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Guild Wars 2: Beta Rage!

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Comments

  • sadeyxsadeyx leicesterPosts: 1,553Member

    oh yes, it IS a beta.

    but when you start charging people money to enter those beta's the frustration is understandable.

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Yahoo, COPosts: 4,990Member



    Originally posted by redzebrass

    @Wickedjelly





    The answer to this is Anet did not force anyone to buy the game.













    Think of it as gambling, you wouldn't walk into a casino, gamble away all your money, then cry and demand your money back simply because you lost........













    Anet simply provided the opportunity, we (the players) weighed up the risks and took the gamble.






















     










     

     Did I ever say or imply they did? They decided to use beta as a marketing tool to spike sales and for viral marketing purposes. So they got some people to buy the game that aren't privy to how betas work.. What a shock...

    ...and I'm supposed to sympathize with Anet when some got bent out of shape for not being able to participate in a beta that Anet on their own turned into a marketing ploy and an incentive to prepurchase their game? Give me a fucking break.

    Unlike some writers and other posters around here I actually still like to hold companies to task for their actions and not always give them a free pass. As if they're even remotely innocent in this affair or there was even a huge outcry of rage that deserved this article. Made for great baiting material though 

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • redzebrassredzebrass HarrogatePosts: 10Member

    Back@wickedjelly

    So what if they used it as a marketing ploy, it's a business at the end of the day not a charity, marketing is what business do, and everyone who bought the game must agree with this otherwise they wouldn't have even considered buying it. The point is that nobody had to buy into it. 

    As for people who aren't privy to how betas work, really, if they found out about guild wars 2 in the first place then they've had plenty of time to find out how betas work, unless you're implying that these people are lower in the IQ department.......

     

    The Last Unicorn

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Yahoo, COPosts: 4,990Member

    Originally posted by redzebrass

    Back@wickedjelly

    So what if they used it as a marketing ploy, it's a business at the end of the day not a charity, marketing is what business do, and everyone who bought the game must agree with this otherwise they wouldn't have even considered buying it. The point is that nobody had to buy into it. 

    As for people who aren't privy to how betas work, really, if they found out about guild wars 2 in the first place then they've had plenty of time to find out how betas work, unless you're implying that these people are lower in the IQ department.......

     

     I'm not marking them with a Scarlet Letter 'A' for using it as a marketing ploy. What I am saying is the moment you go that route you open up the flood gates for people being insanely judgemental because they're now "invested" in the product. Is it smart from a business perspective? Of course. Does going that route have repurcussions from a customer standpoint? Of course. To think some wouldn't get bent out of shape if they had serious issues getting into the beta is simply ridiculous especially when they have a monetary investment in the product now. Frankly, I have no sympathy for Anet because just like no one forced the customer to buy the game - no one forced Anet to go the route they chose either.

    ...and you guys need to wake up in how you judge people. Not everyone follows mmos like we do nor has the time. Just because someone doesn't know how betas work like you or I does not mean they're dense. I mean really now...

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • jtcgsjtcgs New Port Richey, ILPosts: 1,777Member

    Yawn, ive been reading articles like this since Asherons Call 1 beta back in the late 90s.

    New beta tester comes in, complains.

    Old beta tester complains about the complaints.

    New beta tester complains they have a right to complain.

    Article is written by someone talking about all the complaining and what it means.

    Nothing new, dead horse...will be looking forward to this very same thing at the end of the next MMORPGs open beta cycle.

    “I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  • BloodchyldBloodchyld MiriPosts: 5Member

    seriously? you're a columnist? time to go back to journalism 101. write about the facts and let people decide not your opinions. and i'm playing from the other side of the globe and didnt get the issues you were writing about.

    and it is BETA....you should know what that is being a columnist for MMORPG.

     

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Yahoo, COPosts: 4,990Member
    On a side note, really is stunning how many posters responded to this article without even reading it. Should have made an article about forum rage apparently.

