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Looking for an old DAOC player's point of view.

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Comments

  • SaydienSaydien StuttgartPosts: 266Member


    Originally posted by spector_0_0
    I think one of the biggest alures (for me) of DAoC PvP was that individual players could really affect the outcome of a fight quite drastically.  I played a Healer (Midgard) and I could single-handedly change the sway of fight with my cc.  Similarly, as an Enchanter, I could wreak devastating PBAoE if my enemies didn't notice my little Lurikeen slip into their group.  As a sorcerer, I could lay waste to clumps of enemies with nasty DoTs.  Each class had real purpose and excelled in various battle tactics.  I guess you could say that each class was "overpowered" in a particular area.  I have no idea what happened beyond Trials of Atlantis, as I stopped playing then.  I know that realm pride was strong, and stealing an enemy's relic was a huge blow to their morale.  Keep seiges were intense no matter if you were defending or attacking.  My days in Midgard on Lancelot were by far some of the most fun I have had in an mmorpg.  I'm hoping that GW2 can help recapture some of the good ol' days. 

    That's pretty much how I feel and what I loved in DAoC back then. If you did your part exceptionally well then it had an impact. I can't see that happen in GW2. The only way to have an huge and exceptional impact on the outcome of a fight probably is by using siege weapons what has absolutely nothing to do with skill.

    For me this casual game approach sadly also means that the impact of the individual or a group of 2-5 friends on the outcome of the battles are VERY limited. That in my eyes is what will make quite some of the hardcore PVP people drop the game again rather soon. No rivalry due to being nameless and no feelable impact of individual skill is poison for the dedicated and hardcore PVP crowd.

  • VhalnVhaln Chicago, ILPosts: 3,159Member

    I'm pretty old, but still haven't gotten a chance to try GW2.  (I hate this pre-purchase for "beta" marketting / milking trend) but that said...

     

    I really liked the realm abilities in DAOC.  I liked how they made the level cap into a soft cap, because they were a bit unbalancing.  In both PvE and PvP.  That made them worthwhile, and more importantly FUN.

     

    I liked how those realm abilities gave some serious incentive to RvR, that almost all players could get into.  I think that had a lot to do with its popularity.

     

    I liked that the different factions felt so different.  Different races, classes, different PvE experiences.. it really felt like going up against other nations, and bolstered the sense of us-vs-them realm pride.

     

    So I don't know about WvW, because it lacks some key elements that I thought had a lot to do with making RvR what it was.  I'm trying to keep an open mind, and I'll certainly give it a shot.. but I think there's a good chance I'll end up playing GW2 like just another PvE MMO.

     

    When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

  • uidCausticuidCaustic acworth, GAPosts: 128Member
    Originally posted by Pravius

    Any of us who used to play DAOC can easily argue that it was and could possibly still be the best PvP Mmorpg ever made. 

    Let's see how this ideology works.  *clears throat*

    Any of us who used to play DAOC can easily argue that it was entertaining for about a week.

    Blanket statements are fun!

  • MattVidMattVid Terre Haute, INPosts: 399Member
    Originally posted by drel

    WvWvW reminds me so much of the mega battles we had in DAoC!  And I haven't seen GW2 crash as did DAoC with those massive battles.

    I truely enjoy playing GW2 as much as I did DAoC. And I haven't found it as grindy as DAoC could be when you tried to level.

    Leveling in GW2 is much easier and fun!

    So, give the game a try!

    Pretty much this. The only huge difference I feel is that rotating serer match ups every couple weeks. So, if WvWsucks and is unbalanced, in a couple weeks you will be matched up with a new group of servers. I see this as good and bad, but it definitely lacks the persistent feeling that DAoC had.

    I also don't know if there are any kind of "Realm Abilities", and there doesn't appear to be any real progression behind WvW, except just experience and karma points. You also get badges that you can trade in for armor, but the gear progression in Guild Wars is never all that intense. I think there could be more rewards and progression in WvW, personally.

    As far as the epicness ... it is definitely there, and the game seems more stable as well. We will see how it plays out, but with the 5-10 hours of it I have done, it definitely feels a lot like DAoC from the RvR perspective. The game and strategies are only going to evolve with time and with release. Right now, WvW is pretty disorganized, and mostly feels like a huge PvP Pub match. It will only get more interesting when guilds are actually formed and strategy and organization are more of a factor than it is now.

    All I know, is the toys in the sandbox are fun and the scale for epic battles is there. We just have to make it happen!

