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Torchlight 2: The Disgruntled Pony: DarkPony Tackles Torchlight 2!

2

Comments

  • YuuiYuui KaunasPosts: 723Member
    Originally posted by Asamof

    I've been playing the TL2 beta, and I'm enjoying a lot of things about it

    the class mechanics are interesting and the exploration is fun

    honestly though, the game already feels archaic compared to D3

    the game will definitely fill that niche of people who want the oldschool/outdated style of dungeon crawling, but D3 is the natural evolution of the genre

    So sticking to what made the genre GREAT is bad nowadays?

     

    Well I guess soon failures like ME3 or DAII will be also be known as "epitome" of "rpg" genre. 

     

    TLII does some innovations but overall its a logical progression of diablo-like game. Polished as hell. Everything that Diablo3 SHOULD have been. 

     

    D3 tried to "innovate" it failed. Its a cheap cash grap for blizzard through RMT auction house and entire game is built around it. It does not play as ARPG, it has no stats nor skills(thus very streamlined and castrated customization) and the whole game is pretty much a linnear-progression style just like into what WoW has degraded into through years. 

     

    D3 is NOT arpg. Its the only game(alongside Borderlands) that deserves to be called single player mmo. Its just that if borderlands is normal mmo, D3 is pay to win singleplayer mmo that reminds me of those facebook "games" that milk you of your money for nothing. 

     

    # A GRIM, ODD, ARCANE SKY
    # ANY GOD, I MARK SACRED
    # A MASKED CRY ADORING
    # A DREAMY, SICK DRAGON

  • MilanderMilander Windsor, ONPosts: 151Member Uncommon

    I got myself a TL2 beta key....used it on my account and it's all good...Then when trying to make a account on the website to log in, it says that I cant create an account. No reasons just that I am unable to do so. Email got back a form reply basically stating "If it's about beta we wont reply to your email" so well, the company wont be getting my money....And I was looking forward to this game too.

     

    image
  • jpnzjpnz SydneyPosts: 3,529Member
    Originally posted by Yuui
     

    So sticking to what made the genre GREAT is bad nowadays?

     

    Well I guess soon failures like ME3 or DAII will be also be known as "epitome" of "rpg" genre. 

     

    TLII does some innovations but overall its a logical progression of diablo-like game. Polished as hell. Everything that Diablo3 SHOULD have been. 

     

    D3 tried to "innovate" it failed. Its a cheap cash grap for blizzard through RMT auction house and entire game is built around it. It does not play as ARPG, it has no stats nor skills(thus very streamlined and castrated customization) and the whole game is pretty much a linnear-progression style just like into what WoW has degraded into through years. 

     

    D3 is NOT arpg. Its the only game(alongside Borderlands) that deserves to be called single player mmo. Its just that if borderlands is normal mmo, D3 is pay to win singleplayer mmo that reminds me of those facebook "games" that milk you of your money for nothing. 

     

    If 'innovate failure' means people have to reroll their char cause they put one point into a stat they shouldn't have, then yes, we should fail more.

    I don't think people understand how unforgiving D2 was.

    Remember 'saving a skill point'?

    D2 was a good game back in the day but some of its game mechanics were really bad to new players.

    Gdemami -
    Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.

  • YuuiYuui KaunasPosts: 723Member
    Originally posted by jpnz
    Originally posted by Yuui
     

    So sticking to what made the genre GREAT is bad nowadays?

     

    Well I guess soon failures like ME3 or DAII will be also be known as "epitome" of "rpg" genre. 

     

    TLII does some innovations but overall its a logical progression of diablo-like game. Polished as hell. Everything that Diablo3 SHOULD have been. 

     

    D3 tried to "innovate" it failed. Its a cheap cash grap for blizzard through RMT auction house and entire game is built around it. It does not play as ARPG, it has no stats nor skills(thus very streamlined and castrated customization) and the whole game is pretty much a linnear-progression style just like into what WoW has degraded into through years. 

     

    D3 is NOT arpg. Its the only game(alongside Borderlands) that deserves to be called single player mmo. Its just that if borderlands is normal mmo, D3 is pay to win singleplayer mmo that reminds me of those facebook "games" that milk you of your money for nothing. 

     

    If 'innovate failure' means people have to reroll their char cause they put one point into a stat they shouldn't have, then yes, we should fail more.

