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World of Warcraft: The WoW Killer Redux

SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerThe Land of AZPosts: 16,610MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

In the last edition of The WoW Factor, the discussion swirled around what exactly it is that constitutes a "WoW Killer". This week, we continue to examine the issue from the perspective of you, our loyal forumites. Check it out!

You all had wonderful comments last time about what constitutes a “WoW Killer,” and as a writer I greatly appreciate input from all sources and of all types. While some of you took a steadfast approach and seriously discussed the merits of the definition of the term others duked it out fisticuffs-style while still others like punchrx made me spit out coffee due to their hilarious ingenuity with the written word.

Read more of Joe Sanicky's The WoW Factor: The WoW Killer Redux.

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Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

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Comments

  • 77lolmac7777lolmac77 Herp Derp, PAPosts: 496Member
    There was never going to be a game made by another company that killed WoW. It's just going to get staler and staler until people get bored and quit. At that point it will have some kind of F2P option, while Blizz devotes more resources to Titan.
  • lalartulalartu SeoulPosts: 444Member

    Google+ has already taken a huge piece of pie

    they've surpassed 90 million users and that's in 6 months of existence...

     

    It took facebook 3 years to get to the same number

    Join me on Twitter @WhatDaMath
    http://twitter.com/WhatDaMath
    I review lots of indie games and MMORPGs

  • ooblaoobla londonPosts: 87Member

    Given Pandas are very placid herbivores in real life its quite strange thier online equivelent could turn out to be a real killer . When Blizzard announced the subject of thier next expansion the rose coloured glasses fell away from the eyes of many fans . I'm expecting MoP to be fare more significant in WoWs demise than any other new mmo could possibly hope to be . Its like an accident waiting to happen . I've always seen redeaming qualitys in WoW even if I didn't like the direction it was going over all . Thats gone and  I now see nothing here anymore other than a fat complacent greedy company about to make what should have been obvious to them as a massive mistake . Something must be very wrong at Blizzard for them to think this expansion would be a good idea . It will also effect Titan because how can you trust Blizzard anymore .

  • logan400klogan400k Owings Mills, MDPosts: 68Member Uncommon

    Why do people eat at McDonalds? Why do people generally play Dungeons & Dragons versus Amber Diceles RPG? We shop at WalMart where... it is often NOT cheaper. The answer is convenience. WoW and that style of MMO is easy and convenient. The learning curve is small and it works on most machines, even those created by the Blessed Savior Steve Jobs (i.e. MACs). SWTOR is really just the Five Guys to WoW's McDonalds. Different presentation, spicey fries (or something) and better tasting burgers. Its still a burger joint though cause that is what people want even if its bad for you.

    I used to write modules for the RPGA and we often discussed Story vs. Stuff. Players say they want more story but what they really want is stuff. Gobs of stuff. So much stuff it weighs them down because players want to mow through mobs like a John Deere through sickly grass. And when you through a tough fight at them, mess up their pretty character, or heck even kill him (or her) they bitch and moan that you made it too hard, too challenging.

    The player community is getting what is really wants in these games. Buyer beware of what you are asking for, cause they are gonna give it to ya.

    As for innovation, that in itself is not as difficult as it sounds. The difficulty is getting someone to fork over cash for your innovative idea OR finding companies who want to go out on a limb or hire less experienced but more innovative designers. If you look carefully at design teams since EQ, you will see a lot of familiar faces doing familiar things. When the decision makers are following the money they have to use proven commodities. We see the same thing going on in the NFL coaching carousel every year.

    So for me this is not a complex issue at all. Simple inertia of economics. If you REALLY want companies to try something new its very simple: STOP PAYING FOR GAMES YOU DO NOT LIKE. Put your debit card back in your pocket and back away from the chicken nuggets. Go get a salad from your favorite grocery store, hit up your favorite mom n pop Mexican place, or... learn to cook for yourself.

