I'm going to buy the game, and don't mind the system actually. I respectfully disagree, in fairness.
What the poster said does matter if you are PvE oriented and want to play the market. People who chose to spend money for gems will get gold up front and have crafting materials, or anything that can be traded quicker.
No, the gold is coming from other players, so somebody must have enough gold to be willing to sell it.
And when you earn your 1st 2-3 gold, and the next guy does too, and the 3rd guy as well, all agree to buy your mats from the guy who bought his from the cash shop...He now has hundreds of gold and you got........a few gold worth of mats.
buy what? materials... they never said they were selling mats and I doubt they will. You guys are REALLY stretching things now.
If you can sell mats on the AH, you can buy them with real money.
ok and that money is going to the guy in game that spent the time to farm up said mats. Which would have happened no matter what type of cash shop system they have. Besides I am sorry to whoever wants to do this but selling gems in the very start is pretty dumb, they cant sell for much because no one has much. Take Wakfu.. they have a pretty interesting economy.. game started out there isnt one in game currency ANYWHERE.. why? because you have to craft it. So in the first 2 weeks of the game barely ANYTHING sold for over 1 kama which is only 10 ore(you get 1-3 pre per vein). This is like pennies on what it will be in the future.. because in the future everyone has money.. oh also many if not all of their cash shop items are sellable on the AH.
what am I trying to say.. soryy got sidetracked but basically I am saying that the price of gems on the AH will flux with the game just like the price of mats on the vendor in GW1. It wont be an issue.
I'm going to buy the game, and don't mind the system actually. I respectfully disagree, in fairness.
What the poster said does matter if you are PvE oriented and want to play the market. People who chose to spend money for gems will get gold up front and have crafting materials, or anything that can be traded quicker.
No, the gold is coming from other players, so somebody must have enough gold to be willing to sell it.
And when you earn your 1st 2-3 gold, and the next guy does too, and the 3rd guy as well, all agree to buy your mats from the guy who bought his from the cash shop...He now has hundreds of gold and you got........a few gold worth of mats.
buy what? materials... they never said they were selling mats and I doubt they will. You guys are REALLY stretching things now.
Man people love to nitpick on semantics while missing the point or context.
It's not about mats! It's about trade.
CAN A PLAYER GET AN ADVANTAGE OVER OTHERS BY USING THE CASH SHOP?
that's all I want to know. If you can...in any way....the game is P2W
no because you can go out and get the same items in game easily.
Hey buying Plex with in-game currency (isk) is what allows CCP to bloat how many subs and concurrent players they have!
No boasting required. Every active account has been payed for, one way or another. From CCPs point of view, it doesn't make a lick of a difference whether your month was payed with a sub or with PLEX.
Would you sign up for a game where you knew going in, that while it wasn't 100% needed, it's kinda expected that in order to play at the game's "baseline" you'll need multiple accounts and multiboxing? And not a whole lot else about it?
It's a tough pill to swallow. I'd want to hide that from any potential new blood.
I played EVE, if that's what you're asking. No multi accounts, no multiboxing, didn't even buy a single PLEX. Found a nice corp, nice players, played the game and had lots of fun.
That's the baseline people are completely ignoring in this whole discussion. If the game is fun to play out of the box, the cash shop completely loses its raison d'ètre. If I enjoy playing the game, why would I ever pay additional money to play less of it?
Hey buying Plex with in-game currency (isk) is what allows CCP to bloat how many subs and concurrent players they have!
CCP's success with EVE really chaps your ass, huh. I wouldn't let it get to ya, though, it's just a video game. With or without your oh so desired recognition and approval the game will continue to have a very healthy population.
Good luck.
Hey hey settle down sparky, no need to get all twisted and make things personal.
I'm going to buy the game, and don't mind the system actually. I respectfully disagree, in fairness.
What the poster said does matter if you are PvE oriented and want to play the market. People who chose to spend money for gems will get gold up front and have crafting materials, or anything that can be traded quicker.
No, the gold is coming from other players, so somebody must have enough gold to be willing to sell it.
