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Be Scared: Guild Wars is going to release sandbox elements in future expansions

dontadowdontadow Detroit, MIPosts: 1,044Member

This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

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Comments

  • Effin_RabbitEffin_Rabbit Pittsburgh, PAPosts: 772Member Uncommon

    I'll burn your player-house down to the virtual ground!

  • StrixMaximaStrixMaxima SPosts: 884Member
    Originally posted by dontadow

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now. 

    With the exception of the phrase above, I kinda agree. I think the game has a huge potential for expansion, in all aspects: Community, PvE and PvP.

  • DannyGloverDannyGlover Portland, ORPosts: 1,277Member


    Originally posted by dontadow
    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

    Cool story. I'll be sure to send the memo out that in two years, GW2 will be the next great sandbox. Seriously though, Im glad you love the game, but you might want to reign it in a little ;)

    I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.

  • XssivXssiv Haskell, NJPosts: 359Member
    Originally posted by dontadow

    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

    These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

    IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

    You built houses, repaired houses and guarded territory as part of a scripted series of events / quests.  None of that equates to a sandbox experience.

    And you didn't even get to keep the house you spent time building.   :(

  • Ambros123Ambros123 Neverneverland, TNPosts: 877Member
    Originally posted by DannyGlover

     


    Originally posted by dontadow
    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

     

    These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

    IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  


     

    Cool story. I'll be sure to send the memo out that in two years, GW2 will be the next great sandbox. Seriously though, Im glad you love the game, but you might want to reign it in a little ;)

    Nor worse or this is lighter than other fans of different MMOs than... say TSW?

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,981Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by dontadow

    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

    These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

    IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

    But were you building/reparing "your house", did you defend "your" territory from others. You participated in the elements of a story and it really isn't what sandbox games are all about IMO.

    Of course we'll never find any common ground/agreement on what constitutes a sandbox, but I'm not seeing GW2 in any other light other than theme park style MMO. (and that's not a bad thing, it's what they set out to create)

    Perhaps there's some content on the horizon that might qualify, but the fact that ANET has gone out of their way to remove all non-consentual player conflict makes it impossible to really be a sandbox in any real definition of the term. (again IMO)

     

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • RohnRohn Saint Peters, MOPosts: 3,740Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Xssiv
    Originally posted by dontadow

    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

    These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

    IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

    You built houses, repaired houses and guarded territory as part of a scripted series of events / quests.  None of that equates to a sandbox experience.

    And you didn't even get to keep the house you spent time building.   :(

     

    Indeed, it's laughable to equate the scripted events (there's nothing really dynamic about them) found in GW2 to actual sandbox systems that are player-driven.  They aren't similar in any way other than name.

    Those marauders are going to come back, time after time after time after time.  The house will be repaired over and over and over.  Again, it's a script.  Nothing in the gameworld really changes.  No player can build a house, or control the land.

    Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.

  • QuicklyScottQuicklyScott BristolPosts: 433Member

    These forums never cease to entertain me.

     

    Thanks for the laugh guys.

    image

  • Z3R01Z3R01 NYC, NYPosts: 2,426Member
    Originally posted by dontadow

    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

    These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

    IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

    There's always someone that goes into a new mmo, plays for a few hours and then comes to this forum all hyped up explaining in detail what they did in there adventures that day.

    You are all excited because Guild wars 2 is a NEW GAME. 

    It never fails, all of the things you love right now will be in your post a month after release as the Games failure to take those features to their potential.

    Stop getting so excited, all you're doing in GW2 is hoping from one hub event to another. This will get boring in two weeks and in a month or two you will be on this forum QQ about how crappy A-net is.

     

    Playing:

    Waiting on:

  • DannyGloverDannyGlover Portland, ORPosts: 1,277Member


    Originally posted by Ambros123
    Originally posted by DannyGlover   Originally posted by dontadow This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.     These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going.  IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  
      Cool story. I'll be sure to send the memo out that in two years, GW2 will be the next great sandbox. Seriously though, Im glad you love the game, but you might want to reign it in a little ;)
    Nor worse or this is lighter than other fans of different MMOs than... say TSW?