    Just My 2 Lunars

  • BattlerockBattlerock Youngstown, OHPosts: 1,393Member
    The hotkey's and spell bars feel the same because so much of the time spent playing, your looking at the spell bar or making sure your hitting the right key as soon as its available, how do you tell if its available? Look at the hotbar, what's wrong with looking at the hot bar? You missed all the action, what's wrong with missing all the action? It's an mmo rpg right, who needs action.
  • jeremyjodesjeremyjodes antioch, ORPosts: 679Member

    The companys behind most of my favorite MMOs over the years have made me a jaded gamer. it took some time to sit down, look at why,and finally i just said "hell with it" I wanna play and stop being an ass about why this MMO fails and this one's better.

    You have to had loved something at some point to it hate so much when it changes. but everything changes in real life. yet we keep going. the same can be said for MMOs.

    Sure the companys sometimes change what you love and they nerf the hell out of the orginal game you started with. but no amount of negative feedback will make them change the way they design their games. you can't stop developers from straying from their alpha and betas they settled on. they wont ever change it. you see it in beta you can bet it will be at release.

    Now back on topic. you can't kill something that has no life. as with WoW i went back to my 85's and have been having a blast. people say TOR was a WoW killer. all it did was be it's own game.

    It's a good game but has issues as many do. it will do fine as will GW2

    We can't change the devs minds. they get paided to have a one track mind when it comes to features. even if players don't like them expect them to make through.

    I went back to WoW because my ties to my toons i have had for seven years. it has been fun as long as you loose the fact that blizzard has lost touch with it's fanbase. in a sense you will do fine and have fun.

    WoW killer is a myth. as is a TOR killer or any other game.

    image

  • mnemic666mnemic666 asdf, CAPosts: 157Member Uncommon

    STOP USING THAT TERM! YOU ARE PROMOTING MORE STUPIDITY AND "WOW KILLER" BULLSHIT BY WRITING ARTICLES ABOUT IT.

     

    Seriously, I'm sick and tired of "WoW Killer" as a term because it's completely pointless and devoid of any significant meaning.

  • RebxrnRebxrn VA Beach, VAPosts: 18Member

    Originally posted by logan400k

    Why do people eat at McDonalds? Why do people generally play Dungeons & Dragons versus Amber Diceles RPG? We shop at WalMart where... it is often NOT cheaper. The answer is convenience. WoW and that style of MMO is easy and convenient. The learning curve is small and it works on most machines, even those created by the Blessed Savior Steve Jobs (i.e. MACs). SWTOR is really just the Five Guys to WoW's McDonalds. Different presentation, spicey fries (or something) and better tasting burgers. Its still a burger joint though cause that is what people want even if its bad for you.

    I used to write modules for the RPGA and we often discussed Story vs. Stuff. Players say they want more story but what they really want is stuff. Gobs of stuff. So much stuff it weighs them down because players want to mow through mobs like a John Deere through sickly grass. And when you through a tough fight at them, mess up their pretty character, or heck even kill him (or her) they bitch and moan that you made it too hard, too challenging.

    The player community is getting what is really wants in these games. Buyer beware of what you are asking for, cause they are gonna give it to ya.

    As for innovation, that in itself is not as difficult as it sounds. The difficulty is getting someone to fork over cash for your innovative idea OR finding companies who want to go out on a limb or hire less experienced but more innovative designers. If you look carefully at design teams since EQ, you will see a lot of familiar faces doing familiar things. When the decision makers are following the money they have to use proven commodities. We see the same thing going on in the NFL coaching carousel every year.

    So for me this is not a complex issue at all. Simple inertia of economics. If you REALLY want companies to try something new its very simple: STOP PAYING FOR GAMES YOU DO NOT LIKE. Put your debit card back in your pocket and back away from the chicken nuggets. Go get a salad from your favorite grocery store, hit up your favorite mom n pop Mexican place, or... learn to cook for yourself.




