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"Player Bounties" - Every PvP Server should have 'em.

DauzqulDauzqul Detroit, MIPosts: 1,406Member Uncommon

The thought of hunting down a known griefer is intriguing; the thrill of the hunt is intoxicating.

World PvP has earned its bad name due to constant lowbie ganking/griefing. It's obvious that certain sanctions must be placed in order to protect lowbies. These sanctions must be extremely harsh if they are to deter players from 1-2 shotting lowbies or murdering other players of their own faction.

 

I think it's about time that we get a working Player Bounty System for our PvP Servers:



  1. If a player ganks x-amount of lowbies, then he or she will be automatically placed on the Player Bounty Terminal (unless lowbie attacks first).


  2. If a player ganks x-amount of players from his or her own faction, then he or she will be automatically placed on the Player Bounty Terminal (unless attacked first).


  3. These sanctions need to be harsh. If you accept a Bounty Mission and hunt/kill your target, then your target will drop all of his gear/gold. If the target is wielding "no-trade" or "soulbound" items, then these items should either be destroyed or rendered useless for 3 days.


  4. The "Bounty Flag" will remain for 3 days...regardless if the target has been "collected". This is to prevent friends or "second account" from removing the flag.


  5. The Player Bounty System doesn't provide any financial rewards. The reward is the gold/gear that you get from your fallen target. Maybe a title system perhaps, but nothing worth trying to exploit.


It's stuff like this that adds to end-game and sustain. Bring it on!


 




 

Comments

  • YamotaYamota LondonPosts: 6,620Member

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

  • MajinashMajinash st louis, MOPosts: 1,320Member

    Lineage2's flagging system worked just fine, if anything it was a bit too harsh back when the game first launched.

     

    But any kind of bounty system WILL be exploited.  Either a bounty will be too low and no one will bother, or the bounty will reach a point where a person will let one of their friends kill them just to split the reward.

    Everything creates huge amounts of negativity on the internet, that's what the internet is for: Negativity, porn and lolcats.

  • DauzqulDauzqul Detroit, MIPosts: 1,406Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    The automatic system won't provide any reward. The reward comes from when the flagged player drops all of his goods.

  • DauzqulDauzqul Detroit, MIPosts: 1,406Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Majinash

    Lineage2's flagging system worked just fine, if anything it was a bit too harsh back when the game first launched.

     

    But any kind of bounty system WILL be exploited.  Either a bounty will be too low and no one will bother, or the bounty will reach a point where a person will let one of their friends kill them just to split the reward.

    This is the problem when posting pictures: nobody reads the text :P

  • CeridithCeridith Toronto, ONPosts: 2,980Member

    The only way I see player bounties working is:



    1. Bounties can only be placed on characters that have commited a "grievous" act against another "innocent" player. The most common would be unprovoked killing of a player who had not way of defending themselves.


    2. If a bounty is executed and collected, the character the bounty was on receives a stat or experience-loss penalty, scaling with the amount of the bounty. This prevents friends of the offender from collecting the bounty with no other reprecussion, and results in impactful penalties for the offender.

  • AxehiltAxehilt San Francisco, CAPosts: 8,743Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by mmoDAD

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    The automatic system won't provide any reward. The reward comes from when the flagged player drops all of his goods.

    Which is what happens when they both agree to let the guy's friend kill him...

    "Joe stated his case logically and passionately, but his perceived effeminate voice only drew big gales of stupid laughter..." -Idiocracy
    "There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance." -Socrates

  • DauzqulDauzqul Detroit, MIPosts: 1,406Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Axehilt

    Originally posted by mmoDAD

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    The automatic system won't provide any reward. The reward comes from when the flagged player drops all of his goods.

    Which is what happens when they both agree to let the guy's friend kill him...

    If you had read the original post, you would've understood that the "flag" is on a timer and not removed when killed.

  • CuathonCuathon University City, NYPosts: 2,211Member

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    The only way I see player bounties working is:



    1. Bounties can only be placed on characters that have commited a "grievous" act against another "innocent" player. The most common would be unprovoked killing of a player who had not way of defending themselves.


    2. If a bounty is executed and collected, the character the bounty was on receives a stat or experience-loss penalty, scaling with the amount of the bounty. This prevents friends of the offender from collecting the bounty with no other reprecussion, and results in impactful penalties for the offender.

    This is actually a really good system. I am not a huge fan of controlled PvP but if I played a game with it, I would like to see this feature.

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,668Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by mmoDAD

    Originally posted by Axehilt


    Originally posted by mmoDAD


    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    The automatic system won't provide any reward. The reward comes from when the flagged player drops all of his goods.

    Which is what happens when they both agree to let the guy's friend kill him...

    If you had read the original post, you would've understood that the "flag" is on a timer and not removed when killed.

    Basically like the murder count system in UO.

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • SolarstrikerSolarstriker Odense NVPosts: 26Member Uncommon

    deleted..

  • DisdenaDisdena Troy, NYPosts: 1,093Member

    "Players on a PvP server ________ kill players who are significantly weaker than them."

    Fill in the blank with either should or should not.



