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Originally posted by palulalula Well it will be good but not so good as swtor, because of boring same fantasy world we saw 1000 of times. Ii is nothing new like eve online was when they started. Just another theme park like rift. It is made for same 100k fans of first gw, hentai, manga characters and strange walking creatures. In fact it is made for Asian market
I'm starting to think that you've never played an asian MMO in your life given how little you seem to know about the aesthetic. You're flapping your wings but you're not flying. Try again.
I have a hard time responding to someone who claims he plays EvE but was shocked by the fact the Goons were scamming people for recruitment, then wanted a all out war against them. So I will respond with that comment, can't take you seriously.
Here is his link btw, actually it is a funny read, so naive :P
I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY DON'T HAVE FISHING! This game is ruined now.
WTF Anet no fishing?
These inflamatory thread titles are such a desperate attempt for attention.
Just move on. Eve and Darkfall is there for you.
Maybe I'm wrong.... but doesn't GW2 already HAVE parts 2 and 3?
You can build structures and defend them (seen this in WvWvW. You can't build castles, unfortunately, but you can build sieges and such)
And also PvP IS of central importance. Again, we saw this in WvWvW, you're entire server benefits from the outcome of the WvWvW matches.
The only other thing mentioned is having everyone on the same server. I'm not sure what reality the OP lives in, but MMOs haven't had everyone on a single server, since they started attracting more than 100 players at a time.
I'm honestly not sure if this is a really bad attempt at trolling, or not.
I agree with op about 2. and 3. but don't really care about 1. Since there will be 3 servers fighting each other and then after 2 weeks willl get teamed against others, i think you can get your fame this way too.
Originally posted by Alot GW2 doesn't need any of those features, it isn't a sandbox type of MMORPG. It is a themepark, like successful MMORPGs such as Rift, SW:TOR and WOW.
PvP has absolutely nothing to do with Sandbox or Themepark. Neither does the one server thing.
Originally posted by Distaste Originally posted by RameiArashi PVP is the least important part. I'm so sick of you PVP elitest,
Actually it is quite important. The majority of MMO players won't play a MMO unless it incorporates PvP in some form. Go look up PvP vs PvE polls and you'll see that a lot more people want PvP than you think.
And we would have to see these polls. Who is being polled? What demographic?
If one were to take the general thrust of this website one might make some very interesting conclusions. Except that everyone I've met who was an mmo gamer and who I didn't personally know seems to refute a lot of what is always posted on this site.
It's important to know how these polls are worded and who is answering them.
edit: I would also agree that ffa pvp is not needed for a sandbox game just as battleground pvp is not needed to make a game themepark.
Sandbox and Themepark speak to how the players approach the game world. Taking one aspect away might make "one less game play choice" but in this case it doesn't drastically alter how a player is supposed to approach the world.
Themepark you "show up" for the content and the devs have crafted the experience for you. Sandbox you decide, given what is capable of being done, what you will do.
Originally posted by aesperus Maybe I'm wrong.... but doesn't GW2 already HAVE parts 2 and 3? You can build structures and defend them (seen this in WvWvW. You can't build castles, unfortunately, but you can build sieges and such) And also PvP IS of central importance. Again, we saw this in WvWvW, you're entire server benefits from the outcome of the WvWvW matches. The only other thing mentioned is having everyone on the same server. I'm not sure what reality the OP lives in, but MMOs haven't had everyone on a single server, since they started attracting more than 100 players at a time. I'm honestly not sure if this is a really bad attempt at trolling, or not.
Eve has all players on the same server (not physical server but that is not what the OP said). They all share the same world.
As for PvP being central in GW 2, I doubt it. For sure it will be bigger than in SW:TOR but still it feels to me that the PvE will be the central feature with a strong, optional, PvP component. For sure, most articles I have read so far has been more about PvE than PvP.
Originally posted by Bigdaddyx Originally posted by ComfyChair Originally posted by Bigdaddyx I don't think OP is advocating another sandbox..Atleast thats what i didn't get from his post. He is just asking for more player interactive features like structure building in game.
Which is inherently incompatible with themepark games. Housing and guild halls that are instanced are fine, but you can't go building houses in a themepark MMO.
Only because it hasn't been done in themepark MMOS doesn't mean it is not possible.
i was going to say the same thing. Structure building is NOT inherently incompatible with themepark MMOs. If the game engine can create it, we can have it. Just need the right developers to mix the recipes with successful results.
