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What am I missing here?

KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,989Member Uncommon

I heard CCP had some layoffs recently, wondering if many of them were in the marketing department. image

Got an email yesterday annoucing the new expansion (Inferno) and the bridge patch (Escalation) and these are the features they lead with to entice me to return.

Bridging the path from Crucible to Inferno is Escalation, a patch that adds several crucial changes and a couple cool new features as we ready for the big expansion.



» Loot table updates

» Drone reward changes

» Titan tweaking

» Interactive Effects Bar

OK, EVE fans, help me out here, where are the critical changes and cool new features in this list.  There was a link which lead to more detail but truthfully, nothing in the above list enticed me enough to bother if this is the highlights of this patch.

More importantly I guess, when Inferno launches in May, what sort of cool things are they adding that might encourage me to return, because the above list certainly isn't doing it for me.

And I apoligize if I'm coming off as trollish in this post, it's 7 am and my dog got me up early on a Saturday against my will. image

In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
"I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

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Comments

  • kovahkovah Orlando, FLPosts: 695Member

    Definitely nothing in this Escalation that I would see worth sending them money again.  That said, there are some interesting changes here and this summer.  If you have some form of RSS aggregator (like Google Reader) I highly recommend that you follow EVE's official news and devblogs.  They have gone into much more detail on each of those items listed as well as discussed a number of things happening this summer - some of it quite possibly game changing as it were.

    Time will tell.

    o7

  • OrphesOrphes TrePosts: 3,048Member

    Loot Table Updates

    I didn't even reflect over that. After I went to the site reading this.

    "?NPC ships will no longer drop manufacturable T1 loot. NPCs will continue to drop modules, however T1 items which have a blueprint will no longer drop, making player manufacturing the primary source for these items."

     

    Perhaps they take for granted that the reader of the email knows what they (the sender) know.

    I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
    "You have the right not to be killed"

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon

    I thought that shallownes of Crucible was exception but seems like CCP is setting a new norm with content-less expansions...

    I guess we will have to wait for Inferno release and how will it turns out, so far not much was released about the content.


  • WorstluckWorstluck the valley, CAPosts: 1,269Member

    Yeah not hugely impressed either.  However I do want to try my hand at manufacturing again.  The patch will definitely boost the prices of minerals, not sure if that such a great thing though.  More miner bots I guess :P

     

    I am just kind of biding my time until DUST comes out..Until then I don't expect to see any significant changes..imo.

    image

  • SlaverHoundSlaverHound Toronto, ONPosts: 109Member

    It's just a mini expansion that they can release now instead of waiting a month.  Why is that a bad thing to you?

    If you don't want them to send you any more mail about the game I'm sure there's a way to get them to stop.

    "Lectroids? Planet 10? Nuclear extortion? A girl named "John"?

  • ChramChram sigilPosts: 91Member

    This pre-expansion is actually huge in terms of inpact on in-game economy. Miners are going to be the main mineral faucet again, so if you enjoyed that particular playstyle, now is a good time to join. It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc. All of those  things are healthy for the EVE ecosystem in my opinion. 

     

    CCP has temporarily abadoned the big shiny feature expansions after the Incarna rage in favour of fixing the existing gameplay and making obsolete or never iterated upon game systems usable again - Faction Warfare (which was horribly broken) is the first example coming in Inferno. I, for one, am happy for their shift in focus.

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Chram

    It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc.

    Except this does not work...for obvious reasons...

  • ChramChram sigilPosts: 91Member

    Originally posted by Gdemami

     




    Originally posted by Chram



    It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc.




     

    Except this does not work...for obvious reasons...

    Care to spell out the obvious reasons? I think I have been enough times both on the hunting and defending side to know how the dynamic works. But feel free to correct me.

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,989Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Chram

    This pre-expansion is actually huge in terms of inpact on in-game economy. Miners are going to be the main mineral faucet again, so if you enjoyed that particular playstyle, now is a good time to join. It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc. All of those  things are healthy for the EVE ecosystem in my opinion. 