And when you earn your 1st 2-3 gold, and the next guy does too, and the 3rd guy as well, all agree to buy your mats from the guy who bought his from the cash shop...He now has hundreds of gold and you got........a few gold worth of mats.
buy what? materials... they never said they were selling mats and I doubt they will. You guys are REALLY stretching things now.
If you can sell mats on the AH, you can buy them with real money.
ok and that money is going to the guy in game that spent the time to farm up said mats. Which would have happened no matter what type of cash shop system they have. Besides I am sorry to whoever wants to do this but selling gems in the very start is pretty dumb, they cant sell for much because no one has much. Take Wakfu.. they have a pretty interesting economy.. game started out there isnt one in game currency ANYWHERE.. why? because you have to craft it. So in the first 2 weeks of the game barely ANYTHING sold for over 1 kama which is only 10 ore(you get 1-3 pre per vein). This is like pennies on what it will be in the future.. because in the future everyone has money.. oh also many if not all of their cash shop items are sellable on the AH.
what am I trying to say.. soryy got sidetracked but basically I am saying that the price of gems on the AH will flux with the game just like the price of mats on the vendor in GW1. It wont be an issue.
Actually, if you consider how inflation typically works in MMORPGs...the price of gems (gold per gem) will drastically INCREASE over time, because the "gold supply" will increase over time. In the beginning, gems will be relatively "cheap." But in a few months, they will be very expensive.
Okay, so let's say GW2 has DLC every month (already too often imo!). For unsavory or perfectly legitimate reasons, a certain percentage of the playerbase (gold farmers, botters, hackers, kids) have no credit card tied to their account and do not wish to or cannot obtain prepay cards on a regular basis. Maybe they had enough money to buy the box and that's it.
So those players' money is lost. Ah, but wait! Not if other players are willing to fund their DLC purchases in exchange for ingame currency!
This benefits the hell out of NCSoft/Anet, no one is going to argue that. It benefits the hell out of people who can somehow get their hands on the box but can't or won't obtain later content with their CC or a prepaid card.
I've yet to see how it will stop gold sellers (who will always play a game of botting up gold, then undercutting the current diamond prices by just a wee bit while also cheerfully stealing accounts as they have always done).
I have yet to see how this will benefit someone who does not intend to use their wallet to buy ingame currency but who can and will use their wallet to buy DLC they like the looks of.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
Just play the game and make in game gold.If your then so vain you need that pirate hat then trade for gems and get it.
oo! this made me think of another similar system. Turbines LOTRO.. where you can buy shop items from achievement currency. The reason I thought of that is the whole content/dungeon issue I was talking to someone about, because in LOTRO you have to actually buy zones/quest packages. Now this is another extreme case because LOTRO is now F2P so obviously they are selling more than Anet will, but say you want to get that extra quest package they offer on the cash shop.. like the one they have for GW1. You can.. whether you can afford the RL cash or not.
Fun to watch people that dont understand how Guild Wars gear works crying "P2W!"
The question as to wheather it's Pay to Win is not about getting gear.
It's about getting "advantage".
If (keyword is IF) I can gain an advantage(in any way) from CS that you didn't, then I paid to win.
There are two currencies in the game to players (not characters). Time and Real life money.
Since they have already stated that you can buy things with either there is no advantage of pay 2 win over the other unless you want to make the case that its unfair someone who spent 100 hours playing the game over fighting someone who is on hour 10.
Furthermore if it will became Pay2Win depends on what these so-called 'convenience' items will entail: if you can buy Guild and PvP vanity items WvW will become Pay2Win in WvW, because you can buy advantages for WvW with Guild and PvP vanity.
Another problem I have with this micro-transaction system is that in Guild Wars 1 the elite armor was only available to those people who wanted to spend time and effort on the game, although the elite amors stats weren't any better than normal end-game gear. The reason people still wanted to put that much effort in acquiring it was because it looked cool and they could distinguish themselves with it. With this system everyone can just buy the rare kind of armor with real money. The motivation for getting that kind of gear will be lessened because of this, because you can't see the difference between a player who has bought it with cash and a player who got the gear through working hard for it.