  • FliaraFliara ToulousePosts: 1Member
    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'm pretty old, but still haven't gotten a chance to try GW2.  (I hate this pre-purchase for "beta" marketting / milking trend) but that said... I really liked the realm abilities in DAOC.  I liked how they made the level cap into a soft cap, because they were a bit unbalancing.  In both PvE and PvP.  That made them worthwhile, and more importantly FUN. I liked how those realm abilities gave some serious incentive to RvR, that almost all players could get into.  I think that had a lot to do with its popularity. I liked that the different factions felt so different.  Different races, classes, different PvE experiences.. it really felt like going up against other nations, and bolstered the sense of us-vs-them realm pride. So I don't know about WvW, because it lacks some key elements that I thought had a lot to do with making RvR what it was.  I'm trying to keep an open mind, and I'll certainly give it a shot.. but I think there's a good chance I'll end up playing GW2 like just another PvE MMO. 

     

    That's a hardcore player point of view. You spend a huge amount of time playing a game, so you want to be able to kill noob teams when you get skilled. It's understandable but that's absolutely not fun from a casual point of view. And where it's normal for a single skilled player to kill 1 casual easily (which is possible on Gw2) it s not normal for 1 skilled player to be able to kill 10 casuals alone.
    Anet doesn't want this kind of stuff and no video game company should want that. When you create a game, it should be to please most of the players and not a minority as hardcores. As a hardcore player myself i understand that it can be frustrating but why should they care?
    Basing their game on hardcores would prevent many people to play so if they want to sell it, it's a bad idea.

    Anyway WvW is a massive multiplayer Pvp and you aren't supposed to be able to win it alone. It s a team gameplay and i truly believe that a good small team will be able to make their server progress more than a stupid zergteam. Just watch it that way, it's the beginning so there are only zergs but WvW is a cappoint and splitting judiciously is smarter than staying all together and cap one point after another. When most players'll get that, group strategies and combat will be much more fun.

    Anyway, not trying to convice anyone to play it. I just know i will :-p
  • RedempRedemp Hot Springs, ARPosts: 1,042Member

     One HUGE difference ... Seige weapons,  every seige weapon in Gw2 is absurd damage. In Daoc the damage was balanced AND ammo was limited.

     

    Exspect the Seige experience to be one of the issues that pops up with DAOC vets.

     

  • ZigZagsZigZags Modesto, CAPosts: 328Member

    I played DAOC for 3 years and I've Beta Tested GW2 for 2 weekends. I wont be playing GW2 for a couple simple reasons. 1) I can't stand High Fantasy or Steampunk. 2) I can't stand theme park games and GW2 is the EMPEROR of Theme Park Games.

     

    Honestly, I thought most people in the MMO Genre were sick of theme parks....Im suprised how popular GW2 is becomming.

     

    Now: Skyrim
    Later: ?
    Played: M59, UO, EQ, Runescape, DAOC, SB, EQ2, WoW, EVE, Darkfall, AoC, FFXI, FFXIV, WAR, SWTOR
    BOYCOTTING: EA/BioWare/Origin/SOE

  • cronius77cronius77 Fairfax, VAPosts: 1,347Member Uncommon

    I played DAOC for years and IMO it boils down to playstyle if you will like it or not. It lacks to me some of the features that made DAOC such a great game to play. No rivalrys or realm point system , no real power boost on relics as they are just power balls for pvp in GW2 . No nameplates in GW2 WvW just invader etc. There is talk of a bragging and title system going in but as of launch there will be no realm point system so if you like pointless zerging and ganking for no reward and just the fun of it then you will enjoy it. One great feature that GW2 is better then DAOC IMO , every two weeks if your realm is dominating others or losing badly you get rematched to closer servers to your servers progression rate. Im kinda mixed about WvW as I see it getting extreamly boring very very fast and if they do not add some sort of advancement system i highly doubt people will just spend months in it as its WAY faster just to level up doing pve and making money.

  • StrixMaximaStrixMaxima SPosts: 884Member

    Long time DAoC fan here.

    So far, I enjoy GW2 very, very much, especially in the light of the WAR fiasco. It was the first time in a while I managed to have real fun in RvRs (WvWs, here), playing with a small band of people and performing localized tasks, such as Supply Defense while the main forces attacked keeps, pincering enemies, some obfuscation, etc.

    All I needed to do to enjoy this was  understanding that GW2 is GW2, and DaoC is (or, better, was) DAoC.

  • PraviusPravius Almont, MIPosts: 71Member

    Lot's of replies!  Thanks you guys.  I totally understand the nostalgia thing, and I do understand that nothing will bring me back to "that same feeling" like when I used to play DAOC. I mean the way this genre is now there is really nothing that even compares to DAOC, not even close.  I love objective based PvP and not like capture the flag, TDM, etc.  I mean like sieging, coordination, and massive communication to achive a large goal, there is nothing like that feeling when you do. 