     

    CCP has temporarily abadoned the big shiny feature expansions after the Incarna rage in favour of fixing the existing gameplay and making obsolete or never iterated upon game systems usable again - Faction Warfare (which was horribly broken) is the first example coming in Inferno. I, for one, am happy for their shift in focus.

    OK, now this is interesting news, I always thought faction warfare was a good idea...except it didn't work out.

    I'm not angry they sent me emails btw, I'm looking for a good reason to return to EVE and so far, not seeing much. (not even revised loot tables, lol)

    But I'll keep my eyes on it, the game keeps improving, someday they may bring out something I'm more interested in.

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • ChramChram sigilPosts: 91Member

    Originally posted by Kyleran

    Originally posted by Chram

    This pre-expansion is actually huge in terms of inpact on in-game economy. Miners are going to be the main mineral faucet again, so if you enjoyed that particular playstyle, now is a good time to join. It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc. All of those  things are healthy for the EVE ecosystem in my opinion. 

     

    CCP has temporarily abadoned the big shiny feature expansions after the Incarna rage in favour of fixing the existing gameplay and making obsolete or never iterated upon game systems usable again - Faction Warfare (which was horribly broken) is the first example coming in Inferno. I, for one, am happy for their shift in focus.

    OK, now this is interesting news, I always thought faction warfare was a good idea...except it didn't work out.

    I'm not angry they sent me emails btw, I'm looking for a good reason to return to EVE and so far, not seeing much. (not even revised loot tables, lol)

    But I'll keep my eyes on it, the game keeps improving, someday they may bring out something I'm more interested in.

     

    The details are not yet set in stone (=written in a dev blog), devs are still discussing this heavily with CSM and presumably adjusting some stuff. The idea is to give faction Warfare some actual meaning by giving the controlling (player) faction some means of enhancing a system.

    Also coming is a war declaration revamp featuring an integrated option to hire a merceranry corp. Should hopefully make high sec wars less lame (I still doubt they can magically make them enjoybale for both sides though). Changes are also coming to aggresion mechanics, which is another thing that hasn't been touched in ages.

    On the horizon for winter are changes to poses, by making them easier to use, more modular and "cooler", then null sec sov revamp and presumably some shiny stuff CCP hasn't told us yet.

     

  • SlaverHoundSlaverHound Toronto, ONPosts: 109Member

    Originally posted by Kyleran

    Originally posted by Chram

    This pre-expansion is actually huge in terms of inpact on in-game economy. Miners are going to be the main mineral faucet again, so if you enjoyed that particular playstyle, now is a good time to join. It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc. All of those  things are healthy for the EVE ecosystem in my opinion. 

     

    CCP has temporarily abadoned the big shiny feature expansions after the Incarna rage in favour of fixing the existing gameplay and making obsolete or never iterated upon game systems usable again - Faction Warfare (which was horribly broken) is the first example coming in Inferno. I, for one, am happy for their shift in focus.

    OK, now this is interesting news, I always thought faction warfare was a good idea...except it didn't work out.

    I'm not angry they sent me emails btw, I'm looking for a good reason to return to EVE and so far, not seeing much. (not even revised loot tables, lol)

    But I'll keep my eyes on it, the game keeps improving, someday they may bring out something I'm more interested in.

     

    Fine, I'll play along...  It's an empire expansion but there's some goodies for everyone that, from what I hear, will change the way we fit our ships.

    This mini expansion:

    They are removing the drone alloy loot drops.

    Incursions are going to be more random.

    Some ships are being balanced.

    The actual expansion:

    FW changes.

    War Dec changes and an additional introduction of a mercenary market place. .

    New modules that will "change the cookie cutter setups people have for their ships" the ultimate goal (probably not this expansion) is to remove separate PvE and PvP fits.