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • Overfiend138Overfiend138 Pittsburgh, PAPosts: 52Member

    to quote PC Gamer: "You could give away a bag with $10 in it for free, and someone will complain that it's not $20"

    In the case of gamers, this is true more often than not,

  • diabisdiabis Lawrenceville, GAPosts: 35Member
    I believe the issue here is Beta, to many have no idea what Beta means. To many games have long Open Beta because they do not want to be hit with complaints that game is not ready, they can say look Beta. GW2 offered Pre-Sale with Beta Events as a perk for ordering it now.  They gave us nifty bug report button, survey at end of mission events with note areas. Yes there was a time you got true Closed Beta invites. But we have seen that move away.  Some reason for that are people would get into Closed Beta start whining that they would not get to keep their toon and not give helpful info. This weekend, GW2 was giving responses quickly to forums and issues. As always they make a problem they fix it. You never feel that they went home and you will have to wait on this until whenever. I too put in some feedback on que out also from what I can tell you can grp for WvW and  I do think they are looking at all the system for other worlding. When we did last event as a Beta grp my husband and I got moved apart as well.

    Look for the Rose with the Thorn.

  • strangepowersstrangepowers Chiacgo, ILPosts: 602Member Common

    Originally posted by Overfiend138

    to quote PC Gamer: "You could give away a bag with $10 in it for free, and someone will complain that it's not $20"

    In the case of gamers, this is true more often than not,

    That's so true, I heard another version;

    "If you gave gamers a magical hat that granted free wishes they would complain about the color of the hat."

    The scary part is one day the world will be run by adults who were never spanked as kids and got trophies just for participating.

  • redzebrassredzebrass HarrogatePosts: 10Member

    Originally posted by Wickedjelly

    Originally posted by redzebrass

    Back@wickedjelly

    So what if they used it as a marketing ploy, it's a business at the end of the day not a charity, marketing is what business do, and everyone who bought the game must agree with this otherwise they wouldn't have even considered buying it. The point is that nobody had to buy into it. 

    As for people who aren't privy to how betas work, really, if they found out about guild wars 2 in the first place then they've had plenty of time to find out how betas work, unless you're implying that these people are lower in the IQ department.......

     

     I'm not marking them with a Scarlet Letter 'A' for using it as a marketing ploy. What I am saying is the moment you go that route you open up the flood gates for people being insanely judgemental because they're now "invested" in the product. Is it smart from a business perspective? Of course. Does going that route have repurcussions from a customer standpoint? Of course. To think some wouldn't get bent out of shape if they had serious issues getting into the beta is simply ridiculous especially when they have a monetary investment in the product now. Frankly, I have no sympathy for Anet because just like no one forced the customer to buy the game - no one forced Anet to go the route they chose either.

    ...and you guys need to wake up in how you judge people. Not everyone follows mmos like we do nor has the time. Just because someone doesn't know how betas work like you or I does not mean they're dense. I mean really now...


     

    Thing is, I've seen lots of beta's where people haven't had to pay to get to play it, and there have still been people bitch and moan about quality or aspects of those games, the company's will never win no matter what they do, but we gave Anet the reason to go this route, because I've never seen so many people so desperate to play a game before, a lot more than any other I know about.

    as for people, if they don't follow or even have the time, why on earth would they even want to play, I mean come on you have to be interested at least to have looked it up in the first place.

    The Last Unicorn

  • sassoonsssassoonss Monroe Town Patricia Palace, NYPosts: 1,112Member

    This was no pre order beta it was pre purchased beta.

     

    The only way to be in beta was to pay the full money upfront and remember unlike preorders digital pre purchase are not refundables.

     

    The biggest problem was for 90% of the beta event duration thousands of players were not given access to the game at all due to account locked out region wise.

    I could undersand beta issues  as game not performing , crashing , skills bugged etc etc but this was not the case at all.

     

    ANET states on there websire that prepurchase give YOU GUARANTEED ACCESS TO ALL BETA EVENT WEEKENDS

     

    my contention is I did not get that access at all to the game that was guranteed to me

     

    Someone posted ahn example of a Ferrais car, In my case was I come for the test drive and the guy hey the warehouse is locked and we cant open it for you to test the car.

     

    2nd reason for the rage was lack of clear communication .People were glued to hours and hours on the forums wondersing if they had resolved the issue. An honest tweet from ANET that they dont think thye can solve it instantly and might require 6 hours or 10 hours or 15 hours or so time frame it would have helped

  • lokiboardlokiboard Chico, CAPosts: 195Member
    Anet is giving refunds so this thread is moot......Nothing to complain about ,when you can get your money back, now is there....You just got a free beta weekend......
  • IndolIndol O''Fallon, MOPosts: 189Member

    People did not pay for the beta. They paid for the game. Beta access was a gift. Who complains about gifts? Jerks.

     

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Yahoo, COPosts: 4,990Member

    Originally posted by Indol

    People did not pay for the beta. They paid for the game. Beta access was a gift. Who complains about gifts? Jerks.