    I don't think people understand how unforgiving D2 was.

    Remember 'saving a skill point'?

    D2 was a good game back in the day but some of its game mechanics were really bad to new players.

    ANd how is that BAD?

    I LOVE calculating and deciding on into what stat I should invest or on how should I build my character. 

    Its like building a weapon. Its damn satisfying seeing all those numbers you decided upon being put into action.  Thats what makes arpgs enjoyable. Building your character. And if you were careless enough to NOT think when creating and advancing your character that is your problem, not game's. Why should game be casualized just to satysfy a few people who were too lazy or too casual to calculate stat advantages before investing points?

    # A GRIM, ODD, ARCANE SKY
    # ANY GOD, I MARK SACRED
    # A MASKED CRY ADORING
    # A DREAMY, SICK DRAGON

  • ThaneThane berlinPosts: 2,231Member Uncommon

    obviously the poster above me never played d2 :)

     

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • DarkPonyDarkPony RotterdamPosts: 5,566Member
    Originally posted by Thane

    obviously the poster above me never played d2 :)

     

    Not sure about that.

    I really like that unforgiving aspect as well. It adds weight to the choices you need to make and you'll be making them more consciously. It also adds to the replayability; musing over the perfect character to make next. And if you really made terrible mistakes, it doesn't take so long to get a new char up in higher difficulty settings like in most mmorpgs anyway :)

  • jpnzjpnz SydneyPosts: 3,529Member
    Originally posted by Yuui
    Originally posted by jpnz

     

    If 'innovate failure' means people have to reroll their char cause they put one point into a stat they shouldn't have, then yes, we should fail more.

    I don't think people understand how unforgiving D2 was.

    Remember 'saving a skill point'?

    D2 was a good game back in the day but some of its game mechanics were really bad to new players.

    ANd how is that BAD?

    I LOVE calculating and deciding on into what stat I should invest or on how should I build my character. 

    Its like building a weapon. Its damn satisfying seeing all those numbers you decided upon being put into action.  Thats what makes arpgs enjoyable. Building your character. And if you were careless enough to NOT think when creating and advancing your character that is your problem, not game's. Why should game be casualized just to satysfy a few people who were too lazy or too casual to calculate stat advantages before investing points?

    Because 'casuals' outnumber the 'hardcore'?

    Giving players the ability to customize is good but is it really customize when most will either fail utterly and quit (Diablo2) or just go to 'Elitejerks.com' and copy paste?

     

    You know what's funny?

    Diablo3 is more customizable without screwing over the player like they did in Diablo2.

    Gdemami -
    Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.

  • YuuiYuui KaunasPosts: 723Member
    Originally posted by jpnz
    Originally posted by Yuui
    Originally posted by jpnz

     

    If 'innovate failure' means people have to reroll their char cause they put one point into a stat they shouldn't have, then yes, we should fail more.

    I don't think people understand how unforgiving D2 was.

    Remember 'saving a skill point'?

    D2 was a good game back in the day but some of its game mechanics were really bad to new players.

    ANd how is that BAD?

    I LOVE calculating and deciding on into what stat I should invest or on how should I build my character. 

    Its like building a weapon. Its damn satisfying seeing all those numbers you decided upon being put into action.  Thats what makes arpgs enjoyable. Building your character. And if you were careless enough to NOT think when creating and advancing your character that is your problem, not game's. Why should game be casualized just to satysfy a few people who were too lazy or too casual to calculate stat advantages before investing points?

    Because 'casuals' outnumber the 'hardcore'?

    Giving players the ability to customize is good but is it really customize when most will either fail utterly and quit (Diablo2) or just go to 'Elitejerks.com' and copy paste?

     

    You know what's funny?

    Diablo3 is more customizable without screwing over the player like they did in Diablo2.

     

    Diablo fanbase certainly is big enough without the need to casualize it for more mainstream audience. Most of such "casualizations " fail. Dragon Age II failed. Elder Scrolls Oblivion failed. ME3 Failed. 

    They had a fanbase. Thanks to the streamlining and focusing everything(including invasive and horrible online DRM) on pay2win RMT auction house, A LOT of that fanbase will go for Torchlight II and Path of Exile instead. Bu tthen again the horrible issues of game mechanics have already been highlighted in that TotalBiscuit's video. 