    Remaning ship designs will get their improvements, some graphical effects are being improved, launchers are going to get the love that turrets got.

    More ship balancing.

    More ui improvements.

    "Lectroids? Planet 10? Nuclear extortion? A girl named "John"?

  • kovahkovah Orlando, FLPosts: 695Member

    I'm still waiting for the final info but the FW changes are by far the most interesting to me.  I'm a pessimist anyway but from what I can tell they are going to make FW more like Null.  If that is the case I'll likely just quit again.  I'm in lowsec FW because I DON'T WANT to be in Null.  They've added Alliances.  Okay.  But this occupancy can't dock non-sense is silly, imo.  Sure, we need some reason to win but hey - why not have the zone add some effect like Incursions do?  Positive effect for those that hold occupancy and a negative one (or none?) for those that don't?  Or vice versa?  Anyway, if they make it more like Null then fail.

    Aside from FW though, I keep up with all the DevBlogs and, as I said previously, there are some potentially game changing uh...  changes...  coming down the pipe so we'll see.

    o7

  • OrphesOrphes TrePosts: 3,048Member

    Originally posted by Gdemami

     




    Originally posted by Chram



    It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc.




     

    Except this does not work...for obvious reasons...

     

    What are those reasons?

    They will remove alot of the mineral flow from missions when they remove the T1 drops from mission NPC's and the drone alloy.

    How will that effect mining and how will it effect the ships cost, and ISK flow from mission/ratting (vs the price of minerlas and then ships).

     

    We will most likely see more people mining in low/null to kill, or?

    Will it balance things up so that expensive ships no longer is a throw away ship?

    I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
    "You have the right not to be killed"

  • WycliffeWycliffe West Amwell, NJPosts: 354Member

    Originally posted by Chram

    This pre-expansion is actually huge in terms of inpact on in-game economy. Miners are going to be the main mineral faucet again, so if you enjoyed that particular playstyle, now is a good time to join. It will also make mining in low/null somewhat profitable again, which encourages more roaming gangs, which encourages more home defense fleets etc. All of those  things are healthy for the EVE ecosystem in my opinion. 

     

    CCP has temporarily abadoned the big shiny feature expansions after the Incarna rage in favour of fixing the existing gameplay and making obsolete or never iterated upon game systems usable again - Faction Warfare (which was horribly broken) is the first example coming in Inferno. I, for one, am happy for their shift in focus.

    This exactly.

    The "new shiny" in this expansion is mainly graphics.

    Along with that we are getting new frigate models. I imagine all ship models will be redone within the next few expansions to have tech 3 textures.

    Along with that, expect major ship rebalancing. CCP wants to make under-used or what are commonly believed to be terrible ships atm up to par. Their stated goal to make every hull used on a regular basis.

    As for brand spanking new, there are a few new modules and stuff being released which while not a whole lot should prove rather game changing. For example, a micro jump drive which is inderdiction nullified and can jump your ship out 100km. Or the new salvaging drones.

    EVE already has more features than other several other MMOs combined. I think they can afford not to add features for a year in order to revamp whats already there.

  • BizkitNLBizkitNL NetherlandsPosts: 2,280Member Common

    I think they SHOULD revamp. A lot of stuff is outdated and well.......doesn't make sense anymore (FW).

    10
  • SlaverHoundSlaverHound Toronto, ONPosts: 109Member

    Originally posted by BizkitNL

    I think they SHOULD revamp. A lot of stuff is outdated and well.......doesn't make sense anymore (FW).

    Yeah, I'd rather see realistic expansions that improve the game and that they can actually deliver on time than more half assed and incomplete Jesus expansions some of the people in this thread are looking for.

     

    "Lectroids? Planet 10? Nuclear extortion? A girl named "John"?

  • RekindleRekindle Moncton, NBPosts: 1,206Member

    not enough to keep me subbed.  If you didnt find it in the game to stay before I honestly don't see anything on the horizon.  Lately CCP is marketing nerf after nerf as some type of feature improvement.  There are some neat turret effect changes and missle changes but other than that I have found no real compelling reasons to play lately and I've let me subs lapse.