    Always a classic. Someone, somewhere else is being more irrational, so its ok if this person is too.

    I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.

  • BadSpockBadSpock Somewhere, MIPosts: 7,974Member

    GW2 is the evolution of Theme park.

    Consider what a Theme Park is - it's a space in which there are a multitude of rides, each a little or a lot different, and you the patron gets to choose which rides you want to go on and when you get to go on them and how many times you go on them.

    Want to ride the ferris wheel all day? You can do that. Want to hit up the roller coasters and the carnival games too? You can do that too.

    The problem, I think, with previous generations of Theme parks is that they were/are far too restrictive and linear.

    You have to enter here, you have to go to the spinning tea cups first, then you can go on a roller coaster, then you get to go to the ferris wheel, and if you spend all day at the park and go to all the right rides in the right order, you can go on the big super fast upside down roller coaster you saw in the paper and on the TV ads, but only once per day or week because the lines are so long...

    The point is, GW2 is much, much, much less linear of a themepark, where as games like WoW and particularly TOR were/are far too linear of theme parks.

    It's still a theme park, a collection of rides and activities, but you the player has far more choice as to which rides you go on, how many times you go on them, and when you go on them.

    A sandbox, by comparison, is a play area full of sand (material) and the tools to make something out of the materials present.

    Where as if you really want to extend the metaphor, a themepark is a play area full of toys not tools.

  • McGamerMcGamer Fairfield Bay, ARPosts: 1,012Member
    [mod edit]

    [mod edit]

    I am glad GW2 has some sandbox features so far, but not enough to make me want to buy it yet personally. With all the supposed immersion the game has, I have yet to see any player housing or RP features added.

  • dontadowdontadow Detroit, MIPosts: 1,044Member
    Originally posted by Kyleran
    Originally posted by dontadow

    This weekend, I did some very fun things that actually fit into the realm of the game.  I built houses, I repaired houses and I guarded terrotary from maruaders.  I gathered things and they applied to the community i was gathering too and it never took away from the actual struggle of the adventure.  I traveled around hte land, explored caves met friends and many times had adventures without an event or a heart quest to tell me. I also got GREAT XP for doing it.  Sometimes i did things that started other things.  I went into one cave and killed a veteran and it started a quest chain where the centaurs began raiding.  

    These things all sound like the kinds of things that people have been wanting from sandboxes.  But, in a great concept, non-pvp.   

    Guild Wars 2 is a very basic game right now.  I know, it's fantastic, but when you think about that. That this is only teh first layer, and you look at other games and how far they have come since their first layer, you can see where this game is going. 

    IN a year or two, we are going to see some fantastic new ideas with traditional sandbox ideas to move it into a non-pvp age of MMORPG Community.  

    But were you building/reparing "your house", did you defend "your" territory from others. You participated in the elements of a story and it really isn't what sandbox games are all about IMO.

    Of course we'll never find any common ground/agreement on what constitutes a sandbox, but I'm not seeing GW2 in any other light other than theme park style MMO. (and that's not a bad thing, it's what they set out to create)

    Perhaps there's some content on the horizon that might qualify, but the fact that ANET has gone out of their way to remove all non-consentual player conflict makes it impossible to really be a sandbox in any real definition of the term.

     

    I think a very small portion of the population have a very small idea of "sandbox". Which means their are things to do and i can do them as i wish in a sandbox. Sandbox gets its name frome hte idea that you can go around and do things like in a sandbox.  It doesn't mean you can attack other players or initiate player conflict. Particuarlly in RPGs, which, by design have always been coopoerative games.  So, keeping with the integrity of RPGs, it does a great job of having building blocks that can one day be turned into sandbox elements.

