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Main reason why SWTOR flopped?

I followed this game for almost three years! Finally I got into Beta and..... the *feeling* wasn't there!!  I'm not talking about the visuals or graphics but the feeling when jumping and turning and such....

 

Anyway, I still bought it! A mmorpg is supposed to be tested for real, for a period of time before judging it. Still I had problems with the *feeling*!

 

Now, several months later I gave it one last try.....   I do like the graphics, I do like the classes and I do like the entire Star Wars Universe but damn... the *feeling* when you jump and turn and bla bla bla  just isnt there!!

 

The story part of the game is amazing but for me I felt that it should stick to mainquest and not sidequest all the time.

The feeling is my problem though, it aint there. Not sure of the word... gameplay? Wierd gameplay that is?

 

What's your take?

 

(okej, not failed compared to some other mmo's and It's making money for sure but you do know what I mean)

:)

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Comments

  • n3v3rriv3rn3v3rriv3r NowherePosts: 349Member Uncommon

    Instances/Loading screens/no content/...

  • EletherylEletheryl morenoPosts: 152Member

    LoL, ¨the feeling¨, thats something new on the qq list. I think i just give up with mmorpg.com, is just pointless. 

  • waynejr2waynejr2 West Toluca Lake, CAPosts: 4,473Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Clawzon

    I followed this game for almost three years! Finally I got into Beta and..... the *feeling* wasn't there!!  I'm not talking about the visuals or graphics but the feeling when jumping and turning and such....

     

    Anyway, I still bought it! A mmorpg is supposed to be tested for real, for a period of time before judging it. Still I had problems with the *feeling*!

     

    Now, several months later I gave it one last try.....   I do like the graphics, I do like the classes and I do like the entire Star Wars Universe but damn... the *feeling* when you jump and turn and bla bla bla  just isnt there!!

     

    The story part of the game is amazing but for me I felt that it should stick to mainquest and not sidequest all the time.

    The feeling is my problem though, it aint there. Not sure of the word... gameplay? Wierd gameplay that is?

     

    What's your take?

     

    (okej, not failed compared to some other mmo's and It's making money for sure but you do know what I mean)

    [X] other:

    This poll/thread.

     

    There are many things that turned out to be on haters lists.  For the long term, the end game content is lacking.

    As a general design failure:  They tried the voice over thing (innovation.  Many people want innovation but only when it pays off) and it wasn't the hit they hoped it would be.  The focused too much on this one feature and likely didn't stop to ask what if this isn't as big a feature hit as they believed.   At most, they should have kept Voice overs to just the class story lines and at least, dropped it.  Keeping to just the class story line would give them a chance to judge the success at release with the masses.  But they didn't do that.  How to recover from this is tough to do now.

     

  • DromedarrDromedarr PraguePosts: 76Member

    endgame content and hype killed it, but long term would be COMMUNITY. this game has NO community at all. Missing chat bubbles and  meaningful social hubs with very confusing "server group" forums would kill the game anyway.

  • bakabrödbakabröd lysekilPosts: 129Member

    hey it didnt flopp.

    just give it time.

  • BartDaCatBartDaCat Renton, WAPosts: 819Member Uncommon

    Despite the negativity thrown around before the game was even released, I was a big fan of BioWare, and I had misplaced faith on their ability to pull through the rough launch and bugs therein, and give us meaningful content updates and fixes. 

     

    When I saw the first slew of patch notes, and the bug fix, "We have fixed the French translation for the word 'Darth'", but there were still other terribly glaring bugs in the game that had gone untouched (e.g. Operation Boss fights that would break, and the player would have to wait a week for the Operation to reset to make another attempt), I would have fallen out of my chair laughing if I wasn't so stunned at how preposterous the gesture was.

     

    As I saw the continuous decline of population on my server, and the handful of people left were using the Fleet ship as a lobby trying in vain to get groups for anything, I knew my patience was at an end.

