I love how he defends kill 10 x quests... just shows how out of touch these developers have become.
That was one of the first things I though. He also seems to foget they loose 70% of their player by level 10 (accordig to their own commnets).
Well take kill quests out of MMO's and you have a very empty game, kill quests are fine just the devs need to make players want to do those kills quests, give them a reason other than helping some farmer with a badger problem.
"With 10 millions subscribers why change things drasticly? look at apple and the ipads, nothing really changed from the first Ipad yet the new Ipad still sold millions in a matter of days. People like familiarity change something and thy freak out. "slowly slowly chatchy monkey" as they say."
They have no where near 10 million subs anymore lol stop using old numbers prolly in down to a million maybe u cant cuont asia cause they dont pay a sub so ia m counting na and eu the only places that matter to me and there are maybe 2 million subs it's about even with tor tor has about 1.5 mill and no i don't play tor nor wow they both suck.
erm, ok, thanks for your valued input this discussion.
Yeah, comments like these from developers are why this game is going to be deader than a hammer soon. Blizzard isn't the Blizzard that made the games we remember from all those years ago.
I can't wait until Mists of Pandaria comes out, with its truly original(oh wait, they changed it into the same shit as Rogues because it was too complex for the average player) and truly mature(...pandas and pokemon) content.
I love how he defends kill 10 x quests... just shows how out of touch these developers have become.
That was one of the first things I though. He also seems to foget they loose 70% of their player by level 10 (accordig to their own commnets).
Well take kill quests out of MMO's and you have a very empty game, kill quests are fine just the devs need to make players want to do those kills quests, give them a reason other than helping some farmer with a badger problem.
True. that is perhaps the cornerstones of a themepark. Even sandboxes you go and kill stuff your just not told what to kill! Dynamic quests ultimately you kill stuff.
Giving players a reason to kill stuff other than a guy with a gold ! over their head tells you to could use a bit of thought from developers.
For example, my fire mage used to be a brilliant single-target damage dealer. Now, fire mages are geared to do group damage, and are still weak and have limited kiting ability. When you think about it, that is very very stupid.
During the entirety of vanilla, mages were frost for pretty much everything. You couldn't use anything else in raids due to the fact everything was immune to fire and arcane was just plain shit. In PvP you would go frost because you could kite about 4 warriors at the same time without ever having to get worried you might get caught.
Mages used only 1-2 button in raids, frostbolt and more frostbolt. All classed had it easy in raids during Vanilla, except the poor tank who had to maintain threat without having thunderfury himself. Raiding was only hard because you had to gather and coordinate a group of 40+ people every evening who were all fully geared for the content. Except in Molten Core, half the raid could be afk the entire evening there, except for the time you looted epics.
During TBC this changed a little bit, Combat became more complex, simply due the fact you had proper skill rotations and gear for alternative specializations. Feral or Balance druids were a very rare occurance during Vanilla simply because the specialization wasn't viable.
Overall the game became a lot better over time. I still have most nostalgia about Vanilla and TBC, but I can't really deny that Wrath and Cataclysm made it a better game overall, but for me the game just got too old. I needed something new as the questing system with virtually always the same objective just got too boring. This is also the reason why I quit TOR after levelling one character to 50. The questing was on the same level as WoW during Vanilla and TBC, the cutscenes couldn't hide that fact no matter how hard they tried.
To sum it up. The game is getting old, but they shouldn't change the core system as the still gigantic fanbase probably won't like it, you knew how that turned out for SWG. Implementing more content and useless little systems such as pokemon v.2. is the smart way to go. The only thing I find ridiculous for Mists of Pandaria is what they are doing to the talent system.
I loved all expansions of wow, all great. But only with wotlk as "casual" player, i started to end game with 5-man. Said "casual" because i play a lot but I do not have luxury of planning raids 1 week ahead or to stay at once 6 hours in game. I have work and I'm not eternal student. So with wotlk and mainly with dungeon finder I stayed in wow for much more I would usually when I leveled all my alts to max then played other games until release of new expansion pack.
