Jesus, these SWTOR hate threads get old. I wish the kiddies would get over it all ready and move along. We get it -- they don't like the game. I promise the sun will still rise tomorrow. Geez....
SWTOR might not be a good game, but it certainly isn't a bad one.
It has nearly 2million subs so it's doing allright considering how much BS bioware has pulled off in the past months. They aren't going to beat WoW which was their original plan but they are surely surviving and making profit.
Saying SWTOR is a fail just shows how very little you know :j
2m subs, ROFL
I think when the 6 months subs run out people will see that the game only has a few hundred thousand paying customers left and that's why BW is only giving transfers and giving out free 30 days like candy. In a guild with several hundred actual people, not alts. I know a lot of them bought 3-6 months subs/game cards thinking they would play at least that long, my husband included. I only pay month to month so they didn't get me, heh. Of those several hundred in the guild on Jung Ma only 3 are left, the rest are awaiting GW2 or Tera or both. That's a lot of gamecards/subs still floating about and no one online playing. If just that many in my guild aren't playing, imagine how many others are doing the same. That's why there are ghost town servers. They may be able to say they have this many subscribers, but that's only because people prepaid too many months and are now gone. When 6 month playtimes are up, they'll have to face reality that the game is a niche game, that only fanbois and extremely casuals will be playing. It will be lucky to have a few hundred thousand people playing by the end of the year.
This kind of brings up the elephant in the room that the OP completely missed: MMO companies don't rely on long term subs to make money any more!
Contrary to popular opinion that EA lost money on STWOR; it has already made back its investment and going forward everything it gets is just gravy. Box sales + collector edition markup + prepaid game time has already made STWO a financial success even if it isn't a MMO success. EA doesn't need people to actualy be on the servers playing, they just need them to have bought the time. So stop the silly arguments over wether the servers are packed or not, it doesn't matter to EA as long as they got their money and they did that already.
If you want to speculate, start a pool to see when it will go F2P to get a second bumb in revenue.
The only company to make money out of SW;TOR so far, has been Lucas Arts..
I think when the 6 months subs run out people will see that the game only has a few hundred thousand paying customers left and that's why BW is only giving transfers and giving out free 30 days like candy. In a guild with several hundred actual people, not alts. I know a lot of them bought 3-6 months subs/game cards thinking they would play at least that long, my husband included. I only pay month to month so they didn't get me, heh. Of those several hundred in the guild on Jung Ma only 3 are left, the rest are awaiting GW2 or Tera or both. That's a lot of gamecards/subs still floating about and no one online playing. If just that many in my guild aren't playing, imagine how many others are doing the same. That's why there are ghost town servers. They may be able to say they have this many subscribers, but that's only because people prepaid too many months and are now gone. When 6 month playtimes are up, they'll have to face reality that the game is a niche game, that only fanbois and extremely casuals will be playing. It will be lucky to have a few hundred thousand people playing by the end of the year.
*edit* made it easier on the eyes, appologies
You think that most of TORs subscribers were so stupid that they signed up for 6 months when they bought the game?
I doubt it, few people are so dumb that they wont try a single month first before deciding to sign up long term.
Originally posted by Kokushibyou Contrary to popular opinion that EA lost money on STWOR; it has already made back its investment and going forward everything it gets is just gravy. Box sales + collector edition markup + prepaid game time has already made STWO a financial success even if it isn't a MMO success.
I'm sorry to inform you that EA stock performance during the past 6 months doesn't reflect this rose-colored view.
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
SWTOR might not be a good game, but it certainly isn't a bad one.
It has nearly 2million subs so it's doing allright considering how much BS bioware has pulled off in the past months. They aren't going to beat WoW which was their original plan but they are surely surviving and making profit.