     

    Truth...have a pint mate.

    I Once was Dead...Now am Reborn

  • TirinasTirinas hoogerheidePosts: 117Member

    which game is that on the 2nd picture ?



     

  • sanman7890sanman7890 Medina, OHPosts: 96Member

    Originally posted by Tirinas

    which game is that on the 2nd picture ?

    That would be TERA, sorry about that.

    image

  • moosecatlolmoosecatlol Boring, TXPosts: 1,171Member Uncommon

    You know, just through the sheer amount of times that we mention WoW, shouldn't WoW's hype meter be through the metaphorical roof?

    Yes, I understand that's not how the hype works, but honestly how many times does the words WoW, WoW killer, and WoW clone get tossed around on these forums, it has to be some sort of record.

    Better call up Guinness.

  • TirinasTirinas hoogerheidePosts: 117Member

    Originally posted by sanman7890



    Originally posted by Tirinas



    which game is that on the 2nd picture ?

    That would be TERA, sorry about that.




     

    Ah thanks, graphics look awesome. Really like the cape.

  • sanman7890sanman7890 Medina, OHPosts: 96Member

    Originally posted by moosecatlol

    You know, just through the sheer amount of times that we mention WoW, shouldn't WoW's hype meter be through the metaphorical roof?

    Yes, I understand that's not how the hype works, but honestly how many times does the words WoW, WoW killer, and WoW clone get tossed around on these forums, it has to be some sort of record.

    Better call up Guinness.


     

    Ahahaha, I think about this a lot while I brainstorm for these columns.  Not a day goes by that on a prominent forums somewhere WoW is compared to another MMO, and god knows how many people do it unconsciously too.

    I almost wrote an article about it once, but every time I've touched on the idea everyone seems to hate it.  Woe be to me.

    image

  • ClerigoClerigo MatosinhosPosts: 400Member Common

    If someone has an unfortunate accident and becomes braindead, doctors plug him to the machine and he is still breathing, do we consider him to be alive?

    This game is still alive merely by the prodigy power, unlike anything we have ever seen since He-Man, of Blizz marketing department, accessible engine reaching a wide range of machines and smart decisions when it comes to grab subscriptions...paladins? Undeads? Werewolfs? Pandas? I mean, how can they fail in grabbing youngsters by their daddy wallets and credit cards?

    Now this is, for me, the best game i ever played, before it was dumbed down into a point where even my girlfriend said it was not fun anymore, and now that she knows pandas are coming she gives that wicked loud laugh as if she gained the lottery and she is geting ready to cut me loose.

    I will tell you why the community yearns for a "WoW killer". Because deep down every single player knows that this game is, by now, an old carcass devoided of any life in it, getting closer to Mick Jaggers world record of "hours spent working but sucking at it", and yet no one is able to explain why all promising game launches somehow fail to please gamers, grab their subscription, and why at the end most of them return to what they were playing before, and in this case WoW takes the bigger chunk.

  • sanman7890sanman7890 Medina, OHPosts: 96Member

    Originally posted by Clerigo

    If someone has an unfortunate accident and becomes braindead, doctors plug him to the machine and he is still breathing, do we consider him to be alive?

    This game is still alive merely by the prodigy power, unlike anything we have ever seen since He-Man, of Blizz marketing department, accessible engine reaching a wide range of machines and smart decisions when it comes to grab subscriptions...paladins? Undeads? Werewolfs? Pandas? I mean, how can they fail in grabbing youngsters by their daddy wallets and credit cards?

    Now this is, for me, the best game i ever played, before it was dumbed down into a point where even my girlfriend said it was not fun anymore, and now that she knows pandas are coming she gives that wicked loud laugh as if she gained the lottery and she is geting ready to cut me loose.