Hey buying Plex with in-game currency (isk) is what allows CCP to bloat how many subs and concurrent players they have!
CCP's success with EVE really chaps your ass, huh. I wouldn't let it get to ya, though, it's just a video game. With or without your oh so desired recognition and approval the game will continue to have a very healthy population.
Good luck.
Hey hey settle down sparky, no need to get all twisted and make things personal.
Jokes are jokes.
EVE Fanbois are the worst. They got spreadsheets.
(OK, don't get all in an uproar, it was just a joke. I wasn't serious but I couldn't resist either.)
Just play the game and make in game gold.If your then so vain you need that pirate hat then trade for gems and get it.
oo! this made me think of another similar system. Turbines LOTRO.. where you can buy shop items from achievement currency. The reason I thought of that is the whole content/dungeon issue I was talking to someone about, because in LOTRO you have to actually buy zones/quest packages. Now this is another extreme case because LOTRO is now F2P so obviously they are selling more than Anet will, but say you want to get that extra quest package they offer on the cash shop.. like the one they have for GW1. You can.. whether you can afford the RL cash or not.
If the game is good and I can save my gold I make just from having fun then can use it to buy things I have np with it at all.
I'm going to buy the game, and don't mind the system actually. I respectfully disagree, in fairness.
What the poster said does matter if you are PvE oriented and want to play the market. People who chose to spend money for gems will get gold up front and have crafting materials, or anything that can be traded quicker.
No, the gold is coming from other players, so somebody must have enough gold to be willing to sell it.
And when you earn your 1st 2-3 gold, and the next guy does too, and the 3rd guy as well, all agree to buy your mats from the guy who bought his from the cash shop...He now has hundreds of gold and you got........a few gold worth of mats.
buy what? materials... they never said they were selling mats and I doubt they will. You guys are REALLY stretching things now.
If you can sell mats on the AH, you can buy them with real money.
ok and that money is going to the guy in game that spent the time to farm up said mats. Which would have happened no matter what type of cash shop system they have. Besides I am sorry to whoever wants to do this but selling gems in the very start is pretty dumb, they cant sell for much because no one has much. Take Wakfu.. they have a pretty interesting economy.. game started out there isnt one in game currency ANYWHERE.. why? because you have to craft it. So in the first 2 weeks of the game barely ANYTHING sold for over 1 kama which is only 10 ore(you get 1-3 pre per vein). This is like pennies on what it will be in the future.. because in the future everyone has money.. oh also many if not all of their cash shop items are sellable on the AH.
what am I trying to say.. soryy got sidetracked but basically I am saying that the price of gems on the AH will flux with the game just like the price of mats on the vendor in GW1. It wont be an issue.
Actually, if you consider how inflation typically works in MMORPGs...the price of gems (gold per gem) will drastically INCREASE over time, because the "gold supply" will increase over time. In the beginning, gems will be relatively "cheap." But in a few months, they will be very expensive.
doubtful, because it has to be worth it or it will not sell. It will increase to a value point(remember the AH is ALL realms so with that many people making it stable it will be quite stable) and stay put once the market is stabilized. The gem price will always be relative to the amount of gold in the GW2 world. The amount of people spending money on gems wont change much after the first month or so, it will stay a steady ratio to number of players, just like the amount of gold will. There is no tiers of gear to try and achieve like in wow for a reason to spend the money. Gold will not increase as much as you think(at least I think that is what you meant) because people will want to buy influenece and such from the in game vendors. So the money will not be pooling in peoples bags and making the economy crappy.
Anyways, this is exactly how it was when TERA announced Chronoscrolls. Personally I'm not worried about its effects. Its very easy to consider all the potential harm this system could do. But as long as the actual items in the cash shop aren't crazily priced and dont give an advantage in game I think it could work.
This system primarily internalises the gold buying market so that bot farming doesn't become an issue. Thats all really. People who buy gold with RL money will find a means. This is just a more beneficial means to Anet thats all.
TLDR people over worrying.
Currently waiting for the MMO industry to put out something good.
Hey buying Plex with in-game currency (isk) is what allows CCP to bloat how many subs and concurrent players they have!