     

  • AldersAlders Jack Burton'sPosts: 1,857Member Uncommon

    Should have a "mismanaged" option which would cover the majority of the available ones.

  • moosecatlolmoosecatlol Boring, TXPosts: 1,171Member Uncommon

    Combat.

  • SkuzSkuz WorcesterPosts: 1,034Member Uncommon

    Voted "Other"

    2 main reasons.

    Primarily : bad server management - huge queues, cripplingly low population caps, resulting in too many servers with too-thinly spread population & zero sign of any "plan b" contingency to ameliorate the sudden drop-off of players typical of modern MMO's leaving a below "critical mass" of players on the vast majority of servers for the game to feel vibrant, creating a desolated feeling to the game, long Warzone queue times & extremely limited opportunity to group with similarly leveled players.

    Secondary: copied too much of prior MMO design whilst failing to impliment a fleshed-out feature list the game's it copies from posess.

    I like the game "but it's dead Jim, dead!"

  • Trol1Trol1 Kissimmee, FLPosts: 175Member
     

    I really love this rather detailed "the feeling when jumping and turning and such...."

    Not sure what to say to that don't try to play it with a controller? 

    Or maybe he should have just gone for a more turret-like class?

    *shrug*

    We'd love to help but in order to save the patient you need to bring us a bit more than just 2 arms and a leg... how about the head and the torso? And the other leg?

  • SouldrainerSouldrainer Elmer, NJPosts: 1,857Member
    Personally, I loved SWTOR at first... but when patch 1.2 came out, it did a lot of things in the opposite direction of where the game should go.

    Error: 37. Signature not found. Please connect to my server for signature access.

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Copied wow with a gimmick (voice), badly


    People who like wow go back to wow. People who hate wow want something else.
  • BeyornBeyorn Canton, GAPosts: 249Member Uncommon

     

    Mismanaged financially and community wise:
     
    I will say first that I LOVED the leveling game and I don’t think there will be many that would complain about it.  Once you hit 50 however it is just like every other mmo.
     
    Personally I don’t understand how full voice acting could take up THAT much of a budget.  Then after launch they spend their money and time doing silly things.  Legacy is at the top of the list.  They should have been concentrating on STORY which is one of the only things that sets them apart from other mmos.  Without story it is another WoW which WoW does much better.
     
    Also the community has been handled horribly.  I though Mr. Reid did a good job overall but I didn’t like all the social media stuff he was putting up without placing it also on the SWTOR website.  Then last week they can him and they now have several people doing community chores.  It is a little late to have such a visible presence on the forums when you have already lost so many players.  They should have been doing this from day 1.  I just don’t understand what took them so long to get their collective heads out their arses.
     
    With all the above said however, I love star wars and I want the game to succeed.  I just think they need to change their direction from raid/group play and concentrate on story alone.  Let’s face it there are many games on the market that do raid/group content much better than they can.  The last time I even tried a flashpoint it was to buggy a mess to play anyway.
  • snapfusionsnapfusion San, CAPosts: 954Member

    Gutting my BH healer, I was gone as soon as they announced the changes.

  • MahavishnuMahavishnu BerlinPosts: 336Member

    The game, ehm, is not as successful as it could have been (I do not want to use the word  'fail'), because they made WoW in space with voice-overs, instead of an unique SIFI-MMO.

    The whole approach was a disaster. And this is even more disappointing, since they had a very interesting predecessor (SWG). I mean they obviously discussed their plans like this:

    "WoW is the biggest MMO of all times, so we need:

    • leveling and item-grind
    • tanks and healers
    • instanced dungeons
    • battlegrounds
    • raids

    Because this is how an MMO has to be done!"

    When I saw the first preview of ingame mechanics, I was shocked, I could not believe it, it looked so boring and so WoWish. And it did not feel like Star Wars at all. And then the stereotypical sentence "fight epic battles to loot epic gear!" A year ago I already knew, that I would never play this game.