So as I know few that played and stopped and after reading forums .... constant nerfing to druids and wrong changes to 5 man compared to wotlk made happen this loss of subs they are experiencing.
And big difference compared to year, two back is that now i have rift and swtor to play besides wow. Before there was only wow. All the rest was not worth to play more then 1 month or 2 at time.
But I'm afraid damage that Blizzard did listening to VERY VOCAL minority will never be reverted. They will only continue to loose ground. Still wow is for me one of the top games ever made accompanied with rift and swtor now.
Ah, yes, main mistake companies does is to listen to FORUMS. Because on forums you will find maybe only 5% of happy players or less. Or the rest is composed of TROLLS and UNHAPPY players. Every game should have some ingame feedback option, not basing all on forums.
They have no where near 10 million subs anymore lol stop using old numbers prolly in down to a million maybe u cant cuont asia cause they dont pay a sub so ia m counting na and eu the only places that matter to me and there are maybe 2 million subs it's about even with tor tor has about 1.5 mill and no i don't play tor nor wow they both suck.
And you got those numbers and expert opinion on both those games where exactly? How do you know how much ppl is paying for wow and how much are playing for free? I never saw blizz come out with such numbers, so keep your uneducated troll posts for yourself.
Btw, I'm not here to defend wow as I've grown tired of it, but such ignorant post deserves a ban imho.
I dont know if the lot of braindead people know this or not but the reason WoW numbers are dropping is because the MMO market is expanding with games like ToR,GW2,secret world,many games before them lotro,aoc, etc etc i can go on so long as the mmo market expands the people and populatiosns of other games not just WoW will begin to spread out upon all these games some people will enjoy them over others so yeah WoW numbers will continue to drop only people who will stay are the people who actually enjoy the game its a fact of life amongst MMO's as with other popular brands.
I still play because well i look at WoW for what it is a freakin GAME really its a game they are not suppose to spawn up pointless debates there a real life out there for debates and actualy stuff that actually matters outside of the game so yeah i play because i enjoy them and if people dont enjoy it they need to freakin move on anyways instead of causing some of the most unimportant arguments.
"When you get a quest to kill ten things, that lets you be your class, and you know exactly what to do, which means that you can concentrate on the story, concentrate on the atmosphere, concentrate on chatting with your friends. You can really be in the world."
Is this a joke? This statement is why our MMO industry is at rock bottom right now.
It's not so much that "kill x mobs" is the problem. The problem is.. in WoW it's like this:
Story:
"Help! our villiage is under attack by bandits!"
In reality:
Bandit mods are standing around doing nothing in a field waiting for you to attack them. There is nothing immesive about that... Granted WoW has had major success and rightfully so. However I think a lot of MMO players are starting to expect more.
his kill ten mobs statement is extremely revealing
and let me just post to those who still love this game, why are they not taking the large amounts of funds from their $15 a month fee and changing the classes and fixing the talent trees on the test server hmm? Why are they making them "features" for the next expansion? Ever ask yourself that question? Anet FTW for pointing out that the only reason for a monthly sub is GREED nothing more.
Comments on this site make me rage a lot of times. IDK. I'm still playing the game and having fun after 5 or 6 years of playing, so my bad. I've also beta tested, played retail, and progressed through many other MMORPGs. WoW was a great game, and still is. You know, if you even crank up the graphics in WoW it doesn't look half bad at all. Not to mention, the game is fun and pretty immersive. The world and graphics are very stylized, appealing to the classical warcraft theme expectations. Many witty pop cultural references, interesting and intriguing quest lines a lot of times, and great endgame- you just have to find what YOU like to do. For me at this point, I have had fun doing PvP on my rogue in endgame. It's fun. If they changed WoW too much though to be more like these new-gen MMOs that are coming out, then I would really get kind of pissed off to be honest.In my opinion, WoW has not had a TRUE competitor to it yet.SWTOR was pretty big, but by no means WoW...So was Rift, but still. If you people think Tera is? Think again. Playing the beta-it's boring, and it has all been seen before. Graphics are nice, but otherwise it is just an asian action game trying to be an MMO. Maybe GW2 will step up, but for some reason I just doubt it. I think WoW is just one of those timeless games. It's huge, and has TONS of quality content. Haters on here may disagree because they personally don't like the game, but truth is that people have been playing WoW for a good 7 going on 8 years now, and I don''t think they will stop anytime soon. So everyone who rages about how WoW isn't the dynamic sandbox they want it to be, keep raging. They aren't changing the game so the minority of MMO players can play the game for two months and get distracted. Geeze.
