WvWvW is the ONLY reason im buying this game. Otherwise i just cant stand the loading zone layout they built this game with. Such a lobby game. Makes me sad.
Hero Evermore Guild Master of Dragonspine since 1982. Playing Path of Exile and deeply in love with it.
Nice post Garrett. I'm sooo looking forward to jumping into this. <-- old DAOc player.
Just a question for you guys the next time you get to play: No one has made an in-depth report on the crafting system. When the first Beta exploration happened, you guys skimmed over it and didn't give any solid information. Can one of your writers dedicate a Beta weekend to looking at this thoroughly?
Oh, and if someone reading this knows of a link to where I might find a crafting review somewhere, please give the link . Thanks in advance
WvWvW is also nothing really new. Any RvR style of game is always going to have problems with population balance between the factions, it just never really works out.
The difference in GW2 is that it isn't faction it's server. It doesn't matter if more people play Charr than Humans. What matters is how many people on the server participate in the WvWvW.
If there is an imbalance and your server always loses you will be matched up with other losing servers. Low pop servers will eventually be paired up with bad or other low pop servers. It will work itself out.. those who want to do WvWvW will play on servers that can compete.
High participating highly skilled servers will match up against each other and go at it. The ones that suck will always be at the bottom tier.
You can't fix everything and sometimes you just have to live with it and move to another server if you really want to WvWvW.
For me though the biggest turn off is the total lack of cross team reputation. All my foes have to fear is a 'Red Invader', all I will see is a 'Green' or 'Blue'. No reputations to earn or lose. No names to spark fear and urge a response to swarm on.
Secondly, Imbalances, these always lead to optimized play, and if severe enough you will be pretty much be forced into X, Y or Z builds for WvW. Other builds need not apply, Especially if the WvW population limit is significantly lower than the players trying to get in.
You may not get names however you do get the clan tag abreviation so some good pvp clans people may fear seeing your clan abbriveation next to red invader.
I hope you can pick [Friendly] as tag.
You cannot see enemy player names in WvW. Is all you see is "X invader" X being the variable for the color of the enemy invader.
WvWvW is the ONLY reason im buying this game. Otherwise i just cant stand the loading zone layout they built this game with. Such a lobby game. Makes me sad.
I am there with you. The pve aspect of this game is really sort of a let down for me, despite my initial hopes years ago. WvWvW still looks like it will be a blast though, so...awesome!
It's still ultimately just a dedicated area for PvP. Because of this, there is no element of surprise. Eveyrone who enters this zone will be expecting PvP. Predictible.
I tire of such "dedicated areas", Warzones, Battlegrounds, etc. They make me want to vomit.
The PvP zone has really had its day. Noboday has ever made it work. WvWvW is also nothing really new. Any RvR style of game is always going to have problems with population balance between the factions, it just never really works out. And before people say DAoC, well folks thats run by Bioware now, and they didn't use that system for SWTOR as it has too many problems. Major porblem is lvl 1+ being in the PvP. As we all know from SWTOR stat boostong never works out.
Bioware couldn't pull it off, but that's Bioware. There's a lot of things they couldn't pull off. Trying to compare them to ArenaNet is useless since they have diametrically opposed design philosophies and a very different history.
I don't much care what anyone else's opinions are, I'm interested in PvP for pretty much the first time because of WvW. I've participated in it before either because there wasn't much else to do or because there was absolutely *nothing* else to do. Now, I want to be involved. Win for me. Can't wait.
Oh yeah, is there confirmation that you can enter PvP at level one? Last information I had on it was that you needed to complete the tutorial zone first, before being able to go to the Mists. That means level two. Has this changed?
Over population is the biggest threat I guess, because WvW is by far the biggest appeal to GW2 in the pvp department. If I have to wait an hour before getting into WvW on my own server I'd be really frustrated. Really curious about what the player cap will be and how soon it will be reached on an average server.
Another potential downside is the ability to buy Influence for gold and buy appealing guild boosts with that. This might give bigger and richer guilds another edge over members of smaller or poorer guilds.
That is what I worry about too Pony .
I am not that really sure but I think Anet Guild intro says that 1 toon can join 100s' of guild.
You just have to click on the guild that you want to hangout in for abit.
Do not have to quit any guild or make more toons to join other guild.
So I should think there would be a PVP server guild where everyone join in to get the buffs.
It's still ultimately just a dedicated area for PvP. Because of this, there is no element of surprise. Eveyrone who enters this zone will be expecting PvP. Predictible.
I tire of such "dedicated areas", Warzones, Battlegrounds, etc. They make me want to vomit.
There is PvE content in this area, and if we go by your logic a free for all PvP game is predictable because everyone going into the game expects it.
PvP just for the sake of PvP is pointless. You need to have some sort of goal to give it meaning. Yes the WvW is seperate from the rest of the game, but it's basically a game all on its own. You can PvE, take part in dynamic events, you can wander around with your buddies killing straglers, or you can take part in the WvW. You can level from 1-80 without ever leaving PvP zones. How you can compare this type of set up is beyond me.
