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DOTA2: Blizzard Suing Valve Over Trademark

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  • AoriAori Carbondale, ILPosts: 1,886Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Deewe

    Originally posted by nilden

    Activision Blizzard is a far cry from the good guy.

    http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=128252

     

    Epic.

    It is more of kotick being a douche than anything, though quite honestly you can't be a good guy when you're at that level in a company of that size and power. You show any weakness you'll usually be removed.. happens often.

  • AoriAori Carbondale, ILPosts: 1,886Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Hycoo

    Originally posted by Aori

    Well blizzard owns everything and anything created using their editors, its in their eula. So the creators have 0 claim to anything. They are just prevent anyone from claiming the trademark, blizzard has its own dota but made it distinct from the fan versions.

    Blizzard doesnt have its own dota, it has its own moba!

    Except it does.. its called blizzard DOTA. If it was blizzard ATOD then ya sure you'd been somewhat right in trying to correct me.. i wasn't speaking of the genre itself.

  • AutemOxAutemOx Fullerton, CAPosts: 1,704Member

    Originally posted by b00gs

    You are all forgetting the Sony/Verant case about the songs/names the bards were making up while role playing in EQ1.  It does NOT MATTER who created the mod and/or name.  Once you associate it with the licensed product the products owner has the ownership rights to said name, lyrics, code, ect associated with whatever was created by an outside source and brought into the gaming world.

    The bard player in question attempted to sue sony for stealing his songs and names, he lost.  The same applies to any mod name, mod codes, and character names.  Any idea's shared amongst the player community.  Once it is used within the gaming client it can/does become the sole property of the game publisher.

    This.

    Blizzard owns DOTA, they have been very kind to allow for DOTA2 to exist at all, we should be thankful for that.

    Play as your fav retro characters: cnd-online.net. My site: www.lysle.net. Blog: creatingaworld.blogspot.com.

  • HycooHycoo OsloPosts: 217Member

    Originally posted by Aori

    Originally posted by Hycoo


    Originally posted by Aori

    Well blizzard owns everything and anything created using their editors, its in their eula. So the creators have 0 claim to anything. They are just prevent anyone from claiming the trademark, blizzard has its own dota but made it distinct from the fan versions.

    Blizzard doesnt have its own dota, it has its own moba!

    Except it does.. its called blizzard DOTA. If it was blizzard ATOD then ya sure you'd been somewhat right in trying to correct me.. i wasn't speaking of the genre itself.

    I know Blizzard is making its own ''Blizzard Dota'', but it is as similiar to the original dota as LoL is to the same game. Dota 2 (Valve) is a continuation of the original dota game, while Blizzard Dota is gonna be a different game.

    EDIT: This is why i want Icefrog, and therefor Valve, to be able to use the Dota name. As would any dota player that wants to continue to play the game in the future.

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  • squalleonahasqualleonaha miss, ONPosts: 211Member

    valve is greedy when trying to take DOTA for themself. i'm on blizzard side this time. DOTA is simply a mod/copy of warcraft 3. you can deny it all you want but 90% of everything in DOTA is identical to WC3. games might have some point similar, but not 90% similar.

    if this is allowed, then maybe i'll start making private server of all great MMORPG games and name them differently to make them MY OWN GAME. could be Defend of Warcraft ,  Defend of The Old Republic, Defend of Rift , Defend of .....Quest 2. some of my friends in china really good at this.









     




     

  • cant the maker of the dota mod just rename the warcraft 3 dota mod to something different, so there wouldnt be any trademark infringment, cant sue for dota 2 if dota1 isnt named dota....

  • RequiamerRequiamer ???Posts: 2,034Member

    HAHA, are those guys at Blizzard kidding or what? Dota is a genre by itself, at least a sub genre of RTS, and is definitely not attached to Blizzard in anyway. First it was a mod, but was so different than an rts game it gain his own reputation as a genre... It would be as if RG tomorrow decide all the mmo belong to him, that would be ridiculous. And if i'm not wrong the guys that invented the mod work for valve now, and never worked for Blizzard to begin with since it was player made mode. Sometime you really wish the law could turn against the people using it in such an abusive manner, just to make people understand law is not made to offend people but defend them.
     
    Dota genre belong to Blizzard? that must be one of the most absurd claim made in video games since like ever?

  • ValuaValua LiverpoolPosts: 520Member

    Valve is stupid if they didn't think this would happen.

     

    Next we'll see Valve creating an MMO called "World of Portalcraft."