     

    The economy is going to hell with rampant inflation due to many factors (that CCP would BS their way through) and the game just isnt fun for me anymore.  The drama with the meta game used to be entertaining but on top of everything else the fact that goonswarm has such a pressence in the game basically nails it for me.

     

    I never , never say never but I dont think I'll be returning this time (2004 player).

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Chram

    Care to spell out the obvious reasons? I think I have been enough times both on the hunting and defending side to know how the dynamic works. But feel free to correct me.

    Increasing rewards won't attract more players as limiting factor is risk, people care very little about rewards.



    Originally posted by Orphes
     
    We will most likely see more people mining in low/null to kill, or?
    Will it balance things up so that expensive ships no longer is a throw away ship?

    We will see the same amount of people mining in null/low sec, or some negligable increase at best.

    What will happen is that supply will drop rapidly and prices go up. How the change will turn out in long term depends how will CCP react on supply shortage - they either increase the supply or leave the shortage.

    No big deal anyway, there is so much ISK spawning into EVE economy that those changes won't really matter - prices will adjust to reflect mineral supply.

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Rekindle

    The economy is going to hell with rampant inflation due to many factors (that CCP would BS their way through) and the game just isnt fun for me anymore. 


    EVE is deflation since 2004 and CCP has very little impact on the economy.

  • Bozo256Bozo256 Denver, COPosts: 74Member

    There's two main things taht have come down the pipe recently.

    1)  EVE is now focusing on EVE again; whereas previously it was focusing on generating character models and 3-D indoor environments ultimately as proof of concept for its other non-EVE games.  There was a year or two where EVE produced nothing meaningful due to this.

    2)  Ship rebalancing.  Ship tiers are being removed.  This effectively adds a huge amount of new playable, and useful, ships into the game while really changing up combat dynamics.  IE: Every race has 6 T1 frigs, but right now only one of them is worth flying in combat due to ship tiering.  That's changing.

    The other changes aren't that big of a deal.  I guess it depends on when you quit and why you quit.  If you quit because you got AOE Doomsdayed years ago, I guess the Titan rebalancing theyre doing might stand out to you even though that particular change happened a while back.

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Bozo256
    There's two main things taht have come down the pipe recently.
    1)  EVE is now focusing on EVE again; whereas previously it was focusing on generating character models and 3-D indoor environments ultimately as proof of concept for its other non-EVE games.  There was a year or two where EVE produced nothing meaningful due to this.
    2)  Ship rebalancing.  Ship tiers are being removed.  This effectively adds a huge amount of new playable, and useful, ships into the game while really changing up combat dynamics.  IE: Every race has 6 T1 frigs, but right now only one of them is worth flying in combat due to ship tiering.  That's changing.


    1) Lies.

    WiS is still very solid iteration to EVE world(far better than what we have seen with Crucible and mostly likely we will see with Inferno), you just did not like the content.

    No expansion is for everyone.


    2) Ship tree structure has no bearing on ship balancing, it is just a label.

    Ship balance is horrible because CCP fails horribly at balancing and no renaming of ship tiers to ship roles(that are included within ship tiers anyway) can help it.

    Of course only 1 frigate is viable for combat as it is it's role. The other frigates are meant for Mining, Tackle, Ewar, Exploration, Missiles.


    "Other" frigates are not supposed to be combat ships, ship tiers or not. They are just changing labels for something that is already in game and as such it won't bring any inherited balance changes.


  • Bozo256Bozo256 Denver, COPosts: 74Member

    Originally posted by Gdemami

     




    Originally posted by Bozo256

    There's two main things taht have come down the pipe recently.

    1)  EVE is now focusing on EVE again; whereas previously it was focusing on generating character models and 3-D indoor environments ultimately as proof of concept for its other non-EVE games.  There was a year or two where EVE produced nothing meaningful due to this.