    I see nothing wrong with customisation that requires person to think on what the hell he/she/it is doing.  Half the fun of rpg games are behind the statistics and numbers behind the gameplay. If I wanted to go see a movie or play an action brawler, I would do so. I play arpg games for loot and complex numbers and I play rpg games for character roleplay and complex numbers. 

     

    Oh yes, customization. How glorious, I can now decide into which of automatically unlocking skills will I add that +4% area dmg rune that I will unlock at certain level...how complex. AN then I will equip my class-restricted generic loot that shoehorns me EVEN MORE into what Blizz wants my character to be, while every stat and everything is automatically increased to even more restrict me into playing the game the way they want me to play it. Rune system and every other bit of "customisation" in Diablocraft 3 is pretty much linnear progression veiled in lies. 

     

    # A GRIM, ODD, ARCANE SKY
    # ANY GOD, I MARK SACRED
    # A MASKED CRY ADORING
    # A DREAMY, SICK DRAGON

  • fivorothfivoroth LondonPosts: 3,661Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Yizle
    Originally posted by Asamof

    I've been playing the TL2 beta, and I'm enjoying a lot of things about it

    the class mechanics are interesting and the exploration is fun

    honestly though, the game already feels archaic compared to D3

    the game will definitely fill that niche of people who want the oldschool/outdated style of dungeon crawling, but D3 is the natural evolution of the genre

    I lol'd so hard at this fanboy BS. Then I started feeling sorry for you and anyone else who belived this load.

    D3 is crap. Complete crap. If you like old graphics D3 is your game. If you like no skill required and basically autoleveling D3 is for you.

    Post your hell or inferno character and then we can talk. I am sure you have 0 experience of Diablo 3.

    @OP, I really liked the review. I've already bought the game on steam because 15 pounds is nothing.

    Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  • Delerious1Delerious1 Lynnwood, WAPosts: 72Member

    You guys that talk about D3 lacking customization or challenge clearly know jack shit about the game.

    If you leveled a character past the tutorial section of the open beta weekend by buying the game you would know this.

    D3 is fantastic.  The art direction is great, the cinematic cut scenes are fantastic, the customization is awesome, the loot grind is fun. 

    Most of you guys are really talking out of your ass about D3 due to hatred of blizzard/activision(the bad guys ewww), your opinion that smaller companies making games are better and more deserving of your money and last, but certainly not least your ignorant as hell comments on the game.

    The amount of ignorant statements in this thread literally boggles my mind.

    I have nothing against Torchlight 2 and hope the game does well, but it get's old constantly reading bullshit comments about D3 on this forum that aren't merely opinion, but completely inaccurate or false.

     

  • arescagearescage Philsadelphia, PAPosts: 20Member

    I don't see how D3 moved anything in the genre forward. It took out offline single player, mods, and stats. If a game is to move things forward then it should have something that innovates. FATE added pets that we now see in T2. T2 has that superbar that adds up and applifies certain abilities for each class along with fishing and now pet specific equipment.

     

    Even Titan Quest added the character class merging and still some of the best graphics this genre has to this date. PoE has it's own unique skill system using socketted items in it's own original way. I fail to see what D3 has added more than it has discarded from the genre. The only new thing I've seen is the rune system for skills. That's pretty cool, but it would be better if it wasn't the only thing that could be customized. Two people with a Monk have the exact same character minus gear and where they chose to put their skill runes. This concept is primitive compared to every other ARPG out there including D1 and D2.

     

    Sorry, but even though D3 is a well made game, it sure isn't moving the genre forward. It's just capitalizing on the name of it's own franchise. D3 is a huge step backwards.

  • JherakJherak Barrie, ONPosts: 10Member

    Titan Quest was one of my favourite ARPGs ever.  I'm loving torchlight 2 and I think Diablo 3 is not the game it could or should have been.  It has awesome lore, but really the gameplay feels lacking to me.  Its just another step in the casualization of the gaming industry that the Wii started.  All of the technical bugs that it launched with are inexcusable for a company that 1 owns the most successful mmo of all time, and 2 had a 7+ year development cycle.  The DRM always online is obviously terrible, if your internet hiccups you can get booted and loose all sorts of progress.

     

    All that aside, for the people thinking getting rid of stat points was a good idea because of all the "useless" buils in Diablo 2 or the crippling mistakes you could make.  Blizzard could have easily left that in and made it so you could reset your skills for a cost as many times as you wanted.  This would benefit both casual and hardcore.   Or how about letting you choose to auto level or not when you started the game?  This option could be turned off or on whenever you wanted and if it was on it would be just like the current diablo 3.