No it's not the FFA PvP you are looking for but it's pretty close, no you can't build your own keeps and barracades, but I think it finds a happy medium to please a lot of people.
I want to earn a name for myself, I want to be able to hunt down someone who's earned a name for themselves, I want to be able to exact revenge upon someone who got the kill on me.
None of that can happen if you can't see someone's name.
It looks interesting but it is still instanced which does limit the PvP potential. How great the WvW will be dependant on the number of allowed players.
The implementation of this is actually better than DAOC for one fundamental reason - all three servers have access to the same races, classes, abilities, and gear. DAOC, while my favorite MMO of all time, was plagued by the need to constantly re-balance the classes between the realms as they were NOT mirror images of each other.
Looking forward to having some WvWvW fun (in a casual manner)!
World vs World will be causal friendly, that is why it will rule. New players and casuals can randomly just go bonkers casting spells and skills until their hearts are content. Little to no thought process involved = win for the masses.
Hopefully anet will keep increasing the amount of people that can enter WvW making it as huge as possible. If there are queues, ANET should implement the que to countdown in the background as you are playing PvE and pop up with an enter WvW button when it is ready so your not just waiting at a load screen
I want to earn a name for myself, I want to be able to hunt down someone who's earned a name for themselves, I want to be able to exact revenge upon someone who got the kill on me.
None of that can happen if you can't see someone's name.
I don't like the anonymity factor either, but I guess the reputation will go for Guild tags.
It seems player reputation will be exclusive to structured PvP.
They could have created just WvWvW and I would have bought guildwars for the full price. All the other stuff, e-sport pvp, pve, dungeons, dynamic quests i consider just bonus stuff to do if im bored.
Oh I also disagree that its a better system than daoc, for above 2 reasons, and also because there was more of it in daoc (wvw is about 1/3rd the size of vanilla frontiers) and there is no distraction of mini game pvp.
The best thing I can say about WvW is this - The developers have said from the beginning that it's imbalanced.
What a great thing to say. To be able, as a creator to remove the pressure from yourself and just acknowledge that it's chaos.
Only ArenaNet could say something like this and its fans think of it as a positive. They truly are leading a charmed life. We'll see how long that lasts.
I agree with arenanet on this, balance is boring as hell, mmos can never be balanced anyway, they should embrace their unfairness and stop pretending to be first person shooters
Over population is the biggest threat I guess, because WvW is by far the biggest appeal to GW2 in the pvp department. If I have to wait an hour before getting into WvW on my own server I'd be really frustrated. Really curious about what the player cap will be and how soon it will be reached on an average server.
Another potential downside is the ability to buy Influence for gold and buy appealing guild boosts with that. This might give bigger and richer guilds another edge over members of smaller or poorer guilds.
Bigger guilds are always at an advantage because they are bigger. Buying gold to buy influence won't change that. In fact the ability to buy gems and sell them in the auction house to get gold is more of an advantage for the smaller guilds because they can get rich enough that way.
I am getting some serious old school Dark Age of Camelot vibes off of the video. Rampaging around the frontier and taking keeps was one of the most fun things to do, except for maybe capturing Darkness Falls. I get the impression you can't see other player's names though, which is disappointing, since having personal enemies really cranks up the fun factor. Finding that jerk who keeps killing you with his friends, but he is all by himself, or getting the drop on someone who thought it was funny to emote spam you after he killed you and returning the favor is golden. Without being able to see player's names, he is just some random enemy. Where is the fun in that?
This game is looking awesome, though. I can't wait to see how it shapes up.
Currently playing: Rift Played: SWToR, Aion,EQ, Dark Age of Camelot World of Warcraft, AoC
Comments
I support this article. Even though i wouldn't call three servers competing with each others as three factions.
WvWvW is the ONLY reason im buying this game. Otherwise i just cant stand the loading zone layout they built this game with. Such a lobby game. Makes me sad.
Hero Evermore
Guild Master of Dragonspine since 1982.
Playing Path of Exile and deeply in love with it.
Nice post Garrett. I'm sooo looking forward to jumping into this. <-- old DAOc player.
Just a question for you guys the next time you get to play: No one has made an in-depth report on the crafting system. When the first Beta exploration happened, you guys skimmed over it and didn't give any solid information. Can one of your writers dedicate a Beta weekend to looking at this thoroughly?
Oh, and if someone reading this knows of a link to where I might find a crafting review somewhere, please give the link . Thanks in advance
The difference in GW2 is that it isn't faction it's server. It doesn't matter if more people play Charr than Humans. What matters is how many people on the server participate in the WvWvW.
If there is an imbalance and your server always loses you will be matched up with other losing servers. Low pop servers will eventually be paired up with bad or other low pop servers. It will work itself out.. those who want to do WvWvW will play on servers that can compete.