CCP's success with EVE really chaps your ass, huh. I wouldn't let it get to ya, though, it's just a video game. With or without your oh so desired recognition and approval the game will continue to have a very healthy population.
Good luck.
Hey hey settle down sparky, no need to get all twisted and make things personal.
Jokes are jokes.
EVE Fanbois are the worst. They got spreadsheets.
(OK, don't get all in an uproar, it was just a joke. I wasn't serious but I couldn't resist either.)
Anyways, this is exactly how it was when TERA announced Chronoscrolls. Personally I'm not worried about its effects. Its very easy to consider all the potential harm this system could do. But as long as the actual items in the cash shop aren't crazily priced and dont give an advantage in game I think it could work.
This system primarily internalises the gold buying market so that bot farming doesn't become an issue. Thats all really. People who buy gold with RL money will find a means. This is just a more beneficial means to Anet thats all.
TLDR people over worrying.
It actually makes bot farming very convenient, because they're ALLOWED to sell in game gold for cash. It will simply encourage them to undercut ANET and sell their gold for cheaper.
Wait so if the system is not finalized that only means...
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Anyways, this is exactly how it was when TERA announced Chronoscrolls. Personally I'm not worried about its effects. Its very easy to consider all the potential harm this system could do. But as long as the actual items in the cash shop aren't crazily priced and dont give an advantage in game I think it could work.
This system primarily internalises the gold buying market so that bot farming doesn't become an issue. Thats all really. People who buy gold with RL money will find a means. This is just a more beneficial means to Anet thats all.
TLDR people over worrying.
It actually makes bot farming very convenient, because they're ALLOWED to sell in game gold for cash. It will simply encourage them to undercut ANET and sell their gold for cheaper.
I'm going to buy the game, and don't mind the system actually. I respectfully disagree, in fairness.
What the poster said does matter if you are PvE oriented and want to play the market. People who chose to spend money for gems will get gold up front and have crafting materials, or anything that can be traded quicker.
No, the gold is coming from other players, so somebody must have enough gold to be willing to sell it.
And when you earn your 1st 2-3 gold, and the next guy does too, and the 3rd guy as well, all agree to buy your mats from the guy who bought his from the cash shop...He now has hundreds of gold and you got........a few gold worth of mats.
buy what? materials... they never said they were selling mats and I doubt they will. You guys are REALLY stretching things now.
If you can sell mats on the AH, you can buy them with real money.
ok and that money is going to the guy in game that spent the time to farm up said mats. Which would have happened no matter what type of cash shop system they have. Besides I am sorry to whoever wants to do this but selling gems in the very start is pretty dumb, they cant sell for much because no one has much. Take Wakfu.. they have a pretty interesting economy.. game started out there isnt one in game currency ANYWHERE.. why? because you have to craft it. So in the first 2 weeks of the game barely ANYTHING sold for over 1 kama which is only 10 ore(you get 1-3 pre per vein). This is like pennies on what it will be in the future.. because in the future everyone has money.. oh also many if not all of their cash shop items are sellable on the AH.
what am I trying to say.. soryy got sidetracked but basically I am saying that the price of gems on the AH will flux with the game just like the price of mats on the vendor in GW1. It wont be an issue.
Actually, if you consider how inflation typically works in MMORPGs...the price of gems (gold per gem) will drastically INCREASE over time, because the "gold supply" will increase over time. In the beginning, gems will be relatively "cheap." But in a few months, they will be very expensive.
doubtful, because it has to be worth it or it will not sell. It will increase to a value point(remember the AH is ALL realms so with that many people making it stable it will be quite stable) and stay put once the market is stabilized. The gem price will always be relative to the amount of gold in the GW2 world. The amount of people spending money on gems wont change much after the first month or so, it will stay a steady ratio to number of players, just like the amount of gold will. There is no tiers of gear to try and achieve like in wow for a reason to spend the money. Gold will not increase as much as you think(at least I think that is what you meant) because people will want to buy influenece and such from the in game vendors. So the money will not be pooling in peoples bags and making the economy crappy.