     

    Big companies are usually smart enough to avoid even risking copy right infringement.

  • wrekognizewrekognize salt lake city, UTPosts: 384Member

    Originally posted by nyxium

    Sad to see Blizz taking the IP route, don't they feel they make enough money? Very hard for me to feel any sympathy for them. Muscle flexing that turns into bullying might put people off from buying their brand's, I hope they feel strong enough for their rep to take a hit like that.

    Totally agree.

  • MoarDotsMoarDots Anaheim, CAPosts: 40Member

    Rofl at the ignorant people pointing fingers at Blizzard.

    Go back and read their TOS, a lot of companies' TOS will state that whatever mod you make for their game is inherently theirs, NOT yours. I'm pretty sure this is true for Valve as well.

    And why are you hating on Blizzard, saying they want to keep it to themselves? Do you even understand what Valve is trying to do? They're trying to TRADEMARK the name. It's like Facebook tried to trademark "FACE" or "BOOK" - essentially means you CAN'T use the name WITHOUT asking and/or paying Valve a hefty sum if they get the trademark, else you CAN be sued.

    Blizzard left it in the open and anyone could have made a "DOTA" game - hence Valve did it. But now Valve is trying to trademark the name and keeping it for themselves.

    Afraid of the competition? Re-read the situation. Blizzard had all the rights and power to trademark "DOTA" these past few years if they wanted to. They're only suing now because Valve wants to keep the name for itself.

    "DOTA doesn't belong to Blizzard" - and it belongs to Valve? Because Valve is trying to "own" it with their attempt trademark of it.

     

    Hindering the industry? Who is? The company that kept the name un-trademarked and open to anyone developer who wishes to use it - or the company that's attempting to keep the name for itself? And no you do NOT need to trademark the name to release a game. It's normally done for games with UNIQUE titles to prevent copycat, but DOTA is NOT a unique title to a game - at this point, it almost defines a whole genre, moreso than MOBA anyway.



     

  • IceAgeIceAge SomeWhere In ..Posts: 1,013Member Common

    Well, as my english is not my main language, nor I can write it good , Zecinator  have stated exactly what I wish to say. Blizzard even let Valve alone when they first announced Dota 2! But when they heard that Valve is trying to trademark the name, well .. they jumped in, like every company/man/woman/cat/dog would have done.

    Reporter: What's behind Blizzard success, and how do you make your gamers happy?
    Blizzard Boss: Making gamers happy is not my concern, making money.. yes!

  • gilgamesh42gilgamesh42 tampa, FLPosts: 300Member

    oh blizzard wait till they spend a bunch of cash on the game then screw them over by  sueing them  i love the way you troll

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  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon

    Good Luck.

     

    Team Fortress was a mod associated with Quake and Valve snatched them up.

     

     

     

     

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by gaeanprayer

    A lot of you aren't reading this correctly. Blizzard is actually, most likely, the good guy here. They're not suing to own the DoTA trademark, they're suing to PREVENT Valve from doing so. DoTA is a project that's community-based and bigger than either of those companies and thus affects FAR more than just Valve and Blizzard products. It's in everyone's best interest that Blizzard wins their suit. Valve are the greedy bastards trying to own something they don't.

    That doesn't make Blizzard the good guy.  The guy that owns the DoTA source code has IP rights, just as the team that made Team Fortress had the right to sell to Valve and actually make a living on their design.

  • HurricanePipHurricanePip Sommerille, MAPosts: 167Member

    I believe a "Go F yourself, Activision!" is in order.  This is on par with when the NFL tried to trademark "Who Dat!"

    There are some great things about our culture, but the stupid #@$# that companies try to pull just makes me sick sometimes.

    If you don't worry about it, it's not a problem.

  • kartoolkartool Hamilton, ONPosts: 472Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by htiger23

    Originally posted by 77lolmac77

    How do you trademark something you didnt create?

    First of all, according to how games and intellectual property work, Blizzard effectively did "create" DotA.

    It was created using Blizzard's map editor and cannot function without Warcraft 3.  Anything created with Blizzard's tools and for Blizzard products is effectively owned by Blizzard.

    If you actually read through the legal filing, it has a great deal of sound logic behind it.

    Blizzard explains that DotA has been synonymous with Warcraft 3, and Blizzard, since creation.  Due to this, Valve's usage of the word is actually using Blizzard's goodwill as its own, which is completely wrong.