Oh, and if your don't like "kill x creature quests" they have also made it to where players can legitamately level in PvP and dungeons. I have no problem with the quests, it seems all games have some sort of alternative, but it all goes back to killing mobs...so I don't really care.
If they wanted to gain some interest back in their game, they would change up the questing system to be more modern and in depth so people actually DO feel like they're "in that world". I know this is cosmetic, but they would also update their graphics & character models to a significant degree to make the game feel new to potential new players, and even returning players. There's lots of things they could do to really improve upon what they have to bring players back, otherwise they'll continue to bleed subs and lose players to games like SW:TOR, GW2, and whatever other big releases come after. They've always had this vertical progression system and never focused on a potential lateral progression, and lateral expansion. Things to fill the game up with more than leveling and raiding. If they added things like player housing, and other activities other than what they have, they'd probably be able to pull a significant return. Blizzard is a shadow of the company it once, briefly, was. People are finally seeing the intense lack of even attempted innovation in their behalf, and how content they are to let the game fall. It's an old game, it's a natural cycle, but they've done very little to really prevent it due to their own hubris.
Sooooooooo if GW2 turns out to be popular success or there dynamic model for leveling with no questing catches on Blizzard just said we are never changing. Maybe Blizzard should have a conversation with the Everquest devs on why that game crashed after WoW's launch.
It is shocking how bad this game has stagnated the genre and Blizzard is just happy to keep it that way. Thank god better mmorp's are out and more are coming.
Comments on this site make me rage a lot of times. IDK. I'm still playing the game and having fun after 5 or 6 years of playing, so my bad. I've also beta tested, played retail, and progressed through many other MMORPGs. WoW was a great game, and still is. You know, if you even crank up the graphics in WoW it doesn't look half bad at all. Not to mention, the game is fun and pretty immersive. The world and graphics are very stylized, appealing to the classical warcraft theme expectations. Many witty pop cultural references, interesting and intriguing quest lines a lot of times, and great endgame- you just have to find what YOU like to do. For me at this point, I have had fun doing PvP on my rogue in endgame. It's fun. If they changed WoW too much though to be more like these new-gen MMOs that are coming out, then I would really get kind of pissed off to be honest.In my opinion, WoW has not had a TRUE competitor to it yet.SWTOR was pretty big, but by no means WoW...So was Rift, but still. If you people think Tera is? Think again. Playing the beta-it's boring, and it has all been seen before. Graphics are nice, but otherwise it is just an asian action game trying to be an MMO. Maybe GW2 will step up, but for some reason I just doubt it. I think WoW is just one of those timeless games. It's huge, and has TONS of quality content. Haters on here may disagree because they personally don't like the game, but truth is that people have been playing WoW for a good 7 going on 8 years now, and I don''t think they will stop anytime soon. So everyone who rages about how WoW isn't the dynamic sandbox they want it to be, keep raging. They aren't changing the game so the minority of MMO players can play the game for two months and get distracted. Geeze.
The reason you have a different opinion is probably because you play MMORPGs in a different way to most people who post on these forums.
The reason why WoW seems fresh to you after 6 years of playing (ha ha ha, OMG!!!) is because you are a 'causual player' - i.e. 2 hours a week.
Most people who post here play MMORPGs maybe about 1 or 2 hours an evening.
WoW isn't evolving to maintain the interest of MMORPG fans.