Saying SWTOR is a fail just shows how very little you know :j
2m subs, ROFL
I think when the 6 months subs run out people will see that the game only has a few hundred thousand paying customers left and that's why BW is only giving transfers and giving out free 30 days like candy. In a guild with several hundred actual people, not alts. I know a lot of them bought 3-6 months subs/game cards thinking they would play at least that long, my husband included. I only pay month to month so they didn't get me, heh. Of those several hundred in the guild on Jung Ma only 3 are left, the rest are awaiting GW2 or Tera or both. That's a lot of gamecards/subs still floating about and no one online playing. If just that many in my guild aren't playing, imagine how many others are doing the same. That's why there are ghost town servers. They may be able to say they have this many subscribers, but that's only because people prepaid too many months and are now gone. When 6 month playtimes are up, they'll have to face reality that the game is a niche game, that only fanbois and extremely casuals will be playing. It will be lucky to have a few hundred thousand people playing by the end of the year.
*edit* made it easier on the eyes, appologies
I like the game a lot so if any of you have time cards they want to give away let me know
Originally posted by Tayah I think when the 6 months subs run out people will see that the game only has a few hundred thousand paying customers left and that's why BW is only giving transfers and giving out free 30 days like candy. In a guild with several hundred actual people, not alts. I know a lot of them bought 3-6 months subs/game cards thinking they would play at least that long, my husband included. I only pay month to month so they didn't get me, heh. Of those several hundred in the guild on Jung Ma only 3 are left, the rest are awaiting GW2 or Tera or both. That's a lot of gamecards/subs still floating about and no one online playing. If just that many in my guild aren't playing, imagine how many others are doing the same. That's why there are ghost town servers. They may be able to say they have this many subscribers, but that's only because people prepaid too many months and are now gone. When 6 month playtimes are up, they'll have to face reality that the game is a niche game, that only fanbois and extremely casuals will be playing. It will be lucky to have a few hundred thousand people playing by the end of the year. *edit* made it easier on the eyes, appologies
You think that most of TORs subscribers were so stupid that they signed up for 6 months when they bought the game?
I doubt it, few people are so dumb that they wont try a single month first before deciding to sign up long term.
I think quite a few go for the 3 month sub, certainly not a majority, as it has a decent discount/risk balance.
I think when the 6 months subs run out people will see that the game only has a few hundred thousand paying customers left and that's why BW is only giving transfers and giving out free 30 days like candy. In a guild with several hundred actual people, not alts. I know a lot of them bought 3-6 months subs/game cards thinking they would play at least that long, my husband included. I only pay month to month so they didn't get me, heh. Of those several hundred in the guild on Jung Ma only 3 are left, the rest are awaiting GW2 or Tera or both. That's a lot of gamecards/subs still floating about and no one online playing. If just that many in my guild aren't playing, imagine how many others are doing the same. That's why there are ghost town servers. They may be able to say they have this many subscribers, but that's only because people prepaid too many months and are now gone. When 6 month playtimes are up, they'll have to face reality that the game is a niche game, that only fanbois and extremely casuals will be playing. It will be lucky to have a few hundred thousand people playing by the end of the year.
*edit* made it easier on the eyes, appologies
You think that most of TORs subscribers were so stupid that they signed up for 6 months when they bought the game?
I doubt it, few people are so dumb that they wont try a single month first before deciding to sign up long term.
This is not the first post I have read about people going wild and buying collector editions, 6 months subs , etc. Now I think that is still the minority of people, but people do and say silly things and then feel they have to leave their regrets on the mmorpg.com forums
I love how so many people a clinging to the stock performance issue and are either ignorant of the economic climate for the last 5 years or choosing to ignore it in an attempt to lend credence to their personal opinion on a game. EA is a poorly managed company, but it's financial track record is in line with many other major entertainment brands.
Jesus, these SWTOR hate threads get old. I wish the kiddies would get over it all ready and move along. We get it -- they don't like the game. I promise the sun will still rise tomorrow. Geez....
LOL they will never get over it, these are the same knuckleheads that cried a river when a failing SWG turned to CU and finally to NGE in order to save a game that had IMO fatal flaws to begin with. However I am wondering if these same people who played SWG pre CU did not complain so much about SWG if Sony would have taken the unpresidented step in changing the game?