    You seem to really hate computer AI.  To me this is the only opponent i wish to play against in a game (unless i elect to play a subgame of balanced organized pvp combat). Else i pay developers to develop things for me, not to have 13 year old kids grief and assault me. I want challenged tactical encounters.  So, my experience defending my terroritory was far more organized and structured and fit in with the story of the game.  As opposed to the story being, some dude killed some other dude so his guild griefed another guild for the entire day ::OWNAGE::. 

    As I've said before, when i think sandbox, i think darkclouds 2. When i say guild wars is basic, i don't mean it as a slight, i mean that, as amazing as it is, this is just level 1.  It's like driving a mercedes and realizing that you're only in the C-Class Model.  Imagine what the e-class will feel like.  

    Also I said elements, and perhaps only the fun elements.  I see building blocks. I see they have programming in place to build things, repair things aind defend things.  I see they have programs in place to truly offer an AI that reacts to you, tactically and more strategically and most importantly, pitting you against the true foes of the world.  

  • DarkPonyDarkPony RotterdamPosts: 5,566Member
    Originally posted by Darth-Batman

    I'll burn your player-house down to the virtual ground!

    :D

    Lolz.

  • dageezadageeza london, KYPosts: 578Member

    Anet brings all the right and best concepts together in GW2 that make it a really fun and varied game, however the best is yet to come as they hone in on perfecting the core game and then begin to add expansion packs this games potential is only as limited as anets creativity and the boldness to implement it...

    With the talent and aggressive thinking of the anet team the sky is unlimited if anet wants to fly..

    Playing GW2..

  • DarkPonyDarkPony RotterdamPosts: 5,566Member
  • RhoklawRhoklaw Ft. Bliss, TXPosts: 3,483Member Uncommon

    Obviously the term "Sandbox" came from somewhere. Perhaps an MMO that seemed the exact opposite of linear or controlled. With that being said, "Theme Park" is a term used to describe an MMO made up of linear entertainment, where you go on a ride, finish and move on to the next ride for entertainment.

    In all honesty, I think WoW is a mix of "Theme Park" and "Sandbox" since you don't have to take the same path to leveling every time. It's more "Theme Park" though in the sense that you can't build anything in the virtual world for other players to see or visit.

    So, lets take a look at a game that truly was a "Sandbox" game that allowed players to pretty much do whatever they wanted, when they wanted and almost anywhere they wanted. That game being Star Wars Galaxies. Planets had some impassable obstacles, but for the most part, the virtual world was indeed a round planet so to speak. You venture off one side of the known map and you'ld appear on the other side of it coming back around again. You could build player cities / housing virtually anywhere so long as it wasn't too close to a PvE city. You could build machines to gather resources virtually anywhere that would supply an army so long as they were maintained with power and credits. Then you have the PvP conflict which allowed players to blow up each others "Bases" and not destroy the entire town. This conflict finally improved with the Galactic War Conflict addition, but thats not the point. SWG was probably thee bext example of how a working "Sandbox" game can work without the need for mass destruction of player built cities.

    So, to make a long story short, is GW2 "Theme Park" or "Sandbox" or a "Hybrid". GW2 is indeed a "Hybrid" but it leans more towards being "Theme Park" because direction players can choose is still limited. There are still control elements that prevent players from doing whatever they want, whenever they want, where ever they want.

    However, GW2 PvE system with Dynamic Events does make the game A LOT less boring than most traditional MMOs. Also, the separation of PvP and PvE in the game is a wise choice. FFA PvP games never survive with healthy subscription numbers simply because of griefers. So, find a way to prevent griefing and you might find a way to blow 20 million subscriptions out of the water and show WoW who truly is the King of MMOs. That being said, until that actually happens, I will take DAoC style 3 sided territory PvP with bonuses over anything else, which is why GW2 has my vote as the best MMO available to date. This includes the 3 games in my quote to the left except for maybe SWG.

    image

  • CrunkJuice2CrunkJuice2 asdasd, INPosts: 568Member

    and i dont see why i should be scared of guild wars 2 releasing sandbox elements in the future