    I also do miss the feeling of "realm pride".  So many people made fun of DAOC for this but man when I played Midgard, I HATED Albs and Hibs, especially when they would pick on our keeps. But the feeling that we had going out there and defending our own back yard was osmething special, and I hope Guild wars might be able to rekindle that experience even just a little. 

    I do not like what PVP games have become, all this competitive 2v2, 3v3 etc.  I did used to run in 8 man groups when playing DAOC but when things were going on (relic raids, keep sieges, etc) I would join the zerg for the good of the realm!

    Anyway thanks for all the replies and keep them coming. I would also like to see if we can get a guild together (anyone is welcome) but us old school DAOC vets, <Camelot's Casuality's> maybe? lol anyway super pumped for this, keep the opinions coming!

  • SetzerSetzer The Great Northwest, WAPosts: 143Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ZigZags

    I played DAOC for 3 years and I've Beta Tested GW2 for 2 weekends. I wont be playing GW2 for a couple simple reasons. 1) I can't stand High Fantasy or Steampunk. 2) I can't stand theme park games and GW2 is the EMPEROR of Theme Park Games.

     

    Honestly, I thought most people in the MMO Genre were sick of theme parks....Im suprised how popular GW2 is becomming.

     

    I prefer themepark MMO's, it gives me options. I don't like to be limited in my options....the more to do in an MMO, the better.

  • VhalnVhaln Chicago, ILPosts: 3,159Member
    Originally posted by Fliara
    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'm pretty old, but still haven't gotten a chance to try GW2.  (I hate this pre-purchase for "beta" marketting / milking trend) but that said...

     

    I really liked the realm abilities in DAOC.  I liked how they made the level cap into a soft cap, because they were a bit unbalancing.  In both PvE and PvP.  That made them worthwhile, and more importantly FUN.

     

    I liked how those realm abilities gave some serious incentive to RvR, that almost all players could get into.  I think that had a lot to do with its popularity.

     

    I liked that the different factions felt so different.  Different races, classes, different PvE experiences.. it really felt like going up against other nations, and bolstered the sense of us-vs-them realm pride.

     

    So I don't know about WvW, because it lacks some key elements that I thought had a lot to do with making RvR what it was.  I'm trying to keep an open mind, and I'll certainly give it a shot.. but I think there's a good chance I'll end up playing GW2 like just another PvE MMO.

     

    That's a hardcore player point of view. You spend a huge amount of time playing a game, so you want to be able to kill noob teams when you get skilled. It's understandable but that's absolutely not fun from a casual point of view. And where it's normal for a single skilled player to kill 1 casual easily (which is possible on Gw2) it s not normal for 1 skilled player to be able to kill 10 casuals alone. Anet doesn't want this kind of stuff and no video game company should want that. When you create a game, it should be to please most of the players and not a minority as hardcores. As a hardcore player myself i understand that it can be frustrating but why should they care? Basing their game on hardcores would prevent many people to play so if they want to sell it, it's a bad idea. Anyway WvW is a massive multiplayer Pvp and you aren't supposed to be able to win it alone. It s a team gameplay and i truly believe that a good small team will be able to make their server progress more than a stupid zergteam. Just watch it that way, it's the beginning so there are only zergs but WvW is a cappoint and splitting judiciously is smarter than staying all together and cap one point after another. When most players'll get that, group strategies and combat will be much more fun. Anyway, not trying to convice anyone to play it. I just know i will :-p

     

    Did you play DAOC? ..because you're exaggerating greatly.  Took hardcore skills AND realm rank, just to be able to solo two mediocre players at once.  A huge gap might make it more possible, but it wasn't the norm, and any more than two vs one, and it was pretty much impossible, unless you were up against people who had no idea how to play.  Realm abilities were just little bonuses that gave you an edge, but they weren't that game changing.

     

    Also, the way the diminishing returns worked, it was really easy to get your first few abilities, which put you on pretty even footing with almost everyone else.  Some people will always cry about balance, but I thought it was amazingly well balanced, considering.

     

    Anyhow, I definately wasn't hardcore.   My highest character was only halfway through RR5, and I often played alts that were lower.

    When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

  • rdrakkenrdrakken Gotham, FLPosts: 426Member
    Originally posted by uidCaustic
    Originally posted by Pravius

    Any of us who used to play DAOC can easily argue that it was and could possibly still be the best PvP Mmorpg ever made. 

    Let's see how this ideology works.  *clears throat*

    Any of us who used to play DAOC can easily argue that it was entertaining for about a week.

    Blanket statements are fun!