Sandboxes have been very successful. They offered a lot of highly replayble content in the past. Ohh wait... they offered a lot less content than most themeparks and people were bored super quickly with them. Yep, you're right, sandboxes are definitely games which you play for a looooooooooooong time. Games like WOW, EQ2, LOTRO offer you only 1 month worth of content and then you're done...Even if that was the case they would still offer more content than your average sandbox MMO.
Sandbox seems to have turned into a term relating to some idealised MMO which is supposed to be the way MMOs are played. Too bad that was never put to practice.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Originally posted by Mors.Magne I believe that GW2 is lacking the three features that keep players coming back for years, namely: Someone probably already said it but... 1) Everyone should be on the same server, so players have the chance to become real famous legends amongst other players. Your characters will have unique names across all servers. You can move from server to server freely, or much more easily than is the norm in mmos so far. Additionally, the competetive PvP part of the game is completely divorced from servers... It's like an online FPS. There is nothing stopping you from becoming a special and unique avalanche on a global level. 2) Everyone should be able to build structures in-game. This makes the place feel like a home, and gives you something tangible to build, defend, and attack. Guild Halls are coming up soon. It's been mentioned as probably the first thing to come in expansions/updates. Individual housing has also been mentioned but it's not 100% confirmed like guild halls. 3) PvP should be of central importance - As clever human beings, we eventually learn all about a game's AI, but there is nothing quite like a human opponent - we can be brilliant, stupid, and unpredictable. See #1 Also you have WvW (Look it up). I'd happily pay a monthly sub just for the WvW part of the game. I believe that the (marketing) hype is too strong. GW2 will turn out to be another SWTOR - initially impressive, but lacking once the theme-park rides have been done. If you don't agree with me, I would love to hear your arguments and be convinced otherwise.
That's pretty much it. Any more gripes? Let's talk about something more real like... dunno, lack of foliage in WvW areas (I would really fancy some jungle warfare TBH) and the rumours about no direct trading between characters.
Originally posted by Distaste Originally posted by davestr1zl Originally posted by korent1991 Originally posted by Mors.Magne 2) Everyone should be able to build structures in-game. This makes the place feel like a home, and gives you something tangible to build, defend, and attack.
2) No, then the game wouldn't be a theme-park would be? But you'll have your own guild hall in which you can add what you like (from what's offered ofc) and if they decide to add guild hall battles then you'll use that hall to fight against other guilds which challange yours.
Why would it instantly stop being a theme park? Why do you (and others) keep talking about the ability to build housing/structures like its the sole factor that determines whether or not a game is a 'theme park' or a 'sandbox'. Both genres are perfectly capable of supporting such a feature, and (if done well) it would be a great addition to most/all mmo's.
Because a decent housing system requires sandbox elements. In order to allow everyone to build houses they will need to add a lot of landmass. This landmass would be so big that it would probably need to just be randomly generated. It would also be so large that it would take far too long to include content along with it, plus housing could ruin content(a big house right where the boss spawns). So now you have a big area devoid of any real content and people are building houses. What reason is there to go there? All the loot drops in dungeons or from vendors, so it isn't like there are shops to visit. There is no PvP there because that takes place in the Mysts/instances, so there are no forts/bases to capture. Now do you see the problem?
Themepark MMO's are too simplified and dev content driven to include a decent housing system. As soon as you start making things more player driven then guess what? You're in sandbox territory.
Was about to write a reply and then I saw Distaste already did it for me.
Sums up what I wanted to say.
Maybe adding some instanced version of your home could be a solution to people who want to build something for them selves. Not sure how it would work and all, didn't think it trough, but allowing people to just build random stuff anywhere in the world opens up millions of new problems for players and the devs.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life."-------------------------------
Originally posted by Mors.Magne I believe that GW2 is lacking the three features that keep players coming back for years, namely: 1) Everyone should be on the same server, so players have the chance to become real famous legends amongst other players. 2) Everyone should be able to build structures in-game. This makes the place feel like a home, and gives you something tangible to build, defend, and attack. 3) PvP should be of central importance - As clever human beings, we eventually learn all about a game's AI, but there is nothing quite like a human opponent - we can be brilliant, stupid, and unpredictable. I believe that the (marketing) hype is too strong. GW2 will turn out to be another SWTOR - initially impressive, but lacking once the theme-park rides have been done. If you don't agree with me, I would love to hear your arguments and be convinced otherwise.