     




     

     Lol...this just keeps getting better and better.

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • dpcollier128dpcollier128 Englewood, COPosts: 38Member
    I enjoyed myself. It was fun. The bugs were anoying, but beta is beta is always BETA. Can't be anything else. I look forward to playing the next event and live. Those who rage about the bugs are just immature, whining babies.
  • ZoyitaZoyita Elmhurst, NYPosts: 119Member

    I had log in issues but i dont complain because is a BETA. Also i think this was the real beta test, real server test and real gamers players test, before was just a press look what the game is and make a article about it.

    We where there to test find bugs and report them, not to play and enjoy the game (while we are allowed to do it) i did enjoy my experience. And eventho is a BETA i found it less buggy than other games that are released for 1-2 years...

  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Seattle, WAPosts: 1,066Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Ulorik

    Originally posted by Torvaldr

    I disagree in this case.  ANet had a million beta applicants.  They had a huge pool with a lot of hardware profiles to choose from.  They could have sent out questionnaires and refined the pool down to a large pool very interested in BETA testing.  Did any significant portion of that pool even get chosen to test?

    No, instead they chose to sell preview access to their game for marketing purposes.  It worked.  Their marketing department is genius.

    They also deserve everything they get with that.  It is in no way shape or form the fault of the the "stupid gaming community".

    And again, this sums up things nicely....

     

    I'm really glad there are so many peolpe out there who had a great beta experience, which bodes well for the game. I would just kindly ask those who were lucky enough to have a smooth ride to put themselve in the position of those pre-purchasing the game and not getting access (after not being selected for the "free" beta) and ask yourself how you would have felt.

     

    Just to quote Anet again: Pre-Purchase the game now and get Access to all beta events.

    I purchased a product and did not get Access.

    You got Access, the login screen counts for something.

     

    Hopefully beta ragers will get weeded out making the game that much more enjoyable.

    image

  • khartman2005khartman2005 Bluffton, INPosts: 477Member
    Who cares.. Free to play or not the game really sucks. I was expecting a Guild Wars game and instead wet got pure crap.

    image

  • SilverbranchSilverbranch Warren, MIPosts: 192Member

    Originally posted by sassoonss

    This was no pre order beta it was pre purchased beta. 

    The only way to be in beta was to pay the full money upfront and remember unlike preorders digital pre purchase are not refundables. 

    The biggest problem was for 90% of the beta event duration thousands of players were not given access to the game at all due to account locked out region wise.

    I could undersand beta issues  as game not performing , crashing , skills bugged etc etc but this was not the case at all. 

    ANET states on there websire that prepurchase give YOU GUARANTEED ACCESS TO ALL BETA EVENT WEEKENDS 

    my contention is I did not get that access at all to the game that was guranteed to me 

    Someone posted ahn example of a Ferrais car, In my case was I come for the test drive and the guy hey the warehouse is locked and we cant open it for you to test the car. 

    2nd reason for the rage was lack of clear communication .People were glued to hours and hours on the forums wondersing if they had resolved the issue. An honest tweet from ANET that they dont think thye can solve it instantly and might require 6 hours or 10 hours or 15 hours or so time frame it would have helped


     

    No, there was no "pre-purchase Beta", per se.

    The product, the game, was available for pre-purchase.  As a perk, an incentive, to pony up and pre-purchase the Game, several items came with your Game pre-purchase, the inventory of which varies depending on the package you bought:  Digital, Digital Deluxe, Collectors.

    As far as Game access prior to release is concerned this includes the following:

    1)  Access to all Guild Wars 2 Beta Weekend Events, 2) Three Day Head Start Access.

    Of the two only option 2 is represented as live-play availability.

    Option 1 carries with it the clear risk of access problems as a result of problems found during BETA testing.  Sort of the point to a BETA, that being the finding of problems.

    The trick here is all those who could NOT login still participated in the Beta.

    You are thanked for that, job well done for the betterment of the game when it goes live.  Also the point to a BETA.

    You found a problem, a particularly unfortunate one, and reported it, though accompanied with an unnecessary amount of flatulent squealing.

    The problem you found unfortunately LANDED on something that affected login ability.  That would be an infrastructure issue of some kind, likely triggered by load spikes.  My guess anyway.  Frustrating, disappointing, fair enough.  Perfectly understandable people would be disappointed. 