     

    They had so many options and really all they did with D3 was cater to the casual crowd, and alienate the hardcore gamers who made them what they are.  This is what most big publishers are doing these days, butchering franchises for short term profit.

  • fivorothfivoroth LondonPosts: 3,661Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by arescage

    I don't see how D3 moved anything in the genre forward. It took out offline single player, mods, and stats. If a game is to move things forward then it should have something that innovates. FATE added pets that we now see in T2. T2 has that superbar that adds up and applifies certain abilities for each class along with fishing and now pet specific equipment.

     

    Even Titan Quest added the character class merging and still some of the best graphics this genre has to this date. PoE has it's own unique skill system using socketted items in it's own original way. I fail to see what D3 has added more than it has discarded from the genre. The only new thing I've seen is the rune system for skills. That's pretty cool, but it would be better if it wasn't the only thing that could be customized. Two people with a Monk have the exact same character minus gear and where they chose to put their skill runes. This concept is primitive compared to every other ARPG out there including D1 and D2.

     

    Sorry, but even though D3 is a well made game, it sure isn't moving the genre forward. It's just capitalizing on the name of it's own franchise. D3 is a huge step backwards.

    Diablo 3 has a great new crafting system. Diablo 3 has a new skill system which is amazing. Diablo 3 has random events, random dungeons in it. Diablo 3 has an all max level difficulty. They introduced the banner system. They have a very extensive achievement system which I don't think any other action RPG did before it.

    I fail to see how Torchlight 1 did anything new for the genre. 

    Also Diablo 3 doesn't have to do anything new to be successful because Diablo 2 was damn near perfect. Blizzard CREATED this genre. Diablo 3 got pretty much everything right. It is a true Diablo 2 sequel. The same way SC2 was an amazing sequal to SC1. THose games were very similar too. I've played all the Diablo clones which came after Diablo 2 and none of them came even close to the awesomeness of Diablo. They just were not fun to play. Diablo 3 is fun to play.

    Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  • YuuiYuui KaunasPosts: 723Member
    Originally posted by fivoroth

    Diablo 3 has a great new crafting system. Diablo 3 has a new skill system which is amazing. Diablo 3 has random events, random dungeons in it. Diablo 3 has an all max level difficulty. They introduced the banner system. They have a very extensive achievement system which I don't think any other action RPG did before it.

    I fail to see how Torchlight 1 did anything new for the genre. 

    Also Diablo 3 doesn't have to do anything new to be successful because Diablo 2 was damn near perfect. Blizzard CREATED this genre. Diablo 3 got pretty much everything right. It is a true Diablo 2 sequel. The same way SC2 was an amazing sequal to SC1. THose games were very similar too. I've played all the Diablo clones which came after Diablo 2 and none of them came even close to the awesomeness of Diablo. They just were not fun to play. Diablo 3 is fun to play.

     

    Crafting has absolutely zero importance in ARPG games where the main idea is FINDING loot not creating it. If it was MMO, well great for crafting. 99% of arpg fanbase could not care less about crafting.

    "New skill system"? Pretty much a copy of how they destroyed World oF Warcraft skill system.

    random dungeons? Tl1 had it TL2 has it, hell, even original diablo games had it.

    random events? Tl2 has it and half the genre has it too.

    Difficulty? considering starter difficulties are a cakewalk and TL2 already has quite a challenging difficulty AND ability to mod it into more difficult, I don't see how that changes anything. 

    Achievements? casualization yet again. No one seriously cares about "achievements". Next thing you know you will add a "facebook integration" as a pro for diablo3. 

     

    Also, correction: 

    ActivisionBlizzard DID NOT create the genre. Blizzard North(Condor Entertainment) did. And majority of folks responsible for that are guess where? Runic Games. 

    Other stuff in your post...it seems you are more than likely trying to convince YOURSELF that Diablo 3 was "great". 

    Diablo3 is heavily streamlined, heavily casualized "rpg" game with pay2win RMT auction house and invasive DRM. Not to mention the complaints of horrible pacing, linnear mmo-like progression, over-simplification and seriously short game length.