I hope you do not believe what you have just posted.
The fallacy of your entire argument is that:
1) Most mmorpgs have more than one server. Players located far away from servers will be at a dissadvantage. Every server will have its limit. The alternative developers use is to make multiple channels in one server, which ruins the mmo part of the genre. World vs World pvp cannot exist if only one server is present. The best games find the best balance between population and size of world. Im sorry that didnt occur to you.
2) World of Warcraft didnt and if im not mistaken still does nothave buildable structures. Seems to be its been going on strong for years and shows no sign of dying out. In fact, most of the popular long term mmorpgs do not have buildable structures. While they are nice if the game is designed for it, it is not neccessary for a game to be successful, nor is it neccessary for it to be a good game. Fact is, games without it are doing better and are often more fun than the ones with it, which are few and in between. You cannot escape this reality and your argument is invalid because of it. You also forget the Guild Wars business model exists on the concept of releasing expansion packs as opposed to monthly fee's. Each Xpack usually comes with new features and content.
3) PVP cannot be the primary mechanic of a game, lest you might as well turn it into Counter Strike or some other fps game.
Design 101, rulesets create limitations which create challenges which when mixed with the rpg genre, create development of player and character which then result in emotional response. To do this you need content that is not soley based on pvp but a mixture of both. PvE is a form of pvp though, in case you didnt realize it. Its player vs player in the sense that you are competing in developing your character alongside or with the peers that share your server.
The ultimate goal of any rpg is character development. What we call PvE is the ultimate tool for that, the PvP is the testing of that development and the confirmation it does well. It is also the power to play at your own pace when necessary. That said, you forget that Guild Wars not only has multiple pvp elements such as battlegrounds, but also a massive map in which 3 servers and their guilds fight eachother, obtain bases and resources and seige castles with buildable seige weapons.
PvP is a core element, but one on par, balanced with the necessary player vs environment in which the player and character need to exist and grow. Games like this are made to be successful, not some small niche in which 200k people end up playing a year later. Sorry but pvp only rpgs are not successful. Its just a fact.
OP's comments don't fit the game, and he should try another one.
I did laugh @ someone's post that said "an MMO can't be successful without fishing".
As someone who loves and prefers a good sandbox game, I couldn't disagree more with the OP. Would I love to see in-world housing? Sure I would, but I certianly don't expect to see it in a themepark game. Apparently he hasn't read about how epic the PvP is going to be in this game either.
A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.
The only thing that could keep me away from this game atm, would be Bioware improving SWTOR by alot in 3-4months, GW2 servers being crap (since it is NCSOFT = AION was theirs i think), and the confirmation of no keybinds on a pvp mmo.
Originally posted by Kidon The only thing that could keep me away from this game atm, would be Bioware improving SWTOR by alot in 3-4months, GW2 servers being crap (since it is NCSOFT = AION was theirs i think), and the confirmation of no keybinds on a pvp mmo.
Aion servers werent bad, and GW1 servers are pretty good
"I am not a robot. I am a unicorn."
I think you need to find other game....
They want millinos of players coming back for years. What you are asking for is only needed by thousands
Im sure ts been pointed out, but:
I hail from the glory days of Dark Age of Camelot. Naturally, I support your post. I keep hoping that I will peruse these forums and hear of an in depth medieval mmorpg project with real political/religious/cultural separation between races - just as it would be. Games these days are fantasy version of gang bangery, or just two copy paste factions, or as in GW2, just the same Age of Conan model, where the same 5 races fight the same 5 races. This is laziness and lack of inventiveness on the part of the genre as a whole, or, it's done this way because a company would rather spend less time and talent, aim for a mass audience, and market to the Asian market ASAP.
Guild Wars 2 is targeting an audience that you are NOT part of, get over it and move on. There will be other companies/games that will target your style of play ArenaNet's Guild Wars 2 is not one of them. It's like complaining an RPG doesn't have enough FPS so it's going to "fail" and this is simply not true. Guild Wars has an audience and changing the game to the above will alienate that fan base.
The game you might be looking for is called ArcheAge but don't expect that to release in the next couple of years. Until then there is EvE or better yet (as they are closer to what you mentioned above) Mortal Online or Darkfall.
Because flying a Minmatar ship is like going down a flight of stairs on an office chair while firing an Uzi.