In my opinion, the future is with Eve Online and DUST. This is where the exciting gameplay and innovation lives.
Comments on this site make me rage a lot of times. IDK. I'm still playing the game and having fun after 5 or 6 years of playing, so my bad. I've also beta tested, played retail, and progressed through many other MMORPGs. WoW was a great game, and still is. You know, if you even crank up the graphics in WoW it doesn't look half bad at all. Not to mention, the game is fun and pretty immersive. The world and graphics are very stylized, appealing to the classical warcraft theme expectations. Many witty pop cultural references, interesting and intriguing quest lines a lot of times, and great endgame- you just have to find what YOU like to do. For me at this point, I have had fun doing PvP on my rogue in endgame. It's fun. If they changed WoW too much though to be more like these new-gen MMOs that are coming out, then I would really get kind of pissed off to be honest.In my opinion, WoW has not had a TRUE competitor to it yet.SWTOR was pretty big, but by no means WoW...So was Rift, but still. If you people think Tera is? Think again. Playing the beta-it's boring, and it has all been seen before. Graphics are nice, but otherwise it is just an asian action game trying to be an MMO. Maybe GW2 will step up, but for some reason I just doubt it. I think WoW is just one of those timeless games. It's huge, and has TONS of quality content. Haters on here may disagree because they personally don't like the game, but truth is that people have been playing WoW for a good 7 going on 8 years now, and I don''t think they will stop anytime soon. So everyone who rages about how WoW isn't the dynamic sandbox they want it to be, keep raging. They aren't changing the game so the minority of MMO players can play the game for two months and get distracted. Geeze.
The reason you have a different opinion is probably because you play MMORPGs in a different way to most people who post on these forums.
The reason why WoW seems fresh to you after 6 years of playing (ha ha ha, OMG!!!) is because you are a 'causual player' - i.e. 2 hours a week.
Most people who post here play MMORPGs maybe about 1 or 2 hours an evening.
WoW isn't evolving to maintain the interest of MMORPG fans.
In my opinion, the future is with Eve Online and DUST. This is where the exciting gameplay and innovation lives.
lol Ok. No, I play MMOs about an hour to two every day. I also swap back and forth between games...I tend to go back to WoW, though. Good job making a baseless comment extremely long, though. And good luck with Eve Online and DUST, though (LAWL).
Comments
Well take kill quests out of MMO's and you have a very empty game, kill quests are fine just the devs need to make players want to do those kills quests, give them a reason other than helping some farmer with a badger problem.
He's probablly right though. In the spirit of adding something you might find this interesting http://daeity.blogspot.co.uk/2010/08/blizzards-active-subscription-numbers.html
Yeah, comments like these from developers are why this game is going to be deader than a hammer soon. Blizzard isn't the Blizzard that made the games we remember from all those years ago.
I can't wait until Mists of Pandaria comes out, with its truly original(oh wait, they changed it into the same shit as Rogues because it was too complex for the average player) and truly mature(...pandas and pokemon) content.
What a joke.
True. that is perhaps the cornerstones of a themepark. Even sandboxes you go and kill stuff your just not told what to kill! Dynamic quests ultimately you kill stuff.
Giving players a reason to kill stuff other than a guy with a gold ! over their head tells you to could use a bit of thought from developers.
During the entirety of vanilla, mages were frost for pretty much everything. You couldn't use anything else in raids due to the fact everything was immune to fire and arcane was just plain shit. In PvP you would go frost because you could kite about 4 warriors at the same time without ever having to get worried you might get caught.
Mages used only 1-2 button in raids, frostbolt and more frostbolt. All classed had it easy in raids during Vanilla, except the poor tank who had to maintain threat without having thunderfury himself. Raiding was only hard because you had to gather and coordinate a group of 40+ people every evening who were all fully geared for the content. Except in Molten Core, half the raid could be afk the entire evening there, except for the time you looted epics.