     

    as long as they dont start caving to the world of warcraft crowd who wants everything in there mmo exactly like world of warcraft.i could careless if the game has sandbox elements in it

     

  • ariboersmaariboersma Yankton, SDPosts: 1,802Member
    Originally posted by Irus
    Originally posted by callmesneezy

    put this simple.. fuck non-pvp mmos.

    put this simple, fuck FFA PVP MMOS

    +infinity >.< there is not ONE civil aspect of FFA PVP.. not one. There is no need to harass others.. if you want to PVP go to a PVP area.. WvW or BG end of story.

    image

  • ariboersmaariboersma Yankton, SDPosts: 1,802Member
    Originally posted by BigHatLogan
    Originally posted by callmesneezy

    put this simple.. fuck non-pvp mmos.

    LOL true dat.  So many cowards out there afraid of a little challenge.  At least GW2 PVE is interesting and challenging.  Just think how much fun GW2 would be with open FFA PVP everywhere.  Nope, sorry, that would be too much fun.

    spoken like a true ganker.. sure we are all cowards because we want to play a game against the in game MOBS not the in game a holes.

    image

  • SomsbalSomsbal somsbalPosts: 222Member

    It's threads like these that are bound to backfire on the GW2 fanbase.

  • ResetgunResetgun OuluPosts: 471Member

    I beta played last weekend. So far I have seen traditional thema park MMO with "popup quest system" (when you walk to area, you will  automatically get quest to area). They say that doing quest will change world - so far I haven't saw much change - only some cases when there isn't enough players mobs will kill all NPCs in town and you must revive them when come to town. World is not really sandbox and everything is prescripted - there isn't player created content - players actions just shows what content is played next. 

    What makes GW2's popup quests system better from traditional MMO quest system (some NPC is standing still and giving static quests for single players)  is that popup quests are given automatically everyone area. This allows players really co-operate with each other - instead of trying to kill steal quest mobs or items. System is very similar from RIFT's events where group of players in zone must co-operate with each other for common goal. Difference is that there is small change for failure which leads to followup states and quests. I bet that all future MMOs are going to copy GW2's system to their game.

    Another nice thing with GW2 is that there is no  holy trinity class system (healer-dps-tank). Game seems to be pretty nicely soloable - but still because of events there is also lot's of grouping with other players. Also character customization was pretty good (thought it seems like that you can't change any option (like hairstyle) after character creation).

    Otherwise GW2 seems to be pretty traditional themepark MMO - that will bring something new to genre - but nothing really groundbreaking. It is NOT sandbox game - and never going  to be one (game mechanism are not going to allow that). It does NOT provide any superior crafting system. Game mechanism are basically same as in other themepark MMOs. And PvP is same old crappy fight system that was copy pasted from other MMOs (if you want to play good PvP try Battlefield 3).

    I guess I will play month or two - then I am wondering why I preorderd this game...

    (EDIT1: FIxed some spelling)

    "I know I said this was my last post, but you my friend are a idiotic moron." -Shadow4482

  • AmanaAmana New York, NYPosts: 2,538Moderator Uncommon

    Hey guys, can you take the "non-PvP MMOs/FFA PvP MMOs' etc discusion to its own proper thread instead of derailing this one. That topic is kind of its own general thing.

    To give feedback on moderation, contact community@mmorpg.com

  • JonokuJonoku Cool, PAPosts: 645Member

    Why should I be scared if guild wars is going to the sandbox direction? I love sandbox.

    Looking at: The Repopulation
    Preordering: None
    Playing: Random Games

  • DomenicusDomenicus sampaPosts: 290Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DarkPony
    Originally posted by Domenicus
    Originally posted by seridan
    Originally posted by Irus
    Originally posted by callmesneezy

    [mod edit]

    [mod edit]

     

    the part of being sandbox, may be that people who do not like PvP can enjoy GW2 and peole who enjoy PvP can enjoy as well... In ohter words, you can do as you please (PvP or PvE), without being forced to face one or another. But I would not call it a sandbox because of that...

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