    This doesn't change the algorithm one wit however:  A problem was found, it's reported, needs to be fixed.  That's part of Beta.  Which you were given access to.

    I played WoW for five years. Paid them a SUBSCRIPTION FEE every month like clockwork as well as the initial fee.  I PAID for service in LIve well past any form of testing.

    And guess what?  There was down time occasionally, whether scheduled maintenance or server hickups.

    You didn't "pay Anet MONEY for guaranteed access to their infrastructure no matter WHAT!"

    You, and every other person operating through a pre-purchase of the yet-to-be-released GAME had as one of the perks associated with pre-purchase of the Game access to Beta Test Weekends . . .

    . . . which by it's very definition carries with it, automatically, the foreknowledge there are going to be problems found, maybe even server down time or connection issues.

    Get your heads screwed on straight.  THIS is the time the Community can actually play a role in making the game better PRIOR to release and live. 

    Test the product, call out problems, that's what Testing is for, you should do no less.

    But you'd serve the GAME and, believe it or not, yourselves better in the long run if you started to actually THINK before waving your Entitlement Flags over your heads, yapping like schauzers chasing chipmunks.

    Originally posted by Silverbranch

    Asking the general "Gaming Community" to conduct Beta Testing is like trying to train a bunch of chimpanzees to change an auto-transmission.

     

    You'll get an awful lot of noise and commotion and tool bashing sure to ding up the paint and body while the transmission remains a mystery.

     

    I'm sure there are some diamonds in the rough in the middle of all that, but otherwise . . . meh.

     

    Now go stand in a corner and eat a banana.

     

    Wherever you go, there you are.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,590Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Silverbranch

    Originally posted by sassoonss This was no pre order beta it was pre purchased beta.  The only way to be in beta was to pay the full money upfront and remember unlike preorders digital pre purchase are not refundables.  The biggest problem was for 90% of the beta event duration thousands of players were not given access to the game at all due to account locked out region wise. I could undersand beta issues  as game not performing , crashing , skills bugged etc etc but this was not the case at all.  ANET states on there websire that prepurchase give YOU GUARANTEED ACCESS TO ALL BETA EVENT WEEKENDS  my contention is I did not get that access at all to the game that was guranteed to me  Someone posted ahn example of a Ferrais car, In my case was I come for the test drive and the guy hey the warehouse is locked and we cant open it for you to test the car.  2nd reason for the rage was lack of clear communication .People were glued to hours and hours on the forums wondersing if they had resolved the issue. An honest tweet from ANET that they dont think thye can solve it instantly and might require 6 hours or 10 hours or 15 hours or so time frame it would have helped  
    No, there was no "pre-purchase Beta", per se.The product, the game, was available for pre-purchase.  As a perk, an incentive, to pony up and pre-purchase the Game, several items came with your Game pre-purchase, the inventory of which varies depending on the package you bought:  Digital, Digital Deluxe, Collectors.As far as Game access prior to release is concerned this includes the following:1)  Access to all Guild Wars 2 Beta Weekend Events, 2) Three Day Head Start Access.Of the two only option 2 is represented as live-play availability.Option 1 carries with it the clear risk of access problems as a result of problems found during BETA testing.  Sort of the point to a BETA, that being the finding of problems.The trick here is all those who could NOT login still participated in the Beta.You are thanked for that, job well done for the betterment of the game when it goes live.  Also the point to a BETA.You found a problem, a particularly unfortunate one, and reported it, though accompanied with an unnecessary amount of flatulent squealing.The problem you found unfortunately LANDED on something that affected login ability.  That would be an infrastructure issue of some kind, likely triggered by load spikes.  My guess anyway.  Frustrating, disappointing, fair enough.  Perfectly understandable people would be disappointed. This doesn't change the algorithm one wit however:  A problem was found, it's reported, needs to be fixed.  That's part of Beta.  Which you were given access to.I played WoW for five years. Paid them a SUBSCRIPTION FEE every month like clockwork as well as the initial fee.  I PAID for service in LIve well past any form of testing.And guess what?  There was down time occasionally, whether scheduled maintenance or server hickups.You didn't "pay Anet MONEY for guaranteed access to their infrastructure no matter WHAT!"You, and every other person operating through a pre-purchase of the yet-to-be-released GAME had as one of the perks associated with pre-purchase of the Game access to Beta Test Weekends . . .. . . which by it's very definition carries with it, automatically, the foreknowledge there are going to be problems found, maybe even server down time or connection issues.Get your heads screwed on straight.  THIS is the time the Community can actually play a role in making the game better PRIOR to release and live. Test the product, call out problems, that's what Testing is for, you should do no less.But you'd serve the GAME and, believe it or not, yourselves better in the long run if you started to actually THINK before waving your Entitlement Flags over your heads, yapping like schauzers chasing chipmunks.Originally posted by SilverbranchAsking the general "Gaming Community" to conduct Beta Testing is like trying to train a bunch of chimpanzees to change an auto-transmission. You'll get an awful lot of noise and commotion and tool bashing sure to ding up the paint and body while the transmission remains a mystery. I'm sure there are some diamonds in the rough in the middle of all that, but otherwise . . . meh. Now go stand in a corner and eat a banana. 