1.7m subs is a fat lie that anyone who watched server pop will see. I played from the start and for a full 2 months on a server stated at that time as very light which had around 50-100 people on the 1-24 lvl range planets and then droped off to around 10-30 and lower as the lvl got higher. On friday i give the free week a shot and see my server is very low pop still and went to find one of only 2 servers is a high pop which was odd as before i quit there were a good 10+ at most times of the day so i pick one of the 2 high pop server and first thing i see is the some of people of the planets which were in a 30-50 people range and just droped off fast from there. If you have forgot what i said from the start my old low pop server from the start had far more people than this so called high pop server has today so needless to say they don't have that many people and are trying to cover it up!
That one thing is EAs stock price. In 2009, EA's stock was just north of $60. It tanked with the rest of the market during the financial crisis. The market rebounded and EA's stock rebounded with it but not nearly to the same extent. The stock peaked in Oct 11 around $25 right after the launch of SWTOR. As of Fri, the stock closed at $16.18- a drop nearly 36%. Furthermore, this drop has ha been virtually straight down and happened while the broad market was rallying. In addition, the selling has been on heavy volume meaning institutional investors are bailing on EA. These are the people who have the real numbers and they are not liking what they are seeing. Also, there are a fair number of people actively betting that EAs stock will fall further.
TOR may well be the end of EA or at least bring it to the brink of bankruptcy The chart patterns indicate that another large leg down is coming for EAs stock. This will make it even harder for them to borrow money at reasonable rates if they need to. Like the game or not, it may not be around for the long haul or at least that is what financial markets are betting on.
Remember when people didn't play a game, not because all of a sudden they are some hackney H&R Block but because the game wasn't fun, and that was ALL the reason they needed?
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
I love how so many people a clinging to the stock performance issue and are either ignorant of the economic climate for the last 5 years or choosing to ignore it in an attempt to lend credence to their personal opinion on a game. EA is a poorly managed company, but it's financial track record is in line with many other major entertainment brands.
like Sony for instance, 4 years straight of losing money, last year lost a staggering 6 billion dollars.. kind of puts it in perspective doesnt it.
sadly, EA's ability to turn a profit on SW;TOR is in significant doubt.. unless Bioware gets a grip on the games problems anyway. and patch 1.2 didnt really touch anything of any real significance.
Jesus, these SWTOR hate threads get old. I wish the kiddies would get over it all ready and move along. We get it -- they don't like the game. I promise the sun will still rise tomorrow. Geez....
LOL they will never get over it, these are the same knuckleheads that cried a river when a failing SWG turned to CU and finally to NGE in order to save a game that had IMO fatal flaws to begin with. However I am wondering if these same people who played SWG pre CU did not complain so much about SWG if Sony would have taken the unpresidented step in changing the game?
You don't need to cry a river or even be a brain surgeon to know, that SOE and now Bioware have screwed up the SW IP in the mmo genre with radical changes and flat out bad gaming design. For SWG, i know for a fact that everyone i knew and played with never bitched or moaned about changes. It was the ADD twits that wanted to have everything handed to them from first login and not have to actully put in the time and effort to obtain the status of those that had been playing for some time that caused the dumb changes to be made. Radical changes = Mass exodus of players.
In Bioware's case, they just made a horrible and boring game, my opinion, after leveling a 50 Sith Warrior. With a much less on rails design and a more open environment and system tools to create player interdependency with a player made economy, TOR could have been a great mmorpg. I feel all they have created is nothing more than a SPRPG with coop features. This is the reason in my eyes that it is fail. On rails, story, story = level 50 bored and Mass unsubbing.
Payed and played = My opinion is just as valid as the next person.
I love how so many people a clinging to the stock performance issue and are either ignorant of the economic climate for the last 5 years
Please, check NCSoft performance during the last 5 years. Thank you. Come again.
Like when they almost went belly-up in 2009? Check Funcom's pre-AoC and Post stock price for an "what you should expect to see once Guild Wars releases" (I don't really believe this, but I am just extending some of the "logic" applied by the OP an NC Soft fans).