    I will tell you why the community yearns for a "WoW killer". Because deep down every single player knows that this game is, by now, an old carcass devoided of any life in it, getting closer to Mick Jaggers world record of "hours spent working but sucking at it", and yet no one is able to explain why all promising game launches somehow fail to please gamers, grab their subscription, and why at the end most of them return to what they were playing before, and in this case WoW takes the bigger chunk.




     

    If nothing else I applaud your use of imagery.  I love carcass metaphors.

    image

  • newbinatornewbinator LA, CAPosts: 780Member

    Another article on WoW-killing, really? =p

    As someone who has played WoW on and off since the first day it launched. (currently not playing, might come back for the expansion)  I don't think anything will kill WoW. I believe it will still be the #1 MMO 10 years from now. Blizzard will continue to pile on the content and innovate just enough to make it stay at the top.

  • TelondarielTelondariel Ottawa, ONPosts: 1,001Member



    Originally posted by newbinator

    Another article on WoW-killing, really? =p





    As someone who has played WoW on and off since the first day it launched. (currently not playing, might come back for the expansion)  I don't think anything will kill WoW. I believe it will still be the #1 MMO 10 years from now. Blizzard will continue to pile on the content and innovate just enough to make it stay at the top.










     





    I agree.  [mod edit]

    The only people that seem to go on about it, or even care, just need to get over it.  There isn't going to be one game that will kill WoW.  People will bleed off and go to other new shiny games, and some will stay.  It will also gain new players, as it really does offer an excellent game to play.  The community on the other hand..but that's another discussion entirely.

    Maybe one day it will peter off and die a natural death.  Who knows.  EQ1 is still going strong, and (I think) just had its 15th expansion.  People love it like others love WoW, and its still there over 13 years later.  Insisting, with an annoying juvenility, that there simply has to be a David to Blizzard's Goliath is an exercise in futility.  Worse, its spawned contenders that vomit trashy WoW clones hoping to the The One.  /eyeroll

     



     

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  • sanman7890sanman7890 Medina, OHPosts: 96Member

    Originally posted by Telondariel



    Originally posted by newbinator



    Another article on WoW-killing, really? =p

    As someone who has played WoW on and off since the first day it launched. (currently not playing, might come back for the expansion)  I don't think anything will kill WoW. I believe it will still be the #1 MMO 10 years from now. Blizzard will continue to pile on the content and innovate just enough to make it stay at the top.



    I agree.  Its a troll article.

    The only people that seem to go on about it, or even care, just need to get over it.  There isn't going to be one game that will kill WoW.  People will bleed off and go to other new shiny games, and some will stay.  It will also gain new players, as it really does offer an excellent game to play.  The community on the other hand..but that's another discussion entirely.

    Maybe one day it will peter off and die a natural death.  Who knows.  EQ1 is still going strong, and (I think) just had its 15th expansion.  People love it like others love WoW, and its still there over 13 years later.  Insisting, with an annoying juvenility, that there simply has to be a David to Blizzard's Goliath is an exercise in futility.  Worse, its spawned contenders that vomit trashy WoW clones hoping to the The One.  /eyeroll

     Define "troll article," because I can assure you it isn't.  Dismissing it as such is rather insulting though.

    I find it odd you're even commenting on the article as most of the points you made I've already made in my last few articles, including the point that it won't be killed by a single entity but a concerted industry effort (if even) and the fact that EQ is on its 18th expansion since last November.

    I also never insisted "with an annoying juvenility" that a David figure would come along to kill it, as stated in a past article.

    The logical progression of the last three articles was 1) Star Wars MMO comes out and communities clamour about its possible threat to WoW, 2) commenters rampantly discuss what a WoW Killer even is, thus I lay claim to defining it and 3) the why is often as important if not more so than the what, thus the "redux" part of the title and third part in a trilogy of articles.

    Not troll article. :)

    image

  • troublmakertroublmaker St. George''s, NFPosts: 337Member

    Originally posted by lalartu

    Google+ has already taken a huge piece of pie

    they've surpassed 90 million users and that's in 6 months of existence...