    By your logic Microsoft owns any program written for Windows using Visual Studio.

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon



    I agree that's pretty lame.  But Blizzard had no problem stealing the looks of a ton of Games Workshop[ units themselves in WC and SC.

  • kartoolkartool Hamilton, ONPosts: 472Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by squalleonaha

    valve is greedy when trying to take DOTA for themself. i'm on blizzard side this time. DOTA is simply a mod/copy of warcraft 3. you can deny it all you want but 90% of everything in DOTA is identical to WC3. games might have some point similar, but not 90% similar.





    if this is allowed, then maybe i'll start making private server of all great MMORPG games and name them differently to make them MY OWN GAME. could be Defend of Warcraft ,  Defend of The Old Republic, Defend of Rift , Defend of .....Quest 2. some of my friends in china really good at this.






















     










     

    They wouldn't be using any of Blizzards trademarks or intellectual property. Your example doesn't make sense. They aren't using Warcraft or Starcraft or anything else Blizzard owns. They guy that created the original mod might have a case, but legally Blizzard doesn't really have any right to the name. I'm not saying it's right for Valve to try to use it either, but this isn't an emotional debate - it's a legal issue.

    We'll have to wait and see what the courts decide, but I think Blizzard will have a tough time making someone stop using something they don't own. I'm not a lawyer, I'm just trying to be logical about this.

    These bullshit lawsuits need to stop. The only people winning in the end are lawyers and the cost of all these lawsuits are passed on to the consumer.

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Serenes

    Originally posted by Hycoo


    Originally posted by Serenes


    Originally posted by nilden


    Originally posted by Serenes

    Also DOTA was baised off a SC2 map Aeon of Strife, pushing the tide of this lawsuit even more in Blizzards favor.

    Really it was based off a SC2 map in 2003... just stop.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dota

    So in fact with AoS coming before DOTA Blizzard indeed did come up with the concept for DOTA. i love it!!!!

    The lawsuit isnt about who invented the genre, but who deserves to use the trademark. You never enjoyed dota obviously.

    No I loved Dota and play LoL quite abit now. I'm just saying valve try to swoop in and steal a franchise that belonged to the community, and in all rights no one has the rights but if someone had more then the other it would be Blizzard not Valve.

    Did they ever publically release the DoTA source code?  If not the "community" never owned it.

  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Manchester, NHPosts: 2,926Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by expresso

    If Valve TM DOTA2 then no future game to follow, fan made, mod or retail can use the DOTA name - at the moment no one would have issue If I made a DOTA mod in Skyrim and called it 'Skyrim DOTA' cus it's clear it just a DOTA variant. but if Valve have there way then they will set the legal team on me and force me to remove 'DOTA' from the name cus they own it.

    Valve want to pretend they invented the DOTA genre by TM'ing the name and that's wrong... Blizzard want to ensure everyone can call there gamemod '[whatever] DOTA' - yeah Blizzard are the bad guys in this right?

    Blizzards version of DOTA (which is under development) is called 'Blizzard DOTA' legaly valve could sue Blizzard if valve win this case, that is so many kinds of wrong.

    The name isn't the key to it's success, it's the gameplay.  Which is why LoL is doing so well.

  • KingPinoyKingPinoy Concord, CAPosts: 55Member

    Originally posted by Zecinator

    Rofl at the ignorant people pointing fingers at Blizzard.





    Go back and read their TOS, a lot of companies' TOS will state that whatever mod you make for their game is inherently theirs, NOT yours. I'm pretty sure this is true for Valve as well.





    And why are you hating on Blizzard, saying they want to keep it to themselves? Do you even understand what Valve is trying to do? They're trying to TRADEMARK the name. It's like Facebook tried to trademark "FACE" or "BOOK" - essentially means you CAN'T use the name WITHOUT asking and/or paying Valve a hefty sum if they get the trademark, else you CAN be sued.





    Blizzard left it in the open and anyone could have made a "DOTA" game - hence Valve did it. But now Valve is trying to trademark the name and keeping it for themselves.





    Afraid of the competition? Re-read the situation. Blizzard had all the rights and power to trademark "DOTA" these past few years if they wanted to. They're only suing now because Valve wants to keep the name for itself.





    "DOTA doesn't belong to Blizzard" - and it belongs to Valve? Because Valve is trying to "own" it with their attempt trademark of it.