    Instead they should have started like this: "After watching the movies I want to live in this world. What do I want to do? And how should it look like? No matter what we put in this game, it always has to create this special Star Wars feel." *

    Combat should have been much more FPS-style or something like in TERA. But Luke Skywalker in front of a big robot that constantly shoots at him with fat beams? And Han Solo stands behind him with some kind of a remote-control to hit him with a green beam to heal him? Never saw that in the movies.

    And they should have put much more love into space-ships and space-combat. I do not want to start about crafting in SWG here. Although the companion-mechanics in SWTOR was basically a brilliant idea.

    From what my friends told me, the world felt blank and lifeless, this is never good for an MMO.

    ______________________________________________________________________________________________________

    * One of the most amazing features of WoW was that everything in this game from the zones to the smallest details looked very Warcraft-like.

    Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy shit we don't need.

  • PlaidpantsPlaidpants Knoxville, TNPosts: 267Member

    it hasn't flopped. It's still the 2nd most played p2p mmo at the moment and is making money.. atleast in the west (because I'm not sure how big Tera is out east).

     

    Funny how people think if it isn't as popular as WoW then its a fail just because fanbois claimed it was going to bring WoW down.

  • GamerUntouchGamerUntouch smithville ON, ONPosts: 488Member

    Absolute ass backwards management.

     

    They rushed it out, rushed content and now they're trying to push it under the rug and it's showing.

    Every single thing they've done is an attempt to please investors, the biggest is not merging servers when it was clear servers need merging.

     

    They have around half the amount of servers WoW has, but about 1/10th the sub base.

    You'd think EA would learn from WAR, but nope, they aren't even going to learn from this. That's why I don't want TSW, EA cannot make MMOs.

  • TROLL_HARDTROLL_HARD Caucasian/WhitePosts: 312Member

    Dead worlds that can't be really explored.

     

    And the "feeling" thing -- yeah, I noticed it the first time I hit the spacebar and there was a slight delay in jumping and then the animation was off when the toon landed and slid a little bit while moving forward. I said "uh oh" and knew this wasn't gonna work.

  • BeyornBeyorn Canton, GAPosts: 249Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Plaidpants

    it hasn't flopped. It's still the 2nd most played p2p mmo at the moment and is making money.. atleast in the west (because I'm not sure how big Tera is out east).

     

    Funny how people think if it isn't as popular as WoW then its a fail just because fanbois claimed it was going to bring WoW down.

    I agree but it isnt bringing in the numbers they wanted either.  No one really knows how good it is doing right now.  The last report I read was sitting at 1.3 subs which is very impressive but I think the layoffs speak volumns more about what is really going on than anything else that has been said by anyone.

  • PyrateLVPyrateLV Las Vegas, NVPosts: 1,096Member Common

    There is no main reason. There are many variables

    Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
    Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
    Playing: Skyrim
    Following: The Repopulation
    I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
    ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)

  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INPosts: 3,739Member Uncommon

    Heres a few guesses:

    SWTOR is too story based...run out of story and you run out of game

    SWTOR is too much of a single player experience and not a MMO

    SWTOR should have been b2p not p2p...the game was not meant for a monthly but they thought they could make more money that way

    IT was too easy to get to cap and not much of an end game

     

           I still dont really consider it a flop....They made money so its a success in that regards....Players may see it as a failure though as I am sure many were hoping for a long term game, not something to entertain them for a month or two.

  • ThorbrandThorbrand West Palm Beach, FLPosts: 1,198Member

    By definition it wasn't a MMO.

  • chefdiablochefdiablo Barrie, ONPosts: 202Member

    I just didn't feel like I was playing a Star Wars character.

    There were small things like jumping.  My character could barely make a jump over a small rock or some sandbags. This small thing made me question the controls along with a few other skill related details.

    There are far too many stuns and rooting abilities for this type of combat.

    For me the most disappointing aspect is meaningless pvp. I know that many people do not care much for pvp and I respect that, however, I do want to have it in my games and Star Wars should have conflict between the Republic and the Empire.