NC Soft has turned profits for the last few quarters, despite paying for GW2, so their stock is strong. EA hasn't, so their's is down. There may have been some speculation that TOR was going to single handedly turn EA around as a company, but at what point does anyone think that speculation drove the stock price artificially high?
The markets think that EA is worth about 5.5 times as much as NC Soft.
1.7m subs is a fat lie that anyone who watched server pop will see.
It's not a lie, it was released as an adendum to their financail reports, so it was 100% true. Go ask your failed finance teacher to explain that to you. At this time, they certainly can have less, but at the time the statement was pegged (either Dec 31, or Jan 31st) the statement was true. Full stop, it was a true statement, quit denying it, arguing it etc. If you do, you are wrong, and wallowing in ingnorance.
I know it's hard for people at MMORPG to believe, but the executives at EA are not interested in going to jail for fraud so that a bunch of their fans can win internet forum debates.
Originally posted by grimfall It's not a lie, it was released as an adendum to their financail reports, so it was 100% true.
Yeah, any random BS corporations put in their financial reports is 100% true just because it's in their financial reports. Everything Enron said in their reports was true too. /facepalm
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
Why do people make these Posts talking about why they think a Game is Failing. Even if it isn't? We get it! You don't like the Game. Move on. Some people do enjoy the game, why can't you leave it alone? do you have to piss all over others good time to make yourself feel better? The Game has 1.7 m Subs. It will go Up, and it will go down. that is far from a fail. How many subs do Vanguard Have? Dark age of Camelot? Everquest? Everquest 2? Aion? and so on. they don't have that many and are STILL GOING. That's a win in my book. you don't help any thing by being so negitive. Enjoy the games you like and let others enjoy theirs.
There is no way to twist,fold,or bend that stock history into being the harmless rants of Trolls. It is true and accurate, and a public offering lives or dies by its stock value. That is it's,"Blood Pressure", and those numbers indicate that EA is indeed financially on life support. Just because games blah blah and blah blah owned by the same company are around doesn't hide the truth in these hard numbers. The next predictable move by any publically offered corporation in this state of loss is to offer up scapegoats to try and appease stock holders that heads are rolling and measures are being taken to breath life back into their investments. My guess is that EA had its future riding on SWTOR. Look for some at the top to be announcing that ,"...by mutual agreement...." they will be packing their sad little briefcases and moving on soon. Remember that you heard it here first.
Ballerinas are always on their toes. Why don't they just get taller ballerinas?
It's not a lie, it was released as an adendum to their financail reports, so it was 100% true.
Yeah, any random BS corporations put in their financial reports is 100% true just because it's in their financial reports. Everything Enron said in their reports was true too. /facepalm
You mean the same Enron that went into bankruptcy and had many executives tried (or sentenced after pleabargaining) for financial fraud, which is exactly what I said would be the case if EA was doing it? It's actually libelous to go in public forum and accuse people of fraud.... I am pretty sure the judge won't take "Well, I didn't like their game" as a valid defense.
1.7m subs is a fat lie that anyone who watched server pop will see.
It's not a lie, it was released as an adendum to their financail reports, so it was 100% true. Go ask your failed finance teacher to explain that to you. At this time, they certainly can have less, but at the time the statement was pegged (either Dec 31, or Jan 31st) the statement was true. Full stop, it was a true statement, quit denying it, arguing it etc. If you do, you are wrong, and wallowing in ingnorance.
I know it's hard for people at MMORPG to believe, but the executives at EA are not interested in going to jail for fraud so that a bunch of their fans can win internet forum debates.
I believe it, I believe that is what the game started with. I believe that is no where near what the game has now though and anyone using that figure as current has the roses setting turned too high in their glasses.
Fans of the game should be terribly concerned that the figure is as disputable as it is with the game only being 4 months old. Heck, in the 2nd month actual attempts to head count players suggested dismal retention much less 3rd and 4th month attempts and obvious lack of populated servers.
Not looking good for the most hyped and anticipated online game ever to only be 4 months old and the 1st month's numbers are as much yesterday's news as they have been since the 2nd month.