    Let me ask from those who did pre purchase.
    was there any language in the pre purchase that specifically stated there might be issues with logging in? Or anything related to server loads and or queue times and waiting?

    Was that addressed in ANet's Beta Access ELUA or anywwhere?

    Or more to the point, did Anet cover this contingency in the agreement?

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,908Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Silverbranch








     



    ~Stuf~

    The product, the game, was available for pre-purchase. 

    ~stuff~

     

    Uhgg, how hard is this to understand. Yet some just don't get it. They were marketing their BWE as a buy in event. Most got that e-mail not long before sales haulted. "Want guaranteed Weekend beta access? Then pre-purchase GW2 now." This is pushing people into a mentality of entitlement. Any problems with that "access" is going to result in unhappy consumers. They paid for a guarantee they didn't receive. Spin that anyway in A-nets favor you want, it will not change why those people felt entitled to that which they did not receive.

    Everyone else I couldn't care less about ( those generally unhappy with a product). But those paying for services not rendered is a different story entirely.

    What made the matter 100% worse was the state of customer services at the time. (Which yes I understand pre-release this is almost always the case). Doesn't change that it was all but non-existent for those having issues.

    I won't deny some may have overreacted to the issues, at the same time, when money is involved these are customers not testers.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,590Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Distopia

    Originally posted by Silverbranch





     

    ~Stuf~
    The product, the game, was available for pre-purchase. 
    ~stuff~

     


    Uhgg, how hard is this to understand. Yet some just don't get it. They were marketing their BWE as a buy in event. Most got that e-mail not long before sales haulted. "Want guaranteed Weekend beta access? Then pre-purchase GW2 now." This is pushing people into a mentality of entitlement. Any problems with that "access" is going to result in unhappy consumers. They paid for a guarantee they didn't receive. Spin that anyway in A-nets favor you want, it will not change why those people felt entitled to that which they did not receive.
    Everyone else I couldn't care less about ( those generally unhappy with a product). But those paying for services not rendered is a different story entirely.
    What made the matter 100% worse was the state of customer services at the time. (Which yes I understand pre-release this is almost always the case). Doesn't change that it was all but non-existent for those having issues.
    I won't deny some may have overreacted to the issues, at the same time, when money is involved these are customers not testers.

    I am inclined to agree with you on this, But as I asked in my previous post, this issue may have been covered by ANet and if so, It's a simple case of Buyer Beware, if they didn't, then they advertised guaranteed access to a Beta event. Now, understand something. Buying access to a beta event does not make someone a beta tester, nor are they subject to the agreements beta testers have. This was a Beta Event they sold access to. If that is the extend of the language in the offer, then ANet had an obligation to make sure their infrastructure was up for the task.

  • prescortprescort fresch, KYPosts: 45Member

    Originally posted by Overfiend138

    to quote PC Gamer: "You could give away a bag with $10 in it for free, and someone will complain that it's not $20"

    In the case of gamers, this is true more often than not,

    What is the value of the bag itself? if the bag is silk or some other nice material ill be happy

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,908Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by GeezerGamer



     

    I am inclined to agree with you on this, But as I asked in my previous post, this issue may have been covered by ANet and if so, It's a simple case of Buyer Beware, if they didn't, then they advertised guaranteed access to a Beta event. Now, understand something. Buying access to a beta event does not make someone a beta tester, nor are they subject to the agreements beta testers have. This was a Beta Event they sold access to. If that is the extend of the language in the offer, then ANet had an obligation to make sure their infrastructure was up for the task.

    It didn't say anything about that in the E-mail, as far as fine print somewhere else, I have no idea. For legal obligations it most likely does, but as far as in a place to warn plainly of this possible issue, I've seen no example thus far.

     

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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