    I know...just talk to ANYONE that played in Hibernia the first year or so...the bastard realm of DAoC...about how "good" the RvR was. It was so god damn bad most servers held player protests and even crashed servers by having everyone be in a close area. It was the only way to get Mythics attention and they still took their sweet ass time bringing the realm up to par with the others.

  • wutaewutae athensPosts: 73Member Uncommon

    I dont know what you guys are saying, but i had a blast with a friend of mine, duo mesmer-warrior in wvwvw, where we camped a small capture point, and killed all players trying to capture it, ofc if we saw one big zerg inc, we just hided, and we just retook it after they left. That's what i loved in daoc, that's what i like in GW2, having players keep coming and doing some proper outdoor PvP. And yes we did some 2vs3 and 2vs4 nps. We were just in vent, kiting the proper times, bursting the proper times. But i believe that the magic number for small grps is "3" in daoc it was "2" , with 5 i believe that i could easily take up to 10-15 enemies. coordination is the key to success in all these games.

     

     

    The tip for
    The win is
    cooperation.

  • DukeJohnDukeJohn Corpus Christi, TXPosts: 5Member

    DAOC was great fun, especially back in the day. I personally loved one-shotting players in the Battle Grounds. Camping Thid and just killing so many peeps was always a huge rush. Someone earlier mentioned “who has center keep?” lol... good times. Ever since then I have always played some type of stealth toon, whether assassin or bow type. I have some issues with GW2, but your question was geared towards similarities.

     

    There are no Battle Grounds in GW2, so you do not get the chance to progress through different zones or twink out a toon by turning xp off, god I loved that, lol. Anyway, What GW2 does is give you what they call structured pvp, basically starting at level 2 you can enter and they max your guy out to level 80 and give you access to different armor sets, weapons, abilities, and so on. Which is cool, so you can test out various guys at end game play. Go figure I seem to really kick butt with the ranger so far. Although, sometimes the battles last a while going one on one and when you fight a Mesmer and they start building up clones, it can get a little confusing, lol. I still haven't been beat yet in one on one. So, it is fun for me, but nothing like the brutal killing in DAOC, but then again, GW2 has only be available for BWE and stress tests.

     

    Switch over to the “End Game” map and it is really cool you can enter at level two. They bolster you up to 80, but you only have abilities for whatever level you where when you entered. So, if you come in at level 2, you have the power and hit points, but not the abilities to make you shine. That is kind of a drag, but once you get up there it should be a lot more fun, I hope.

     

    So, if you liked the end game in DAOC, then you will find a lot of similarities and you don't have to level up a character to get into the action. However, if Battle Grounds is where your fun was had, then maybe Warhammer Online would be more to your liking.

     

    For me, I will play GW2, but I don't think it will shine for me as DAOC or Warhammer or even Shadowbane did.

  • EmoqqboyEmoqqboy SINGAPOREPosts: 186Member
    Originally posted by DukeJohn

    DAOC was great fun, especially back in the day. I personally loved one-shotting players in the Battle Grounds. Camping Thid and just killing so many peeps was always a huge rush. Someone earlier mentioned “who has center keep?” lol... good times. Ever since then I have always played some type of stealth toon, whether assassin or bow type. I have some issues with GW2, but your question was geared towards similarities.

     

    There are no Battle Grounds in GW2, so you do not get the chance to progress through different zones or twink out a toon by turning xp off, god I loved that, lol. Anyway, What GW2 does is give you what they call structured pvp, basically starting at level 2 you can enter and they max your guy out to level 80 and give you access to different armor sets, weapons, abilities, and so on. Which is cool, so you can test out various guys at end game play. Go figure I seem to really kick butt with the ranger so far. Although, sometimes the battles last a while going one on one and when you fight a Mesmer and they start building up clones, it can get a little confusing, lol. I still haven't been beat yet in one on one. So, it is fun for me, but nothing like the brutal killing in DAOC, but then again, GW2 has only be available for BWE and stress tests.

     

    Switch over to the “End Game” map and it is really cool you can enter at level two. They bolster you up to 80, but you only have abilities for whatever level you where when you entered. So, if you come in at level 2, you h!ve the power and hit points, but not the abilities to make you shine. That is kind of a drag, but once you get up there it should be a lot more fun, I hope.

     

    So, if you liked the end game in DAOC, then you will find a lot of similarities and you don't have to level up a character to get into the action. However, if Battle Grounds is where your fun was had, then maybe Warhammer Online would be more to your liking.

     

    For me, I will play GW2, but I don&e2339;t think it will shine for me as DAOC or Warhammer or even Shadowbane did.

    I dont think anyone should be one-shotted regardless. You casually left out how YOU enjoy being one-shotted?

    <QQ moar plz. kkthxbai.>

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