I think what's going to happen is that goods on the AH will ultimately be tied to their gold-equivalent value in real money. So a sword that sold for $10 today, will sell for $10 in 6 months. The difference will be that $10 will probably exchange for a wildly different (almost certainly higher) amount of gold in 6 months.
Moral of the story is...invest in gems .
If you want to get money in GW2, I would try to spend all your gold on gems early and then just hold onto them...they will likely appreciate quickly.
One important thing about the Guild Wars 2 item system, and this is true for Guild Wars 1 also, is we want people who are casual gamers, people who don't have a billion hours to play our game, to be able to get the most powerful items just like everybody else. If you just play through the game normally and complete the game, you should have the most powerful items in the game. The rare stuff, the prestige gear, is things that have unique looks to it, the armours that look super flashy. So if you just want to play our game and have a great time and you don't have a billion hours to dedicate, you can still be just as powerful as anybody else, you're just not gonna have as much of a prestige look type stuff as anybody.
The above is a from an interview Colin Johanson did with Gameovercast.
Furthermore
wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Armor
If people read that link, from what lilttle we know so far, armor can either be made by npcs( a gold sink) or crafted by other players or we can get RARE (the aforementioned FLASHY) armor from dungeon explorable modes. Given the fact that crafting profession can be changed with a quick trip to a nearby town and since resources nodes can be gathered from by everyone you end up being able to craft whatever you want. There are no STAT benefit to armor and wepons of the same level, only a AESTHETIC benefit which will be available to all. Take away message is: BEING ABLE TO BUY AND SELL GEMS WILL MEAN NOT ONE THING IN TERMS OF GEAR PROGRESSION.
Now comes the word conviences and that I agree is kind of ambigous. In GW1 convenience meant more storage tabs (somehting I never bought) ,more character slots (somehting I did buy) , bonus mission content (which I bought) and fluff social "dresses" (I bought a few and passed on the rest), as long as these and items in similar vein are what is on offer, gems are again not going to make this game pay 2 win. But I withhold judgement until more information on this aspect is made available.
Finally the thing that does scare me is what was mentioned earlier by someone in this thread that keep upgrades in WvWvW will be using money and yes this can make it Play 2 Win and I hope this is not the case because then Anet just lost a potential CE buyer.
If I led a big WvWvW pvp guild, the first thing I'd be doing is stocking up on gems, some as an investment for later in hopes prices go up, some to use as soon as the first botters...I mean players...offer gold on the market (As someone already pointed out, gem prices will probably go up, meaning gold sellers could directly trade their gold for gems at first and still expect to turn a profit later by exchanging them for more gold than they paid, then selling that gold directly to players willing to step outside the gem system).
Next I'd rush everyone to max level as fast as possible for the advantages having all skills gives. Even if it's only a small advantage, 50 people working together with that advantage against 50 who don't have it are going to have a very easy time of pvp. (Note: this is going to happen regardless of the currency system in game, it's just standard pvp guild behavior, but if in any way gems traded for gold quickens or eases the process, guilds will take advantage.)
Now my guild can buy siege engines and other pvp advantages with gold that I got, not by taking the time to farm it up as we leveled, but by trading it for gems bought with real money! Jackpot!
This scenario is disgraceful. If it's true that pvp equipment can be bought with gold, WvWvW will be all about wallet wars.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
Just play the game and make in game gold.If your then so vain you need that pirate hat then trade for gems and get it.
oo! this made me think of another similar system. Turbines LOTRO.. where you can buy shop items from achievement currency. The reason I thought of that is the whole content/dungeon issue I was talking to someone about, because in LOTRO you have to actually buy zones/quest packages. Now this is another extreme case because LOTRO is now F2P so obviously they are selling more than Anet will, but say you want to get that extra quest package they offer on the cash shop.. like the one they have for GW1. You can.. whether you can afford the RL cash or not.
If the game is good and I can save my gold I make just from having fun then can use it to buy things I have np with it at all.
