk to them.  They're probably just assuming you're RPing a surly mute.

    There's quite a lot of NPC text actually, you're just not clicking on them and hearing it.  They often do a great job of explaining what you're doing and why. :)

    One of the main differences is just that, unlike a quest giver in a normal game, they're perfectly willing to accept that committing centaur genocide counts as 'killing centaurs' rather than you needing to talk to them to make it official that you did it. :)

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    I was more immersed in GW2 just roaming around checking everything out, completing dynamic events on a whim, exploring, etc than I have been in most other games. There is something about just leaving and not going back to town for a few hours that just feels good. TSW gave me a different type of immersion, but I'd say they were both very immersive experiences.

  • FoomerangFoomerang Portland, ORPosts: 5,565Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Meowhead
    How about this.  Let's agree that you're not feeling the extra immersion and that I am, and therefore I'm logically going to probably be enjoying GW2 more? :)  It's SORT of like what you said we were agreeing on, except in my version we have different opinions because we're different people.

    but...but...that goes against the unspoken ROC!

  • heartlessheartless Brooklyn, NYPosts: 4,993Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by Meowhead
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    There are no cutscenes in GW2 outside of your personal story, and considering you just happen upon dynamic events rather than having any real reason to be in that location, how exactly does the context of the DEss in GW2 stand out any more than the quests do in WoW?  If anything, I am less attached to the gameworld because I have no interaction with NPCs.  Playing GW2 is just a matter of roaming around an overland map until an orange circle pops up on your minimap.

     D:  Talk to those NPCs, man.  They WANT to talk to you.  You can talk to them before, during and after dynamic events.  You can start dynamic events that way.  You can continue dynamic event chains by talking to NPCs.  These NPCs have text, you know!  Spoken lines and ones you can read.

    I bet the NPCs are wondering why you never talk to them.  They're probably just assuming you're RPing a surly mute.

    There's quite a lot of NPC text actually, you're just not clicking on them and hearing it.  They often do a great job of explaining what you're doing and why. :)

    One of the main differences is just that, unlike a quest giver in a normal game, they're perfectly willing to accept that committing centaur genocide counts as 'killing centaurs' rather than you needing to talk to them to make it official that you did it. :)

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Actually it does an amazing job at immersing the player. The NPCs are not static, they move around the world, talk and interact with each other. They react differently to different events. For example if you finish an event for a guy and he says that he's going to report to his commander, he's not going to run off a few feet away and disappear like he would in other games. He will actually run to his commander and give a report. Even if his commander is on the other side of the zone.

    GW2 does a really great job of immitating an actual world, where everyone, including the NPCs feel alive. That's what immersion is.

    image

  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Amory, MSPosts: 2,544Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Seeing and hearing it happen is not immersive at all...

    I wonder why are people so affraid of GW2...

    Where do the mobs come from?  Is there a bandit camp set up near a farmer's field?  Can you watch the bandits leave their camp then run over to and assault the farmer's field?  When you repell the attack, does the event actually end before all mobs are dead?  If so do the surviving bandits run back to their camp?

    If the answer to all that is "no," do the mobs just spawn out of thin air in set waves until you complete or fail the event?

    That's not very immersive at all, especially after the 5th time you do it in a single day.  It's a minigame.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Seeing and hearing it happen is not immersive at all...

    I wonder why are people so affraid of GW2...

    Where do the mobs come from?  Is there a bandit camp set up near a farmer's field?  Can you watch the bandits leave their camp then run over to and assault the farmer's field?  When you repell the attack, does the event actually end before all mobs are dead?  If so do the surviving bandits run back to their camp?

    If the answer to all that is "no," do the mobs just spawn out of thin air in set waves until you complete or fail the event?

    That's not very immersive at all, especially after the 5th time you do it in a single day.  It's a minigame.

    You have both.

    Sometimes they come from camps, caves or hidden in bushes.

    Others you times you just have respawns.

     

    Did you actually play the game or just talking?

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • xenogiasxenogias warsaw, INPosts: 1,926Member

    I wonder how many hours people sit here and talk trash about GW2 and its fans just because someones opinion on whats "fun" or "engaging" is diffrent. I know it happens on every games forums. I just like when people act like they are sooo smart when in reality they are a frickin idiot because they dont know what the word opinion means.

    I personally like how GW2 presents its quests. I like to go off on my own and explore, randomly finding things to do. I like having options for nearly every heartquest I have come on. The verry first one in the human area for example. I can either feed cows, water corn, or kill wurms. If I'm patient I can also kill a wurm queen to help complete it or wait till bandits ACTUALLY RAID the farm. Then I have the choice of either killing thoes bandits or putting out the hay fires. So that gives us 6 options in just 1 heart quest on how to finish it. Granted not all of them are like this.

    What I dont like is running up to an NPC, having said NPC say "I'm racist against boars go kill them" and then doing it. At least in GW2 more often than not if I have to do something I can plainly see why. That makes the world feel alive to me.

     

    Its fine if you do not agree with that. But dont try and tell me I'm wrong. Since its my opinion and I'm worried about what I like YOU would infact be wrong if you try and tell me I'm wrong. Just like it would be wrong of me to say "Hey, moron, this is why its good, you are just to stupid to see it."

  • MexorillaMexorilla Las Vegas, NVPosts: 313Member
    Originally posted by Mephster
    Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

    I have no problems with picking apples, feeding cows, etc. I find diversity in actions and elments to be far more intersting than

    "The (insert x enemy) is attacking (insert x location) again. Stop them".