Why do people make these Posts talking about why they think a Game is Failing. Even if it isn't? We get it! You don't like the Game. Move on. Some people do enjoy the game, why can't you leave it alone? do you have to piss all over others good time to make yourself feel better? The Game has 1.7 m Subs. It will go Up, and it will go down. that is far from a fail. How many subs do Vanguard Have? Dark age of Camelot? Everquest? Everquest 2? Aion? and so on. they don't have that many and are STILL GOING. That's a win in my book. you don't help any thing by being so negitive. Enjoy the games you like and let others enjoy theirs.
Actually NCsoft stock price tripled in 2009. Next. Sorry, typo, that was supposed to be 2008, in Oct specifically when their market cap was so low that they probably had trouble attracting financing.
Originally posted by grimfall
The markets think that EA is worth about 5.5 times as much as NC Soft.
In 2005 market thought BoA was worth 5.7 times more than Apple.
You really think NC Soft is the next Bank of America, come on, man, they're not that bad.
Comments
Jesus, these SWTOR hate threads get old. I wish the kiddies would get over it all ready and move along. We get it -- they don't like the game. I promise the sun will still rise tomorrow. Geez....
The only company to make money out of SW;TOR so far, has been Lucas Arts..
You think that most of TORs subscribers were so stupid that they signed up for 6 months when they bought the game?
I doubt it, few people are so dumb that they wont try a single month first before deciding to sign up long term.
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
I like the game a lot so if any of you have time cards they want to give away let me know
You think that most of TORs subscribers were so stupid that they signed up for 6 months when they bought the game?
I doubt it, few people are so dumb that they wont try a single month first before deciding to sign up long term.
I think quite a few go for the 3 month sub, certainly not a majority, as it has a decent discount/risk balance.This is not the first post I have read about people going wild and buying collector editions, 6 months subs , etc. Now I think that is still the minority of people, but people do and say silly things and then feel they have to leave their regrets on the mmorpg.com forums
I love how so many people a clinging to the stock performance issue and are either ignorant of the economic climate for the last 5 years or choosing to ignore it in an attempt to lend credence to their personal opinion on a game. EA is a poorly managed company, but it's financial track record is in line with many other major entertainment brands.
Please, check NCSoft performance during the last 5 years. Thank you. Come again.
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
LOL they will never get over it, these are the same knuckleheads that cried a river when a failing SWG turned to CU and finally to NGE in order to save a game that had IMO fatal flaws to begin with. However I am wondering if these same people who played SWG pre CU did not complain so much about SWG if Sony would have taken the unpresidented step in changing the game?
1.7m subs is a fat lie that anyone who watched server pop will see. I played from the start and for a full 2 months on a server stated at that time as very light which had around 50-100 people on the 1-24 lvl range planets and then droped off to around 10-30 and lower as the lvl got higher. On friday i give the free week a shot and see my server is very low pop still and went to find one of only 2 servers is a high pop which was odd as before i quit there were a good 10+ at most times of the day so i pick one of the 2 high pop server and first thing i see is the some of people of the planets which were in a 30-50 people range and just droped off fast from there. If you have forgot what i said from the start my old low pop server from the start had far more people than this so called high pop server has today so needless to say they don't have that many people and are trying to cover it up!
Remember when people didn't play a game, not because all of a sudden they are some hackney H&R Block but because the game wasn't fun, and that was ALL the reason they needed?
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
like Sony for instance, 4 years straight of losing money, last year lost a staggering 6 billion dollars.. kind of puts it in perspective doesnt it.
sadly, EA's ability to turn a profit on SW;TOR is in significant doubt.. unless Bioware gets a grip on the games problems anyway. and patch 1.2 didnt really touch anything of any real significance.
You don't need to cry a river or even be a brain surgeon to know, that SOE and now Bioware have screwed up the SW IP in the mmo genre with radical changes and flat out bad gaming design. For SWG, i know for a fact that everyone i knew and played with never bitched or moaned about changes. It was the ADD twits that wanted to have everything handed to them from first login and not have to actully put in the time and effort to obtain the status of those that had been playing for some time that caused the dumb changes to be made. Radical changes = Mass exodus of players.