Thats one of the big points a lot of people are missing. This makes it fair to everyone. YES there is a cash shop, but now you can still play completely free and just sell your in game earnings for cash shop credits instead of spending real $. Some of us have lot of time and no money, some of us have lots of money but not as much time, and some are in the middle. Thgis helps balance evrything for everyone. Those with time can play free, those with money can spend it instead of time, and either way the end result is the same.
This isnt the first time its been done. In fact even RoM (Runes of Magic) had a similar system (until they got greedy and went pure CS), and even Rohan had their exchange market where players could sell items and even entire characters for cash shop credits. Ive been bringing those 2 up for years and hoping more F2P games would adopt this method instead of pure cash shops. The fact that GW2 is going this route with their cash shop is an even bigger bonus.
Just play the game and make in game gold.If your then so vain you need that pirate hat then trade for gems and get it.
oo! this made me think of another similar system. Turbines LOTRO.. where you can buy shop items from achievement currency. The reason I thought of that is the whole content/dungeon issue I was talking to someone about, because in LOTRO you have to actually buy zones/quest packages. Now this is another extreme case because LOTRO is now F2P so obviously they are selling more than Anet will, but say you want to get that extra quest package they offer on the cash shop.. like the one they have for GW1. You can.. whether you can afford the RL cash or not.
If the game is good and I can save my gold I make just from having fun then can use it to buy things I have np with it at all.
Thats one of the big points a lot of people are missing. This makes it fair to everyone. YES there is a cash shop, but now you can still play completely free and just sell your in game earnings for cash shop credits instead of spending real $. Some of us have lot of time and no money, some of us have lots of money but not as much time, and some are in the middle. Thgis helps balance evrything for everyone. Those with time can play free, those with money can spend it instead of time, and either way the end result is the same.
This isnt the first time its been done. In fact even RoM (Runes of Magic) had a similar system (until they got greedy and went pure CS), and even Rohan had their exchange market where players could sell items and even entire characters for cash shop credits. Ive been bringing those 2 up for years and hoping more F2P games would adopt this method instead of pure cash shops. The fact that GW2 is going this route with their cash shop is an even bigger bonus.
Some would make you feel dirty and evil for that! You need to stop spending time with your family and job and play for 8 hours a day like an MMO is meant to be played!
Comments
ok and that money is going to the guy in game that spent the time to farm up said mats. Which would have happened no matter what type of cash shop system they have. Besides I am sorry to whoever wants to do this but selling gems in the very start is pretty dumb, they cant sell for much because no one has much. Take Wakfu.. they have a pretty interesting economy.. game started out there isnt one in game currency ANYWHERE.. why? because you have to craft it. So in the first 2 weeks of the game barely ANYTHING sold for over 1 kama which is only 10 ore(you get 1-3 pre per vein). This is like pennies on what it will be in the future.. because in the future everyone has money.. oh also many if not all of their cash shop items are sellable on the AH.
what am I trying to say.. soryy got sidetracked but basically I am saying that the price of gems on the AH will flux with the game just like the price of mats on the vendor in GW1. It wont be an issue.
Just play the game and make in game gold.If your then so vain you need that pirate hat then trade for gems and get it.
The straight up answer is , not a chance.
Pay to speed up gameplay maybe, but since end game is a non issue, its like speeding to a red light.
no because you can go out and get the same items in game easily.
I played EVE, if that's what you're asking. No multi accounts, no multiboxing, didn't even buy a single PLEX. Found a nice corp, nice players, played the game and had lots of fun.
That's the baseline people are completely ignoring in this whole discussion. If the game is fun to play out of the box, the cash shop completely loses its raison d'ètre. If I enjoy playing the game, why would I ever pay additional money to play less of it?
Hey hey settle down sparky, no need to get all twisted and make things personal.
Jokes are jokes.
Actually, if you consider how inflation typically works in MMORPGs...the price of gems (gold per gem) will drastically INCREASE over time, because the "gold supply" will increase over time. In the beginning, gems will be relatively "cheap." But in a few months, they will be very expensive.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
Okay, so let's say GW2 has DLC every month (already too often imo!). For unsavory or perfectly legitimate reasons, a certain percentage of the playerbase (gold farmers, botters, hackers, kids) have no credit card tied to their account and do not wish to or cannot obtain prepay cards on a regular basis. Maybe they had enough money to buy the box and that's it.