    Most of the war zones set up battles against your own faction which causes conflict between your allies instead of your enemies. This is not a great result. The open world pvp (if any can be found) has no purpose or reward worth fighting over. The maps are designed so that each side avoids one another while out questing, crossing paths is a rare occurance and it is seemingly discouraged.

    Access to enemy bases are almost impossible due to the overpowered cannons that can track you stealthed or not. Why create a game with the ability to have open world pvp but make it so that you can't even invade an enemy base even at max level with high end gear?

    Why are there no contested areas on the planets?

    I was hoping for some epic battles between the sides fighting for planets or resources or even control of trade and commerce. Instead we got a steady diet of Hutt ball, and whatever the hell Ilum was supposed to be. The rest of the war zones are just farms with limited purpose.

    I had some fun days in Ilum when we could get some good 30 on 30 battles going but certainly not enough to sustain my interrest. I refused to trade kills.

    I grew up with Star Wars. I wanted the mmo to drop me into the conflict between the Republic and the Imperials with war, battles, planetary control, and large scale light saber and blasters flying all over.

    Bounty hunting.......smuggling.......how could they reduce these classes to such a pointless level? After the story line there is no more need for them outside of the forced combat mechanics for raids and some minor pvp. If these were my main classes, I would want to collect my bounty or smuggle stuff. These people should have a purpose in the game relating to their class.

    There should be a game within the game. Classes should have a job to do to keep things going.....missions, seeking data, Bounties to be collected, objects and items to be smuggled.

    My Assasin got a seat on the council and now just wanders around without true purpose or reason until someday when they patch in more story. He is important......I guess. Someday he will have to make desicisions and stuff but for now just farm war zones against everyone else until we need you.

    This game at the end was just a pile of WTF.

     

     

  • CorehavenCorehaven Colorado Springs, COPosts: 1,538Member
    Originally posted by TROLL_HARD

    Dead worlds that can't be really explored.

     

     

     

    For me this was it.  I noticed it right away in Beta and within the first 20 min and actually said out loud, " Uh oh.  Not good.  Not good at all...." .   Everything had a very static feel to it.  There were just roads everywhere.  Set paths with hardly any room on either side.  I never saw much of the game beyond that.  Heard Tatooine was a bit more open but regardless from what I saw of it, while it didnt suffer from that same problem, it didnt look all that great either. 

  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,939Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Theocritus

    H       I still dont really consider it a flop....They made money so its a success in that regards....Players may see it as a failure though as I am sure many were hoping for a long term game, not something to entertain them for a month or two.

     

    First, there is no real indication that BW/EA are "in the black" on TOR yet... they might be, they might not... it all depends on the specifics of deals with distributors, both physical and digital AND the split on sub revenue with LA.

    In particular, the revenue going back to EA from box sales is hard to assess, because for physical copies sold in any retail outlet or Amazon, EA is getting only 30%-40% that. And since the box price was the biggest chunk for them so far, that could be a lot. They do not get 100% of the box on digital sales either (although for Origin copies, that is somewhat a technicality).

     

    All that aside, and frankly more important, is that TOR in no way lived up to expectations, either for units sold or retention. The various interests that funded this game did so with the expectations of a MUCH bigger return than they got. They collectively tied up $200 mil for 5+ years, money that could have been used from many other projects, and they were expecting TOR to be a jackpot and have numbers that were comparable to WoW, that clearly did not and will not happen.

    Otherwise, they would have never put so much cash, for so long, for the marginal, if profitable returns TOR has generated.

     

    Bottom line is that TOR has failed to meet the expectations the investors in TOR had, and the very high "opportunity costs" that the making of TOR entailed.

    As such, the people who funded this game do not consider TOR anything but a flop, and the chances of seeing another $200 mil MMO in the next decade are basically nil.

    TOR is that much of a lesson to the industry.

     

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