During TBC this changed a little bit, Combat became more complex, simply due the fact you had proper skill rotations and gear for alternative specializations. Feral or Balance druids were a very rare occurance during Vanilla simply because the specialization wasn't viable.
Overall the game became a lot better over time. I still have most nostalgia about Vanilla and TBC, but I can't really deny that Wrath and Cataclysm made it a better game overall, but for me the game just got too old. I needed something new as the questing system with virtually always the same objective just got too boring. This is also the reason why I quit TOR after levelling one character to 50. The questing was on the same level as WoW during Vanilla and TBC, the cutscenes couldn't hide that fact no matter how hard they tried.
To sum it up. The game is getting old, but they shouldn't change the core system as the still gigantic fanbase probably won't like it, you knew how that turned out for SWG. Implementing more content and useless little systems such as pokemon v.2. is the smart way to go. The only thing I find ridiculous for Mists of Pandaria is what they are doing to the talent system.
I loved all expansions of wow, all great. But only with wotlk as "casual" player, i started to end game with 5-man. Said "casual" because i play a lot but I do not have luxury of planning raids 1 week ahead or to stay at once 6 hours in game. I have work and I'm not eternal student. So with wotlk and mainly with dungeon finder I stayed in wow for much more I would usually when I leveled all my alts to max then played other games until release of new expansion pack.
So as I know few that played and stopped and after reading forums .... constant nerfing to druids and wrong changes to 5 man compared to wotlk made happen this loss of subs they are experiencing.
And big difference compared to year, two back is that now i have rift and swtor to play besides wow. Before there was only wow. All the rest was not worth to play more then 1 month or 2 at time.
But I'm afraid damage that Blizzard did listening to VERY VOCAL minority will never be reverted. They will only continue to loose ground. Still wow is for me one of the top games ever made accompanied with rift and swtor now.
Ah, yes, main mistake companies does is to listen to FORUMS. Because on forums you will find maybe only 5% of happy players or less. Or the rest is composed of TROLLS and UNHAPPY players. Every game should have some ingame feedback option, not basing all on forums.
And you got those numbers and expert opinion on both those games where exactly? How do you know how much ppl is paying for wow and how much are playing for free? I never saw blizz come out with such numbers, so keep your uneducated troll posts for yourself.
Btw, I'm not here to defend wow as I've grown tired of it, but such ignorant post deserves a ban imho.
and why is it that my post is cut in half? known issue with the comments?
I dont know if the lot of braindead people know this or not but the reason WoW numbers are dropping is because the MMO market is expanding with games like ToR,GW2,secret world,many games before them lotro,aoc, etc etc i can go on so long as the mmo market expands the people and populatiosns of other games not just WoW will begin to spread out upon all these games some people will enjoy them over others so yeah WoW numbers will continue to drop only people who will stay are the people who actually enjoy the game its a fact of life amongst MMO's as with other popular brands.
I still play because well i look at WoW for what it is a freakin GAME really its a game they are not suppose to spawn up pointless debates there a real life out there for debates and actualy stuff that actually matters outside of the game so yeah i play because i enjoy them and if people dont enjoy it they need to freakin move on anyways instead of causing some of the most unimportant arguments.
Is this a joke? This statement is why our MMO industry is at rock bottom right now.
Exactly. Fat cats don't tend to wander far - why bother? Sucks for us though.
It's not so much that "kill x mobs" is the problem. The problem is.. in WoW it's like this:
Story:
"Help! our villiage is under attack by bandits!"
In reality:
Bandit mods are standing around doing nothing in a field waiting for you to attack them. There is nothing immesive about that... Granted WoW has had major success and rightfully so. However I think a lot of MMO players are starting to expect more.
From what I understand all classes are getting revamped such as Shaman not being able to use totems anymore.
Grim Dawn, the next great action rpg!
http://www.grimdawn.com/
his kill ten mobs statement is extremely revealing
and let me just post to those who still love this game, why are they not taking the large amounts of funds from their $15 a month fee and changing the classes and fixing the talent trees on the test server hmm? Why are they making them "features" for the next expansion? Ever ask yourself that question? Anet FTW for pointing out that the only reason for a monthly sub is GREED nothing more.