    # A GRIM, ODD, ARCANE SKY
    # ANY GOD, I MARK SACRED
    # A MASKED CRY ADORING
    # A DREAMY, SICK DRAGON

  • Psycho2kPsycho2k SeahamPosts: 63Member
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Originally posted by arescage

    I don't see how D3 moved anything in the genre forward. It took out offline single player, mods, and stats. If a game is to move things forward then it should have something that innovates. FATE added pets that we now see in T2. T2 has that superbar that adds up and applifies certain abilities for each class along with fishing and now pet specific equipment.

     

    Even Titan Quest added the character class merging and still some of the best graphics this genre has to this date. PoE has it's own unique skill system using socketted items in it's own original way. I fail to see what D3 has added more than it has discarded from the genre. The only new thing I've seen is the rune system for skills. That's pretty cool, but it would be better if it wasn't the only thing that could be customized. Two people with a Monk have the exact same character minus gear and where they chose to put their skill runes. This concept is primitive compared to every other ARPG out there including D1 and D2.

     

    Sorry, but even though D3 is a well made game, it sure isn't moving the genre forward. It's just capitalizing on the name of it's own franchise. D3 is a huge step backwards.

    Diablo 3 has a great new crafting system. Diablo 3 has a new skill system which is amazing. Diablo 3 has random events, random dungeons in it. Diablo 3 has an all max level difficulty. They introduced the banner system. They have a very extensive achievement system which I don't think any other action RPG did before it.

    I fail to see how Torchlight 1 did anything new for the genre. 

    Also Diablo 3 doesn't have to do anything new to be successful because Diablo 2 was damn near perfect. Blizzard CREATED this genre. Diablo 3 got pretty much everything right. It is a true Diablo 2 sequel. The same way SC2 was an amazing sequal to SC1. THose games were very similar too. I've played all the Diablo clones which came after Diablo 2 and none of them came even close to the awesomeness of Diablo. They just were not fun to play. Diablo 3 is fun to play.

    Torchlight 1 has an achievement system through steam.

    image

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by Yuui

    Also, correction: 

    ActivisionBlizzard DID NOT create the genre. Blizzard North(Condor Entertainment) did. And majority of folks responsible for that are guess where? Runic Games.

    Flagship Studios did have 6 people from Blizzard North

    but only 3 of them did the transition to Runic Games

  • itgrowlsitgrowls newport news, VAPosts: 2,951Member

    Absolutely fantastic design, they did make it harder i dunno how many times right from the beginning one has to watch the damage the enemies are doing to you.

    The class designs are fantastic as an avid engineer fan i have to say they did a fantastic job especially with the bots. Those things are awesome. I love the shield abiliities.

    The pet running back to town to sell my crap is the best design ever, wish i had that in D3 every time my bags are full.

     

  • YuuiYuui KaunasPosts: 723Member
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by Yuui

    Also, correction: 

    ActivisionBlizzard DID NOT create the genre. Blizzard North(Condor Entertainment) did. And majority of folks responsible for that are guess where? Runic Games.

    Flagship Studios did have 6 people from Blizzard North

    but only 3 of them did the transition to Runic Games

     

    And that includes all the people that matter - lead designers and main composer. You know, the people with ideas who direct all the cogs in the machine to make those ideas? 

    # A GRIM, ODD, ARCANE SKY
    # ANY GOD, I MARK SACRED
    # A MASKED CRY ADORING
    # A DREAMY, SICK DRAGON

  • just1opinionjust1opinion Kansas City, MOPosts: 4,844Member
    Originally posted by Hayasa

    If by evolution you are refering to being less and less interactive and more left button clicker, sure, is an evolution. For me that's the arcaic thing, themeparking is not an evolved form. 

    I discovered this game by someone telling me "go play TL2" while giving my opinion about internet dependance on d3. I signed for beta, why not? If that guy hate it may be good. So far I'm enjoying the game so much. TL2 gives me a lot to do while D3 don't give much besides grabing blizzard's hand through their new theme park based on diablo lore. If that's an evolution I'll stick to the other branch of the evolution, the one with TL2 on it. Customization on skills, stats, single player and LAN, different difficulty levels, rich enviroments and dungeons, etc... I rather have fun hacking and slashing that pressing levers to kill monsters conveniently waiting under a big lamp. 

    The new blizzard activision's Diablo 3 have and amazing team doing cinematics and an amazing lore left behind by other talented people working now in different games, that's all. The game itself is not what a game named Diablo 3 should be. I am a Diablo fan since '96, but that's is no diablo.