High participating highly skilled servers will match up against each other and go at it. The ones that suck will always be at the bottom tier.
You can't fix everything and sometimes you just have to live with it and move to another server if you really want to WvWvW.
Sounds edgy and exciting. How embarrassing if you are a level 80 killed by a lucky hit from a level one. Shhhhhhh....don't tell anynow.
Ballerinas are always on their toes. Why don't they just get taller ballerinas?
You cannot see enemy player names in WvW. Is all you see is "X invader" X being the variable for the color of the enemy invader.
I am there with you. The pve aspect of this game is really sort of a let down for me, despite my initial hopes years ago. WvWvW still looks like it will be a blast though, so...awesome!
Bioware couldn't pull it off, but that's Bioware. There's a lot of things they couldn't pull off. Trying to compare them to ArenaNet is useless since they have diametrically opposed design philosophies and a very different history.
I don't much care what anyone else's opinions are, I'm interested in PvP for pretty much the first time because of WvW. I've participated in it before either because there wasn't much else to do or because there was absolutely *nothing* else to do. Now, I want to be involved. Win for me. Can't wait.
This is a big one for me. Plus you get to keep earning rewards at your real current level.
Oh yeah, is there confirmation that you can enter PvP at level one? Last information I had on it was that you needed to complete the tutorial zone first, before being able to go to the Mists. That means level two. Has this changed?
I am not that really sure but I think Anet Guild intro says that 1 toon can join 100s' of guild.
You just have to click on the guild that you want to hangout in for abit.
Do not have to quit any guild or make more toons to join other guild.
So I should think there would be a PVP server guild where everyone join in to get the buffs.
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
There is PvE content in this area, and if we go by your logic a free for all PvP game is predictable because everyone going into the game expects it.
PvP just for the sake of PvP is pointless. You need to have some sort of goal to give it meaning. Yes the WvW is seperate from the rest of the game, but it's basically a game all on its own. You can PvE, take part in dynamic events, you can wander around with your buddies killing straglers, or you can take part in the WvW. You can level from 1-80 without ever leaving PvP zones. How you can compare this type of set up is beyond me.
No it's not the FFA PvP you are looking for but it's pretty close, no you can't build your own keeps and barracades, but I think it finds a happy medium to please a lot of people.
Anonymity in PvP is a big let down.
I want to earn a name for myself, I want to be able to hunt down someone who's earned a name for themselves, I want to be able to exact revenge upon someone who got the kill on me.
None of that can happen if you can't see someone's name.
It looks interesting but it is still instanced which does limit the PvP potential. How great the WvW will be dependant on the number of allowed players.
The implementation of this is actually better than DAOC for one fundamental reason - all three servers have access to the same races, classes, abilities, and gear. DAOC, while my favorite MMO of all time, was plagued by the need to constantly re-balance the classes between the realms as they were NOT mirror images of each other.
Looking forward to having some WvWvW fun (in a casual manner)!
World vs World will be causal friendly, that is why it will rule. New players and casuals can randomly just go bonkers casting spells and skills until their hearts are content. Little to no thought process involved = win for the masses.
Grim Dawn, the next great action rpg!
http://www.grimdawn.com/
Hopefully anet will keep increasing the amount of people that can enter WvW making it as huge as possible. If there are queues, ANET should implement the que to countdown in the background as you are playing PvE and pop up with an enter WvW button when it is ready so your not just waiting at a load screen
I don't like the anonymity factor either, but I guess the reputation will go for Guild tags.
It seems player reputation will be exclusive to structured PvP.
They could have created just WvWvW and I would have bought guildwars for the full price. All the other stuff, e-sport pvp, pve, dungeons, dynamic quests i consider just bonus stuff to do if im bored.
I'm also not so hot on the rotating servers, good rivalries are as important as good alliances
Only ArenaNet could say something like this and its fans think of it as a positive. They truly are leading a charmed life. We'll see how long that lasts.
Bigger guilds are always at an advantage because they are bigger. Buying gold to buy influence won't change that. In fact the ability to buy gems and sell them in the auction house to get gold is more of an advantage for the smaller guilds because they can get rich enough that way.
This is not a game.
I am getting some serious old school Dark Age of Camelot vibes off of the video. Rampaging around the frontier and taking keeps was one of the most fun things to do, except for maybe capturing Darkness Falls. I get the impression you can't see other player's names though, which is disappointing, since having personal enemies really cranks up the fun factor. Finding that jerk who keeps killing you with his friends, but he is all by himself, or getting the drop on someone who thought it was funny to emote spam you after he killed you and returning the favor is golden. Without being able to see player's names, he is just some random enemy. Where is the fun in that?
This game is looking awesome, though. I can't wait to see how it shapes up.
Currently playing:
Rift
Played:
SWToR, Aion,EQ, Dark Age of Camelot
World of Warcraft, AoC