    • If players should freely kill players who are weaker than them, what need is there for a deterrant? The whole point of playing the game is to hang out in a world where people are free to fight each other. The people who pick fights they can't possibly lose are still playing the game in a valid way. In an FPS, whether it's a FFA arena, a team deathmatch, or a team objective-based game, you wouldn't dream of punishing someone for using a sniper rifle to kill another player who only had a pistol. The point of the game is to kill other people; if you see another person, you kill them and get rewarded. Open PvP games are slightly different in that you're not explicitly given the goal of killing other players, but it's basically the reason why you're there.


    • If players should not freely kill players who are weaker than them, why allow it at all? In order for this bounty system to work, the game must explicitly define what it means to "gank a lowbie" so that it can count how many times it happens. Once a definition has been settled on, why allow it to happen at all? The game can identify when someone attempts to gank a lowbie, and simply say "No, you can't do that." What excuse is there for creating a system for players to do something they should not be doing? It's like telling players they can't AFK craft with a macro, and then deliberately putting in a menu for creating craft macros. It's like telling players they can't stand on a ledge and fire upon non-ranged mobs below them, then deliberately making tons of ledges with non-ranged mobs below them. If you know the behavior is undesired and you can identify it and you can prevent it 100% of the time, why let it happen in the first place?


     


    Of course, regardless of which way you feel, it should be pretty obvious that a bounty system like this would fail at what it's trying to do. It's trying to provide a disincentive to griefing. A bounty system can't accomplish this because:


    1. Griefers thrive on notoriety. It's the main reason they do what they do. A notice that tells you you've killed enough lowbies to warrant a bounty might as well be a frigging achievement to griefers.


    2. Someone is playing an Open PvP game where the whole point is to engage in PvP, and the fact that some people are actively tracking them down is supposed to be a punishment? Seriously? Being the hunted is no less intoxicating than being the hunter.


    3. You don't NEED good gear in order to destroy people 20 levels below you, and you don't GET good gear by destroying people 20 levels below you. If there are people in the game who care about having really awesome gear, they're not the ones who are griefing. As long as the punishment for bounty death is merely loss of items, it's irrelevant to griefers.


    And finally, making griefing a part of the rules instantly justifies it. Imagine walking into a casino and seeing a notice by the poker tables that says "If you are caught cheating, you lose the hand and add an extra $100 to your next ante." This is literally a written invitation to cheat! Rather than being told that it's against the rules, you're told that there are rules to handle how it works. I see this bounty system in exactly the same light. It is a message straight from the developers, saying "Yes you are supposed to grief defenseless lowbies—we put in some rules to handle how it works."

    image
  • myrmxmyrmx ste-catherine, QCPosts: 93Member

    Everytime i hear this feature i keep feeling like people just want a easy way to scam people ... As if you could in anyway put a bounty on someone and not tempt the person with the bounty to simply self collect it. there is no way to block such a scenario from happening , the only one would be to play hardcore perma death games where it would be impossible to put a bounty in the first place since the victim has been long dead.

  • CeridithCeridith Toronto, ONPosts: 2,980Member

    Originally posted by myrmx

    Everytime i hear this feature i keep feeling like people just want a easy way to scam people ... As if you could in anyway put a bounty on someone and not tempt the person with the bounty to simply self collect it. there is no way to block such a scenario from happening , the only one would be to play hardcore perma death games where it would be impossible to put a bounty in the first place since the victim has been long dead.

    Actually there is a way to block bounty scamming.

    Make bounties incur stat/experience loss that scales with the size of the bounty. Sure they or their friends could collect on their own... provided they're willing to re-level their characters.

    Of course, bounties should only be placeable on characters that are actually going after "innocent" players unprovoked.

    And if stat/experience loss is too much for the offenders to bear, then maybe they could have the opporunity to pay off their own bounty... with the proceeds going straight to the person who placed the bounty on them.

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common

    If you have go into extremes in order to disincentivize ganking lowbies, why allow it in the first place?

     

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • eowdaoceowdaoc Wyeoming, WYPosts: 27Member

    Placing a "WANTED" bounty thing on someone for slaughtering lowbies implies that slaughtering lowbies is morally wrong.

     

    Not sure if I agree there. :) 

  • UnshraUnshra Hanover, MDPosts: 382Member

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    This is how it works in EvE if you don't have an alt account then just get a friend you trust to pod you and share the isk.

    image
    Because flying a Minmatar ship is like going down a flight of stairs on an office chair while firing an Uzi.

  • MajinashMajinash st louis, MOPosts: 1,320Member
    Originally posted by mmoDAD


    Originally posted by Majinash

    Lineage2's flagging system worked just fine, if anything it was a bit too harsh back when the game first launched.
     
    But any kind of bounty system WILL be exploited.  Either a bounty will be too low and no one will bother, or the bounty will reach a point where a person will let one of their friends kill them just to split the reward.

    This is the problem when posting pictures: nobody reads the text :P

     

    I read the post just fine, the idea just isn't very good, and the use of the word "bounty" is silly unless their is some type of reward. If you just want players to drop their gear when they PK people, go play Lineage2, they've had a system that does this for what... 8-9 years?