    2)  Ship rebalancing.  Ship tiers are being removed.  This effectively adds a huge amount of new playable, and useful, ships into the game while really changing up combat dynamics.  IE: Every race has 6 T1 frigs, but right now only one of them is worth flying in combat due to ship tiering.  That's changing.




     



    1) Lies.

    WiS is still very solid iteration to EVE world(far better than what we have seen with Crucible and mostly likely we will see with Inferno), you just did not like the content.

    No expansion is for everyone.



    2) Ship tree structure has no bearing on ship balancing, it is just a label.

    Ship balance is horrible because CCP fails horribly at balancing and no renaming of ship tiers to ship roles(that are included within ship tiers anyway) can help it.

     

    Of course only 1 frigate is viable for combat as it is it's role. The other frigates are meant for Mining, Tackle, Ewar, Exploration, Missiles.



    "Other" frigates are not supposed to be combat ships, ship tiers or not. They are just changing labels for something that is already in game and as such it won't bring any inherited balance changes.

     

     

     

    I don't normally respond to trolls.  But, well, yeah I didn't like it.  Mainly because there was no content.  If they had figured out how to make it relevant to EVE and included those features at release it might not have been so bad.

    And two.. ship tiering is a lot more than just a label.  It has a direct bearing on HP, fitting stats, and the number of slots a ship has. The entire T1 line up is currently balanced around the thought process that a Tier 3 ship is inherently superior and significantly more costly to build than a Tier 1 ship.

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Bozo256But, well, yeah I didn't like it.  Mainly because there was no content. ...The entire T1 line up is currently balanced around the thought process that a Tier 3 ship is inherently superior and significantly more costly to build than a Tier 1 ship.

    1) Just because you did not like it does not make it "no content".

    2) T1 line is not balanced around tiers but roles, as pointed out before.

    T1 Ewar frigate will never ever have more slots or HP because it does not fit it's role and would be imbalanced towards T2 counterpart.

    etc.


    It is just a label because ships are not balanced around tiers but it is more complex, they are balanced about their roles primarily.

    Note: I am not saying tiers have no say in ship stats, but it is rather minor and unimportant.

    Tiers are the last thing holding CCP from balancing. Just look at poor state of Hybrids or Projectiles being OP for years. If you look at ships itself, compare Prophecy/Harbinger as tier 1&2 BC to Claymore/Hurricane...or Tristan being tier 3 gallente frigate despite it is a bomber hull, Rifter being pretty much only viable 1 frigate as it is so much superior to others, etc. list can go on and on and nothing about it is a tier issue, the problem is people doing the balancing and having no clue what they are doing(in those rare cases when they happen to touch something)...

    There is tons CCP can do within current ship tree but they are not doing anything and they will not do anything after the tree has changed. But I guess that was the point of the change - to make some people happy despite not improving the game in a least bit.

  • Mors.MagneMors.Magne LondonPosts: 1,420Member

    I live in the drone regions, so drones having bounties is good for me.

    Personally, I'm getting ready for DUST.

  • GarkanGarkan BirminghamPosts: 552Member

    Originally posted by Gdemami

     




    Originally posted by Rekindle



    The economy is going to hell with rampant inflation due to many factors (that CCP would BS their way through) and the game just isnt fun for me anymore. 




     



    EVE is deflation since 2004 and CCP has very little impact on the economy.

     

    CCP control the economy, CCP control loot drops, the materials required for manufacturing, they control the spawn rates of faction NPCs and the exploration sites and asteroid belts, they also control the bountys and everything else.

    CCP can manipulate the economy via those variables. A very good example would be the changes to moon minerials, the players didnt have much control when CCP wanted to change which minerals where the most valuable did they? The only control players have is to try and make the best of what CCP provide.

    Currently playing:

    EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

    Gravity Rush,
    Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

    (Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
    Company of Heroes II.

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