    As i said, I'm sticking to TL2

     

    +1

     

    I loved Torchlight and will soon get to love T2.  I only wish I hadn't spent the money on D3 because my partner is not going to be happy to hear I need to spend another 40 bucks for us both to play after having just spent 120 dollars a few days ago.  I don't expect that conversation to go down well.  Maybe I'll wait a few months.

     

     

    President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club

  • heartlessheartless Brooklyn, NYPosts: 4,993Member

    I've been playing T2 open beta and I absolutely love it. I'm not sure how to explain it but Torchlight 2 feels more like a Diablo game than Diablo 3 does. I guess it's probably because both D2 and T2 had some of the same people working on it. The combat has a lot of impact to it. When you shoot that zombie with a rifle, you can almost feel it. And when the mobs explode into little bits and pieces... well it's just so delicious. Dugeons actually have secrets passages and puzzles. Classes are different than the typical warrior, priest, rogue, mage we get in ARPGs. I absolutely love the pet system. Being able to send the pet to sell your junk is a great idea. That ferret is the man!

    Never have to deal with always on DRM, player created mod suport, co-op either through online or LAN. You can't beat the price either. $20 on Steam and you get T1 free. Or guaranteed access to the beta of Cryptic's NWN game, if that's your thing. Personally, I avoid Cryptic games like a plague but I can see why some may be interested.

    The only down side is that the game is not released yet. It could've held me over until GW2 launches. Too bad. Still a great game though and if you're a fan of ARPGS, you owe it to yourself to buy it. It's $20, no excuses.

    image

  • fivorothfivoroth LondonPosts: 3,661Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Yuui
    Originally posted by fivoroth

    Diablo 3 has a great new crafting system. Diablo 3 has a new skill system which is amazing. Diablo 3 has random events, random dungeons in it. Diablo 3 has an all max level difficulty. They introduced the banner system. They have a very extensive achievement system which I don't think any other action RPG did before it.

    I fail to see how Torchlight 1 did anything new for the genre. 

    Also Diablo 3 doesn't have to do anything new to be successful because Diablo 2 was damn near perfect. Blizzard CREATED this genre. Diablo 3 got pretty much everything right. It is a true Diablo 2 sequel. The same way SC2 was an amazing sequal to SC1. THose games were very similar too. I've played all the Diablo clones which came after Diablo 2 and none of them came even close to the awesomeness of Diablo. They just were not fun to play. Diablo 3 is fun to play.

     

    Crafting has absolutely zero importance in ARPG games where the main idea is FINDING loot not creating it. If it was MMO, well great for crafting. 99% of arpg fanbase could not care less about crafting.

    "New skill system"? Pretty much a copy of how they destroyed World oF Warcraft skill system.

    random dungeons? Tl1 had it TL2 has it, hell, even original diablo games had it.

    random events? Tl2 has it and half the genre has it too.

    Difficulty? considering starter difficulties are a cakewalk and TL2 already has quite a challenging difficulty AND ability to mod it into more difficult, I don't see how that changes anything. 

    Achievements? casualization yet again. No one seriously cares about "achievements". Next thing you know you will add a "facebook integration" as a pro for diablo3. 

     

    Also, correction: 

    ActivisionBlizzard DID NOT create the genre. Blizzard North(Condor Entertainment) did. And majority of folks responsible for that are guess where? Runic Games. 

    Other stuff in your post...it seems you are more than likely trying to convince YOURSELF that Diablo 3 was "great". 

    Diablo3 is heavily streamlined, heavily casualized "rpg" game with pay2win RMT auction house and invasive DRM. Not to mention the complaints of horrible pacing, linnear mmo-like progression, over-simplification and seriously short game length.

    I was talking about what's new. Crafting is new. Doesn't matter if it is very important to action RPGs. Do you think that pets (aka the donkeys that carry and sell your stuff) and stupid fishing matters in action RPGs?

    By random dungeons I meant that you can get a wide variety of different dungeons in one area and that some of them you will not see as they do not all spawn in the game. Not just one and the same template randomised which you see in Diablo 2.

    Random events - Diablo 3 came out first so they introduced it first? Can you tell me which other action RPGs which are currently on the market have random events? I must've missed them.

    Difficulty. I wouldn't say that normal is cake. It's on the same level as Diablo 2.