    Everything creates huge amounts of negativity on the internet, that's what the internet is for: Negativity, porn and lolcats.

  • Mythios11Mythios11 Paterson, NJPosts: 129Member

    I played a Bounty Hunter in SWG (Pre-NGE) and player bounties were by far my favorite.   I would certainly welcome this game play feature in a new MMO

  • ZBergzZBergz Clifton Park, NYPosts: 20Member
    While I do agree a game involving pvp gameplay would be wise to incorporate a bounty system, it must be a set of rules which drives the game play you are looking for. The system outlined by the op is incomplete at best and would encourage gameplay far removed from the spirit of what the op wishes to accomplish.
  • Drama24-7Drama24-7 New York, NYPosts: 36Member

    I would like a mechanism in the game where you put money up to have someone PK'ed, and anyone can offer the bounty, for any amount, for any reason, no restrictions.

    But, that's too real for most game companies because they want all the subs from the same people who would whine and moan over such a bounty system as being a griefing system. And, of course, it would be a griefing system, an awesome one.

  • DibdabsDibdabs FelvershamPosts: 2,604Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    Yep, this happens.  I've seen it time and again in Eve where gullible but irate people put a bounty on guy A, then guy A's pal (lets be creative and call him guy B) takes him out and they happily split the bounty (or bounties) that all the suckers put up.  Next day, guy B goes out and ganks people to get a bounty on his head and then rinse and repeat.

  • LeegOfChldrnLeegOfChldrn Jcakson, MSPosts: 364Member

    Originally posted by Majinash

    Lineage2's flagging system worked just fine, if anything it was a bit too harsh back when the game first launched.

     

    But any kind of bounty system WILL be exploited.  Either a bounty will be too low and no one will bother, or the bounty will reach a point where a person will let one of their friends kill them just to split the reward.

    In a game of permadeath, a Bounty System would be perfect.

     

    Even in a game without permadeath, becoming a "PK" or murderer of innocents could be penalized with (temporary or permanent) debuff that can result in permadeath. Perhaps players can wait it out and thus it becomes more of a time-out after murder (you cant play or risk dying) or perhaps it's a % chance of permadeath or it's 100% chance of permadeath.

    Regardless of how it is done, permadeath of any kind would make a bounty system perfect. A bounty could only be placed on an outlaw/murderer, which are the players who can suffer permadeath.

    Even if it was a 1% - 10% chance of permadeath, a player wouldn't be likened to allow his friend to kill him to split the reward-- although the friend might think differently.

     

    It would actually be quite amazing...as murderers would literally turn on their best friends and betray them for the gold...if the price was right...

  • StonesDKStonesDK SomewherePosts: 1,805Member

    Originally posted by Quirhid

    If you have go into extremes in order to disincentivize ganking lowbies, why allow it in the first place?

     

    Bingo! We have a winner

  • dave6660dave6660 New York, NYPosts: 2,543Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Dibdabs

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Yep would be awesome! However it could be abused, by for example his friends taking the bounty and sharing the money with him, so it need to be properly implemented.

    Yep, this happens.  I've seen it time and again in Eve where gullible but irate people put a bounty on guy A, then guy A's pal (lets be creative and call him guy B) takes him out and they happily split the bounty (or bounties) that all the suckers put up.  Next day, guy B goes out and ganks people to get a bounty on his head and then rinse and repeat.


    "It's immoral to let a sucker keep his money"


    -- Canada Bill Jones


     


    I'm a retired Eve pirate and am eternally thankful for people putting huge bounties on my head.


     


    It will be really hard to design a bounty system that can't be abused or circumvented.  I don't think it's worth the effort.

    “There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.”
    -- Herman Melville

  • ZBergzZBergz Clifton Park, NYPosts: 20Member
    Originally posted by dave6660


    It will be really hard to design a bounty system that can't be abused or circumvented.  I don't think it's worth the effort.

     

     

    It really is not hard. First of all to accept a contract you must be of relatively equivalent level (within 1-2 levels).

     

    If a player has been killed by another person give them the option to put a lets call it "Blood Bounty" on their killers head by offering up lets say some currency scaled to the victims level. Bounty hunters can now accept this contract and kill the offending player. The result of dying with a Blood Bounty on your head results in losing 10% of your exp to next level ( can go negative and delevel) with 3% of that loss going to the Bounty Hunter. The currency posted to make the contract is lost as is a portion of the exp from the bounty target. Its really about vengeance and only bounty hunters stand to come out ahead in this.

     

    Now for "regular" bounties you allow anyone to place it with the cost scaled according to target level. The penalty for dying with a normal contract on your head should be much less severe. Say 3% loss with 0.5% going to the bounty hunter and successfully warding off a bounty hunter would net you 0.5% of their xp. There would need to be a time limit between normal contracts to prevent it from being abused. Sure some one with a lot of money could keep posting a bounty on your head to be spiteful but thats on you for irritating him.

     

    No one will be abusing this system for profit. Its simply a manner in which to enact revenge on someone you think has wronged you. Obviously i picked numbers out thin air to simply illustrate my point before anyone comments that its too harsh or lenient.
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