It is too late in the game for them to change things with WoW, But I'm hoping things are different with Project Titan.
http://www.youtube.com/internetkidzgaming <- My Youtube Channel
Comments on this site make me rage a lot of times. IDK. I'm still playing the game and having fun after 5 or 6 years of playing, so my bad. I've also beta tested, played retail, and progressed through many other MMORPGs. WoW was a great game, and still is. You know, if you even crank up the graphics in WoW it doesn't look half bad at all. Not to mention, the game is fun and pretty immersive. The world and graphics are very stylized, appealing to the classical warcraft theme expectations. Many witty pop cultural references, interesting and intriguing quest lines a lot of times, and great endgame- you just have to find what YOU like to do. For me at this point, I have had fun doing PvP on my rogue in endgame. It's fun. If they changed WoW too much though to be more like these new-gen MMOs that are coming out, then I would really get kind of pissed off to be honest.In my opinion, WoW has not had a TRUE competitor to it yet.SWTOR was pretty big, but by no means WoW...So was Rift, but still. If you people think Tera is? Think again. Playing the beta-it's boring, and it has all been seen before. Graphics are nice, but otherwise it is just an asian action game trying to be an MMO.
Maybe GW2 will step up, but for some reason I just doubt it. I think WoW is just one of those timeless games. It's huge, and has TONS of quality content. Haters on here may disagree because they personally don't like the game, but truth is that people have been playing WoW for a good 7 going on 8 years now, and I don''t think they will stop anytime soon. So everyone who rages about how WoW isn't the dynamic sandbox they want it to be, keep raging. They aren't changing the game so the minority of MMO players can play the game for two months and get distracted. Geeze.
Oh, and if your don't like "kill x creature quests" they have also made it to where players can legitamately level in PvP and dungeons. I have no problem with the quests, it seems all games have some sort of alternative, but it all goes back to killing mobs...so I don't really care.
If they wanted to gain some interest back in their game, they would change up the questing system to be more modern and in depth so people actually DO feel like they're "in that world". I know this is cosmetic, but they would also update their graphics & character models to a significant degree to make the game feel new to potential new players, and even returning players. There's lots of things they could do to really improve upon what they have to bring players back, otherwise they'll continue to bleed subs and lose players to games like SW:TOR, GW2, and whatever other big releases come after. They've always had this vertical progression system and never focused on a potential lateral progression, and lateral expansion. Things to fill the game up with more than leveling and raiding. If they added things like player housing, and other activities other than what they have, they'd probably be able to pull a significant return. Blizzard is a shadow of the company it once, briefly, was. People are finally seeing the intense lack of even attempted innovation in their behalf, and how content they are to let the game fall. It's an old game, it's a natural cycle, but they've done very little to really prevent it due to their own hubris.
Sooooooooo if GW2 turns out to be popular success or there dynamic model for leveling with no questing catches on Blizzard just said we are never changing. Maybe Blizzard should have a conversation with the Everquest devs on why that game crashed after WoW's launch.
It is shocking how bad this game has stagnated the genre and Blizzard is just happy to keep it that way. Thank god better mmorp's are out and more are coming.
The reason you have a different opinion is probably because you play MMORPGs in a different way to most people who post on these forums.
The reason why WoW seems fresh to you after 6 years of playing (ha ha ha, OMG!!!) is because you are a 'causual player' - i.e. 2 hours a week.
Most people who post here play MMORPGs maybe about 1 or 2 hours an evening.
WoW isn't evolving to maintain the interest of MMORPG fans.
In my opinion, the future is with Eve Online and DUST. This is where the exciting gameplay and innovation lives.
lol Ok. No, I play MMOs about an hour to two every day. I also swap back and forth between games...I tend to go back to WoW, though. Good job making a baseless comment extremely long, though. And good luck with Eve Online and DUST, though (LAWL).