    Do you know how many times I've heard this? STudio X was the original Diablo team. Lalalaala. It's all fancy words. There have been like what 3-5 action RPGS which were made by the "original Blizzard North"? Was Torchlight 1 created by these supposedly "Blizzard North" guys? Cause that game was horrible compared to Diablo and it came out 5-6 years (maybe more not sure) after Diablo 2. And boy was it cartoony. 

     

     

    Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  • kreakrea MaastrichtPosts: 193Member
    Originally posted by jpnz

    Yep, TL2 seems like a quality game that I'll buy and sink dozens of hours into. Just like TL1.

    Yes, I also play D3 and yes I'll buy PoE too!

     

    What? I am a gamer!

    Just because I like Pizza doesn't mean I have to hate Steak!

    Yeh same here i do prefer d3 but thats my taste , tho i own all the others to and i switch around depending how i feel .

  • heartlessheartless Brooklyn, NYPosts: 4,993Member
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Originally posted by Yuui
    Originally posted by fivoroth

    Diablo 3 has a great new crafting system. Diablo 3 has a new skill system which is amazing. Diablo 3 has random events, random dungeons in it. Diablo 3 has an all max level difficulty. They introduced the banner system. They have a very extensive achievement system which I don't think any other action RPG did before it.

    I fail to see how Torchlight 1 did anything new for the genre. 

    Also Diablo 3 doesn't have to do anything new to be successful because Diablo 2 was damn near perfect. Blizzard CREATED this genre. Diablo 3 got pretty much everything right. It is a true Diablo 2 sequel. The same way SC2 was an amazing sequal to SC1. THose games were very similar too. I've played all the Diablo clones which came after Diablo 2 and none of them came even close to the awesomeness of Diablo. They just were not fun to play. Diablo 3 is fun to play.

     

    Crafting has absolutely zero importance in ARPG games where the main idea is FINDING loot not creating it. If it was MMO, well great for crafting. 99% of arpg fanbase could not care less about crafting.

    "New skill system"? Pretty much a copy of how they destroyed World oF Warcraft skill system.

    random dungeons? Tl1 had it TL2 has it, hell, even original diablo games had it.

    random events? Tl2 has it and half the genre has it too.

    Difficulty? considering starter difficulties are a cakewalk and TL2 already has quite a challenging difficulty AND ability to mod it into more difficult, I don't see how that changes anything. 

    Achievements? casualization yet again. No one seriously cares about "achievements". Next thing you know you will add a "facebook integration" as a pro for diablo3. 

     

    Also, correction: 

    ActivisionBlizzard DID NOT create the genre. Blizzard North(Condor Entertainment) did. And majority of folks responsible for that are guess where? Runic Games. 

    Other stuff in your post...it seems you are more than likely trying to convince YOURSELF that Diablo 3 was "great". 

    Diablo3 is heavily streamlined, heavily casualized "rpg" game with pay2win RMT auction house and invasive DRM. Not to mention the complaints of horrible pacing, linnear mmo-like progression, over-simplification and seriously short game length.

    I was talking about what's new. Crafting is new. Doesn't matter if it is very important to action RPGs. Do you think that pets (aka the donkeys that carry and sell your stuff) and stupid fishing matters in action RPGs?

    By random dungeons I meant that you can get a wide variety of different dungeons in one area and that some of them you will not see as they do not all spawn in the game. Not just one and the same template randomised which you see in Diablo 2.

    Random events - Diablo 3 came out first so they introduced it first? Can you tell me which other action RPGs which are currently on the market have random events? I must've missed them.

    Difficulty. I wouldn't say that normal is cake. It's on the same level as Diablo 2.

    Do you know how many times I've heard this? STudio X was the original Diablo team. Lalalaala. It's all fancy words. There have been like what 3-5 action RPGS which were made by the "original Blizzard North"? Was Torchlight 1 created by these supposedly "Blizzard North" guys? Cause that game was horrible compared to Diablo and it came out 5-6 years (maybe more not sure) after Diablo 2. And boy was it cartoony. 

     

     

    There is a lot more to the pet system in T2 and pets are a lot more than just pack mules but nice try though.