    When it comes to quests, i like having different situation to spice it up. IMO, it's way more fun that stoping the 2nd generic mob invasion. Not to meantion that's already in Rift.

    I do because picking apples, watering plants and feeding cows have nothing to do with the war against the dragons. 

    those apples, plants, and cows,  feed the hero's.  it has everything to do with the war.

  • MeowheadMeowhead New Carlisle, INPosts: 3,716Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    Where do the mobs come from?  Is there a bandit camp set up near a farmer's field?  Can you watch the bandits leave their camp then run over to and assault the farmer's field?  When you repell the attack, does the event actually end before all mobs are dead?  If so do the surviving bandits run back to their camp?

    If the answer to all that is "no," do the mobs just spawn out of thin air in set waves until you complete or fail the event?

    That's not very immersive at all, especially after the 5th time you do it in a single day.

     .... actually uhm, you know, I can think of at least one example where yes, there IS a band camp set up near a farmer's field, and they do indeed run of the camp and run over to assault the moas.  D:  ... I'm pretty sure they even run away (They do in other events, running away at a certain point in time if enough are killed).

    Now, unlike most other NPCs, yes, enemy monsters do spawn out of mid-air a lot of the time (NPCs don't do that, they actually run around nonstop, and go the places they mention they're going), but that's because of the harsh realities of an MMORPG where there's literally hundreds of homicidal players killing badguys, so that it's harder to give them a natural ecosystem, especially when it comes to spreading them across the map and so on.

    Even Skyrim, GTA, any of the single player style sandboxes you care to mention, the badguys spawn out of nothingness, they don't have a real ecosystem.  Players are simply too homicidal to allow for realistic enemy ecosystems most of the time. :)

  • XzenXzen Los Alamos, NMPosts: 2,607Member Common
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Seeing and hearing it happen is not immersive at all...

    I wonder why are people so affraid of GW2...

    Where do the mobs come from?  Is there a bandit camp set up near a farmer's field?  Can you watch the bandits leave their camp then run over to and assault the farmer's field?  When you repell the attack, does the event actually end before all mobs are dead?  If so do the surviving bandits run back to their camp?

    If the answer to all that is "no," do the mobs just spawn out of thin air in set waves until you complete or fail the event?

    That's not very immersive at all, especially after the 5th time you do it in a single day.  It's a minigame.

    Hmm I was in some DEs where minotaurs invaded a camp. The invaders came from the direction of the minotaur fort near by and when they were repelled the survivors did run back twords the fort.

  • xenogiasxenogias warsaw, INPosts: 1,926Member
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Seeing and hearing it happen is not immersive at all...

    I wonder why are people so affraid of GW2...

    Where do the mobs come from?  Is there a bandit camp set up near a farmer's field?  Can you watch the bandits leave their camp then run over to and assault the farmer's field?  When you repell the attack, does the event actually end before all mobs are dead?  If so do the surviving bandits run back to their camp?

    If the answer to all that is "no," do the mobs just spawn out of thin air in set waves until you complete or fail the event?

    That's not very immersive at all, especially after the 5th time you do it in a single day.  It's a minigame.

    Its 50/50. Sometimes the awnser to what you said is yes, they do come from thier camps, sometimes no. Usually if they spawn out of thin air though Anet has tried to spawn them in a place you can not see so it feels like they are comming from somewhere. Like out of houses that just happen to have a bandit cave under it. Or they come running over,up, or around hills.

    Whats funny about what you are arguing about is there is NO MMO on the market that does everything you are trying to "call" GW2 out for.  GW2 has actually done a much better job in trying to make the world feel alive than any other MMO to date.

    Dont get me wrong, I have my own issues with GW2 even though I plan on playing it. But you are trying to pick a fight you simply cant win. Not because you are "wrong" per say. Immersive depends on each person. But you simply can not come up with another MMO that does exactly what you are trying to say makes it "immersive"

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Xzen
    Originally posted by SuperXero89
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    So we both agree that GW2 doesn't do any better a job at getting players immersed in PvE progression than any other MMORPG on the market?

    Well, one could argue that SW:TOR and TSW probably do a better job.

    Seeing and hearing it happen is not immersive at all...

    I wonder why are people so affraid of GW2...

    Where do the mobs come from?  Is there a bandit camp set up near a farmer's field?  Can you watch the bandits leave their camp then run over to and assault the farmer's field?  When you repell the attack, does the event actually end before all mobs are dead?  If so do the surviving bandits run back to their camp?

    If the answer to all that is "no," do the mobs just spawn out of thin air in set waves until you complete or fail the event?

    That's not very immersive at all, especially after the 5th time you do it in a single day.  It's a minigame.

    Hmm I was in some DEs where minotaurs invaded a camp. The invaders came from the direction of the minotaur fort near by and when they were repelled the survivors did run back twords the fort.

    And the skritts stealing work tools had a lair in a cave nearby.

    Dredge just come in their excavator machines, etc.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Amory, MSPosts: 2,544Member Uncommon

    Even so, it's really only immersive the first couple of times it happens as in the real world, I doubt centaurs raid villages 10 times in a 24 hour period.  After the fifth time you've saved a farmer's field from the same group of bandits, you start to wonder why the city guard doesn't station a legion in the area.

    In the end, you realize it's just a simplistic minigame where you're repelling waves of invaders, none of whom look very different from one another.  It's fun, but I wouldn't use it as evidence of immersion. 

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