     

    It took facebook 3 years to get to the same number




     

    Google is already an existing brand that is already popular.  When they release something it should become very popular.  As an example Facebook made it so app designers could make games and after 3 years their games are the most popular in the world.

    It would be like if Apple was to make a cell phone, we'll call it the iPhone and they were to release it into a smart phone market domianted by let's call them Blackberry.  We'd expect Apple as an established brand to not only do alright, but dominate.... which they have.

    Website: http://www.thegameguru.me / YouTube:

  • WNxbadboy3WNxbadboy3 scunthoprePosts: 121Member Uncommon

    people are going to runes of magic instead of world of warcraft

  • madnessman13madnessman13 trimont, MNPosts: 91Member

    world of warcraft = easy and simple sense of accomplishment, that is all.

    no one comment will explain it but all of them combined together give you a good idea of what where thinking.

    madnessman

  • DaddyDarkDaddyDark MoscowPosts: 138Member

    Easy formula

    WoW killer = A + B + C + D + E + F

    where

    A = great and timely support and development

    B = balanced endgame PvE and PvP system

    C = convinient, fast and fun to play (no anonostic grinding, auto-grouping ect., lots of voiceacting while leveling only)

    D = lots of social features/not limited to combat (appearence customisation, lots of emotions, housing, useful crafting - not limited to producing not-the-best gear...)

    E = lots of new content or random content like random dungeons

    F = Great setting and universe

    example - why SWTOR is not WoW killer?

    answer: SWTOR= c + F

    where c = C with anonistic grinding in the endgame, skipping voiceacting and no auto-grouping ect.

    example 2 - why WoW can't be WoW killer itself ;-) lol

    answer: WoW = A + B + e + f

    where e= E but the new content comes in rare waves

    f = F but wihtout pandas, noris staff and other "asia-oriented" ideas.

    oh - forgot to add G = up to date feeling ;-)

  • KedoremosKedoremos Nashua, NHPosts: 435Member

    WoW is fun. The others aren't.

    image
    Life of an MMORPG "addict"
    For 7 years, proving that if you quote "fuck" you won't get banned.

  • KingPinoyKingPinoy Concord, CAPosts: 55Member

    Seriously......a games bad just because of pandas. Get over it.

  • IsturiIsturi Phoenix, AZPosts: 1,509Member

    If you are looking for the history of why WoW is WoW and henc force why the term "WoW killer" is now an official MMO statement well in brief here it is for you eyes only. And the few others that read this post.

    1. WoW took the best from a little know from Sony called Everquest ya I know it is after all a obscure game that had only "more than 225,000" subscriptions on 1 November 1999, with an increase to "more than 450,000" subscriptions by 25 September 2003 and the fact that WoW started on September 2, 2001 which was backed by a liitle known company called Blizzard for at the time they only had games like Rock N' Roll Racing and The Lost Vikings. go fugue, Blizz wanted to make a name for themself and a name they made by doing what they do best that is by stealing from the best hence force that is were Everquest came in they took the Bill Gates approach in the gaming world.

    2. Because of this DEV's with scruples ya I know another hard fact to believe but hey they did exist back then. Left WoW and formed some company called ArenaNet who knew right? Anywho they came up with some little called yup you guessed it Guild Wars and called it a CORPG  meaning that it was a cooperative role play game that is online.  WOW what a concept no pun intended. Well even though Guild wars had a huge success it could not take down there provable parents from Blizz so on some cold day in winter some were around the years April 2005 to August 2007 someone in some office coined the word "WoW killer" and to be completely honest just like every clone that came after Guild Wars you know wich ones I mean did not want to kill WoW but ride the coat tail of the MMO giant. Hey why not?

    3. Finally only one company that took all this and is making it for themselves that is a game by Bioware called Star Wars the Old Republic look it up and look at the huge success it is having on the MMO world is it a WoW killer no but instead it is a WOW surpasses by today's standards.

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