In Bioware's case, they just made a horrible and boring game, my opinion, after leveling a 50 Sith Warrior. With a much less on rails design and a more open environment and system tools to create player interdependency with a player made economy, TOR could have been a great mmorpg. I feel all they have created is nothing more than a SPRPG with coop features. This is the reason in my eyes that it is fail. On rails, story, story = level 50 bored and Mass unsubbing.
Payed and played = My opinion is just as valid as the next person.
Like when they almost went belly-up in 2009? Check Funcom's pre-AoC and Post stock price for an "what you should expect to see once Guild Wars releases" (I don't really believe this, but I am just extending some of the "logic" applied by the OP an NC Soft fans).
NC Soft has turned profits for the last few quarters, despite paying for GW2, so their stock is strong. EA hasn't, so their's is down. There may have been some speculation that TOR was going to single handedly turn EA around as a company, but at what point does anyone think that speculation drove the stock price artificially high?
The markets think that EA is worth about 5.5 times as much as NC Soft.
Actually NCsoft stock price tripled in 2009. Next.
In 2005 market thought BoA was worth 5.7 times more than Apple.
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
It's not a lie, it was released as an adendum to their financail reports, so it was 100% true. Go ask your failed finance teacher to explain that to you. At this time, they certainly can have less, but at the time the statement was pegged (either Dec 31, or Jan 31st) the statement was true. Full stop, it was a true statement, quit denying it, arguing it etc. If you do, you are wrong, and wallowing in ingnorance.
I know it's hard for people at MMORPG to believe, but the executives at EA are not interested in going to jail for fraud so that a bunch of their fans can win internet forum debates.
For me then is the question:
What will EA do with SWtOR? Will they pull the plug or will we get a NGE?
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
Why do people make these Posts talking about why they think a Game is Failing. Even if it isn't? We get it! You don't like the Game. Move on. Some people do enjoy the game, why can't you leave it alone? do you have to piss all over others good time to make yourself feel better? The Game has 1.7 m Subs. It will go Up, and it will go down. that is far from a fail. How many subs do Vanguard Have? Dark age of Camelot? Everquest? Everquest 2? Aion? and so on. they don't have that many and are STILL GOING. That's a win in my book. you don't help any thing by being so negitive. Enjoy the games you like and let others enjoy theirs.
There is no way to twist,fold,or bend that stock history into being the harmless rants of Trolls. It is true and accurate, and a public offering lives or dies by its stock value. That is it's,"Blood Pressure", and those numbers indicate that EA is indeed financially on life support. Just because games blah blah and blah blah owned by the same company are around doesn't hide the truth in these hard numbers. The next predictable move by any publically offered corporation in this state of loss is to offer up scapegoats to try and appease stock holders that heads are rolling and measures are being taken to breath life back into their investments. My guess is that EA had its future riding on SWTOR. Look for some at the top to be announcing that ,"...by mutual agreement...." they will be packing their sad little briefcases and moving on soon. Remember that you heard it here first.
Ballerinas are always on their toes. Why don't they just get taller ballerinas?
You mean the same Enron that went into bankruptcy and had many executives tried (or sentenced after pleabargaining) for financial fraud, which is exactly what I said would be the case if EA was doing it? It's actually libelous to go in public forum and accuse people of fraud.... I am pretty sure the judge won't take "Well, I didn't like their game" as a valid defense.
/facepalm indeed!
I believe it, I believe that is what the game started with. I believe that is no where near what the game has now though and anyone using that figure as current has the roses setting turned too high in their glasses.
Fans of the game should be terribly concerned that the figure is as disputable as it is with the game only being 4 months old. Heck, in the 2nd month actual attempts to head count players suggested dismal retention much less 3rd and 4th month attempts and obvious lack of populated servers.
Not looking good for the most hyped and anticipated online game ever to only be 4 months old and the 1st month's numbers are as much yesterday's news as they have been since the 2nd month.
I feel your pain.