    As far as your little anti Torchlight rant, that game has ratings almost as high at Diablo II. Metacritic has it at 8.3 critic and 8.4 user rating, compared to Diablo II's 8.8 critic and 8.5 user rating. You may not like the game but it's far from horrible. It's a solid ARPG, one of the best actually and it is true, some of the people who were responsible for Diablo II are responsible for Torchlight 1 and 2.

    Personally, I can't wait for T2. I'm really looking forward to playing a single player game and not having to worry about lag or the servers being down.

    image

  • AsamofAsamof La Canada, CAPosts: 738Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by heartless
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Originally posted by Yuui
    Originally posted by fivoroth

    Diablo 3 has a great new crafting system. Diablo 3 has a new skill system which is amazing. Diablo 3 has random events, random dungeons in it. Diablo 3 has an all max level difficulty. They introduced the banner system. They have a very extensive achievement system which I don't think any other action RPG did before it.

    I fail to see how Torchlight 1 did anything new for the genre. 

    Also Diablo 3 doesn't have to do anything new to be successful because Diablo 2 was damn near perfect. Blizzard CREATED this genre. Diablo 3 got pretty much everything right. It is a true Diablo 2 sequel. The same way SC2 was an amazing sequal to SC1. THose games were very similar too. I've played all the Diablo clones which came after Diablo 2 and none of them came even close to the awesomeness of Diablo. They just were not fun to play. Diablo 3 is fun to play.

     

    Crafting has absolutely zero importance in ARPG games where the main idea is FINDING loot not creating it. If it was MMO, well great for crafting. 99% of arpg fanbase could not care less about crafting.

    "New skill system"? Pretty much a copy of how they destroyed World oF Warcraft skill system.

    random dungeons? Tl1 had it TL2 has it, hell, even original diablo games had it.

    random events? Tl2 has it and half the genre has it too.

    Difficulty? considering starter difficulties are a cakewalk and TL2 already has quite a challenging difficulty AND ability to mod it into more difficult, I don't see how that changes anything. 

    Achievements? casualization yet again. No one seriously cares about "achievements". Next thing you know you will add a "facebook integration" as a pro for diablo3. 

     

    Also, correction: 

    ActivisionBlizzard DID NOT create the genre. Blizzard North(Condor Entertainment) did. And majority of folks responsible for that are guess where? Runic Games. 

    Other stuff in your post...it seems you are more than likely trying to convince YOURSELF that Diablo 3 was "great". 

    Diablo3 is heavily streamlined, heavily casualized "rpg" game with pay2win RMT auction house and invasive DRM. Not to mention the complaints of horrible pacing, linnear mmo-like progression, over-simplification and seriously short game length.

    I was talking about what's new. Crafting is new. Doesn't matter if it is very important to action RPGs. Do you think that pets (aka the donkeys that carry and sell your stuff) and stupid fishing matters in action RPGs?

    By random dungeons I meant that you can get a wide variety of different dungeons in one area and that some of them you will not see as they do not all spawn in the game. Not just one and the same template randomised which you see in Diablo 2.

    Random events - Diablo 3 came out first so they introduced it first? Can you tell me which other action RPGs which are currently on the market have random events? I must've missed them.

    Difficulty. I wouldn't say that normal is cake. It's on the same level as Diablo 2.

    Do you know how many times I've heard this? STudio X was the original Diablo team. Lalalaala. It's all fancy words. There have been like what 3-5 action RPGS which were made by the "original Blizzard North"? Was Torchlight 1 created by these supposedly "Blizzard North" guys? Cause that game was horrible compared to Diablo and it came out 5-6 years (maybe more not sure) after Diablo 2. And boy was it cartoony. 

     

     

    There is a lot more to the pet system in T2 and pets are a lot more than just pack mules but nice try though.

    As far as your little anti Torchlight rant, that game has ratings almost as high at Diablo II. Metacritic has it at 8.3 critic and 8.4 user rating, compared to Diablo II's 8.8 critic and 8.5 user rating. You may not like the game but it's far from horrible. It's a solid ARPG, one of the best actually and it is true, some of the people who were responsible for Diablo II are responsible for Torchlight 1 and 2.

    Personally, I can't wait for T2. I'm really looking forward to playing a single player game and not having to worry about lag or the servers being down.

    are you seriously quoting metacritic as proof of a games quality? really?

  • VooDoo_PapaVooDoo_Papa Somewhere on a beach on the east coast, FLPosts: 883Member Uncommon

    mouse wheel zoom ftw

    image
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