So those players' money is lost. Ah, but wait! Not if other players are willing to fund their DLC purchases in exchange for ingame currency!
This benefits the hell out of NCSoft/Anet, no one is going to argue that. It benefits the hell out of people who can somehow get their hands on the box but can't or won't obtain later content with their CC or a prepaid card.
I've yet to see how it will stop gold sellers (who will always play a game of botting up gold, then undercutting the current diamond prices by just a wee bit while also cheerfully stealing accounts as they have always done).
I have yet to see how this will benefit someone who does not intend to use their wallet to buy ingame currency but who can and will use their wallet to buy DLC they like the looks of.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
oo! this made me think of another similar system. Turbines LOTRO.. where you can buy shop items from achievement currency. The reason I thought of that is the whole content/dungeon issue I was talking to someone about, because in LOTRO you have to actually buy zones/quest packages. Now this is another extreme case because LOTRO is now F2P so obviously they are selling more than Anet will, but say you want to get that extra quest package they offer on the cash shop.. like the one they have for GW1. You can.. whether you can afford the RL cash or not.
There are two currencies in the game to players (not characters). Time and Real life money.
Since they have already stated that you can buy things with either there is no advantage of pay 2 win over the other unless you want to make the case that its unfair someone who spent 100 hours playing the game over fighting someone who is on hour 10.
So basically gems will become the new ectos.
Furthermore if it will became Pay2Win depends on what these so-called 'convenience' items will entail: if you can buy Guild and PvP vanity items WvW will become Pay2Win in WvW, because you can buy advantages for WvW with Guild and PvP vanity.
Another problem I have with this micro-transaction system is that in Guild Wars 1 the elite armor was only available to those people who wanted to spend time and effort on the game, although the elite amors stats weren't any better than normal end-game gear. The reason people still wanted to put that much effort in acquiring it was because it looked cool and they could distinguish themselves with it. With this system everyone can just buy the rare kind of armor with real money. The motivation for getting that kind of gear will be lessened because of this, because you can't see the difference between a player who has bought it with cash and a player who got the gear through working hard for it.
EVE Fanbois are the worst. They got spreadsheets.
(OK, don't get all in an uproar, it was just a joke. I wasn't serious but I couldn't resist either.)
lol---see, I'm smiling when I said that.
If the game is good and I can save my gold I make just from having fun then can use it to buy things I have np with it at all.
doubtful, because it has to be worth it or it will not sell. It will increase to a value point(remember the AH is ALL realms so with that many people making it stable it will be quite stable) and stay put once the market is stabilized. The gem price will always be relative to the amount of gold in the GW2 world. The amount of people spending money on gems wont change much after the first month or so, it will stay a steady ratio to number of players, just like the amount of gold will. There is no tiers of gear to try and achieve like in wow for a reason to spend the money. Gold will not increase as much as you think(at least I think that is what you meant) because people will want to buy influenece and such from the in game vendors. So the money will not be pooling in peoples bags and making the economy crappy.
Wow over 250 posts!
Anyways, this is exactly how it was when TERA announced Chronoscrolls. Personally I'm not worried about its effects. Its very easy to consider all the potential harm this system could do. But as long as the actual items in the cash shop aren't crazily priced and dont give an advantage in game I think it could work.
This system primarily internalises the gold buying market so that bot farming doesn't become an issue. Thats all really. People who buy gold with RL money will find a means. This is just a more beneficial means to Anet thats all.
TLDR people over worrying.
Y U NO SPREADSHEET
It actually makes bot farming very convenient, because they're ALLOWED to sell in game gold for cash. It will simply encourage them to undercut ANET and sell their gold for cheaper.
Wait so if the system is not finalized that only means...
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Im not sure how you could bot farm this game.
I think what's going to happen is that goods on the AH will ultimately be tied to their gold-equivalent value in real money. So a sword that sold for $10 today, will sell for $10 in 6 months. The difference will be that $10 will probably exchange for a wildly different (almost certainly higher) amount of gold in 6 months.