     

    Hindering the industry? Who is? The company that kept the name un-trademarked and open to anyone developer who wishes to use it - or the company that's attempting to keep the name for itself? And no you do NOT need to trademark the name to release a game. It's normally done for games with UNIQUE titles to prevent copycat, but DOTA is NOT a unique title to a game - at this point, it almost defines a whole genre, moreso than MOBA anyway.










     

    -1 for the blizzard haters. Nice to hear that blizzard didnt sue them until they heard they were trying to TM the name.

  • renrinkenrenrinken Downey, CAPosts: 29Member

    I think people are missing the point entirely.

    Blizz isnt suing Valve for using the name DOTA, they would of took action a long time ago if that was the case. They are suing to prevent Valve from claiming copyright ownership of the name DOTA. I be like CoD taking copyright for "FPS" and in tern sue every other game that uses the term FPS afterwards.

    Because thats what will happen. If Valve gets copyright they will force games like LoL or HoN to pay royalties to even use a term like "DoTA" or "DoTA-like", I dont know about HoN but LoL has the term DoTA plastered all over its website.

    Also take note, it says no were that Blizz themselves wish to copyright the name, all they are doing is preventing others from doing so. I believe this is absolutely right thing to do. DoTA is a genre now, its morally inept to try to copyright it, and to be blunt, Valve are bunch of pricks for trying to copyright it.



    EDIT: But I feel even with this DB move on valve part, it would have little effect on the genre. Games would just use the term MOBA Instead even though its a much more vague and broad term. I hate to use a fallacy like slippery slope but if DOTA2 does very well, I feel like Valve will not only try to take the name, but the genre itself.

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,255Member Uncommon

    INCOMING ANONYMOUS

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  • HycooHycoo OsloPosts: 217Member

    Originally posted by renrinken

    I think people are missing the point entirely.





    Blizz isnt suing Valve for using the name DOTA, they would of took action a long time ago if that was the case. They are suing to prevent Valve from claiming copyright ownership of the name DOTA. I be like CoD taking copyright for "FPS" and in tern sue every other game that uses the term FPS afterwards.





    Because thats what will happen. If Valve gets copyright they will force games like LoL or HoN to pay royalties to even use a term like "DoTA" or "DoTA-like", I dont know about HoN but LoL has the term DoTA plastered all over its website.





    Also take note, it says no were that Blizz themselves wish to copyright the name, all they are doing is preventing others from doing so. I believe this is absolutely right thing to do. DoTA is a genre now, its morally inept to try to copyright it, and to be blunt, Valve are bunch of pricks for trying to copyright it.










    EDIT: But I feel even with this DB move on valve part, it would have little effect on the genre. Games would just use the term MOBA Instead even though its a much more vague and broad term. I hate to use a fallacy like slippery slope but if DOTA2 does very well, I feel like Valve will not only try to take the name, but the genre itself.

    Dota isnt a genre. It is a game. The genre has been called moba for quite a while now, but maybe some game developers refers to dota to explain the gameplay, since Dota was the first game in this genre. Btw didnt find many Dota references on that LoL website.

    The product Valve is making is the game Dota in a new skin. Same mechanics, same name for heroes and items, only better graphics and stability. To achieve this (the only way) they have worked with the modder Icefrog who have developed Dota for the last 5 years. This is a game true to the original game and deserves by all means the name dota because that is just what it is and has the whole Dota community behind it.

    Then you have Blizzard that is making its own version of Dota. The only resemblence it has to the original is that is has heroes fighting each other on a similiar map. Mechanics, heroes, items etc. isnt like in Dota. You can compare Blizzard Dota to LoL or HoN. Therefor it is its own game and imo should have its own name. It seems to me that Blizzard wants the Dota name because Dota is a popular name and would attract customers, not because it has more to do with the original Dota than HoN or LoL.

    In the end i dont think it matters much what name each game ends up with. People who wants to play the original Dota will play Valve's Dota and people who wants something different can play Blizzard Dota.

    Saying that Valve doesnt  deserve the name more than Blizzard in a moral/mechanics/community point of view is wrong. But maybe not in a legal point of view.

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  • RelGnRelGn halalaPosts: 494Member

    Dota belongs to some guy named icefrog.Whats this all about.Icefrog created this game that became popular and some other guys before him have created something similar in starcraft if im correct.

    What tha fuck wants blizzard now.They created a crap warcraft 3 game and icefrog gave it life.So dota belongs to icefrog not blizzard.Americans are all crap heads indeed.They may sue us one day because we breath.



     

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