Moral of the story is...invest in gems
.
If you want to get money in GW2, I would try to spend all your gold on gems early and then just hold onto them...they will likely appreciate quickly.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
One important thing about the Guild Wars 2 item system, and this is true for Guild Wars 1 also, is we want people who are casual gamers, people who don't have a billion hours to play our game, to be able to get the most powerful items just like everybody else. If you just play through the game normally and complete the game, you should have the most powerful items in the game. The rare stuff, the prestige gear, is things that have unique looks to it, the armours that look super flashy. So if you just want to play our game and have a great time and you don't have a billion hours to dedicate, you can still be just as powerful as anybody else, you're just not gonna have as much of a prestige look type stuff as anybody.
The above is a from an interview Colin Johanson did with Gameovercast.
Furthermore
wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Armor
If people read that link, from what lilttle we know so far, armor can either be made by npcs( a gold sink) or crafted by other players or we can get RARE (the aforementioned FLASHY) armor from dungeon explorable modes. Given the fact that crafting profession can be changed with a quick trip to a nearby town and since resources nodes can be gathered from by everyone you end up being able to craft whatever you want. There are no STAT benefit to armor and wepons of the same level, only a AESTHETIC benefit which will be available to all. Take away message is: BEING ABLE TO BUY AND SELL GEMS WILL MEAN NOT ONE THING IN TERMS OF GEAR PROGRESSION.
Now comes the word conviences and that I agree is kind of ambigous. In GW1 convenience meant more storage tabs (somehting I never bought) ,more character slots (somehting I did buy) , bonus mission content (which I bought) and fluff social "dresses" (I bought a few and passed on the rest), as long as these and items in similar vein are what is on offer, gems are again not going to make this game pay 2 win. But I withhold judgement until more information on this aspect is made available.
Finally the thing that does scare me is what was mentioned earlier by someone in this thread that keep upgrades in WvWvW will be using money and yes this can make it Play 2 Win and I hope this is not the case because then Anet just lost a potential CE buyer.
That it's already something different than what people were expecting.
Some are more ok with it than others.
If I led a big WvWvW pvp guild, the first thing I'd be doing is stocking up on gems, some as an investment for later in hopes prices go up, some to use as soon as the first botters...I mean players...offer gold on the market (As someone already pointed out, gem prices will probably go up, meaning gold sellers could directly trade their gold for gems at first and still expect to turn a profit later by exchanging them for more gold than they paid, then selling that gold directly to players willing to step outside the gem system).
Next I'd rush everyone to max level as fast as possible for the advantages having all skills gives. Even if it's only a small advantage, 50 people working together with that advantage against 50 who don't have it are going to have a very easy time of pvp. (Note: this is going to happen regardless of the currency system in game, it's just standard pvp guild behavior, but if in any way gems traded for gold quickens or eases the process, guilds will take advantage.)
Now my guild can buy siege engines and other pvp advantages with gold that I got, not by taking the time to farm it up as we leveled, but by trading it for gems bought with real money! Jackpot!
This scenario is disgraceful. If it's true that pvp equipment can be bought with gold, WvWvW will be all about wallet wars.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
Thats one of the big points a lot of people are missing. This makes it fair to everyone. YES there is a cash shop, but now you can still play completely free and just sell your in game earnings for cash shop credits instead of spending real $. Some of us have lot of time and no money, some of us have lots of money but not as much time, and some are in the middle. Thgis helps balance evrything for everyone. Those with time can play free, those with money can spend it instead of time, and either way the end result is the same.
This isnt the first time its been done. In fact even RoM (Runes of Magic) had a similar system (until they got greedy and went pure CS), and even Rohan had their exchange market where players could sell items and even entire characters for cash shop credits. Ive been bringing those 2 up for years and hoping more F2P games would adopt this method instead of pure cash shops. The fact that GW2 is going this route with their cash shop is an even bigger bonus.
Some would make you feel dirty and evil for that! You need to stop spending time with your family and job and play for 8 hours a day like an MMO is meant to be played!